My Diet/Cycle for Critique

[IronClydes]

For background, I just finished a long, low dose, EQ/TC Cycle for my bike racing season. It was as follows:

EQ 100 twice weekly
Test Cyp 80 twice weekly

The goal was to minimize bulk weight gain (weight is no good racing bikes), protect muscle (lots of intense cardio), and enhance endurance (EQ raises RBC's very well).

As you can see, it was a low-impact, low-dosage cycle, hence why I feel it's okay to move forward with a short 8 week true cycle to wrap it up and recover some muscle lost in-season or finalize my cuts.

This cycle lasted from 3/21 to 8/25, and as I stated, I am now looking to cap that off, as it was very low dosing and my 5th cycle, with a short 8 week cycle (before time off) as follows:

Cut option:

1) Test Cyp 80 twice weekly
2) NPP 50 EOD (until supply runs out in approx 2 weeks, then maybe low-dose deca for joints at 60 twice weekly)
3) 75 Tren E EOD (started first week at 50 Tren A and 50 Tren E to kick it off; now on the second week and transitioning over at Tren A 25 and Tren E 50)
4) Anavar 50 ED (once in an only) for first 5.5 weeks of this cycle (all I have left)
5) .5 Caber once weekly
6) .25 Anastrozole EOD
7) Liv52 and NAC twice daily

I am currently on week 2, going over to only the E version of Tren in a couple days.

What do you think and/or recommend?

After such a long race season on low calories, to keep the weight minimal, I am currently at the following stats and wondering if perhaps I should instead make this into an 8 week bulk to recover lost muscle and from all that diet control and cardio! I lost strength and size for sure.

1) 208 pounds
2) 10-12% body fat (DECA said 8.7% on 6/27 at 212 pounds, but I'm looking a little less cut than I did then)
3) 36 years, 6 foot, 34" waist (33-33.5 when I had DECA done)

What are your thoughts? Bulk or Cut short cycle?

In each case, what AAS do you choose? If not what I laid out, this is what else I have on hand to select from:

Orals:
Winstrol 50: 64 pills
Clen 40: 25 pills
T3/4 (20/100 mix): 54 pills
Halo 5: 120 pills
Anavar 10: 150 pills left

Injectables:
Tren A 100: 54ml
Tren E 200: 35ml
EQ 300: 24ml
NPP 100: 11ml
Deca 250: 15ml
Test Prop 100: 4ml

The following are preferred due to upcoming expiration dates:

Anavar: 4/18
Tren E: 20ml of it on 9/17
EQ: 3/18
Winstrol and Clen: unknown, but purchased same time as Anavar.

As for the diet, TDEE is typically around 3000 with my usual weight and moderate cardio routine in place. I typically follow a 40/40/20 split for 6 days with a 1 day refeed at 60/25/15 (carb/pro/fat split). I can modify, as advised, for a cut/bulk, and have grown decent at carb cycling if you like that approach as well.

Thanks in advance for sharing your insight, experience, and AAS/diet wisdom!

For reference, the attached pictures are my DECA and me my lean point, 6/18/2017, when the test was competed, indicating 8.9%, which I understand typically gives a 2% higher than actual bf%.




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[IronClydes]

My typical meal plan is currently set for a cut, at 2300 daily, with weights 4x/wk and 45-90 minutes cardio the other 3 days, as follows:

Breakfast:


Work Meals (2 of these):


Pre-workout Meal:


Post-workout Shake:


Bedtime Snack:



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[Back In Black]

Are you on TRT? If not I'm guessing you are planning it.

[IronClydes]

Are you on TRT? If not I'm guessing you are planning it.

Yes, on TRT for life since 2014.



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[MuscleScience]

Tren and Deca in the same cycle?

[kelkel]

So basicaly your were running a TRT dose test alongside EQ.
In my opinion if racing season's over then it's time to put some size on. I'd keep it simple imho and just run a moderate dose of test along side some deca and call it a day. No need to over-complicate it.

Initial thoughts would be:

4-500 test and 250 deca (exactly what I'm running now.) When cycle's over continue with 100-125 mgs deca alongside your TRT protocol.
Adex at .25 eod.
Caber at .25 x 2 at the start or wait till mid cycle BW and assess.
If you're looking at only short esters then adjust to prop and npp.
All this is assuming you've had some recent BW and all is well.
Don't worry about the expiration dates of what you currently have. Their fine for years to come.

[IronClydes]

Tren and Deca in the same cycle?

Low dose so it won't be an issue. Therapeutic dose only.


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[IronClydes]

So basicaly your were running a TRT dose test alongside EQ.
In my opinion if racing season's over then it's time to put some size on. I'd keep it simple imho and just run a moderate dose of test along side some deca and call it a day. No need to over-complicate it.

Initial thoughts would be:

4-500 test and 250 deca (exactly what I'm running now.) When cycle's over continue with 100-125 mgs deca alongside your TRT protocol.
Adex at .25 eod.
Caber at .25 x 2 at the start or wait till mid cycle BW and assess.
If you're looking at only short esters then adjust to prop and npp.
All this is assuming you've had some recent BW and all is well.
Don't worry about the expiration dates of what you currently have. Their fine for years to come.

Thank you, Kel.

That's where I was starting to lean towards as well.

I had used Tren for the past 3 cut cycles and was considering, however, for a bulk as I understand it is also great for that.

I tend to stray towards TRT dose test due to possible drug random testing at work....test is more likely to be tested than the other AAS...how would you modify your advice if I kept the test at TRT dose?

But, given my stores, and my goals, that also sounds ideal.

8 weeks sound good to you for this? Or is 12 okay?

Blood work was done and waiting on results. I will post as soon as received. But, I'd expect them be typical - fats/tris/chol are always not ideal - apparently genetic.


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[IronClydes]

Oh, and if I do bulk, reviewing the diet numbers already provided. Any recommendations? (Not Kel lol)

Assuming 11% bf, 210x.89=187

Lean body weight of 187 x 15 = 2804. So, perhaps a 300 (10%) surplus at 3100 with a 40/40/20 split?




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[IronClydes]

Thanks in advance for your insight brothers. Looking back at my history with you all, you have saved me and set me straight more times than I remembered. Humbling.


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[RaginCajun]

Looks like Kel has you sorted out.

Your work drug tests for AAS? Never heard of it unless you are on a riding team of some sort.

For your bulk, start with what you have there and see how you body responds in a few weeks. If no change, up the cals by another 200-300. Also, you may want to stop by Marcus' Dungeon in the Lounge, some HIT training may be just what you need to stimulate some growth

[IronClydes]

Looks like Kel has you sorted out.

Your work drug tests for AAS? Never heard of it unless you are on a riding team of some sort.

For your bulk, start with what you have there and see how you body responds in a few weeks. If no change, up the cals by another 200-300. Also, you may want to stop by Marcus' Dungeon in the Lounge, some HIT training may be just what you need to stimulate some growth

Love Marcus's HIT.

That is already planned!

This will by my second year returning to it.


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[kelkel]

Thank you, Kel.

That's where I was starting to lean towards as well.

I had used Tren for the past 3 cut cycles and was considering, however, for a bulk as I understand it is also great for that.

I tend to stray towards TRT dose test due to possible drug random testing at work....test is more likely to be tested than the other AAS...how would you modify your advice if I kept the test at TRT dose?

But, given my stores, and my goals, that also sounds ideal.

8 weeks sound good to you for this? Or is 12 okay?

Blood work was done and waiting on results. I will post as soon as received. But, I'd expect them be typical - fats/tris/chol are always not ideal - apparently genetic.


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They seriously will test you for AAS?

Long esters have to be at least 12 weeks. I'd prefer 14.
If you can't run elevated test then I'd do TRT test and lower dose tren A for 8 weeks.
Bulking or cutting is more nutrition related than drug related.

Make sure you're taking Fish Oil as well as Slo-Niacin to help with your HDL.

Using Niacin to Improve Cardiovascular Health | Life Extension

[IronClydes]

They seriously will test you for AAS?

Long esters have to be at least 12 weeks. I'd prefer 14.
If you can't run elevated test then I'd do TRT test and lower dose tren A for 8 weeks.
Bulking or cutting is more nutrition related than drug related.

Make sure you're taking Fish Oil as well as Slo-Niacin to help with your HDL.

Using Niacin to Improve Cardiovascular Health | Life Extension

Thank you, Kel.

They don't test for AAS, and haven't in the 8 years I've been here. But, at the very least, they would check testosterone levels in accordance with my regular TRT treatment if anything.

But all that is mute now. Took care of it. Doing my annual employee blood testing and my biannual testosterone treatment CBC/lipid/hormone panel right now. In line at this minute.

So, I am good to do whatever for at least the next 6 months now.

I'll share my blood results in about 3 days, unless I get them back sooner (unlikely).

So, with this newfound freedom, what do you advise?

Deca 250 with Test Cyp 500, weekly.. Or something more?

14 weeks sounds like a good bulk to me!


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[IronClydes]

Took your earlier advice and started the slo niacin about a week ago too.

Glad to see you haven't changed one bit… You're still a wealth of knowledge and resource, Kel!


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[IronClydes]

Okay.

So, all agree with the test Cyp at 500/week.

Since I already started the Tren a week ago, wouldn't it make sense to stick with it?

For dosing schedule, how does this look:

Monday's and Friday's: inject 1.25ml (250mg) Test Cyp and .75ml (150mg) Tren E?

I'll alternate between glutes and delts on those.

Additionally, I'll take Anastrozole .25 EOD and .5 Caber on injection days (twice weekly).

This will be on a 3100 calories diet (300 surplus) at 310carb/270pro/85fat.

Sound legit?


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[IronClydes]

Change of heart.

From here on out, I think I'd like to stick to Deca plus Test to bulk and Tren plus Test to cut

Still have all those orals to work in at some point however.

Any thoughts on good times to incorporate now or in the future?

Thanks fellas

Just did first injection and followed it with my first day back at HIT since last year! The burning sensation was long overdue and missed sorely...no pun intended lol


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[kelkel]

I agree on the test/deca combo. And var's a great addition to any cycle, doesn't matter front or back.

[IronClydes]

I agree on the test/deca combo. And var's a great addition to any cycle, doesn't matter front or back.

Thanks Kel.

I'll polish off the Var then with the first half since the Deca (Alin Shop) and Test Cyp (pharmaceutical) won't kick in right away anyhow. I have about 5 weeks of the Var left at 50/day (Geneza)

14 months still solid?


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

Hey Kel, here's the latest blood results...

Perhaps not the best time for that Anavar . But I see no problem sticking with the Deca /Test bulk AAS plan. You?

Started Liv52 and slo-niacin a week ago, restarted NAC the week before that.








-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[RaginCajun]

Bump for Kel and the other blood test gurus

[BG]

Sorry was busy, glad to see you back around. If I were able to run tren without to bad of sides (I get high bp and hair falls right out) I would just run that, everything else is a waste of time. You need to at least double your test (prop) from the recent cycle and run tren at reasonable dosage, be honest with your goals and dosage. What are your real goals?

[IronClydes]

Sorry was busy, glad to see you back around. If I were able to run tren without to bad of sides (I get high bp and hair falls right out) I would just run that, everything else is a waste of time. You need to at least double your test (prop) from the recent cycle and run tren at reasonable dosage, be honest with your goals and dosage. What are your real goals?

Lean bulk. Add back the muscle lost over the past 7/8 months of mountain bike racing, and then some, minus excess fat.



-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[kelkel]

Iron I think you need to hold off on your cycle for a while and get your BW in order imho. I think you said you're only a couple weeks in...

ALT/AST elevated. Yes, most of us know that muscular trauma can cause supraphysiologic elevations in these levels that can last 7-10 days or so. That said, you need to be sure that's the only reason they're elevated. Take a couple weeks off from lifting. Take more NAC and maybe add ursodiol or TUDCA along with it. Remember alcohol can contribute to this as can high protein diets..

Cholesterol sucks. Total chol doesn't mean that much imho but the rest does. Specifically take a look as how low your HDL is and how high your LDL is. Take a moment and divide your triglycerides by your HDL. The hoped for result is 2 or less which indicates almost a minimal chance of cardiac events. I believe yours is 5+. Triglycerides seem to be the only good aspect or your chol panel. Along with the Slo-Niacin add in some Red Yeast Rice powder sourced from outside the U.S.. It has natural statins in it and can make a huge difference with your LDL. The FDA regulated out all the natural statins from it inside the U.S. I use Hard Rhino brand. Worst tasting stuff ever made but it works. Several here have used it successfully. One that comes to mind is Samson.

You need to give blood asap. Preferably a DRBC donation imho. Your HCT is elevated and I know you understand the ramifications of this.

[IronClydes]

Iron I think you need to hold off on your cycle for a while and get your BW in order imho. I think you said you're only a couple weeks in...

ALT/AST elevated. Yes, most of us know that muscular trauma can cause supraphysiologic elevations in these levels that can last 7-10 days or so. That said, you need to be sure that's the only reason they're elevated. Take a couple weeks off from lifting. Take more NAC and maybe add ursodiol or TUDCA along with it. Remember alcohol can contribute to this as can high protein diets..

Cholesterol sucks. Total chol doesn't mean that much imho but the rest does. Specifically take a look as how low your HDL is and how high your LDL is. Take a moment and divide your triglycerides by your HDL. The hoped for result is 2 or less which indicates almost a minimal chance of cardiac events. I believe yours is 5+. Triglycerides seem to be the only good aspect or your chol panel. Along with the Slo-Niacin add in some Red Yeast Rice powder sourced from outside the U.S.. It has natural statins in it and can make a huge difference with your LDL. The FDA regulated out all the natural statins from it inside the U.S. I use Hard Rhino brand. Worst tasting stuff ever made but it works. Several here have used it successfully. One that comes to mind is Samson.

You need to give blood asap. Preferably a DRBC donation imho. Your HCT is elevated and I know you understand the ramifications of this.

Thank you, Kel.

I know you'd give it to me straight.

So, stop all but TRT completely in lieu of my liver enzymes and HDL/LDL?

Just so you understand, completely, I have been on Anavar for a week at least now, so that may have some bearing on those liver enzymes.

Aside from that, I'm only 36 and I have a VERY long history (like over 10 years) of my HDL, LDL, and cholesterol being like that. The doctors say that I'm a certain blood profile type and these are genetically influenced. I've spent years eating clean and off gear to improve those to little or no effect. They had tried statins on me, since it's genetically predetermined and needs to be mitigated, but the statins worsened my liver values exponentially. So, they took me off. As an afterthought, they did mention that they should have probably given my body more time to adapt. If I push them, they will likely allow me another go with them.

Liver enzymes are the same story. They are constantly in flux and average double the top end.

Now the RBC's, that I did on purpose for the race season as it directly enhanced my endurance exponentially. However, now that it's over, a donation is definitely a good idea. I had overlooked that.

Knowing what I've said regarding my HDL and LDL and total cholesterol and liver enzymes, being all rather permanent, what is your opinion?

Just donate blood and move forward? Or are you still apprehensive for me to stay on cycle?


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

I'll look into donating double blood tomorrow if possible.

Can you give me your recommended dosages for NAC, Liv52, fish oil, and the red yeast?

I'm trying to minimize my Supplements, but I will do my best if you feel it is a good idea, regardless of the history and genetics.


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[kelkel]

NAC 2400 instead of Liv
Fish Oil-2 grams combines epa/dha
RYR-spoonfull daily with any liquid that allows you to swallow it. I use warm milk usually.

Brother I'm sorry to hear about the issues. And yes, var can significantly impact liver values. This is where NAC can help as can items like TUDCA or Ursodiol.
Genetics play a part in chol for sure and I surely don't want to go against anything your doctors may have said. I can only give you my thoughts based on our brief conversations. I'd be interested in another run at statins to help with those numbers. Maybe the RYR would be a "go between" for you. Between doing nothing and going on a scripted statin. Have you ever pulled an advanced Lipo Profile where they break down your cholesterol showing exactly what type LDL particles you have, etc? It may be useful to you..

I'm aware of why you elevated your RBC's but regardless you need to dump blood asap.

Personally I'd be very apprehensive about moving forward and would want to see what my numbers would be after a couple months simply on TRT and specifically with at least 10 days to two weeks off lifting prior to pulling BW. That said, you know your history better than I do.

If you've never read this thread do so. The power of supplements:

http://forums.steroid.com/hormone-re...xperiment.html

[IronClydes]

Thank you, Kel. Okay, you have never steered me wrong. In fact, you may have saved my life a time or two . To review and confirm your advice:

Donate Drbc asap.

Start ryr; already on the rest, but I'll increase to your specified dose.

Dial diet back down to maintenance intake.

Stop Cycle and spend a couple months at TRT only.

Take 7-10 days off lifting, cardio only, before blood test. Request an advanced lipid profile for this test.

Ask doctor to consider another run of statins. He may want to try a different statin this time, it was atorvastatin last time. Is there one you'd recommend I push for?

As I still have about 80 Liv52 tabs left, continue those at what strength?

Not sure I can afford more UDCA right now, but I'll look at the RYR and UDCA for pricing. Do you know a budget friendly source you'd recommend for these? I assume that's acceptable to ask as these aren't illegal.


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

If you think it's a good idea. I can actually donate drbc twice, as there are two clinics that don't track who the other one sees.

I could do one right away, and one in a couple weeks maybe?


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

What dosages do you recommend for the slo-Niacin and, if I can get some, the UDCA or TUDCA?




-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

I feel like my body has been on a break since February due to the race season and my avoidance of extra weight.

I didn't lift intensely at all that whole time and have really been looking forward to hitting it hard, regaining muscle, and a solid bulk.

But, that being said, I want a long healthy life for my wife and kids for many years to come.

I'm not sure that my body is due for recovery as I haven't really been on anything but TRT and very low dose EQ this whole time...

But you guys know AAS, blood, and you know a whole hell of a lot more than I probably do so far. This would be my 5th cycle.

I trust your combined knowledge, experiences, and wisdom.

Guide me and I will follow.

Just know that I am REALLY in need of some heavy intense lifting, a bulk cycle with AAS support to maximize results - my sanity could use this lol

However, long term health and living is more important and if you see cause for concern....

What would you do?


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[kelkel]

Thank you, Kel. Okay, you have never steered me wrong. In fact, you may have saved my life a time or two . To review and confirm your advice:

Donate Drbc asap. one donation or drbc should be fine. Can drop you 4-6 pts from memory. Maybe a whole blood donation later on.

Start ryr;Only start RYR if you don't start statins. You don't need both. Bring up Welchol (non-statin) to your doc and see what he thinks. It won't have the same impact as a statin but it will help with LDL, HDL and blood glucose

Dial diet back down to maintenance intake. I think you should for at least 2 months or so

Stop Cycle and spend a couple months at TRT only. yes, above.

Take 7-10 days off lifting, cardio only, before blood test. Request an advanced lipid profile for this test. Do 10 if possible

Ask doctor to consider another run of statins. He may want to try a different statin this time, it was atorvastatin last time. Is there one you'd recommend I push for?None if possible! But no preference here. Again, look into Welchol plus RYR

As I still have about 80 Liv52 tabs left, continue those at what strength? Not a fan compared to NAC

Not sure I can afford more UDCA right now, but I'll look at the RYR and UDCA for pricing. Do you know a budget friendly source you'd recommend for these? I assume that's acceptable to ask as these aren't illegal. Look into tudca then. It's everywhere on line.


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

in bold above.

[TRA]

Hey Kel, here's the latest blood results...

Perhaps not the best time for that Anavar . But I see no problem sticking with the Deca /Test bulk AAS plan. You?

Started Liv52 and slo-niacin a week ago, restarted NAC the week before that.








-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

Doh! Just looked at these. Those liver enzymes are way too high my friend. I wouldn't even LOOK at a tab of anavar with those readings. The Hb/Hct reasonable for the cardio shape you're in, especially if you're at any altitude, but agree with kel on donation.
I would seriously question your HDL at that level being genetic and again would immediately DC anything that affects your cholesterol. Not saying this is the case, but it almost looks like a couple of runs took place without proper recovery between. At your age I would pay prompt attention to them.
If your diet is dialed in you can add some psyllium husk to the sups kel recommended - it has mild properties of binding with undesirable fats and helps LDL a tad, but just that.
If it were me I would definitely drop everything but TRT as kel recommended and monitor bloods.

[IronClydes]

in bold above.

Thank you, Kel.

Last injection and Anavar was Monday. So Cycle is effectively stopped.

I've already reached out to my doc. I'll keep you updated!

I'll dial down to maintenance diet now but continue to hit the weights hard… At least as hard as my elbow tendon will allow LOL

So, just toss the Liv52? Useless?

I'll grab some TUDCA to take with the rest.

Thanks again for your help.




-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

Doh! Just looked at these. Those liver enzymes are way too high my friend. I wouldn't even LOOK at a tab of anavar with those readings. The Hb/Hct reasonable for the cardio shape you're in, especially if you're at any altitude, but agree with kel on donation.
I would seriously question your HDL at that level being genetic and again would immediately DC anything that affects your cholesterol. Not saying this is the case, but it almost looks like a couple of runs took place without proper recovery between. At your age I would pay prompt attention to them.
If your diet is dialed in you can add some psyllium husk to the sups kel recommended - it has mild properties of binding with undesirable fats and helps LDL a tad, but just that.
If it were me I would definitely drop everything but TRT as kel recommended and monitor bloods.

Thanks.

Consider it done


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

Check this post out to help with my diet to address the blood results:

http://forums.steroid.com/diet-nutri...et-review.html


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[IronClydes]

So they wouldn't allow me to make a double red blood cell donation today as my iron exceeded their limit. Their limit is 18, my iron\hemoglobin was 18.5. As a result, I was only permitted to do a whole blood cell donation.

I can make another donation, double red blood cell or whole blood at another facility. What are your thoughts?


-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

[TRA]

That should have gotten you out of the woods so to speak. You were not exceptionally high. You can hydrate and recheck CBC in a few weeks, see what some of the vets say to follow also.

[kelkel]

That should have gotten you out of the woods so to speak. You were not exceptionally high. You can hydrate and recheck CBC in a few weeks, see what some of the vets say to follow also.

That's the answer ^^^

[BG]

Lean bulk. Add back the muscle lost over the past 7/8 months of mountain bike racing, and then some, minus excess fat.



-IronClydes

"Half of any battle you face in life is just showing up every day, despite how you feel"

Now that Kel has seen your blood work I would take his advice, get things back to normal then run a cycle. Plenty off time and your in great shape so no need to rush.