what dose of clen is anabolic?

[Dobie-BOY]

its not anabolic, never will be.

Yep^

[Swifto]

Yep^

its not anabolic, never will be.

Beta-2 agonists have been shown to have some anabolic effects in humans.(1)

Clen has been shown to have some "therapeutic potential in the treatment of muscle-wasting conditions.(2)"

That would suggest its mildly anabolic of some sort. Therfore, anti-catabolic.



(1): Arch Phys Med Rehabil. 1995 Jan;76(1):55-8.
(2): Clin Sci (Lond). 1993 Jun;84(6):651-4

[Immortal Soldier]

Beta-2 agonists have been shown to have some anabolic effects in humans.(1)

Clen has been shown to have some "therapeutic potential in the treatment of muscle-wasting conditions.(2)"

That would suggest its mildly anabolic of some sort. Therfore, anti-catabolic.



(1): Arch Phys Med Rehabil. 1995 Jan;76(1):55-8.
(2): Clin Sci (Lond). 1993 Jun;84(6):651-4

The potent anabolic effects of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist clenbuterol on skeletal muscle have been reported to be independent of actions on beta-adrenoceptors. In the present study clenbuterol, presented to rats in the diet (4 mg/kg), caused significant increases in gastrocnemius muscle mass, protein, and RNA content and a decrease in epididymal fat pad mass. These effects were not mimicked by oral administration of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist salbutamol even at high dose (52 mg/kg diet), and the effects of clenbuterol were not inhibited by addition of DL-propranolol (200 mg/kg diet). However, the selective beta 2-antagonist ICI-118,551 (200 mg/kg diet) reversed the anabolic effects of clenbuterol, and a high dose of DL-propranolol (1,000 mg/kg diet) also inhibited these actions of clenbuterol. Furthermore, continuous infusion of salbutamol (1.15 mg.kg body wt-1.day-1) via miniosmotic pumps did cause significant increases in muscle mass, protein, and RNA content. These results indicate that the anabolic effects of clenbuterol are dependent on interaction with the beta 2-adrenoceptor. However, a long duration of action appears to be required to induce the anabolic effects of beta 2-agonists.


http://ajpendo.physiology.org/cgi/co...ract/263/1/E50

[JiGGaMaN]

The potent anabolic effects of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist clenbuterol on skeletal muscle have been reported to be independent of actions on beta-adrenoceptors. In the present study clenbuterol, presented to rats in the diet (4 mg/kg), caused significant increases in gastrocnemius muscle mass, protein, and RNA content and a decrease in epididymal fat pad mass. These effects were not mimicked by oral administration of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist salbutamol even at high dose (52 mg/kg diet), and the effects of clenbuterol were not inhibited by addition of DL-propranolol (200 mg/kg diet). However, the selective beta 2-antagonist ICI-118,551 (200 mg/kg diet) reversed the anabolic effects of clenbuterol, and a high dose of DL-propranolol (1,000 mg/kg diet) also inhibited these actions of clenbuterol. Furthermore, continuous infusion of salbutamol (1.15 mg.kg body wt-1.day-1) via miniosmotic pumps did cause significant increases in muscle mass, protein, and RNA content. These results indicate that the anabolic effects of clenbuterol are dependent on interaction with the beta 2-adrenoceptor. However, a long duration of action appears to be required to induce the anabolic effects of beta 2-agonists.


http://ajpendo.physiology.org/cgi/co...ract/263/1/E50

this is a study done on animals, not humans. dosage is insane as well.

[jimmyinkedup]

The potent anabolic effects of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist clenbuterol on skeletal muscle have been reported to be independent of actions on beta-adrenoceptors. In the present study clenbuterol, presented to rats in the diet (4 mg/kg), caused significant increases in gastrocnemius muscle mass, protein, and RNA content and a decrease in epididymal fat pad mass. These effects were not mimicked by oral administration of the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist salbutamol even at high dose (52 mg/kg diet), and the effects of clenbuterol were not inhibited by addition of DL-propranolol (200 mg/kg diet). However, the selective beta 2-antagonist ICI-118,551 (200 mg/kg diet) reversed the anabolic effects of clenbuterol, and a high dose of DL-propranolol (1,000 mg/kg diet) also inhibited these actions of clenbuterol. Furthermore, continuous infusion of salbutamol (1.15 mg.kg body wt-1.day-1) via miniosmotic pumps did cause significant increases in muscle mass, protein, and RNA content. These results indicate that the anabolic effects of clenbuterol are dependent on interaction with the beta 2-adrenoceptor. However, a long duration of action appears to be required to induce the anabolic effects of beta 2-agonists.


http://ajpendo.physiology.org/cgi/co...ract/263/1/E50

good study and these statements are not directed twords you...but it is meaningless IMO. 4mg/kg dosege??? are you kidding me???? Also the study is on Rats. Also not to mention the last statement - long duration of action required to induce anabolic effects. I in not way would consider clen a viable anabolic compound. I think personally ...and this is just my theory ...that clen by its mechanism is muscle sparing and due to its effects on BMR it increases protein synthesis slightly....just as any compound that increases BMR - but most are not muscle sparing by there mechanism of action. I still consider clen anti catabolic and personally believe that is only so when adeqaute protein ingested alongside.... JMO

[M302_Imola]

^^^Good stuff, Jimmy!

[Immortal Soldier]

this is a study done on animals, not humans. dosage is insane as well.

Exactly, that was the whole point, look at the dosages needed in animals to acheive even close to anabolic results. So in humans it will never be anabolic for a variety of reasons.

good study and these statements are not directed twords you...but it is meaningless IMO. 4mg/kg dosege??? are you kidding me???? Also the study is on Rats. Also not to mention the last statement - long duration of action required to induce anabolic effects. I in not way would consider clen a viable anabolic compound. I think personally ...and this is just my theory ...that clen by its mechanism is muscle sparing and due to its effects on BMR it increases protein synthesis slightly....just as any compound that increases BMR - but most are not muscle sparing by there mechanism of action. I still consider clen anti catabolic and personally believe that is only so when adeqaute protein ingested alongside.... JMO

Exactly, this was meant to show that Clen cannot be anabolic in humans both because humans and the beta 2 receptors and the fact dosages are extremely low. Also I don't see the big deal on the study being done on rats, most pharmacuetical drugs are tested on rats before they are put into human trials, obviously they aren't going to take a human and give them 4mg/kg dosage of Clen just to prove it isn't anabolic.

[Kratos]

Beta-2 agonists have been shown to have some anabolic effects in humans.(1)

Clen has been shown to have some "therapeutic potential in the treatment of muscle-wasting conditions.(2)"

That would suggest its mildly anabolic of some sort. Therfore, anti-catabolic.



(1): Arch Phys Med Rehabil. 1995 Jan;76(1):55-8.
(2): Clin Sci (Lond). 1993 Jun;84(6):651-4

Those are pretty poor studies swifto, no offense. But they are very small sample sizes, have other variables and at best the conclusions are overstated.

There is no known dose where clenbuterol becomes anabolic or even anti-catabolic. Not to say it doesn't in humans, just nobody has done a proper study.

[Swifto]

Those are pretty poor studies swifto, no offense. But they are very small sample sizes, have other variables and at best the conclusions are overstated.

There is no known dose where clenbuterol becomes anabolic or even anti-catabolic. Not to say it doesn't in humans, just nobody has done a proper study.

I agree.

There poor studies, but they may show some insight into possible effects.

What do you think Kratos?

[Kratos]

I agree.

There poor studies, but they may show some insight into possible effects.

What do you think Kratos?

Based on my understanding of the drug.
Most likely with the right diet it's good for body composition.
I think with a high fat diet no.
Probably muscle sparing during a healthy cutting diet.
Probably helps shift the balance from carbs to ketone bodies and the increased heart rate will up the use of free fatty acids.
So, I would say a good addition to a strict cutting diet or lean bulk. I would think where it really shines is after 3 days of caloric deficency in a cut.
With this drug probably much more diet dependant then anabolics, I'm sure it has some contribution to the balance between fat and muscle on the users body. It would be interesting if a pure study were done, esp if they could take diet out as a var.

I shake like a drug addict on the stuff so can't really experiment with it. My mom thought I needed to go to re-hab when I went over my parent's house for dinner lol.