Educated cycle at 18

[susticous]

Hey guys, before posting the usual "eat, eat, eat" and "chicknbol and riceobol" replies I would appreciate the time and effort to post only educated replies after reading through.

NO, I have not made up my mind on using gear at 18 meaning the "fk this guy he will do it anyways, let him die" replies are not needed.

I have been researching for about 9 months to a year and honestly I am still researching like almost everyone will/should be.
I appreciate all replies based on experience or personal opinion, positive and negative, as long as they include reasons and evidence.

Honestly I understand a lot of you have read many posts like this and will be infuriated that another kid is thinking of ruining his life, but in saying that I also believe I am weighing up the odds with all fairness.

Please do not treat this as another '18 year old cycle post' as most of those posts consist of guys saying "Hey brahs, want to get juicy as fuark for futures and festivals, reckon there are any risks taking tren ace without any base test??!!" I am being completely honest and will make no excuses such as 'my brother is thinking of cycling'.

Background information:
-18 years old
-3 years background training since 15 (2 years serious training at 6 days a week)
-188cm tall (6,2)
-bulked to 94kg before shredding down to 85kg at 10-11%bf (Which I am at now)
-I consult a nutritionist every two months on diet and calorie intake (diet is solid)
-I have had blood tests which came back showing testosterone levels below average for my age, not alarmingly below but just below.
-two serious knee injuries one 2 years ago and one 1 year ago.
-30 minute cardiac vascular training every morning

No I do not believe I have reached my maximum genetic potential but in saying that in my opinion I don't believe anyone has no matter how far along they are.

Other points:
-Yes I am committed to this and will do things properly and take in all information
-No I am not doing this to impress girls or 'rake poon' or to be a lad sport star in school/uni
-Yes I understand the POSSIBLE risks.

My proposed cycle:
Week Test C D-Bol Aromasin HcG Nolva Clomid Proviron
1 600mg/2 20mg/ed On Hand 500mg/2 50mg/ed
2 600mg/2 20mg/ed 500mg/2 50mg/ed
3 600mg/2 25mg/ed 500mg/2 50mg/ed
4 600mg/2 25mg/ed 500mg/2 50mg/ed
5 600mg/2 25mg/ed 500mg/2 50mg/ed
6 600mg/2 25mg/ed 500mg/2 50mg/ed
7 600mg/2 500mg/2 50mg/ed
8 600mg/2 500mg/2 50mg/ed
9 600mg/2 500mg/2 50mg/ed
10 600mg/2 500mg/2 50mg/ed
11 600mg/2 500mg/2 50mg/ed
12 600mg/2 500mg/2 50mg/ed
13 1000mg/2 50mg/ed
14 1000mg/2 50mg/ed
15 40mg/ed 100mg/ed 50mg/ed
16 40mg/ed 100mg/ed 50mg/ed
17 20mg/ed 50mg/ed 50mg/ed
18 20mg/ed 50mg/ed 50mg/ed


Please only legitimate help and advice, I understand some of you will have the opinion 'have fun having a limp dick for ever' but I believe anyone with a good understanding will know this isn't accurate.
Also I understand the endocrine system risks and stunting my growth/TRT being needed but do not believe this will be the case, also no scientific backing of steroids stunting growth has been found. Also the endocrine system is shut-down by oestrogen and not testosterone, I believe my proposed cycle will contain oestrogen very well (almost no sides)

I am a real fan of the quote "there is no such thing as too young, but rather too dumb"

Cheers guys.

[EquilibriumZ]

You clearly havent researched properly in these 9 months. Read austinite's educational threads.

Do not post until you read them all.

[EquilibriumZ]

Here is link http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...-database.html

[NACH3]

I think it's way too much gear on a fist cycke regardless of age! Plus we do get this a lot but I think from what I see your doing clomid on cycle and PCT??

I'm also confused how you wrote your proposed cycle(though I don't think you need to yet but that's your decision... I respect the fact that your ready to listen as opposed to just saying in doing it regardless, etc! Try and do this so we can help!

Wk 1-12 test e
Wk 1-4 ??
HCG on cycle at 250iu 2x wkly not at end
AI ???
Etc!

Thx!

[NACH3]

I Still think you can grow natty too!

[susticous]

I think it's way too much gear on a fist cycke regardless of age! Plus we do get this a lot but I think from what I see your doing clomid on cycle and PCT??

I'm also confused how you wrote your proposed cycle(though I don't think you need to yet but that's your decision... I respect the fact that your ready to listen as opposed to just saying in doing it regardless, etc! Try and do this so we can help!

Wk 1-12 test e
Wk 1-4 ??
HCG on cycle at 250iu 2x wkly not at end
AI ???
Etc!

Thx!

Sorry about the cycle being messed up, I have attached an image of it to make things clearer.

Too much gear in terms of the Dbol or just too much test?
Cheers for the reply!

[Bio-Active]

Please take the time to read the sticky..... Planning and executing my first successful cycle

[lovbyts]

I am a real fan of the quote "there is no such thing as too young, but rather too dumb"

Cheers guys.

Do you know who says that? Only the young. As you get older/more mature you realize that is far from the truth.

[susticous]

You clearly havent researched properly in these 9 months. Read austinite's educational threads.

Do not post until you read them all.

Thanks for the reply, I read through her post about first cycle and HPTA system.
Yes steroids run a huge risk of shutting down the HPTA system to a point where they cannot be restarted but there has been no such link that doing steroids at 18 or 30 changes the chances of it being shut-down, also I believe (could be wrong) my cycle should adequately start up my HPTA system?

Also should have mentioned I have had X-rays on my growth plates showing they have been 95% fused, I was told it's only 95% due to small amounts of growth always being possible.

I respect your reply but "clearly havent researched properly" is a bit ignorant.

Cheers.

[susticous]

Please take the time to read the sticky..... Planning and executing my first successful cycle

I have done this, cheers for the reply.

[Bio-Active]

I have done this, cheers for the reply.

then are you ignoring it? It spells out your first cycle in the sticky for you

[susticous]

Do you know who says that? Only the young. As you get older/more mature you realize that is far from the truth.

I completely agree that many young people will say this in attempt to justify potentially ruining their lives but many older wiser people have also said this.

Any 40 year old male can run a tren ace only cycle and ruin their body just like a 18 year old can. Besides this why is it far from the truth?

Cheers man!

[susticous]

I Still think you can grow natty too!

I completely agree, but so can almost everyone!

[susticous]

then are you ignoring it? It spells out your first cycle in the sticky for you

No I am not completely ignoring it, I just think everyone has a way of doing things, that first cycle plan did not include proviron which I believe is a must.

I'd like to think my cycle plans and general goals are pretty similar? Saying someone needs to stick to that first cycle plan is completely ridiculous, in my own opinion.

[lovbyts]

I completely agree that many young people will say this in attempt to justify potentially ruining their lives but many older wiser people have also said this.

Any 40 year old male can run a tren ace only cycle and ruin their body just like a 18 year old can. Besides this why is it far from the truth?

Cheers man!

True but at 40 your HPTA is fully matured and you dont have to worry about fusing their growth plates prematurely. 18 your growth plates are not fused, you are not done growing no matter what you think, science proves this. Your HPTA is not matured and it's easier to damage it and seriously damage your natural testosterone production.

[susticous]

True but at 40 your HPTA is fully matured and you dont have to worry about fusing their growth plates prematurely. 18 your growth plates are not fused, you are not done growing no matter what you think, science proves this. Your HPTA is not matured and it's easier to damage it and seriously damage your natural testosterone production.

Cheers for being level with me man and not condescending. I agree that most people are not done growing but from 18-24 the rate of growth is minimal. Science does prove that but science does not prove that there is a higher risk of damaging you HPTA system by running gear at a younger age, yes indeed it does prove that there can be more risks though! But in most cycle situations the HPTA system is seriously suppressed or shut-down, the problem occurs when arrogant 18 year olds believe they do not need proper PCT to start it back up.

Also like I forgot to mention my growth plates are done growing, proven by X-rays.

[kelkel]

If you've been researching for 9 months then you should know that an AI is not "on hand." It needs to be taken as you'll "contain" nothing without taking it.
You do not need dbol and there no need for proviron, especially in pct.
You're 18 and your natural test levels are low. Finding out why should be step one, not cycling.

All that said, it's great to see you researching but honestly, you should be figuring out why you're natural levels are low and fixing that, first and foremost. Steroids can wait.

[AllKindsOGains]

I would like this to be delved into a little further. I agree with everyone promoting abstinence, but maybe there could be a thread dedicated to the science behind it? Or, something totally different, an attempt to see if it's possible to have a cycle at a young age prove to be safe? For example, I have spent ridiculous amounts of money on either bogus or barely useful supplements, wheras a low dose test e cycle, properly planned and executed, would make all of those moot. Would it be possible? Anyway, I love the comraderie here, and that everyone seems to look out for each other, especially the young ones. Abstinence is always safest

[Bio-Active]

No I am not completely ignoring it, I just think everyone has a way of doing things, that first cycle plan did not include proviron which I believe is a must. I'd like to think my cycle plans and general goals are pretty similar? Saying someone needs to stick to that first cycle plan is completely ridiculous, in my own opinion.

why do you think it's ridiculous? Maybe you know something that we don't?

[kelkel]

the problem occurs when arrogant 18 year olds believe they do not need proper PCT to start it back up.

So, exactly what is "proper pct" and how do you know it will be effective for you? Yes, we all support a certain pct program but in reality it's still a crap shoot as to how well (or even if) you recover to near normal levels.

[lovbyts]

Cheers for being level with me man and not condescending. I agree that most people are not done growing but from 18-24 the rate of growth is minimal. Science does prove that but science does not prove that there is a higher risk of damaging you HPTA system by running gear at a younger age, yes indeed it does prove that there can be more risks though! But in most cycle situations the HPTA system is seriously suppressed or shut-down, the problem occurs when arrogant 18 year olds believe they do not need proper PCT to start it back up.

Also like I forgot to mention my growth plates are done growing, proven by X-rays.

What 18yr old actually gets x-rays to check growth plates? Sort of hard to believe any doctor would do this without a good reason.

Yes the growth from 18-24 is minimal, at least in height but it's not so minimal as in broadening out. I would say my shoulders got wider and chest bigger well past 25.

[lovbyts]

OK I just realized what's going on the last couple of week. It's almost spring break.

I'm out... Time to check out of the lounge for a while.

[AllKindsOGains]

Lol

[susticous]

If you've been researching for 9 months then you should know that an AI is not "on hand." It needs to be taken as you'll "contain" nothing without taking it.
You do not need dbol and there no need for proviron, especially in pct.
You're 18 and your natural test levels are low. Finding out why should be step one, not cycling.

All that said, it's great to see you researching but honestly, you should be figuring out why you're natural levels are low and fixing that, first and foremost. Steroids can wait.

They are not dangerously low, they are just below average, the doctor said it might just be time of day, I went back another time and same results, concluded it was just the way I am (genetics) as my father is suffering from low testosterone in his 50's. The doctor said it is not of concern so nothing should be done.
I will adjust my cycle to include the aromasin instead of on hand.
Why no need for proviron?

Cheers for the help!

[susticous]

I would like this to be delved into a little further. I agree with everyone promoting abstinence, but maybe there could be a thread dedicated to the science behind it? Or, something totally different, an attempt to see if it's possible to have a cycle at a young age prove to be safe? For example, I have spent ridiculous amounts of money on either bogus or barely useful supplements, wheras a low dose test e cycle, properly planned and executed, would make all of those moot. Would it be possible? Anyway, I love the comraderie here, and that everyone seems to look out for each other, especially the young ones. Abstinence is always safest

I agree! But testing steroids on minors will never be allowed.. Maybe.

[susticous]

why do you think it's ridiculous? Maybe you know something that we don't?

Do you believe in such thing as 'one cycle fits all'? Maybe someone is allergic to certain compounds, what then?
Cheers for the replies!

[susticous]

So, exactly what is "proper pct" and how do you know it will be effective for you? Yes, we all support a certain pct program but in reality it's still a crap shoot as to how well (or even if) you recover to near normal levels.

Well what I meant by that is ignoring PCT completely.
I agree with you, just like I said a certain cycle will not suit everyone just like PCT.

[kelkel]

What exactly is your T level and the range used? I'd be interested in seeing your BW.

[susticous]

What 18yr old actually gets x-rays to check growth plates? Sort of hard to believe any doctor would do this without a good reason.

Yes the growth from 18-24 is minimal, at least in height but it's not so minimal as in broadening out. I would say my shoulders got wider and chest bigger well past 25.

I have no reason to lie, when injured I had many X-rays and eventually had full body X-rays under the 'might as well' idea from my surgeon. I am not sure on the broadening out but believe it is in the same boat as height? Otherwise broadening out is caused by muscle growth and ligament changes.

[susticous]

What exactly is your T level and the range used? I'd be interested in seeing your BW.

The doctor pulled it up on his computer and ran through it, I never got an actual copy. I am definitely not saying I want to or believe I need gear to fix a small low testosterone problem.

Cheers for the interest man!

[susticous]

OK I just realized what's going on the last couple of week. It's almost spring break.

I'm out... Time to check out of the lounge for a while.

Australia mate :')

Cheers for the help!

[Bio-Active]

Do you believe in such thing as 'one cycle fits all'? Maybe someone is allergic to certain compounds, what then? Cheers for the replies!

yes I do test only for your first cycle with hcg and an ai.

[NACH3]

Really you should get your BW done to see where you are as Kel stated... Along w/not cycling at your age! All the proven science on growth plates, im mature HPTA! This is all proven by science! Reconsider...

[AllKindsOGains]

yes I do test only for your first cycle with hcg and an ai.

Do you think there would ever be a way to have a safe cycle at this age? I was thinking test only at an extremely low dose, along with as perfect a pct as is possible. Hypothetically of course.

[PT]

Man I need to give you props, you came in with a plan and know exactly what to say. I started around your age and luckily font have any issues but if I could go back in time I would of waited until I had my diet and workout in check. I found out over the years that your going to do what you want so just make sure you read over every possible article on here

[The Deadlifting Dog]

Do you think there would ever be a way to have a safe cycle at this age? I was thinking test only at an extremely low dose, along with as perfect a pct as is possible. Hypothetically of course.

There are safer ways than others but all ways have an inherent risk.
Remember, the HPTA is still developing so by shutting it down for 3-4 months it may have it maximal output lessened since it is has less in which to fully mature.

[Bio-Active]

Do you think there would ever be a way to have a safe cycle at this age? I was thinking test only at an extremely low dose, along with as perfect a pct as is possible. Hypothetically of course.

there is no such thing as a safe cycle at any age. There is always risks. I don't think at his age the risk is worth it no

[AllKindsOGains]

So the real battle here is trying to get somebody to be ok with a young person taking the risk. A losing battle for support. Of course it's better to lose this battle.

[monster-ish]

Do you think there would ever be a way to have a safe cycle at this age? I was thinking test only at an extremely low dose, along with as perfect a pct as is possible. Hypothetically of course.

What do you consider a low test dose? Anything under 500 a week doesn't seem worth the time to me why risk doing a cycle with minimal results

[AllKindsOGains]

Have you cycled with anything less than 500?