Free Diet advice by Narkissos & Novastepp: Intro to Performance Nutrition 101

[Narkissos]

Have you ever hit a wall?

w/ regard to fat-loss? No.
w/ regard to muscle gain? No.
w/ regard to strength gains? Yes.

w/ regard to fat-loss... the key is to stay ahead of the plateaus... and also to set realistic goals.

I have been at it hard for the last 7 weeks, and have drop 10 pounds( most of that in the first 3 weeks)

Only?

and it seems like the last 2 1/2 to three weeks I have lost nothing.At first, I thought it was because I was gaining muscle, but my pant are not fitting better or anything. I was just curious. I am 29 years old, 210 lbs

210 lbs @ what height and bodyfat percentage?

, and my macros are 300 grams of protein, 150 grams of carbs, and 60 grams of fat.That is around 2400 calories broke up in 6 meals.

Your kcal intake is a little on the high side if you're not lean @ your current weight.

Lay out what your daily diet looks like.

I do cardio about 3-4 times a week.

What do you mean 'about'?

What's the duration of your cardio?

Additionally, how are you training?

Volume training?

HIT?

How many bodyparts per session?

How many sessions per week?

Am I just being impatient or what?

Impatient or inconsistent?

Fill in the blanks for me.

I cut every year, this year seems to be alot harder though.

Your body changes from day to day, month to month, and year to year.

If it's getting 'harder', clearly you need to change your approach.

Furthermore, it would assist most if they stayed leaner year-round.

Could my metbolism be messed up?Any help would be appreciated.

Fill in the blanks.

Thanks.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

So I'm back it it again this time reading everything twice and acting once, I'm going for bulk then cut.

STAT: 230 ( use to weigh 300+) 6'4" age27 , BF 20%, never smoked or drink

starting of with clen
pre work out supplement is NO-Explode and Whey 2times a day
eating rice, tuna, steak, eggs, oatmeal, oranges , apples, salads.( sometimes oatmeal cookies ) <-this is leatrly my daily food i eat within the week, maybee subway or a salad at times
drinking coffee with splenda, water and sugar free lemande, ocasioanl SF monster.

work out 5 times a week and 3 days of those i do cardio aswell.

i sit at a desk all day for my job and workout after my secedule

thanks bro !

I don't see an actual diet or routine listed here mate.

The purpose of this thread isn't to build you a diet from scratch.

Please review: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=113010

...then get back to us.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

I’m currently in my last week of bulking and basically I’m at a maintenance intake of around 3,500 calories on workout days and around 3,000 calories for non workout days. I work a desk job from 9:00-5:30, hit the gym, go home and eat, then train people sometimes as late as 11:30pm. I want to transition into my cut diet and prepare myself for my upcoming contest on June 27th. If I start next week that gives me 17 weeks till the contest.

Noted.

I’m currently
196lbs 13% body fat
6 foot 1
22 years old
All Natty

Noted.

Im interested in trying Nark and Nova’s approach to dieting. For my clients and myself I’ve always used the high protein/high fat approach to dieting while incorporating 1 high carb/high fat meal every 2-3 days to replenish glycogen and pull the body out of slight ketosis. It’s worked well for me…but I enjoy learning new techniques. So im going to post my current maintenance diet for a workout day…Nark and Nova…..lets see you work your magic.

Meal 1 (8:30am)
1.5 Scoops Whey
42.4g Peanut Buter
64g banana
60g oats
8 oz milk
75g Carbs, 42g Protein, 20g Fats 648 calories

Meal 2(11:30am)
5oz London broil
99g Orange
80g oats
6 almonds
75g Carbs, 35g Protein, 20g Fats 620 calories

Meal 3(2:30pm)
6oz chicken
4oz avocado
1c green beans
8oz sweet potato
70g Carbs, 42g Protein, 20g Fats 628 Kcals

Meal 4(5:30pm)
5oz London broil
6 almonds
6oz sweet potato
8oz milk
1 cup green beans
70g Carbs, 42g Protein, 20g Fats 628 Kcals

7:00 – WORKOUT

Meal 5(8:30pm-9:30pm)varies
6oz tuna
3tsp olive oil
1 cup green beans
128g brown rice
45g Carbs, 42g Protein, 15g Fats 483 Kcals

Meal 6(11:30pm)
285g cottage cheese
24 almonds
1 cup broccoli
4oz sweet potato
40g Carbs, 35g Protein, 20g Fats 480 Kcals

Asleep by 12:15 or so…

Total Carbohydrates 375g
Total Protein 238g
Total Fat 115g
Total Calories 3487g

This is your bulking diet as it currently stands?

No wonder you have to drop straight to ketosis to cut.

Do you cycle carbs in the off-season at all?

Where do i start?

193 lbs@ 13%

LBM = 168 lbs

Your 3500kcal intake is WAY TOO HIGH for 168 lbs LBM mate.

Anyway... you asked about cutting, so let's talk about that.

For the cut.. at least in the initial stages:

2400kcals on non training days
3000kcals on training days

Obviously for the cut cottage cheese and milk will be removed.

Current training looks like this
Day 1: Upper Body/20 mins pwo cardio - Power
Day 2: Lower Body/Abs - Power
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Upper Body/Abs - Hypertrophy
Day 5: Upper Body/20 mins pwo cardio - Hypertrophy
Day 6: Lower Body/Abs - Hypertrophy
Day 7: Rest

Break these days down a bit more for me.

Might switch up my routine a bit for cutting…..obviously cardio will be increased.

Noted.

Incorporate the above suggestions... fill in the blanks (As requested above), and hit me with a revised diet.

-C

[Narkissos]

Have you seen the new studies showing that eggs help reduce cholesterol and fight bad cholesterol??? Or is this old news??

There has been one that I've seen.

But, it is old news overall.

They've been stating that (and investigating how) eggs fight cholesterol for a decade now, to my knowledge.

I read some literature from 2000 which investigated the phospolipid and b-vitamin components.

Current literature is investigating ACE-inhibitor-like compounds produced post-digestion.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

Bump!

I bumped this, by the way, so we'd get more questions... that i could answer 'en masse'...

Didn't mean to ignore any questions already posted.

-C

[Narkissos]

Here is my new diet. I posted it in the diet forum but this one is tweaked just a bit more. I think it worked out pretty good for what I'm trying to do.

How has it 'worked'?

I am using this diet to cut down to around 10-12% body fat. here are my current stats:

weight: 235
bf: 20%
Lean body weight: 188
BMR: 2216
TDEE: 3435

What factors did you base your TDEE on?

Cardio: 30 minutes post-workout, 45 minutes on Wednesday & Saturday

Outline your training on other days.

Cardio is only one factor in the overall equation.

Here is my cutting diet as I have lined it out. I'm about 700 calories under TDEE. Any critiques appreciated!

Meal #1 kcals protein carbs fat
1/2 cup egg whites 60 12 2 0
2 whole eggs 140 12 0 8
1/2 cup oats 150 5 27 3
TOTAL 350 29 29 11

Meal #2
4oz. Tuna 200 44 0 2
2 slices ww bread 240 12 44 3
Total 440 56 44 5

Meal #3
8oz. Chicken breast 240 41 0 8
8oz. Red potato 165 4 39 0
1 cup broccoli 30 1 4 0
Total 435 46 43 8

Meal #4
2 scoop ON whey 260 48 8 4
1/2 cup oats 150 5 27 3
Total 410 53 35 7

WORKOUT

Meal #5 PWO
2 scoop ON whey 260 48 8 4
1/2 cup oats 150 5 27 3
Total 410 53 35 7

Meal #6
8oz. Chicken breast 240 41 0 8
1/2 cup brown rice 165 4 35 1
Total 405 45 35 9

Meal #7
1 cup ff cottage cheese 160 28 14 0
20g Almonds 120 4 4 11
Total 280 32 18 11


TOTAL KCAL protein carbs fat
2730 - 314 - 239 - 58

Overall.. it's a pretty solid diet.

Ratios are pretty decent as well... particularly for someone with bodyfat as high as you've noted.

I wouldn't change anything about it... until you plateaued.

Stay on it for at least 6 weeks.

Looking at it as is, it's more in the vein of a recomposition diet.

i.e. You should be able to add some lean tissue here, even while losing bodyfat.

It'll be a slower process overall...

A question for you: What supplements are you currently running?

-C

[Narkissos]

Nark can you give me some insight on PWO nutrition?

I sure hope so

I only have one shake and its PWO. What should the macros be?

That depends:

What does your overall diet look like?
Do you practice pre-workout and intra-workout feeding?
Are you using any nutrient partitioning agents?
Are you 'cutting' or 'bulking'?

Should I use a banana and oats? Or should I only have one, if so whats better the banana or the oats?

That depends on your overall requirements, and how well you absorb either carb source.

Do I want to avoid fat all together PWO? I'm eating one hour later.

If you're eating one hour later, then yes... avoid fats, as they'll slow gastric emptying.

This is a good read w/ regard to the effects of a meal's macronutrient profile on gastric emptying: http://www.slackbooks.com/excerpts/77166/77166.asp

Current shake:
2 scoops whey (46 grams protein)
1/2 cup fat free milk (can I keep this?)
1 banana
1/2 cup oats
the rest is water and ice.

Post your current diet... as well as your LBM.

The above shake seems like a shitload to digest prior to a meal 1 hour later.

Are you utilizing GDAs as well as digestive enzymes?

-C

[Matt]

Here is some new info on the eggs Nark http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNew...90212/20090212
I have another i shall find it..

[Matt]

And http://www2.surrey.ac.uk/mediacentre...erol_issue.htm

[Narkissos]

In your opinion do fats slow down the digestion of high GI carbs in essence lowering there GI. or does the High GI carbs increase the propensity of the fats to be stored because of the insulin spike?

It depends on the carb/fat.

GI isn't the end-all be-all of dietary concerns.


(re: Glycemic index v.s. Glycemic Load)

e.g.

A pop-tart v.s. a potato w/ olive oil.

^^Which do you think would more likely promote fat gain?

Additional reading:

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocente...ains/gigl.html

[Narkissos]

Here is some new info on the eggs Nark http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNew...90212/20090212
I have another i shall find it..

And http://www2.surrey.ac.uk/mediacentre...erol_issue.htm

^^Both links are dead.

Here's something you can read however:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0218224655.htm

^^Brief, but food for thought all the same.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

Nark of nova I have a question

third week on my cut....cals on training days are around maintenance and non training are lowered roughly 800cals. Trying to hit 4-5 days/wk 40-45min cardio.

Does your "maintenance" factor in activity?

Is the 800kcals deficit an actual deficit, or simply actual maintenance for the day? (i.e. your calculated TDEE in light of reduced activity)

Yesterday I had a carb reload of good carbs. Roughly 9-10 meals and doubled my carbs for every meal. So roughly 600g's from carbs and 200cals from protein per meal. Is this overkill? I feel great today and may continue to do this every 2 wks if it's not too detrimental.

Thanks and I love you guys

Jeez man... you're really piling it in

200kcals from protein per meal... i.e. 50gr.

Is this akin to your normal protein intake.. or higher?

You really don't need to pile in the protein on your re-feed day Audis.

In fact, you would benefit from protein cycling... as you do from carb-cycling.

-CNS

[Matt]

Thanks Nark a very good read.....

[Narkissos]

^^np mate

[IM708]

Nark, can you answer my post #960?

[Narkissos]

Can't...stand....muscletech...and...cytosport.

When you are referring to gnc and assimilation of some of their products, what products are you referring to? The vitamins and/or proteins?

Vitamins/minerals primarily.

[ckyass]

Noted.



Noted.







This is your bulking diet as it currently stands?
Yes this is my bulk diet for days i train...for non training days i drop about 500 calories

No wonder you have to drop straight to ketosis to cut.
Curious why you said this? Please give me details

Do you cycle carbs in the off-season at all?
Well on non workout days as i said i drop 500 calories mostly from carbs and fat...so that means twice a week my body is getting lower amounts of carbs...since im training 5x a week.

Where do i start?

193 lbs@ 13%

LBM = 168 lbs

Your 3500kcal intake is WAY TOO HIGH for 168 lbs LBM mate.
Well this is my bulking diet...HOWEVER the 3,500 calorie intake + my training for that particular day basically will maintain my weight of 193

Anyway... you asked about cutting, so let's talk about that.

For the cut.. at least in the initial stages:

2400kcals on non training days
3000kcals on training days





Break these days down a bit more for me.



Noted.

Incorporate the above suggestions... fill in the blanks (As requested above), and hit me with a revised diet.



-C

Will revise diet in next posting...thanks bro..replies are in BOLD

[ckyass]

Noted.



Noted.







This is your bulking diet as it currently stands?

No wonder you have to drop straight to ketosis to cut.

Do you cycle carbs in the off-season at all?

Where do i start?

193 lbs@ 13%

LBM = 168 lbs

Your 3500kcal intake is WAY TOO HIGH for 168 lbs LBM mate.

Anyway... you asked about cutting, so let's talk about that.

For the cut.. at least in the initial stages:

2400kcals on non training days
3000kcals on training days





Break these days down a bit more for me.



Noted.

Incorporate the above suggestions... fill in the blanks (As requested above), and hit me with a revised diet.

-C

Here is a diet I constructed based around your advice…. I’m sure it wont be perfect as you know I’m used to the high pro/high fat approach…Please correct as necessary and help me figure out when carb reefed days should be incorporated. Thanks much!

HIGH CARB CUT DIET APPROACH
% totals for workout days = 3,000 calories
45% Carbohydrates = 1,350cals
35% Protein = 1,050cals
20% Fat = 600cals

GRAM TOTALS
337g Carbohydrates
262g Protein
66g Fat

6 Meals a day split like this
Meal 1
43g Protein
80g carbs
11g fat

WORKOUT

Meal 2
43g Protein
80g carbs
11g fat

Meal 3
43g Protein
60g carbs
11g fat

Meal 4
43g Protein
40g carbs
11g fat

Meal 5
43g Protein
40g carbs
11g fat

Meal 6
43g Protein
40g carbs
11g fat


I didnt put in food example because i know all of that....just need help with ratios/scheduling refeeds/ect. Thanks man

[XD-9]

How has it 'worked'?

I meant the numbers (kcals) worked out pretty good

What factors did you base your TDEE on?

I used 1.55



Outline your training on other days.

Monday Back & Bis, Tuesday Chest & Tris, Thursday Legs, Friday shoulders

Cardio is only one factor in the overall equation.



Overall.. it's a pretty solid diet.

Ratios are pretty decent as well... particularly for someone with bodyfat as high as you've noted.

I wouldn't change anything about it... until you plateaued.

Stay on it for at least 6 weeks.

Looking at it as is, it's more in the vein of a recomposition diet.

i.e. You should be able to add some lean tissue here, even while losing bodyfat.

It'll be a slower process overall...

A question for you: What supplements are you currently running?

Not taking any supps except for daily multi and protein. Planning on getting some BCAA's sometime soon



-C

Answers in bold Nark. Also, I have done 3 cycles in the past. First cycle was d-bol, Deca and Sust. Second Cycle was Anadrol, Test E, Deca. Third cycle was straight Test E. My bodyfat has not always been this high. I usually maintain in the 14-15% range at most but I have been drinking a lot over the past year. And my age is 35, been lifting for 15 years.

I probably need to get BF tested again because it has dropped nicely over the past 3-4 weeks. My weight in the AM is between 230.7 and 229.8 on an empty stomach. My guess is that my BF is around 17% but that is only a guess and I can't go off of a guess.

[F4iGuy]

What does your overall diet look like?

-2 packets sugar free instant oats with 1 scoop whey mixed with water cooked in microwave (7:15 AM)
-2 whole eggs hardboiled (9:45 AM)
-1 can tuna on whole wheat bread (11:50 AM)
-1 turkey cheese sandwich on whole wheat bread (3:00 PM)
-PWO shake about 18 oz. (60/40 water & skim milk, 1/2 cup oats, 40 grams whey) (6:00 PM)
-1 chicken breast, broccoli, sweet potatoe (8:00 PM)
-1 cup cottage cheese w/2 tbsp. Natty peanut butter (10:30PM)

I know this needs work.

Do you practice pre-workout and intra-workout feeding?
Pre workout meal
-turkey cheese sandwich on whole wheat bread (3:00 PM) I only consume water intra-workout.
-Creatine Mono. (10 grams 40 minutes pre workout)

Are you using any nutrient partitioning agents?
Supplements
-Multivitamin (1 morning w/ breakfast)
-Vitamin C (1 morning w/ breakfast)
-Fish Oil (1 morning w/breakfast, 1 before bed)
-Optimum whey (1/2 scoop morning w/breakfast) *1 scoop is 25 grams
-Creatine Mono. (10 grams 40 minutes pre workout)
-Creatine mono. (10 grams pwo shake)
-Optimum whey ( 1 + ½ scoop pwo)

I don't think I'm using nutrient partitioning agents? Should I be? If so when and what do you recommend?

Are you 'cutting' or 'bulking'?
I would like to maintain the mass I've acquired and lose a small amount of bodyfat.

That depends on your overall requirements, and how well you absorb either carb source.
I feel fine with either source, no bloat or gas.

If you're eating one hour later, then yes... avoid fats, as they'll slow gastric emptying.

Got it.


I'm 5'6" 180lbs. 10-11%BF.

Are you utilizing GDAs as well as digestive enzymes?

Please explain what GDA stands for. I am not using digestive enzymes. If I do use digestive enzymes when would they be used?

I plan on spending more time in the diet section, I have so much to learn about diet.

[GymHero]

How is this for a bulking diet?


meal 1:
1.5 cup of oats
12 oz milk
1 scoop whey
3 tbspn pb

meal 2:
8 oz sweet potato
6 oz 93/7 ground beef

meal 3:
1 cup oats
5 whole eggs
.5 scoop of whey

meal 4:
8 oz sweet potato
6 oz turkey burger or 93/7 beef

meal 5:
1 cup oats
12-16 oz milk
1 scoop pro peptide
2 tbspn pb

train

pwo shake:
50 grams whey iso
75 grams wms
10 grams bcaa
15 grams creatine mono
5 grams taurine

pwo meal
12 oz white potato
2 cans tuna

meal 8:
1.5 cup of oats
12 egg whites
1 scoop whey

meal 9:
8 oz sweet potato or 1 cup oats
6 oz lean beef

meal 10:
2 cans tuna
3-4 tbspn pb

totals: calories 6661 fat 194 carbs 670 protein 546

[audis4]

Does your "maintenance" factor in activity?

Is the 800kcals deficit an actual deficit, or simply actual maintenance for the day? (i.e. your calculated TDEE in light of reduced activity)



Jeez man... you're really piling it in

200kcals from protein per meal... i.e. 50gr.

Is this akin to your normal protein intake.. or higher?

You really don't need to pile in the protein on your re-feed day Audis.

In fact, you would benefit from protein cycling... as you do from carb-cycling.

-CNS

The 800cal drop on off days is 800 under maintenance.

ya, should be 50g/meal of protein....I usually take in 50g per meal all the time.

Ok, 50g is easy for me to kill but I'll drop it down on re-feed days I'll look more into the protein cycling. BTW, 4 days and I dropped most all the water and my abs are appearing....lovin it!

Thanks nark for the feedback! my g/f is a crazy cook

[XD-9]

Bump for Nark & Nova

[ckyass]

what happened to this thread? BOOOOOO

[rebelwithoutacause]

This message is for narkissos: What up, and much respect! First of all, I would like to thank everybody for their time and input to this post. I was a world champion freestyle wrestler at age 17, weighing in at 103 and 112. Since then, I gained a shit load of weight, by ****ing off, drinking alcohol and smoking. I'm 30 now, and am weighing in at 275. I'm 6 ft. tall and have a body fat percentage of 35%! I have been back in the gym and exercising for the last 6 months. I have come down from 300 pounds actually. Right now, I'm trying a diet of counting calories and trying to stay under 1500 a day. I eat turkey products in the morning like turkey links and turkey bacon, along with some cut up potatoes and 2 eggs. Sometimes instead, I'll make a shake in the blender with Carnation Instant Breakfast. For lunch, I will usually have a lean cuisine of my choice in the afternoon, and a mid afternoon snack like almonds or some sort of fruit. For dinner, I make usually cut up boneless skinless chicken and frozen vegetables in a stir fry over some instant brown rice, or I will substitute the chicken with shrimp. Another dinner time dish maybe baked fish, (salmon, tilapia, mahi mahi) a baked potato side of brown rice, and a salad with vinegrette. MY QUESTION IS THIS: Is there a better diet I can do that will help me lose weight more efficiently? What cardio tips do you all suggest? I have a high metabolic rate when I'm clean and focused and my primary goal is to lose 90 pounds in a 8 month time frame, and then do a light cutting cycle to build up all the muscle loss, but I don't want to bulk up, I want to maintain a lean, 190 pound appearence with cut muscle, a defined chest, back and shoulders, and a six pack stomach. What is my best route to get here? All advice is greatly appreciated!! Thanks.

[mg1228]

Need some help with diet--new to this. Im 33 5'11 174 pounds bf is around 13-14% (can see top 4 abs). Trying to get to under 10% and add 8 to 9 pounds of muscle. Diet previously was basically eat somewhat smart no junk food but basically ate what I wanted also bmr is about 2900 tdee used 1.6
Here is my diet
meal 1- shake 3/4 cup oats with 1/2 cup skim milk cal 525 pro 61 ca 55 f 4.5
workout
pwo shake w banana along w some simple carbs ie 10oz gatorade oatmeal cookie
meal 3- 8oz chicken breast w cup brown rice cal 436 pro 51 ca 45 f 7
meal 5- 1 cup oats w 1 cup skim cal 380 pro 18 ca 65 f 6
meal 6- 8oz chicken breast or 8 oz sirloin or filet w 1 cup brown rice and salad fat free italian cal 536 pro 55 ca 45 f 7 (filet or sirloin add 18g fat)
meal 7- shake 2 sc whey/casein mix w 1tsp flax seed cal 530 pro 48 ca 28 f 24
total cal 2407 pro 233 ca 238 f 49 not including pwo shake cal 350 p48 c6 f 2
workout m/w/f this is a workout day--tues/thurs/sat cardio is 6 interval sprints at 60 sec. walk 2 min. elliptical--no pwo shake on cardio days or sun. Any advice is appreciated--

[mg1228]

Maybe there not monitoring this thread anymore?

[seriousmass]

Maybe there not monitoring this thread anymore?

nark.

[ckyass]

I took the time to read every page of this thread and put together a bunch of notes....Here ya go.....should make things slightly more simple.

-Carbs At the core of the diet? 45% of total calories.This shifts to 35% during times of carb cycling....but 45% at core.When stagnation is reached... either go thru a depletion phase, or implement carb cycling.Protein is kept constant during either protocol.
-Staying at a maintenance level for your LBM and adding cardio to a consistent weight training program is exactly what this kind of approach is based around, the performance athlete.
-Work with a <>20% caloric reduction on calculated TDEE while cutting
-Occasional pro/fat meal before bed, but that is in accordance with a period of fasting longer than normal.
-Don’t use fruits when striving for pure fat loss. stick to a very easy approach for weeks at a time. however, when training hard and looking for overall athletic performance, i will use fruits.
-Caloric expenditure should be highest when beginning a cut. It forces your body to adjust to a simple dietary approach as you manipulate your training regimen. So, keeping your cardio high and maximizing a high protein and high carbohydrate diet allows you to preserve muscle and improve strength. It also provides energy for training and cardio, and allows your body the opportunity to dissolve non-contributory tissue (fat). Further manipulation of a diet further along in fat loss, continues this process. So it wouldn't be needed now and you should rely on your dietary approach to propel you to that fat loss level.
-You shouldn't use zero carb days. I meant that when you are much leaner and nearing the end of your cutter it may benefit you to eliminate them in a couple meals.
-You want to keep carbs in every meal. So keep those levels steady. Figure how many carbs you want in your day, and divide that by your meals. I'm going to guess and say it should be around 240g. You will get all the fat you need from your lean meats. you don't need supplemented fat. Make every one of those meals a pro/carb meal and utilize the higher carbs to help you stay active and keep your glycogen stores at highest possible levels, allowing you to succeed in the gym.
-Remember the role of the pwo shake is to initiate recovery... by curbing catabolism
-Don't let fats exceed 20% of daily kcal allotment.
-Don't let fats drop lower than 15% of daily kcal allotment
-At any rate, I think you should stick to any changes you make to your diet or training for 6 weeks... and no less.
-The high day would be refeed kcals the medium day would be 25% less carbs than the refeed. The low day would be 50% less carbs than the refeed. The very low day would be 75% less carbs than the refeed.
-Keep protein and fat at the same amount tru-out a 'pure' carb-cycle

Im always saving notes....here is one i found i believe written by layne norton regarding re-feeds.

Re-Feeding

For those who are below 10%, it is probably a wise idea to incorporate re-feeds two times per week. For those people who are in the 10-15% range, re-feeding every 6-12 days will probably be adequate, for those who are above 15%, re-feeding will probably not need to be done more than once every week to two weeks. Obviously as one loses body fat they will need to re-feed more often.
• Re-feed on the day you work your worst body part(s) as re-feeding will not only raise leptin, but be quite anabolic.
• Keep fat as low as possible during re-feed days as high insulin levels will increase dietary fat transport into adipose tissue. In addition dietary fat has little to no impact on leptin levels.
• Reduce protein intake to 1 g/lb bodyweight.
• Consume as little fructose as possible as fructose does not have an impact on leptin levels.

[mg1228]

Good notes---thanks for taking the time---Ive been on above diet for 2 1/2 weeks (no cheat meals), should I implement a re-feed day and what carb total should I do on a re-feed day? Im assuming on the re-feed keep protein the same as well as fats according to your post.

[mg1228]

On the supplemented fat issue---does that mean no flax seed oil?

[Narkissos]

For the cut.. at least in the initial stages:

2400kcals on non training days
3000kcals on training days

Here is a diet I constructed based around your advice…. I’m sure it wont be perfect as you know I’m used to the high pro/high fat approach…Please correct as necessary and help me figure out when carb reefed days should be incorporated. Thanks much!

HIGH CARB CUT DIET APPROACH
% totals for workout days = 3,000 calories
45% Carbohydrates = 1,350cals
35% Protein = 1,050cals
20% Fat = 600cals

GRAM TOTALS
337g Carbohydrates
262g Protein
66g Fat

6 Meals a day split like this
Meal 1
43g Protein
80g carbs
11g fat

WORKOUT

Meal 2
43g Protein
80g carbs
11g fat

Meal 3
43g Protein
60g carbs
11g fat

Meal 4
43g Protein
40g carbs
11g fat

Meal 5
43g Protein
40g carbs
11g fat

Meal 6
43g Protein
40g carbs
11g fat

Split macros equally over meals: <> 43 gr pro; <> 55gr carb; <>10 gr fat

^^This would be on training days solely... and, again, only the beginning phases.

As fat-loss stagnates, drop to 2400 kcals during the week... bumping to 3000kcals for your re-feeds.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

Answers in bold Nark. Also, I have done 3 cycles in the past. First cycle was d-bol, Deca and Sust. Second Cycle was Anadrol, Test E, Deca. Third cycle was straight Test E. My bodyfat has not always been this high. I usually maintain in the 14-15% range at most but I have been drinking a lot over the past year. And my age is 35, been lifting for 15 years.

I probably need to get BF tested again because it has dropped nicely over the past 3-4 weeks. My weight in the AM is between 230.7 and 229.8 on an empty stomach. My guess is that my BF is around 17% but that is only a guess and I can't go off of a guess.

Sweet.

As suggested above, change nothing until you plateau.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

-2 packets sugar free instant oats with 1 scoop whey mixed with water cooked in microwave (7:15 AM)
-2 whole eggs hardboiled (9:45 AM)
-1 can tuna on whole wheat bread (11:50 AM)
-1 turkey cheese sandwich on whole wheat bread (3:00 PM)
-PWO shake about 18 oz. (60/40 water & skim milk, 1/2 cup oats, 40 grams whey) (6:00 PM)
-1 chicken breast, broccoli, sweet potatoe (8:00 PM)
-1 cup cottage cheese w/2 tbsp. Natty peanut butter (10:30PM)

I know this needs work.

Definitely.

At least you're consistent w/ regard to feeding times.

Pre workout meal
-turkey cheese sandwich on whole wheat bread (3:00 PM) I only consume water intra-workout.
-Creatine Mono. (10 grams 40 minutes pre workout)

Noted.

Why I asked, is because you asked what your pwo shake's macros should be.

If you practiced pre-/intra-workout nutrition, then the macros would be different.

That being said, ordinarily I'd say that your pwo shake's macros should be similar to those of your other meals (providing that you follow the school of dieting which purports that food should be spread equally tru-out the day)... This wouldn't be fitting here however, as your macros tru-out the day are all over the place.

I don't think I'm using nutrient partitioning agents?

Fish oil aside, no.

Should I be?

Yes.

If so when and what do you recommend?

At the minimum, Chromium polynicotinate...

At minimum, pwo.

Personally I use it tru-out the day... along with other GDAs.

I would like to maintain the mass I've acquired and lose a small amount of bodyfat.

Noted.

I'm 5'6" 180lbs. 10-11%BF.

Noted.

Please explain what GDA stands for.

Glucose Disposal Aide.

I am not using digestive enzymes. If I do use digestive enzymes when would they be used?

Just prior to the start of each meal.

I plan on spending more time in the diet section, I have so much to learn about diet.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

How is this for a bulking diet?


meal 1:
1.5 cup of oats
12 oz milk
1 scoop whey
3 tbspn pb

meal 2:
8 oz sweet potato
6 oz 93/7 ground beef

meal 3:
1 cup oats
5 whole eggs
.5 scoop of whey

meal 4:
8 oz sweet potato
6 oz turkey burger or 93/7 beef

meal 5:
1 cup oats
12-16 oz milk
1 scoop pro peptide
2 tbspn pb

train

pwo shake:
50 grams whey iso
75 grams wms
10 grams bcaa
15 grams creatine mono
5 grams taurine

pwo meal
12 oz white potato
2 cans tuna

meal 8:
1.5 cup of oats
12 egg whites
1 scoop whey

meal 9:
8 oz sweet potato or 1 cup oats
6 oz lean beef

meal 10:
2 cans tuna
3-4 tbspn pb

totals: calories 6661 fat 194 carbs 670 protein 546

Depends on your stats and level of activity... neither of which was listed.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

The 800cal drop on off days is 800 under maintenance.

Noted.

BTW, 4 days and I dropped most all the water and my abs are appearing....lovin it!

Sweet!

When are we going to see updated pics?

And when the hell are you going to update your training log over on my forum?

I PMed you over there as well.

Thanks nark for the feedback! my g/f is a crazy cook

-CNS

[ckyass]

Split macros equally over meals: <> 43 gr pro; <> 55gr carb; <>10 gr fat

^^This would be on training days solely... and, again, only the beginning phases.

As fat-loss stagnates, drop to 2400 kcals during the week... bumping to 3000kcals for your re-feeds.

-CNS

Thanks man...i posted that awhile ago and took the time to read the whole thread which basically answered all my questions :-) Im enjoying this approach to cutting rather then the keto way....so far down 1.5lbs.

[Narkissos]

This message is for narkissos: What up, and much respect!

Welcome aboard buddy.

First of all, I would like to thank everybody for their time and input to this post. I was a world champion freestyle wrestler at age 17, weighing in at 103 and 112. Since then, I gained a shit load of weight, by ****ing off, drinking alcohol and smoking. I'm 30 now, and am weighing in at 275. I'm 6 ft. tall and have a body fat percentage of 35%!

103/112 to 300 lbs?

Hell.

We've got our work cut out for us.

I have been back in the gym and exercising for the last 6 months. I have come down from 300 pounds actually.

Congrats.

Right now, I'm trying a diet of counting calories and trying to stay under 1500 a day.

Shit... that must suck ass.

I eat turkey products in the morning like turkey links and turkey bacon, along with some cut up potatoes and 2 eggs. Sometimes instead, I'll make a shake in the blender with Carnation Instant Breakfast.

Carnation instant breakfast?

I'm reading the product info now... and it's crap.

Too many carbs, barely any protein... It's a waste of your time.

For lunch, I will usually have a lean cuisine of my choice in the afternoon

Same as above... waste of your time.

, and a mid afternoon snack like almonds or some sort of fruit. For dinner, I make usually cut up boneless skinless chicken and frozen vegetables in a stir fry over some instant brown rice, or I will substitute the chicken with shrimp. Another dinner time dish maybe baked fish, (salmon, tilapia, mahi mahi) a baked potato side of brown rice, and a salad with vinegrette.

Seems that dinner is your only sound meal for the day.

MY QUESTION IS THIS: Is there a better diet I can do that will help me lose weight more efficiently?

To start... you need an actual diet: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=75729

What cardio tips do you all suggest?

The most important thing is to get it done.

How much are you currently doing, and when are you doing?

How regularly are you currently training?

I have a high metabolic rate when I'm clean and focused

You base this on?

and my primary goal is to lose 90 pounds in a 8 month time frame

That's a really tall order... You're looking at a year's work.

Just under 2 lbs of fat per week = 12 months time frame.

2lbs/week does not even begin to account for plateaus.

All advice is greatly appreciated!! Thanks.

My primary suggestion would be that you put together an actual diet.

Secondarily, set realistic goals.

Progress is never linear.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

Maybe there not monitoring this thread anymore?

Or maybe Nark has a full client load 7 days per week, so he replies in his spare time

-CNS

[mg1228]

everyone has a job---I simply stated they may not be monitoring the thread anymore---it is old. No need to get snappy