Where to put cardio when gaining weight

[Twist]

I agree with Turkish on this. However we never talked about the point of doing the cardio when gaining. Why are we doing cardio? Is it to build CV performance or to burn fat?
If CV performance than HIIT for 20 minutes for sure.
If burning fat then diet is key with low intensity for long periods of time.

[gbrice75]

I would not do cardio as the first thing in the morning, especially on an empty stomach, unless I really wanted to torch the muscle and tear it down. Cortisol levels are high in the morning and the best proven method to reduce those levels is to have a carb + protein meal. There is no point in hitting the treadmill with an empty stomach since it will only result in further incremented cortisol as well as a messed up ratio of test to cortisol. Fasted AM cardio is a very poor choice for a BB IMO.

I agree with Turkish on this. However we never talked about the point of doing the cardio when gaining. Why are we doing cardio? Is it to build CV performance or to burn fat?
If CV performance than HIIT for 20 minutes for sure.
If burning fat then diet is key with low intensity for long periods of time.

Now this is getting interesting. What are your views on a regimen like mine, where i'm not only doing cardio fasted, but a full intense workout beforehand? In fact, my fast starts at 7pm the night before, I train at 5:30am the next morning, then do an hour of cardio immediately afterwards. I am only 3 weeks in, but so far have no noticeable muscle, strength, or energy loss. In fact, I feel more energized if anything and some key lifts (squat, dead, bench) have increased. This is testament to my metabolism being in a fat burning state as I surely would feel like crap if I were to be catabolic.

I all fairness, I have to point out that I take 10g EAA/BCAA prior to my workout, and another 10g immediately after cardio, so it's technically not fasted. However, there is no energy source present whatsoever.

I should also note that I am currently not trying to gain per se; stripping bodyfat is my priority, but of course I would be interested in preserving every ounce of LBM.

[jimmyinkedup]

Originally Posted by Turkish Juicer
I would not do cardio as the first thing in the morning, especially on an empty stomach, unless I really wanted to torch the muscle and tear it down. Cortisol levels are high in the morning and the best proven method to reduce those levels is to have a carb + protein meal. There is no point in hitting the treadmill with an empty stomach since it will only result in further incremented cortisol as well as a messed up ratio of test to cortisol. Fasted AM cardio is a very poor choice for a BB IMO.

A few thoughts on this.
IMO Am cortisol is not a major concern as far as muscle catabolism. In fact it is essential. Certain causes of cortisol spikes can have adverse effects ie: muscle catabolism , am cortisol not being one. Cortisol is often villified. Its an essential hormone that exerts its effects at the time that it is essential for our body to function safely and properly. It plays a crucial role in lipolysis , regulates blood pressure as well as glucose and insulin release. A perfect example of how essential cortisol is are the failed attempts to use pharmceuticals to lower it (ie: cytadren) After only 7-14 days the body circumvents the moa of the drug and cortisol resumes normal levels. It is clearly not a tolerance issue as other effects the drug induces contniue.
I should add the only time i think attempts at cortisol control would be prudent is during pct. Elevated cortisol with virtually non esistant levels of testosterone would be detrimental. Cortisol is involved in negative feedback on HPA. The only pharmaceutical way i know to possibly accomplish this would be to upregulate glucocorticoid receptors. The problem is the only drugs i know of that do this are hardcore anti depressants like lithium - so no thanks. I have heard and seen some potential for cortisol control by using the herb ashwagandha. Swifto would prob know better than I ....