Hcg?

**378feetdeep** · 01-29-2009, 07:03 PM

ok...so i'm wondering if I need hcg or not. From what i've read it seems like a must but, browsing through this forum I don't see to many people talking about it that much for a basic test cycle. i mostly only see people using clomid and nolvadex.

here are my stats and cycle plan. I just took my first injection today

I'm 24, 5'5" 176lbs.
This is my first cycle. I have 10 years of mma/lifting experience. fairly solid cardio.

.5cc shots eod

100mg (each) of prop, enanthate and cypionate per week

Now, from what i've gathered from this website my pct should look somthing like this?:

25 mg of proviron daily through cycle into pct

then 18 days after last injection start:

20 mg Nolvadex and 50 mg clomid daily for about 4 weeks
hcg (pregnyl maybe?)
1, 5000 i.u. shot once every three days (three times) then 3 more shots 5 days apart for a total of 6 shots

**Mammon** · 01-29-2009, 07:09 PM

could use it but HCG is not necessary..
will be fine with clomid and nolvadex

**378feetdeep** · 01-29-2009, 07:14 PM

that's kind of what i thought...thank you

**Pinnacle** · 01-29-2009, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by 378feetdeep

ok...so i'm wondering if I need hcg or not. From what i've read it seems like a must but, browsing through this forum I don't see to many people talking about it that much for a basic test cycle. i mostly only see people using clomid and nolvadex.

For a simple, low dose test cycle like you plan on running. HCG most likely wouldn't be needed. HCG really helps when you run more suppressive drugs like Tren, or Deca, for example.

As for your PCT drugs. Pick one. Either Clomid, or Nolvadex. Using both is a poor choice, and why it's touted on this board I haven't any idea.

I'm a huge advocate of short Prop cycles,and I have all my trainee's run them.
Nolvadex is all they use,and they recover much faster than when they tried clomid. Myself included. I personally think Clomid is a lousy PCT drug. Nolvadex has been shown countless times to raise test levels rapidly in men. Clomid works, but it comes with nasty sides for many people.

**Immortal Soldier** · 01-29-2009, 07:19 PM

Why are you running 3 different tests? (Prop, Ethan, and Cyp)

**Mammon** · 01-29-2009, 07:21 PM

believe its a blend

**Pinnacle** · 01-29-2009, 07:24 PM

Originally Posted by Immortal Soldier

Why are you running 3 different tests? (Prop, Ethan, and Cyp)

LOL. I need to put on my glasses. I noticed just the prop only..haha

I can see running prop throughout with EITHER Enanthate or Cyp, but both is pointless since they are almost identical in chemical structure. Like 1 atom to be more accurate

**Pinnacle** · 01-29-2009, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by Mammon

believe its a blend

You BELIEVE or you know? Which is it?

**Mammon** · 01-29-2009, 07:28 PM

read his other thread.. ITS A BLEND

**Mammon** · 01-29-2009, 07:30 PM

i remember these little details..mind like a steel trap.. lol

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=373256

**Immortal Soldier** · 01-29-2009, 07:36 PM

What a stupid blend, who puts 2 identical tests in a blend with prop?

**378feetdeep** · 01-29-2009, 08:48 PM

yea, it maybe pointless to blend the 2 but it's all that I could get a hold of from someone i trust. this is my first cycle so i don't really know anyone to go through. The guy I got it from is a good friend and he had really decent results on it.

**jbm** · 01-29-2009, 09:02 PM

IMO! Test enth would enough.
Thanks!

**Big_Intruder** · 01-30-2009, 05:20 AM

Originally Posted by Immortal Soldier

What a stupid blend, who puts 2 identical tests in a blend with prop?

organon???

infact there are 4 esters:
Sustanon '250' :
Each 1mL ampoule or 1 ml disposable syringe of Sustanon '250' contains the active
ingredients:
Testosterone Propionate 30 mg
Testosterone Phenylpropionate 60 mg
Testosterone Isocaproate 60mg
Testosterone Decanoate 100mg
and the inactive ingredients benzyl alcohol 10% and arachis oil making up the volume.

**Immortal Soldier** · 01-30-2009, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by Big_Intruder

infact there are 4 esters:
Sustanon '250' :
Each 1mL ampoule or 1 ml disposable syringe of Sustanon '250' contains the active
ingredients:
Testosterone Propionate 30 mg
Testosterone Phenylpropionate 60 mg
Testosterone Isocaproate 60mg
Testosterone Decanoate 100mg
and the inactive ingredients benzyl alcohol 10% and arachis oil making up the volume.

Thanks for the science lesson, but I know about Sus and it has 4 esters, my point was why make a two esters of the same test and mix it with prop when Sus is already available?

Makes no sense other than the fact the dealer is trying to save money and not make Sus.

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-30-2009, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

For a simple, low dose test cycle like you plan on running. HCG most likely wouldn't be needed. HCG really helps when you run more suppressive drugs like Tren, or Deca, for example.

As for your PCT drugs. Pick one. Either Clomid, or Nolvadex. Using both is a poor choice, and why it's touted on this board I haven't any idea.

I'm a huge advocate of short Prop cycles,and I have all my trainee's run them.
Nolvadex is all they use,and they recover much faster than when they tried clomid. Myself included. I personally think Clomid is a lousy PCT drug. Nolvadex has been shown countless times to raise test levels rapidly in men. Clomid works, but it comes with nasty sides for many people.

so what you are saying is you are more shut down on in cycles with tren or deca - thats about some bs. Shut down is shut down - period. Also if you dont see the benefit of reducing sides by combining a low dose of nolva and clomid (which clomid IS more effective in restoring hpta function based on 15 years experience AND studies re: male fertility) then you are missing something and seem to have bought into anecdotal misnomers that state the effect of both is exactly the same re: restoring lh / fsh / etc.... I havent seen you here much but you put out some opinionated BS from what i see...

**Pinnacle** · 01-30-2009, 10:37 PM

.............Ah, the internet troll is stalking me..ROFL @ this loser

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

so what you are saying is you are more shut down on in cycles with tren or deca - thats about some bs.No, I was refering to Drugs like deca being harsh. Since you haven't any experience with drugs, let me tell you aboutTren, or Deca. People get far more testicular atrophy than opposed to test. So I was saying HCG would certainly be more beneficial when running harsh, very suppressive drug like tren/deca where recovery is prolonged over a simple test only cycle. Some day when you are experienced and get blood work done after cycles, you'll see. We'll that's if a loser like you would ever be able to afford blood work.

Shut down is shut down - period.No sh*t punk

.... I havent seen you here much but you put out some opinionated BS from what i see...Reason you don't see any Experienced members in this forum anymore is becuase of punks like you. Most of us have forgotten more than your pencil neck, pathetic excuse for a man, will ever know.

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-30-2009, 10:46 PM

*L* 40 years old ..juicing for 15 years ....getting bloodwork for years ....yeah thats me an inexperinced punk *L* - get a clue bro ....you have no idea what i know....thats obvious...
How about you go measure your testicular atrophy after your tren containing cycles and then compare your nut measurements to your post "less supressive cycles"...you know provide more useful info like that...cause you have less testicular function when you take 19nors compared to test right? Get a clue....
Now if u want to get into why hcg may be more useful in recovery while using say for example tren, we can do that ...lets just stop posting stupid nonsense ok ? How about that?
Oh not smart ass comments on the nolva / clomid either huh?
all i "know" from your posts is u are a jackass......

**Pinnacle** · 01-30-2009, 10:57 PM

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

*L* 40 years old ..juicing for 15 years ....getting bloodwork for years ....yeah thats me an inexperinced punk *L* - get a clue bro ....

Ah even worse. The fat pathetic piece of sh*t that thinks he's a know it all at 40. Where's you pics fat boy? Come on punk, I'm 40 yrs old as well. Unlike you, I have size. Know why I have size punk? Because unlike your pathetic a*sI follow a tight diet yr round, train my f*cking a*s off, and unlike your pathetic a*s, understand and practice proper drug use

Get it FAT BOY? Do you, fat F*ck?

Where's YOUR PICTURES MR. STEROID GURU. COME ON FAT BOY. JUST ONE PIC OF YOUR F*CKING CHICKEN LEGS.

ROFL @ THIS 40 yr OLD TROLL. BWHAHAHAHAHA//F*CKING LOSER!

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-30-2009, 11:03 PM

*L* get a life ...and a clue ....
I see what you do - when someone proves how stupid you really are you change the topic and insult them ....
What a Loser.......
Again too stupid to understand why no pics....what an insecure , sad sack you are....

**Mammon** · 01-30-2009, 11:07 PM

not to argue.. dont want to get into a pissing match like yesterday.. lol.. im drama free tonight..
but one doesnt have to be a monster to have a high level of knowledge on the subject..
Nandi for example, older guy,not a monster.. one of the brightest minds we had in this game.. his knowledge is missed.. bigcat, another bright guy, not the most likeable character but pretty wise none the less.. atleast his ideas are thought provoking and atleast lead me to do more research.. but Nandi was the man i learned the most from over the years.. he was a great guy..

**Pinnacle** · 01-30-2009, 11:11 PM

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

*L* get a life ...and a clue ....
I see what you do - when someone proves how stupid you really are you change the topic and insult them ....
What a Loser.......
Again too stupid to understand why no pics....what an insecure , sad sack you are....

BWAHAHAAA look at the f*cking bit*ch coward run away. You aren't posting pics becuase you don't have any physique. WE ALL KNOW IT, you f*cking loser. GET IT NOW?

Lastly, you've proven only that you"re a 40 yr old internet troll . If you think you've proven me wrong by taking my posts out of text, you are even more delusional than I originally thought you were.You've proven only that you're a f*cking coward bit*ch, that you are and always will be.

See ya round PUNK! And learn how to spell if you want someone to "actually" give a f*ck what vomit you spew off your fingers tips

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-30-2009, 11:16 PM

yeah hows that nolva /clomid theory of yours doing?

Or the more testicular atrophy with 19 nors ...thats why hcg helps more theory ?? ( i mean i know you prob dont know enough to discuss the real reasons hcg may be more helpful - but saying stupid shit over and over)
*L*

Oh wait - should i respond for you ....you don't have pics....your tiny.....your a troll....

*L*
Get a life ....

**Pinnacle** · 01-30-2009, 11:29 PM

..........

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

yeah hows that nolva /clomid theory of yours doing? Theory? What therory? I have probably 20 blood panels to show Nolvadex is superior for ME and all my trainee's over a 15 yr span. You have what? A study? ROFL

Or the more testicular atrophy with 19 nors ...thats why hcg helps more theory ?? Your lack of experience shines through if you don't know drugs like tren/deca cuase testicular atrophy. But you wouldn't know. You never used them. Not surprised the least bit

*L*
Get a life ...Unlike your pathetic a*s, I have a wonderful life. Several very successful bushiness. Fiancee' that's a self made entrepreneur.And that comes to you and your pathetic self. Loser is putting it too kindly in your case. I'd use bigger words, but since you can't spell, I won't stress you out having to use an on line dictionary

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-30-2009, 11:30 PM

we can talk about it in philly.....

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-30-2009, 11:32 PM

Theory? What therory? I have probably 20 blood panels to show Nolvadex is superior for ME and all my trainee's over a 15 yr span. You have what? A study? ROFL
15 years and bloodwork einstein ...oh and yeah even studies too *L*

Your lack of experience shines through if you don't know drugs like tren/deca cuase testicular atrophy. But you wouldn't know. You never used them. Not surprised the least bit
Oh but test doesnt dumba$$ ??

Unlike your pathetic a*s, I have a wonderful life. Several very successful bushiness. Fiancee' that's a self made entrepreneur.And that comes to you and your pathetic self. Loser is putting it too kindly in your case. I'd use bigger words, but since you can't spell, I won't stress you out having to use an on line dictionary
A topic we can discuss in philadelphia tough guy

**Pinnacle** · 01-30-2009, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

Theory? What therory? I have probably 20 blood panels to show Nolvadex is superior for ME and all my trainee's over a 15 yr span. You have what? A study? ROFL
15 years and bloodwork einstein ...oh and yeah even studies too *L*

Your lack of experience shines through if you don't know drugs like tren/deca cuase testicular atrophy. But you wouldn't know. You never used them. Not surprised the least bit
Oh but test doesnt dumba$$ ??

Unlike your pathetic a*s, I have a wonderful life. Several very successful bushiness. Fiancee' that's a self made entrepreneur.And that comes to you and your pathetic self. Loser is putting it too kindly in your case. I'd use bigger words, but since you can't spell, I won't stress you out having to use an on line dictionary
A topic we can discuss in philadelphia tough guy

ROFL @ you. I never said Test doesn't cause testicular atrophy. You once again, twisted my post out of text. Why am I not surprised?
Your a fu*cking joke of a human being. Do yourself a favor. Get a gun and blow your f*cking brains out. Actually, you'd be doing the world a favor. GET IT LOSER?

Anytime punk. Show me proof of who you are,address, and I'll be there anytime.Trust me on that, you punk bit*ch

**auslifta** · 01-30-2009, 11:46 PM

laughs and keeps eating popcorn

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-30-2009, 11:47 PM

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

ROFL @ you. I never said Test doesn't cause testicular atrophy. You once again, twisted my post out of text. Why am I not surprised?
Your a fu*cking joke of a human being. Do yourself a favor. Get a gun and blow your f*cking brains out. Actually, you'd be doing the world a favor. GET IT LOSER?

Anytime punk. Show me proof of who you are,address, and I'll be there anytime.Trust me on that, you punk bit*ch

And i quote:
No, I was refering (btw nice spelling dickweed - since u seem to be a dictionary and all) to Drugs like deca being harsh. Since you haven't any experience with drugs, let me tell you aboutTren, or Deca. People get far more testicular atrophy than opposed to test.
so your nuts get smaller on deca than test huh? get the fvck outta here.... Like i said if u ever wanna talk about why hcg is REALLY more beneficial after tren or deca ...we can ..if not stop being such a fool.
Ok like i said i live in philly - u let me know when u r coming in ...no problem here....proof will be waiting .....

**Pinnacle** · 01-31-2009, 12:08 AM

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

Like i said if u ever wanna talk about why hcg is REALLY more beneficial after tren or deca ...we can ..if not stop being such a fool.Your the a*ss taking everything I say out of text. You're looking for a fight, you got one.Truth is, you know nothing at all. You haven't any drug experience. Real easy to "say" you do, but your vomit flowing from your finger tips says otherwise. GET IT NOW?
Ok like i said i live in philly - u let me know when u r coming in ...no problem here....proof will be waiting .....

Damn. I ate a filet waiting for your PM with your personal info.You see, I demand your info. I'm not getting on a plane for nothing. I want your name, phone number,address. Physical proof it's authentic. GET IT, YOU STUPID F*CK?

GUESS WHAT FELLAS. THE PUS*SY BIT*CH DIDN'T SEND A PM. AM I SURPRISED THIS PU*SSY DIDN'T? NOT THE LEAST BIT

YOU FAIL DOUGH BOY!

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-31-2009, 12:12 AM

yeah i get it ...your all talk ..... u tell me when u r coming in ...hell ill even pick u up at philly international....then we can have a nice chat ...the only thing out of context here is your perception that you know shit ...and your perception of me...so lets straighten that out.....

**Pinnacle** · 01-31-2009, 12:29 AM

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

yeah i get it ...your all talk ..... u tell me when u r coming in ...hell ill even pick u up at philly international....then we can have a nice chat ...the only thing out of context here is your perception that you know shit ...and your perception of me...so lets straighten that out.....

Let's straightened out here and now.

YOU'RE A PU*SSY ****ING COWARD THAT STILL HASN'T SENT ME A PM WITH INFO.
YOU'RE A LOSER ON THE INTERNET,AS YOU ARE A LOSER IN LIFE.

A LOSER WITH NO PHYSIQUE NONETHELESS. PATHETIC! HIDE BEHIND A FEMALE AVATAR SPEWING VOMIT ALL OVER THIS BOARD. SHOW YOUR PICTURES MR. BIG TIME INTERNET GURU.COME ON FAT F*CK, SHOW ALL YOUR FAITHFUL FOLLOWERS HOW HUGE YOU ARE.SURELY WITH ALL YOUR 15 yrs EXPERIENCE USING DRUGS. YOU HAVE TO BE HUGE AND RIPPED, RIGHT?
ROFL. YOU'RE A FAT, MUSCLELESS INTERNET TROLL, NOTHING MORE. GET IT, LOSER?

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-31-2009, 12:33 AM

fly to philly and lets see ? how about that ?
You are a stupid fvck who pulls posts out of his ass then cant even explain what he meant - then when u get proved to be the fool ....you just spout insults. You have been proven an idoit in both posts i responded too. Get lost ....let me know when your flight is coming in tough guy...anything you have so say other than that is bullshit imo .... Then we can know for sure what i am ok ? IM WAITING !!!

**Immortal Soldier** · 01-31-2009, 12:41 AM

Every Night Pinnacle is going at it with someone...

**Mammon** · 01-31-2009, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by Immortal Soldier

Every Night Pinnacle is going at it with someone...

yeah im just following this one tonight.... lol

**Pinnacle** · 01-31-2009, 12:48 AM

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

fly to philly and lets see ? how about that ?
You are a stupid fvck who pulls posts out of his ass then cant even explain what he meant - then when u get proved to be the fool ....you just spout insults. You have been proven an idoit in both posts i responded too. Get lost ....let me know when your flight is coming in tough guy...anything you have so say other than that is bullshit imo .... Then we can know for sure what i am ok ? IM WAITING !!!

You've proven nothing as*hole. Nothing. You think you know about drugs. You know sh*t. I stated my opinion about HCG, and Nolvadex. You think my opinion is stupid, that's fine. Unlike you, I have BW and countless trainee's BW as well, to prove what I say about Nolvadex vs Clomid. YOU? Nada..zilch..nothing but useless vomit from your finger tips. You avoided all my retorts purposely. You know nothing about Fina implants, nor cattle, or how cattle are raised.You know nothing about the effects of tren on humans, nor cattle.NADA. NOW YOU GET IT?

You say you know about HCG. You "say" you do. ROFLMAO

WHERE'S THE PM FAT F*CK?I DEMAND INFO. GET IT STUPID F*CK?

YOU'RE A LOSER. YOU FAIL! F*CKING COWARD,BIT*CH.

NO PICTURES. HIDES BEHIND A FEMALE AVATAR. WHAT A F*CKING LOSER YOU ARE. MY F*CKING WORD.

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-31-2009, 12:52 AM

*L*You better re read the threads dummy - u look like an ass....duh do they give it to cattle....uhhh your nuts shrink more with deca than with just test ...uhhhh clomid and nolva doesnt make sense together ...get out of here dumba$$
Like ill give u my home addy - u r a fool ....and full of shit....LIKE I SAID WHAT FLIGHT AND WHEN? NAME IT ...IM THERE.....
As i expected bullshit ...not flight info..... come see in person internet tough guy.....im here...and waiting ...
Ok now spout more bullshit ...

**Pinnacle** · 01-31-2009, 01:00 AM

Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup

*l*you better re read the threads dummy - u look like an ass....
Like ill give u my home addy - u r a fool ....and full of shit....like i said what flight and when? Name it ...im there.....
As i expected bullshit ...not flight info..... Come see in person internet tough guy.....im here...and waiting ...
Ok now spout more bullshit ...

look at the coward..bwahahahhahahahaaa. You think i'm booking a flight without your info? Damn your stupid. You're dancing around this just as poorly as you've danced around my retorts in this thread, and more so, the tren thread.

No pictures= fu*cking loser

no pm= f*cking coward bi*tch (that you are and always will be)

you've failed miserably, just as you're a failure in life.

loser!

**jimmyinkedup** · 01-31-2009, 01:16 AM

*L* yeah cause most people would give out there home address - you ARE an idiot! Ill meet you in a public place..ill pick u up ...whenever , wherever. You said youll fly in - do it ....i wanna meet you.....badly...we have a lot to discuss.... btw - your posts - prove how stupid you are ..anyone that read the threads knows it ..its ok ...admit you are wrong and said stupid things and move on.....
Like i said buvllshit.....more moronic bvllshit....thats all you contribute.... and continue ....
OK ...im waiting for more bvllshit.....

**Immortal Soldier** · 01-31-2009, 01:19 AM

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

look at the coward..bwahahahhahahahaaa. You think i'm booking a flight without your info? Damn your stupid. You're dancing around this just as poorly as you've danced around my retorts in this thread, and more so, the tren thread.

No pictures= fu*cking loser

no pm= f*cking coward bi*tch (that you are and always will be)

you've failed miserably, just as you're a failure in life.

loser!

Why are you getting so worked up man? Just take a deep breath and realize your posting on a message board.

Take it easy...

The mods aren't enjoying this...

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