Nark, This is what I came up with...

[Undecided09]

This is how I see it, lemme know what you think...
LIFT(4 sets of everything):
Monday- Chest: Flat bench 7-5 reps as weight increases, Incline bench/press 7-5 as weight increases, Incline flys 8-10 as weight increases, Decline Bench/Press 10-8 as weight increases, Decline fly's 10-8 as weight increases, possibly cable crosses just to finish em up.

Upper Abs at the beginning of lift, before weight training....

Tuesday- Back ("this is" Johnny Jacksons routine supposedly): Chin ups assisted weight, in order to do sets of 15-10 as hardness increases, Deadlift 8-5 as weight increases, Wide Lat pulldows 15-10 as weight increases, Lat Row 15-10 as weight increases.

Cardio for 30 min at the end of the lift....

Wednesday- Legs: Squats 8-5 reps as weight increases, Leg Press 8-5 as weight increases, Lunges 10 reps, Leg Extensions 15-10 as weight increases, superset with Calve extensions 15-10 as weight increases....

Lower Abs at the beginning of lift (this day is my most confusing for me, cause what about hammys and Calves)....

Thursday- Arms: Barbell Curls 8-5 as weight increases, Seated d-bell curls 10-6 as weight increases, Hammers 8-6 as weight increases, Spyder Bar 15 reps-hammers 15 reps-Standing concentrations 15 reps (This is a superset to finish 4 of these as well) Skull crushers spyder bar 8-6 reps as weight increases, Overhead extensions, two handed, 8-6 reps as weight increases, Straight bar cable pull downs 15-10 reps, Single Handle pulldown 15-10 reps.....

Cardio 30 min after lift.....

Friday- Shoulders: Military press 8-6 reps as weight increases, Dumbell press 8-6 as weight increases, Seated side lateral raises 15-10 reps, Barbell Shrugs (not smith machine) 10-8 reps, Dumbell shrugs 15-10 reps, Bent over raises (rear delt move, not sure what its called) 15-10 reps....

Oblique Ab workout at begining before lift....

DIET:
2 grams of protein per pound of body weight (175x2=350 grams per day) spread out over 6 meals/shakes every three hours over the course of a day (50-60 per meal/shake)

100 carbs Max perday, majority coming in the morning or post lift...Regular flavor oatmeal in the morning with breakfast, 60-70 grams of carbs post lift, other than that, just a little bit throught my other meals....

Fat- Very low fat diet, EFA's two fish oil tabs with my NONCARB meals/shakes....

Veggies- With every whole food meal, i.e. every protein thats not a shake....

Water- with every meal, and I never stop drinking it, have a water bottle in my hand, all day every day...

SUPPLEMENTS:
Protein (Procomplex by on), GLutamine, post work out shake and bedtime shake, NO2/CE2 by MRI, Multivitamin, Ageless (for ALA) 600 miligrams with breakfast, 600 4 hours later, L-Carnitine 500 miligrams in the morning.

Thats the Plan what do you think? I really appreciate all of your input, its so helpful, and incase you can't tell I ask a million questiosn about everything, i just wanna do it right, and I want someone who has experienced the right way to tell me what to do...Thanks alot...

[*Narkissos*]

It's great that you have a plan of attack. Here's how i'd change it.. step-by-step

This is how I see it, lemme know what you think...
LIFT(4 sets of everything):
Monday- Chest: Flat bench 7-5 reps as weight increases, Incline bench/press 7-5 as weight increases, Incline flys 8-10 as weight increases, Decline Bench/Press 10-8 as weight increases, Decline fly's 10-8 as weight increases, possibly cable crosses just to finish em up.

You've 5-6 exercises listed.. I'd drop it to 3 or 4 exercises:

Dumbbell Incline+ Dumbbell Flat+ maybe decline+ one fly (either flat incline or decline: optional)

Upper Abs at the beginning of lift, before weight training....

And i'd train abs after chest.. seeing chest is the major muscle group i'd prefer you go at chest with everything you've got in you. Leave abs til after.

Tuesday- Back ("this is" Johnny Jacksons routine supposedly): Chin ups assisted weight, in order to do sets of 15-10 as hardness increases, Deadlift 8-5 as weight increases, Wide Lat pulldows 15-10 as weight increases, Lat Row 15-10 as weight increases.

Looks pretty kosher. I'm not sure if by 'lat row' you mean: "low-pulley; dumbbell row; etc" I'd suggest a barbell row there instead of a cable movement if possible.

Cardio for 30 min at the end of the lift....

Cool.

Now here's where i have a prob... Leg day and back day are too close. Deadlifts will tax the glutes/hams/erectors... and so will squats. I think you should change the order of bodyparts. Train Back first in the week. Train Chest second... Train legs on the 3rd training day. In addition i'd insert a rest day between the 2nd and 3rd day.

Wednesday- Legs: Squats 8-5 reps as weight increases, Leg Press 8-5 as weight increases, Lunges 10 reps, Leg Extensions 15-10 as weight increases, superset with Calve extensions 15-10 as weight increases....

Lower Abs at the beginning of lift (this day is my most confusing for me, cause what about hammys and Calves)....

Too many quad-dominant exercises. What about hammy and calves? (as you noted )

Drop the leg-extensions... and put in layin leg-curls. Don't superset calves and quads. The superset doesn't 'make sense'.

Simply train calves after hamstrings.

Drop abs here.. the volume of this session is already relatively high.

Train abs after arms.

Thursday- Arms: Barbell Curls 8-5 as weight increases, Seated d-bell curls 10-6 as weight increases, Hammers 8-6 as weight increases, Spyder Bar 15 reps-hammers 15 reps-Standing concentrations 15 reps (This is a superset to finish 4 of these as well) Skull crushers spyder bar 8-6 reps as weight increases, Overhead extensions, two handed, 8-6 reps as weight increases, Straight bar cable pull downs 15-10 reps, Single Handle pulldown 15-10 reps.....

Cardio 30 min after lift.....

Here i have a prob again. Why SO many exercises? Arms are a tiny muscle group. Back is times larger but you don't have these many exercises. Why? Cus it's simply overkill. Pick 1-2 exercises for Bis... and 2 exercises for tris. That's it.

Friday- Shoulders: Military press 8-6 reps as weight increases, Dumbell press 8-6 as weight increases, Seated side lateral raises 15-10 reps, Barbell Shrugs (not smith machine) 10-8 reps, Dumbell shrugs 15-10 reps, Bent over raises (rear delt move, not sure what its called) 15-10 reps....

Oblique Ab workout at begining before lift....

I'd switch this day... Train shoulders on thursday.. train arms on friday (or better yet, Saturday). On this session, why dumbbell shrugs and barbell srugs in the same session? That's like flogigng a dead horse. It's arguable that the same can be said for dumbbell presses and Military presses. Still, i'd only suggest you drop one of the srugging exercises. The rest looks kosher.

DIET:
2 grams of protein per pound of body weight (175x2=350 grams per day) spread out over 6 meals/shakes every three hours over the course of a day (50-60 per meal/shake)

Hard to stick with.. but awesome

100 carbs Max perday, majority coming in the morning or post lift...Regular flavor oatmeal in the morning with breakfast, 60-70 grams of carbs post lift, other than that, just a little bit throught my other meals....

I'd bump it to at least 150 grams honestly.

Fat- Very low fat diet, EFA's two fish oil tabs with my NONCARB meals/shakes....

You need to ingest fat to lose fat... conversely you need to ingest fat to gain muscle. 2 fish oil tabs aren't cutting it (unless they're 5 gram tabs.. which is HIGHLY unlikely). My suggestions? Re-evaluate your fat intake. Keep it 'low', but not extremely so.. or it'll be like shooting yourself in the foot.

Veggies- With every whole food meal, i.e. every protein thats not a shake....

Water- with every meal, and I never stop drinking it, have a water bottle in my hand, all day every day...

SUPPLEMENTS:
Protein (Procomplex by on), GLutamine, post work out shake and bedtime shake, NO2/CE2 by MRI, Multivitamin, Ageless (for ALA) 600 miligrams with breakfast, 600 4 hours later, L-Carnitine 500 miligrams in the morning.

Thats the Plan what do you think? I really appreciate all of your input, its so helpful, and incase you can't tell I ask a million questiosn about everything, i just wanna do it right, and I want someone who has experienced the right way to tell me what to do...Thanks alot...

Looks good.

Goodluck

~Narkissos

[Undecided09]

I really really appreciate your help. I spent atleast a half an hour typing that up last night just for you to read, in case you can't tell by the title, lol. I have a couple quick questions just to finish.
1. Do you think that abs can be done twice a week just to tone em up, and cardio three times a week will help burn that fat that is hiding them, along with a carb/fat consciencious diet doing most of the visibility work?

2. Just one hammy exercise after quads is sufficient? What are some good calve moves and how many?

3. When I say low fat I mean if I am eating a meat, thats all im eating, no dressing/sauce for the most part, because those meats obviously have some fats in them, and the EFA's are more to replace my bad fat?

4. Does 4 sets on all my moves sound good?

5. After what we've analyzed, does this plan sound like a good plan to really bring out my definition (plan I mean diet/exercise) as well as add some mass/hard dense muscle?

6. Even if I am trying to bring out my cuts, 150 grams of carbs isn't too much? and how would you recommend I distribute those throughout the day?

I just wanna thankyou alot for taking the time to go over all of this stuff from me, your guidaince is invaluable, and incase you can't tell, I love to be sure about everything before I do it, and I really really want to do this right, becasue when I do something I am committed, as long as I believe in it...

[Undecided09]

Nark, if you could help me work through those couple questions I have above I think i will be ready to get it on...

[Undecided09]

Nark, I dont know how to send a PM to let you know I want you to look at those questions, lol, so I'm tryin to keep up posts to get your attention so you;'ll know Im continuing the post,lol, I need help with the questions above...

[*Narkissos*]

I really really appreciate your help. I spent atleast a half an hour typing that up last night just for you to read, in case you can't tell by the title, lol. I have a couple quick questions just to finish.
1. Do you think that abs can be done twice a week just to tone em up, and cardio three times a week will help burn that fat that is hiding them, along with a carb/fat consciencious diet doing most of the visibility work?

I think abs should be trained like any other muscle.. If you're hitting everything else once per week.. hit abs once per week.. And if you'r edoing a twice per week split... abs should follow in the same vein.

Cardio 3 times per week should do for a start.. you're not 'fat' by conventional sense so you should be able to lose a % or two of bodyfat
through 3 times per week 30-45 minutes duration per session.

2. Just one hammy exercise after quads is sufficient? What are some good calve moves and how many?

Actually if you count squats and lunges you have 3 hamstring exercises. One direct.. two indirect. I think that should be sufficient.

Good calf exercises.. i honestly i don't think there are any 'bad' ones. I do standing calves.. or seated calf raises. Or donkey calf raises.. or calf raises on the leg-press station.

*shrugs*.. pick and exercise and hit it hard.

3. When I say low fat I mean if I am eating a meat, thats all im eating, no dressing/sauce for the most part, because those meats obviously have some fats in them, and the EFA's are more to replace my bad fat?

'k

4. Does 4 sets on all my moves sound good?

That i can't tell you. I don't know enough about you personally (i.e. the way your body reacts to exercise etc.) to speak objectively. "4" is a nice round number tho. I normally work between 3-5 sets per exercise... sometimes 2 sets.. so you get the picture. It's individualised.

5. After what we've analyzed, does this plan sound like a good plan to really bring out my definition (plan I mean diet/exercise) as well as add some mass/hard dense muscle?

Add some muscle.. get leaner.. yes.

Get HUGE.. and RIPPED.. no.

The two are separate events. You've got to have a foundation (achieved by many years hard training.. and adequate caloric consumption) to have dense underlying muscle.

It's a good plan granted.

But i personally think you should be concerned with bulking if you end goal is to be "dense".

6. Even if I am trying to bring out my cuts, 150 grams of carbs isn't too much? and how would you recommend I distribute those throughout the day?

I think 150 is just enough. You're not trying to starve for Pete's sake. You need carbs to train hard... Training hard is necessary for muscle gain/maintenance.

Distribution hmm.. that's touch-and-go

Personally i like to spread my carbs evenly through-out the day.. taking carbs in at each meal
Carbs + healthy fats + protein

Some prefer carb timing: i.e. taking in carbs at the points of higher insulin sensitivity: breakfast; pwo; post-pwo

You've got to experiment to find the best route.

Start with small amounts of carbs at each meal spaced evenly throughtout the day.. assess how that works for you ...or doesn't.

I just wanna thankyou alot for taking the time to go over all of this stuff from me, your guidaince is invaluable, and incase you can't tell, I love to be sure about everything before I do it, and I really really want to do this right, becasue when I do something I am committed, as long as I believe in it...

Good stuff man

Hope i've been of some help

Good luck

~Narkissos

[Undecided09]

Ok so today was the first day of cardio, 30 min on the bike, 325 cals burned, 10 miles biked, is that pretty standard? Does that seem sufficient for cutting?

[Undecided09]

bump for you IB

[IBdmfkr]

Nark covered it. Couldn't have said it better. Follow that advice and you'll make great gains until you can individulize what your body responds to. Then you can alter it as needed to make even better gains.

Btw, list a sample diet that you follow. What you had listed is too broad to critique.

Ex.

9am - dozen eggs (6whites), 2cups oatmeal.

11am - 35g Whey + 2tbsn Flax

1:30pm - 6oz Chicken + 1.5cups brown rice

etc
etc

[*Narkissos*]

Ok so today was the first day of cardio, 30 min on the bike, 325 cals burned, 10 miles biked, is that pretty standard? Does that seem sufficient for cutting?

possibly.

Personally i never look at the electronically generated 'number of calories burnt'.. because imo it isn't very accurate.

If you're getting in at least 4 session per week 30 minutes should do fine.

When you hit a plateau.. bump it to 45 minutes.

[Liftnainez]

great thread here... nark you did a great job answering the questions.. this helped many people out.. thanks bro

[charlie20]

Livtnainez said it, great thread, helped me out and good luck undecided!