In my experience as well, personally I take a few caffine pills as a diuretic or something if I have an event I want to look my best for in terms of bloat (if I'm on something that induces bloating)... I notice that too much eca makes me cramp (as well as clen) so I'm assuming that has to do with my water levels... I don't know if It's placebo but I notice a difference with visually with caffine... not so much with let's say liquidex (I guess it depends on how much you're aromatizing)... but I guess everybody is different![]()