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A lot of people preach using testosterone, nandrolone and oxy for bulking. But what if you use a different stack of drugs, something like trenbolone, testosterone or boldenone. A drier stack vs wet stack. I know that you would put on more weight using the wet compounds but it’s not always muscle. So what do you guys think on using trenbolone for bulking? And maybe using drier orals for short bursts?
I always been wondering if results would be way different.
I’ve forgot that wet compounds will put on more muscle because of the elevated estrogen but what if you want to keep your bulk cleaner. I’ve read that trenbolone has the ability to burn fat if estrogen is lower (low test + tren). What if you don’t want to deal with all the bloat and water retention.
well 'wet' compounds can help build more muscle ultimately then dry compounds because water helps indirectly build muscle and the networks to eventually hold more mass overall .
https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...pensation.html
buy yes, you can 'grow' on dry compounds like Tren as well , its just not as easy or as fast (unless your a genetic hyper responder to Tren, then you can grow on it no problem).
one reason why its hard to grow on Tren is because it is sooo damn androgenic (5x more then Test). and keep in mind that androgen activity in and of itself does not build size. in fact, too much androgen activity can cause you to lose weight by overly stimulating the CNS (on top of greatly effecting your ability to sleep which hinders gains even more), but this is why its great for cutting. it will all by itself put you in a calorie deficit and raise your TDEE. it will activate AR's in fat tissue.
Tren is the number one best contest prep drug there is for a reason. it gets you full hard lean dry vascular and cut, and its anabolic enough to help you keep your size.
its just not great at putting ON massive amounts of size. its better at recomping the size you already have and with enough calories, filling out your muscle and glycogen stores to give you the appearance of more muscle .
if you want to truly bulk with it, its best stacked with wet compounds at higher amounts of estrogen to help counter the super high amounts of androgens that come from tren.
there are ways to grow 'dry' though and use different AAS to do this. its just a more slow process and the overall size will not be as much as with 'wet' compounds.
I'll give examples in another post
but the idea that 'wet' compounds only give you water bloat and not actual muscle, is really over stated. wet does not mean bloat.. heck your muscle is made up of 78% water to begin with.
Can you imagine tren ace and sdrol in the same mix? That would be fucking insane! Use that shit to treat muscle dystrophy..Quote:
Originally Posted by GearHeaded
Ment and Tren is a great combo for growth. they have a lot of synergistic and off setting attributes that will definitely help you grow (but not a good combo for guys that are Estrogen or Prolactin sensitive or gyno prone)
50mg Ment per day
50mg Tren a per day
50mg Test p per day
very light cycle right there. train hard eat hard and just grow. nuttin fancy
How about the combo of SD and mentQuote:
Originally Posted by GearHeaded
both extremely anabolic. if you were in a max anabolic phase then it would be ideal (transitioning from say a max androgen phase to an anabolic phase at the end of say a 12 week run). of course the Ment wouldn't be ideal at the tail end of a cycle for guys that run PCT though as the Ment is just too estrogenic. Superdrol at the end of a cycle is definitely ideal though (as there is not E conversion)Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlesticks
I'm a fan of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by McGregor
The issue is, the dose and duration I'm a fan of isn't the safest... so I'd never suggest it.
But, yes... Tren would be one of my go-tos.
the thing about the Ment is that its a very strong Anabolic , yet its very very estrogenic. Where as most of your pure Anabolics (Var, Wiinstrol, Deca, Eq, Primo, Superdrol) are not estrogenic. so being Anabolic and strongly Estrogenic is unique to Ment.
note- where as Tren is a very strong Androgenic, is Anabolic too , yet is NOT estrogenic
So there is no sense in using trenbolone on a bulk if gaining a lot of muscle is the goal because estrogenic AAS are way more efficient and you don’t want to waste the fat burning properties of trenbolone because of elevated estrogen. This makes a lot of sense now. Thank god i’m not gyno prone. :D Imagine running trenbolone and superdrol on a recomp.
Also are there benefits in adding non aromatising AAS like Winstrol (Stanozolol) on a high estrogen stack?
Multiple experienced members told you in your thread a few weeks back that nutrition dictates goals first, then training, and compounds is the smallest factor.
You were advised to also not cycle at 19, let alone be using harsh compounds like Tren at a young age.
If you want to ignore the advice because you think you know everything at 19 that's your prerogative. Making a new thread a few weeks later isn't going to change the reality of your situation.
just because OP is only 19 years old doesn't mean he can't go around starting threads and asking legitimately good questions about AAS.
he might as well learn all he can for one day when he may cycle (without being called out for it by daddy).
his thread did say for "educational purposes"
I've bulked on both, separately and together. Test + Deca, Tren + Test & Tren, Deca & Test.
I prefer Deca for bulking purely because tren makes me very acidic so i find it difficult to eat. Trial and error, but you can certainly gain muscle with which ever potion you choose! :)
Wait a few years... (i cant talk i started at 20, but i wish i waited a few more years)
I'm bulking with Sustanon and Tren Ace now.
After exactly two weeks I'm about 11 lbs more, I do not have much water retention and I have the abs visible.
Compared to the past classic Deca Dbol Test cycles I am noticing that the muscular districts are much more affected by growth (especially shoulders, back width, upper pectoral, arms), the muscle is more dense and less watery.
I believe that growing with the Tren is certainly possible, but slower and more definitive than other bulking compounds.
Only drawback is the poor appetite and a great effort to eat 350/400 grams of pasta and rice a day.
what your experiencing is the super strong Androgenic effects of Tren to be able to load and partition a lot more nutrients into muscle cells , as long as carb consumption is high enough. your muscle get full and hard and dense. this is why Tren is a great contest prep drug. its gives you 'that look' , but this is also why Tren is a bit addictive and guys want to stay on it all the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by TestoSuper
personally though, you don't get the above effect from a pure nandrolone, but you would overall grow more actual size in a years time with that then you would Tren. its just Tren has more visual effects due to the glycogen loading that occurs right away
I'm not going to use anything i'm just trying to learn more about steroids and using different stacks. I didn't make this thread to justify using steroids that's why i've put Educational purpose in the title. I can lie about my age and blast AAS but i prefer to be honest. I'm not rich to run proper Tren cycles lol.
Can you clean those clean full gains from tren off of it . Never used to tren beforeQuote:
Originally Posted by GearHeaded
Sent from my JSN-AL00 using Tapatalk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrisp83TRT
I'm assuming your asking if the tren gains are keepable ? no, not the gains I was speaking about. the visual changes that occur from the high androgenic effects of Tren are only there when your run the drug. again this is why Tren is the number one ran contest drug, and why its one of the most addicting drugs and guys want to run it all the time. it gives you a certain 'look'.
note: thats not to say the anabolic aspects of tren and some of the tissue you may build while on tren over time are not keepable. I'm merely talking about the androgenic appearance effects from it
@GearHeaded is it true that estrogen blunts the fat burning properties of trenbolone? We know that testosterone burns fat even on a bulk (the 20 week study where they compared 300 mg vs 600 mg). Shouldn't tren enhance the fat loss? Also the study didn't use any AI's and they didn't lift.
no not that I'm aware of. in fact, estrogen itself has some fat burning properties too (this is a very complex topic, as estrogen also has some fat storing capability at estrogen receptor dense sites).Quote:
Originally Posted by McGregor
but if your body is in a state of lipolysis (wither thats achieved through diet or drugs) and needs to use fat for fuel, then it will, period. estrogen is not going to blunt this metabolic requirement somehow.
having said that . high levels of estrogen is not ideal for getting shredded and dry appearance like a stage ready bodybuilder.
please note: when I use the word "wet" compounds or wet AAS, I don't always specifically mean estrogenic AAS. a compound can still be a bit 'wet' and not be very estrogenic
Looks like everyone should just pick their poison and keep things simple. If you don't want to retain a bunch of water go with the drier aas, if you don't mind the water go with the wet compounds. I've always wondered how do you control the water from using Oxymetholone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GearHeaded
this is certainly true ... but in other posts you also wrote me that it can be very effective in growth if combined with elevated estrogens, right? So, in addition to the particular visual effect, it should also give good gains in lean tissue, right?
On the other hand, if the compound is 5 times more anabolic (as well as more androgenic) than Test and Deca, consequently it should allow more effective muscle growth and anabolism than Test and Deca, or not?
@GearHeaded which compounds do you think are the best for recomp sir? Also how do you feel on very high testosterone?
If you want to put on some good size with tren you need to eat a lot of food I’m talking 5-6k cals a day of CLEAN food if ur 240-250lb range. It’s simply not the best option for mass. Test, deca, dbol, anadrol. Best mass options. Tried and true. Don’t try to reinvent the wheel.