Novice about to begin using but not sure which to use

[mkrulic]

Looks likt to me you are the only person in the thread saying that. . .oh and a quote from Anthony Roberts, I believe it was. . .

Pst. . .I will let you in on a secret. . .test is test. And with sust, you will get more actual hormone than straight cyp or enanthate. 3 of the four esters are shorter than either Cyp or Enan. (only 1 carbon molecule difference in the two)

Shorter esters = less total weight consumed by the ester chain. Dosage is total weight of the compound per ml. (ie 250mg/ml) so of that 250mg, more of that weight is test in Sust than in Enan or cyp.

If you shoot sust ED or EOD, your sides should be no different than any other test and your blood levels will be stable. The more frequently you shoot ANY gear, the better off you will be. The big mistake people make is thinking you can shoot it 2x per week.

The only drawback to Sust is it usually costs more.

more hormone does not mean more hormone in your sys. enan and cyp might weigh more than prop but you will have more test in your sys using longer chain esters becuase of the way they build up.

[kynetguy]

more hormone does not mean more hormone in your sys. enan and cyp might weigh more than prop but you will have more test in your sys using longer chain esters becuase of the way they build up.

But on longer esters, the actual peak value is lower. If you look at the release rate of a long vs short ester, the short ester releases all its hormone over a shorter time period. However, 500 a week is 500 a week. Once your levels are stable, you are still taking 500 a week. . .

a 100mg of prop will release in 3 days vs 250 of enan over 10-14 days.

Do you have any links or documentation on this?

None the less, at the end of a given cycle length, you will have had more hormone with prop than enan. Or any other short ester when compared to a long ester.

[football3355]

But on longer esters, the actual peak value is lower. If you look at the release rate of a long vs short ester, the short ester releases all its hormone over a shorter time period. However, 500 a week is 500 a week. Once your levels are stable, you are still taking 500 a week. . .

a 100mg of prop will release in 3 days vs 250 of enan over 10-14 days.

Do you have any links or documentation on this?

None the less, at the end of a given cycle length, you will have had more hormone with prop than enan. Or any other short ester when compared to a long ester.

I see what you mean, but besides this fact, I just want a short esterfied molecule like prop since it will work FASTER, since I have never used before and like some people ave stated, I have "virgin" receptors and I dont want to wait 3 weeks for enanth to start working. I rather pay a little extra (or the same where I am thnking of going) especially since the acual steroid will work kind of like test susp in the beginning weeks unlike enanth. plus less bloat and overall detection is much less and if i realize the dose it too high or too low, I can change it quick without having a depot delay like enanth would.

also how long should I run test prop at 50mg-100mg per day? (wks)

[mkrulic]

But on longer esters, the actual peak value is lower. If you look at the release rate of a long vs short ester, the short ester releases all its hormone over a shorter time period. However, 500 a week is 500 a week. Once your levels are stable, you are still taking 500 a week. . .

a 100mg of prop will release in 3 days vs 250 of enan over 10-14 days.

Do you have any links or documentation on this?

None the less, at the end of a given cycle length, you will have had more hormone with prop than enan. Or any other short ester when compared to a long ester.

just plug in the numbers and see for yourself.

[kynetguy]

just plug in the numbers and see for yourself.

Plug what numbers in where?

Lets compare Prop and Cyp:

Every 100 mg you inject, Cyp gives you 69.90mg of actual hormone and prop gives you 83.72mg.


For a 500mg/week cycle you get 349.50mg with Cyp and 418.60mg with prop.

Over a 10 week cycle you are getting 691mg more of test with the shorter ester. (3,495mg Cyp vs 4,186mg Prop)

Three days after your last Prop inj it basically has exhausted itself, compared to 10-14 days with Cyp. (see PCT Start times as another reference for this)

So in 10 weeks and 3 days you will have had 4,186mg of actual Test with prop. This considers a shot every day with the last one being at the last day of 10 weeks and having an effective release of 3 days.

In 11 weeks and 3.5days you will have had 3,495mg of actual test with Cyp. This consideres that you take Cyp every 3.5 days with the last shot being at 9 weeks and 3.5days and having an effective release over 2 weeks.

SO, how can a longer ester give you a higher level at anytime in the cycle when you consider:

1) Mg per mg you get more hormone with a short ester.
2) The hormone is released more quicky with a shorter ester.

If you get more in a less time, your peaks are going to be higher.

[mkrulic]

Plug what numbers in where?

Lets compare Prop and Cyp:

Every 100 mg you inject, Cyp gives you 69.90mg of actual hormone and prop gives you 83.72mg.


For a 500mg/week cycle you get 349.50mg with Cyp and 418.60mg with prop.

Over a 10 week cycle you are getting 691mg more of test with the shorter ester. (3,495mg Cyp vs 4,186mg Prop)

Three days after your last Prop inj it basically has exhausted itself, compared to 10-14 days with Cyp. (see PCT Start times as another reference for this)

So in 10 weeks and 3 days you will have had 4,186mg of actual Test with prop. This considers a shot every day with the last one being at the last day of 10 weeks and having an effective release of 3 days.

In 11 weeks and 3.5days you will have had 3,495mg of actual test with Cyp. This consideres that you take Cyp every 3.5 days with the last shot being at 9 weeks and 3.5days and having an effective release over 2 weeks.

SO, how can a longer ester give you a higher level at anytime in the cycle when you consider:

1) Mg per mg you get more hormone with a short ester.
2) The hormone is released more quicky with a shorter ester.

If you get more in a less time, your peaks are going to be higher.

its not linear. google exponential decay. I dont have a calculator so you are going to have to punch the numbers in yourself but here is the formula if you are shooting 100mg of test p and 70mg of test e
test e
70*(.5)^(t/7)
after 1 week we would have (injecting ed)
70*(.5)^(1/7) + 70*(.5)^(2/7) + 70*(.5)^(3/7) + 70*(.5)^(4/7) +
+ 70*(.5)^(5/7) + 70*(.5)^(6/7) + 70*(.5)^(7/7)

the prop is done the same way. only instead of a 7 put in a 2. instead of 70 use 100
I think it will overtake in a week but it might take two.

[kynetguy]

its not linear. google exponential decay. I dont have a calculator so you are going to have to punch the numbers in yourself but here is the formula if you are shooting 100mg of test p and 70mg of test e
test e
70*(.5)^(t/7)
after 1 week we would have (injecting ed)
70*(.5)^(1/7) + 70*(.5)^(2/7) + 70*(.5)^(3/7) + 70*(.5)^(4/7) +
+ 70*(.5)^(5/7) + 70*(.5)^(6/7) + 70*(.5)^(7/7)

the prop is done the same way. only instead of a 7 put in a 2. instead of 70 use 100
I think it will overtake in a week but it might take two.

You have to have your decays on actual usage. IE: Enen at 250mg every 3.5 days and prop at 75mg ED. (75 ED actually gives you 525 a weeks, so for apples to apples you should use 71.43mg/day)

Exponential decay does work to a degree, but it is not taking into consideration the actual amount of raw hormone. Unfortunately, with enan you get less effective hormone than with prop.

You are right, it is not linear at all. Everything you inject comes on in a wave. Which is why frequency is so important. the closer these waves are together, the more stable your levels remain.

I will play with your formula. I am not certain this is the right formula for this. Because unlike something like a radioactive isotope which has a predictable and constant half-life, the esters slow the release of the hormone.

What has to be considered is the actual release rate. Since, for example, prop slows by 2-3 days, it is not until day two or three that a particular injection has released all its hormone. You will get SOME release along the way, but the bulk of its load is released close to the end of the ester life rather than in the middle. So, I do not believe that we are dealing with a true half life here.