No More Insurance for TRT

[2Sox]

Anyone pushing for single payer should read this.
The Checkup - Canadian official has heart surgery -- in the U.S.

Danny Williams is a billionaire on par with Michael Bloomberg who donates his salary to charity.
Danny Williams, Canadian Official, Seeks Heart Surgery In US

I spoke in a previous post that we have to take care not to be lazy and uninquisitive but look past the slogans and talking points, and not only listen to what we want to hear because it agrees with our previous biases. Let's fight that tendency. Here from a Canadian paper. You can certainly find differing opinions everywhere. But one has to look in order to find what's true.

Williams's heart surgery choice was based on ignorance - The Globe and Mail

And by the way, we have a very successful single payer system in the U.S., administered by the government and from my knowledge it works great. I have many friends who are Vets and doctors who I have known who worked there, and they all love it - the V.A.

[dhickey]

And by the way, we have a very successful single payer system in the U.S., administered by the government and from my knowledge it works great. I have many friends who are Vets and doctors who I have known who worked there, and they all love it - the V.A.

At what cost? Everything our gov't is involved in automatically includes massive inefficiency, waste, fraud and corruption. Everything. That's why they should be limited to only services that are absolutely essential for them to provide. The reason our health care system is so ungodly expensive is because of gov't regulation and intervention. Now we what them even more involved? Lunacy.

[2Sox]

At what cost? Everything our gov't is involved in automatically includes massive inefficiency, waste, fraud and corruption. Everything. Unsubstantiated generalization.

That's why they should be limited to only services that are absolutely essential for them to provide. Opinion. State it as such

The reason our health care system is so ungodly expensive is because of gov't regulation and intervention. Another unsubstantiated generalization with an opinion thrown in. Now we what them even more involved? Lunacy. Opinion.

This is very frustrating. How can an intelligent exchange take place with comments such as these? In my opinion, substantiating you claims would be the sensible thing to do, not to mention common courtesy. No one can debate opinions - only facts. And substantiated facts usually make clear who is in the right in no time at all.

[Metalject]

At what cost? Everything our gov't is involved in automatically includes massive inefficiency, waste, fraud and corruption. Everything. Unsubstantiated generalization.

There are things government does well, but 17trillion in debt strongly lends to the idea of massive waste. As far as fraud and corruption, I don't care who's in power, I don't see how anyone could argue that the government isn't anything but fraud and corruption. That's not to say there are no good people in government, but, and yes this is my opinion, the American system of government is a disastrous mess and nowhere close does it resemble what it was intended to be. The mere fact that we're discussing this on a federal level and that states aren't allowed to decide this for themselves is proof of that.


That's why they should be limited to only services that are absolutely essential for them to provide. Opinion. State it as such

It's hard to argue against, the constitution largely prohibits government more than it allows them and sets in place very few and limited things it can do...speaking of the federal government only. And in recent times, Obama has recognized this, called the constitution a document of negative liberties and one that should be corrected with affirmative rights. But that would do away with what we have and create something new...which in many ways has already been done as the constitution is not often followed anymore. But the basis of the constitution is of the basis of nature's God. It doesn't not matter if you believe in God or not, that is the basis...even Thomas Paine, an ardent atheist understood this and was one of the very reasons he wrote common sense. And yes, many things in the constitution, following it to the letter, we can argue that if that's the right path it is a matter of opinion, but those that believe so simply believe it is common sense.


The reason our health care system is so ungodly expensive is because of gov't regulation and intervention. Another unsubstantiated generalization with an opinion thrown in. Now we what them even more involved? Lunacy. Opinion Government is partially (if not largely) to blame. The court system that allows ambulance chasing lawyers, that's driven the cost up. Regulation that has made it impossible to buy insurance across state lines has driven the cost up. And a massive one, an FDA that allows the board members of the big pharma companies to hold the top spots at the FDA, they basically play a game of never ending musical chairs, that is perhaps the biggest problem of all and that is 100% government.

In Red

[Beethoven]

And btw, what that article blames Williams for kind of sounds like our government officials exempting themselves from their very own law. You think they know something we don't? If they have to live by the same laws they pass, many of those wouldn't pass.

[2Sox]

[/B]
In Red

[/B]
In Red

First: Please, enough with the red bold print. How about blue? It's a nice, relaxing color. (My favorite, actually)

Second, I'm going to agree with your statement about the FDA. The revolving door policy has been documented, is common knowledge and has to stop. There is no doubt about this.

Now about your remark citing Obama as stating that "the constitution is a document of negative liberties." I don't want to think that you were being intentionally disingenuous - because if you research this statement, it's easy to find what the President did say and the context in which he said it. He was in an interview in 2001, while he was a senator, talking about the Warren court - not his views. I would suggest you stop believing everything you hear or read on the right wing blogs and do your homework. The facts are out there. I would be happy to provide you with this one link:

Obama’s “Redistribution of Wealth” Quote In Context | The Moderate Voice

I'm tired so you find some others yourself.

Now about Thomas Paine and his important "Common Sense". I'm in the process of reading it now and I'll get back to you on it, but before I do, is there anything you like to change about what you wrote concerning this work?

Oh, one more thing. As someone who studied law and the Constitution you ought to know - as every kid in grade school learns very early - there is absolutely no mention of God in the constitution and one of the basic tenets on which this county was founded has been the separation of church and state.

[Metalject]

First: Please, enough with the red bold print. How about blue? It's a nice, relaxing color. (My favorite, actually)

The Red bold print, I don't know why I always pick red...subconscious favorite color maybe? I don't know. Nothing more than that to add there.

Second, I'm going to agree with your statement about the FDA. The revolving door policy has been documented, is common knowledge and has to stop. There is no doubt about this.

Glad we could agree. Most of the time when I've brought this up people just sort of stare blankly.

Now about your remark citing Obama as stating that "the constitution is a document of negative liberties." I don't want to think that you were being intentionally disingenuous - because if you research this statement, it's easy to find what the President did say and the context in which he said it. He was in an interview in 2001, while he was a senator, talking about the Warren court. I would suggest you stop believing everything you hear or read on the right wing blogs and do your homework. The facts are out there. I would be happy to provide you with this one link:

Obama’s “Redistribution of Wealth” Quote In Context | The Moderate Voice


I'm tired so you find some others yourself.

The comment on negative liberties and the Obama interview that came from, the comment about his belief in affirmative rights was the main point, in that government has the responsibility to right the wrongs of society rather than society righting the wrongs and government protecting the ability for it to do so. Yes, we can argue that if left to its own that society would trample this...the strong would destroy the weak. I recognize that, but that cannot happen if we remember what we talked about before...those in society (individuals) cannot do anything that tramples the life and liberty of another. That's governments role, but I believe president Obama sees it as more than that. Can I prove that as absolute fact? No, no one can either way; you would have to unequivocally know his heart and mind. I can only base my opinion on how I perceive what's in front of me.

Now about Thomas Paine and his important "Common Sense". I'm in the process of reading it now and I'll get back to you on it, but before I do, is there anything you like to change about what you wrote concerning this work?

I'm not sure what you're after here. Are you asking if I feel I may have misspoke or if I'd like to add more?

Oh, one more thing. As someone who studied law and the Constitution you ought to know - as every kid in grade school learns very early - there is absolutely no mention of God in the constitution and one of the basic tenets on which this county was founded has been the separation of church and state.

The separation of church and state, you are correct, that is a basic tenet. Which I believe was put in place so that there would be no state religion nor prohibition of one in private. But the idea of separating it completely is an impossible idea. I've said this before in another thread...a man's religious beliefs or lack thereof define how he sees the world, they make up a large part of who he is and his decisions will largely be influenced by that. It is impossible to separate that part of a man from himself, religious or not.

In any case, if we read the letters, diaries and countless books written by those who wrote the constitution, this topic is discussed at great length. The constitution itself is more or less a bullet point instruction of the role of government free from any emotional basis, while the declaration of independence is the opposite. Further, the founders believed it was for each man to determine his faith, that does not require constitutional persuasion nor should it prohibit it in any way.

Lastly, I have always found it confusing that so many in education have tried to paint the founders as atheist or deist at best. The idea that they were anything else seems to bother a lot of people and I don't understand why. Read Washington's diary sometime or if you're really feeling fancy, read Jefferson's. I think you'll find that the educators in America are either idiots or sheep. I'm not saying that radical fire and brimstone preachers are right but the opposite most certainly is dead wrong.

[2Sox]

The Red bold print, I don't know why I always pick red...subconscious favorite color maybe? I don't know. Nothing more than that to add there.


Glad we could agree. Most of the time when I've brought this up people just sort of stare blankly.



The comment on negative liberties and the Obama interview that came from, the comment about his belief in affirmative rights was the main point, in that government has the responsibility to right the wrongs of society rather than society righting the wrongs and government protecting the ability for it to do so. Yes, we can argue that if left to its own that society would trample this...the strong would destroy the weak. I recognize that, but that cannot happen if we remember what we talked about before...those in society (individuals) cannot do anything that tramples the life and liberty of another. That's governments role, but I believe president Obama sees it as more than that. Can I prove that as absolute fact? No, no one can either way; you would have to unequivocally know his heart and mind. I can only base my opinion on how I perceive what's in front of me.



I'm not sure what you're after here. Are you asking if I feel I may have misspoke or if I'd like to add more?



The separation of church and state, you are correct, that is a basic tenet. Which I believe was put in place so that there would be no state religion nor prohibition of one in private. But the idea of separating it completely is an impossible idea. I've said this before in another thread...a man's religious beliefs or lack thereof define how he sees the world, they make up a large part of who he is and his decisions will largely be influenced by that. It is impossible to separate that part of a man from himself, religious or not.

In any case, if we read the letters, diaries and countless books written by those who wrote the constitution, this topic is discussed at great length. The constitution itself is more or less a bullet point instruction of the role of government free from any emotional basis, while the declaration of independence is the opposite. Further, the founders believed it was for each man to determine his faith, that does not require constitutional persuasion nor should it prohibit it in any way.

Lastly, I have always found it confusing that so many in education have tried to paint the founders as atheist or deist at best. The idea that they were anything else seems to bother a lot of people and I don't understand why. Read Washington's diary sometime or if you're really feeling fancy, read Jefferson's. I think you'll find that the educators in America are either idiots or sheep. I'm not saying that radical fire and brimstone preachers are right but the opposite most certainly is dead wrong.

I respect how you write here. I believe you've made some very good points. There are some points that I take exception to but these are fine details, and rather than commenting, I'll just leave it at that.

One small point I'll disagree with. I'm a retired educator - spent 30 years in the classroom - and I was privileged to meet some of the finest, most brilliant people I have ever known. The few bad ones I've met along the way didn't last long.

[2Sox]

Posted by Metalject: I'm not sure what you're after here. Are you asking if I feel I may have misspoke or if I'd like to add more?

You might have misspoken but I think that it was more that I was unclear on exactly what you were saying about Thomas Paine and God in referencing "Common Sense". I believe you may have confused "Common Sense" with his "Age of Reason" - in which he essentially expresses that organized religion is an abomination - even while being a Deist himself - and says it has absolutely not place in government. Of course, this is how I understand it from what I have read - but it seems pretty clear to me.

I'm very grateful for this discussion because it has given me the opportunity to research and learn new things. Gets the blood moving.

[Metalject]

Posted by Metalject: I'm not sure what you're after here. Are you asking if I feel I may have misspoke or if I'd like to add more?

You might have misspoken but I think that it was more that I was unclear on exactly what you were saying about Thomas Paine and God in referencing "Common Sense". I believe you may have confused "Common Sense" with his "Age of Reason" - in which he essentially expresses that organized religion is an abomination - even while being a Deist himself - and says it has absolutely not place in government. Of course, this is how I understand it from what I have read - but it seems pretty clear to me.

I'm very grateful for this discussion because it has given me the opportunity to research and learn new things. Gets the blood moving.

I may have gotten confused...you may be right. It's been years since I've ready anything by Paine, so you could be correct. I do recall, however, reading where Paine discussed Hamilton and Washington's basis of the separation of powers on the book of Jeremiah, the branches of government on the book of Isaiah. Even article 4 comes straight from the book of Exodus. And Paine discusses these matters, how he came to terms with it despite his overall lack of faith. The basis of his acceptance was simple, faith or not these principles are basic common sense any man should be able to hold to.

Regardless of our personal beliefs, the idea that much of the constitution directly reflects biblical text, in my opinion this isn't something anyone should be threatened by. Religious or not, the bible says murder is bad; would any of us argue otherwise just because we do not share christian faith? I would hope not; I would hope we could all agree that such things are common sense despite where they come from.

[Metalject]

Danny Williams is a billionaire on par with Michael Bloomberg who donates his salary to charity.
Danny Williams, Canadian Official, Seeks Heart Surgery In US

I spoke in a previous post that we have to take care not to be lazy and uninquisitive but look past the slogans and talking points, and not only listen to what we want to hear because it agrees with our previous biases. Let's fight that tendency. Here from a Canadian paper. You can certainly find differing opinions everywhere. But one has to look in order to find what's true.

Williams's heart surgery choice was based on ignorance - The Globe and Mail

And by the way, we have a very successful single payer system in the U.S., administered by the government and from my knowledge it works great. I have many friends who are Vets and doctors who I have known who worked there, and they all love it - the V.A.

I have yet to hear of anyone call the V.A. a quality place. Not anyone I know anyway.

[2Sox]

I have yet to hear of anyone call the V.A. a quality place. Not anyone I know anyway.

Wait awhile. You might be surprised.

[Beethoven]

I have yet to hear of anyone call the V.A. a quality place. Not anyone I know anyway.

That's because it is not largely reported in the media. There was a massive case of vets and other VA members contaminated with Heatitus b from a colonoscopy where the instruments were not properly sterilized.
VA Contaminated Colonoscopies: 'Completely Inexcusable'

In regard to Danny Williams, the article can say what they want but, when the chips are down and it was HIS heart, we saw where his money went. All the rest is buffalo chips. Everyone can talk a big game but none where in HIS predicament. "Edited not really pertinent to the discussion"

[BuzzardMarinePumper]

And by the way, we have a very successful single payer system in the U.S., administered by the government and from my knowledge it works great. I have many friends who are Vets and doctors who I have known who worked there, and they all love it - the V.A.

2sox I respect you but you are way off track here ! You offer herasay from friends as a statement and I promise you it is not a fact ! The VA offers basic medical care fore basic 1st aid and anything that requires real specialist are the Dr. who can't get a real job in the real world . I know you are a liberal and drink the Obama Kol-Aid but for Christ sake ? What real qualified Dr would work for the VA . . . because he has a heart for vets . . . .I think not and even if that is the case !! I know from hands on treatment aything that requires real spelized medicine is out sourced and sent to a real hospital !

Oh and try to receive pain management from the VA ? NOT !
Try to get TRT from the VA ? NOT !
Try to go to an appointment and get there on time and spend less that 7 hours there at the VA ? NOT !
As a vet you can live in the low rent district and be close to the VA or drive 100 + miles round trip for basic treatment ?
Is it really free when they put a banana on your ear and say you are well ?

So on that statement I am qualified to call BULL $HIT !

[CobraMustangSVT]

2sox I respect you but you are way off track here ! You offer herasay from friends as a statement and I promise you it is not a fact ! The VA offers basic medical care fore basic 1st aid and anything that requires real specialist are the Dr. who can't get a real job in the real world . I know you are a liberal and drink the Obama Kol-Aid but for Christ sake ? What real qualified Dr would work for the VA . . . because he has a heart for vets . . . .I think not and even if that is the case !! I know from hands on treatment aything that requires real spelized medicine is out sourced and sent to a real hospital !

Oh and try to receive pain management from the VA ? NOT !
Try to get TRT from the VA ? NOT !
Try to go to an appointment and get there on time and spend less that 7 hours there at the VA ? NOT !
As a vet you can live in the low rent district and be close to the VA or drive 100 + miles round trip for basic treatment ?
Is it really free when they put a banana on your ear and say you are well ?

So on that statement I am qualified to call BULL $HIT !

Dammit, dammit, dammit......

I stopped TRT for the past 3 weeks because the VA wanted me to show them a low number before they can treat me.

[2Sox]

Dammit, dammit, dammit......

I stopped TRT for the past 3 weeks because the VA wanted me to show them a low number before they can treat me.

Cobra,

Don't give up hope. Not to make less of Buzz's experiences at all but you've got to look into things for yourself. I'd suggest you go slow.

A good buddy of mine of thirty years, 100% disabled U.S. Navy Vietnam vet - with Hep C, has himself, his wife and four daughters treated by the VA all his adult life. Not a hiccup with his care.

By the way, another fairly successful single payer U.S. Government sponsored system: Medicare. Just try to take away medicare from someone who has it - like myself! Not a chance. Why not Medicare for all and throw out the ACA? I'd go for that.

(Maybe this will have you guys talk about something else.) ;-)

[Metalject]

Cobra,

Don't give up hope. Not to make less of Buzz's experiences at all but you've got to look into things for yourself. I'd suggest you go slow.

A good buddy of mine of thirty years, 100% disabled U.S. Navy Vietnam vet - with Hep C, has himself, his wife and four daughters treated by the VA all his adult life. Not a hiccup with his care.

By the way, another fairly successful single payer U.S. Government sponsored system: Medicare. Just try to take away medicare from someone who has it - like myself! Not a chance. Why not Medicare for all and throw out the ACA? I'd go for that.

(Maybe this will have you guys talk about something else.) ;-)

OK, I'll take a stab. Big difference in medicare and ACA. You pay into medicare for years and years, you're entire adult life. The ACA, you take money away from working people who are already also paying into medicare and giving it to others. That's the first difference and a massive one.

If Obama care is to work at all, they will absolutely have to take more and more from others. So in the end, I will lose more of my paycheck to fund Obama care and there is no way they're going to stop taking away what I'm required to pay for medicare. As of now, 25% of all my pay goes to the federal government. That's not including all other taxes. Do you understand how much money that is? Granted, the total amount is relative to each individual's situation and total income but 25% plus all the other taxes puts a strain on anyone.

[Beethoven]

Cobra,

Don't give up hope. Not to make less of Buzz's experiences at all but you've got to look into things for yourself. I'd suggest you go slow.

A good buddy of mine of thirty years, 100% disabled U.S. Navy Vietnam vet - with Hep C, has himself, his wife and four daughters treated by the VA all his adult life. Not a hiccup with his care.

By the way, another fairly successful single payer U.S. Government sponsored system: Medicare. Just try to take away medicare from someone who has it - like myself! Not a chance. Why not Medicare for all and throw out the ACA? I'd go for that.

(Maybe this will have you guys talk about something else.) ;-)

Well I happen to have my mother that's 91 years old and I can tell you Medicare on its own for her has not been that good. She came down with myasthenia graves some years ago and to make a long story short, I had to pay for a highly regarded specialist out of my own pocket for the correct diagnosis. Why you ask? Because Medicare part A still has co pays and out of pocket costs that for a working person might be tough, but a retired person widowed on a fixed income can not. So in comes the Medicare HMO plans. Not too bad except for a condition like hers, the meds were not covered. If she hadn't had me, forget about it. This woman came to this country, LEGALLY I might add with my father more than 60 years ago and NEVER had any government help. Any other immigrant today without being a citizen gets Medicare, Medicaid, low income housing etc, but the one who worked, paid taxes and became an American Citizen does not. Forgive me if I'm not thrilled. Again the welfare state at work. I looked up the budget from the CBO the other day and guess what, Medicare IS getting reduced money wise, mind you none of Obamas penalties or anything else has kicked in yet. It was supposed to but the executive order pen came out real quick due to upcoming elections, which btw is illegal. But what's a little illegality to this administration. The funny and sad thing is, if similar things were happening and this was a Republican president, these same people would be outraged and the media would be bashing 24X7. Romney did say that Russia would be a threat, and Medicare would be cut and all the left mocked him. Now this President spies on Americans, gave away or missiles defense from Europe, Russia invades Ukraine, a little thing considered an uprise of a few million is happening in Venezuela which the media hardly covers while University students are beaten and killed. Meanwhile or President is going on Jimmy Fallon, picking his March Madness brackets, Michelle is on yet another vacation in a communist country talking us down. The military is going to suffer extensive cuts, (your smooth running VA program) in lieu of more welfare. I'm sorry but that's down right embarrassing for this great country being divided and conquered from within.

[BuzzardMarinePumper]

Dammit, dammit, dammit......

I stopped TRT for the past 3 weeks because the VA wanted me to show them a low number before they can treat me.

Sorry man but run from the VA Endo I have a thread explaining how just plain stupid they are and I will up date it around the 9th of this mth next week so go to my profile and seen which thread it is you will be amazed at the ignorance of some of the comments the Endo gave me and he lied and what he didn't know the answers to he as a professional Dr. actully yried to Bull $hit me . I would give you the link but I am 54 self taught on puters and relly don't know how to post the link but you can find it in my profile under subscribed threads

I was diled i nnear perfect with a 886 on HCG which if I had dropped the HCG I would have most likely tested serum levels around 700 and went back to civilian MD because VA ENdo saw no reason to tst E2 ? WTF ? Anyway he tried to convience me about how I was about to die due to not above normal just the high end of normal RBC. Also he STATED if you needed and Ai you are taking to much Test and he would never script Injection they are a death sentence ! . Now Get this after my E2 came back from my Civilian Dr. E2 was 26 and It had been 18 on ,25 EOD so I was only on .25 the day after injections for a little over 3 weeks so I am staying at .25 the day after injection and should fall right bout in at E2 of 30 and feel great on 180 mg of Cypionate . . .. underlying cause of need for high dose id high dose of opiates due to sever Trauma and RA .

NORMAL AND FEEL GOOD PROTICALL
1) I am on 90 mg every 3.5 days
2) .25 of generic adex day after injection and will be real close to 30 on E2 but will be 3 mths before I get another reading enless I can make VA Endo take it with Test next week
3) 150 iu's of HCG EVERY 3RD DAY and feel great and nuts are swinging in the wind
4) took 14 mths to get here due to DA civilian Dr. but he scripts Test and ai . . . lol Ai at 1 mg daily but zI use a pill cutter OH and inject 200 mg EOW I inject every 3.5 days
__________________________________________________ _________________________

1) Now for the last 30 days I have done as VA Dr recommended cut Test Injections to 100 mg a week almost in half today I feel zacalak - $hit ? I wanted to do this to see if I had same results as when I 1st started TRT and the highest I got on 100MG a week was 389 and civilain Dr, said you are in normal range so your fixed . . .lol I screamed and yelled and got an Ai becuse at 100 mg a week my E2 was 72
2) I go next week to VA Endo and he will take a test reading and I expect it to be ball park 400 not optiminal for me . . .The VA endo said Optiminal not important only to be in normal range ? Now stop and think of how out right stupid this statement was ?
3) He said the only treatment he would give me was a gel and he would prescribe a heavy dose for me . . .I am thinking BS I will use his DA to get all the free BW I can and lie my ass off maybe get some free gel and he don't give a shit when I feel good and come back in next mth at 700 with no HCG the week of BW
4) I had high but in normal range for RBC and he said this coud kill me but yet he refused to do a therpudic blood draw ? Really concerned about my health and well being ? NOT !
5) I was there because I had an elevated PSA a sign of possible prostate cancer he never mentiond that ?
6) I told him I had Deep Vain Thrombious a few years ago and some of my toes were numb ? He didn't give a $hit about this ?
7) Not really high to be on TRT but colertroil was 3 point high and the average of high and low puts me in normal range .
8) Type II diabetic but due to TRT and exercise and diet A1C is 5 but he didn't even comment?
9) He even made a statement that back loading passgaeway could give a false reading on BW . . .total BS he is a DA and a looser (Oh I told him that in not thise exact words but i did say his treatment for TRT was out dated and he had no idea what he was doing
10) So he said I had issues to think I knew morw about TRT than he did so now I have to go see the Shrink because I want to feel good and he said that he was not concerned with me feeling good but proper TRT treatment required no HCG and no blood donations and most of all NEVER an AI .
11) So if you have a 1/2 a day to waste and want to mess with him go if you are going to a VA DR for TRT do not waste your time Sgt Bearden USMC Vet

[Beethoven]

Sorry man but run from the VA Endo I have a thread explaining how just plain stupid they are and I will up date it around the 9th of this mth next week so go to my profile and seen which thread it is you will be amazed at the ignorance of some of the comments the Endo gave me and he lied and what he didn't know the answers to he as a professional Dr. actully yried to Bull $hit me . I would give you the link but I am 54 self taught on puters and relly don't know how to post the link but you can find it in my profile under subscribed threads

I was diled i nnear perfect with a 886 on HCG which if I had dropped the HCG I would have most likely tested serum levels around 700 and went back to civilian MD because VA ENdo saw no reason to tst E2 ? WTF ? Anyway he tried to convience me about how I was about to die due to not above normal just the high end of normal RBC. Also he STATED if you needed and Ai you are taking to much Test and he would never script Injection they are a death sentence ! . Now Get this after my E2 came back from my Civilian Dr. E2 was 26 and It had been 18 on ,25 EOD so I was only on .25 the day after injections for a little over 3 weeks so I am staying at .25 the day after injection and should fall right bout in at E2 of 30 and feel great on 180 mg of Cypionate . . .. underlying cause of need for high dose id high dose of opiates due to sever Trauma and RA .

NORMAL AND FEEL GOOD PROTICALL
1) I am on 90 mg every 3.5 days
2) .25 of generic adex day after injection and will be real close to 30 on E2 but will be 3 mths before I get another reading enless I can make VA Endo take it with Test next week
3) 150 iu's of HCG EVERY 3RD DAY and feel great and nuts are swinging in the wind
4) took 14 mths to get here due to DA civilian Dr. but he scripts Test and ai . . . lol Ai at 1 mg daily but zI use a pill cutter OH and inject 200 mg EOW I inject every 3.5 days
__________________________________________________ _________________________

1) Now for the last 30 days I have done as VA Dr recommended cut Test Injections to 100 mg a week almost in half today I feel zacalak - $hit ? I wanted to do this to see if I had same results as when I 1st started TRT and the highest I got on 100MG a week was 389 and civilain Dr, said you are in normal range so your fixed . . .lol I screamed and yelled and got an Ai becuse at 100 mg a week my E2 was 72
2) I go next week to VA Endo and he will take a test reading and I expect it to be ball park 400 not optiminal for me . . .The VA endo said Optiminal not important only to be in normal range ? Now stop and think of how out right stupid this statement was ?
3) He said the only treatment he would give me was a gel and he would prescribe a heavy dose for me . . .I am thinking BS I will use his DA to get all the free BW I can and lie my ass off maybe get some free gel and he don't give a shit when I feel good and come back in next mth at 700 with no HCG the week of BW
4) I had high but in normal range for RBC and he said this coud kill me but yet he refused to do a therpudic blood draw ? Really concerned about my health and well being ? NOT !
5) I was there because I had an elevated PSA a sign of possible prostate cancer he never mentiond that ?
6) I told him I had Deep Vain Thrombious a few years ago and some of my toes were numb ? He didn't give a $hit about this ?
7) Not really high to be on TRT but colertroil was 3 point high and the average of high and low puts me in normal range .
8) Type II diabetic but due to TRT and exercise and diet A1C is 5 but he didn't even comment?
9) He even made a statement that back loading passgaeway could give a false reading on BW . . .total BS he is a DA and a looser (Oh I told him that in not thise exact words but i did say his treatment for TRT was out dated and he had no idea what he was doing
10) So he said I had issues to think I knew morw about TRT than he did so now I have to go see the Shrink because I want to feel good and he said that he was not concerned with me feeling good but proper TRT treatment required no HCG and no blood donations and most of all NEVER an AI .
11) So if you have a 1/2 a day to waste and want to mess with him go if you are going to a VA DR for TRT do not waste your time Sgt Bearden USMC Vet [/FONT]

Don't feel bad, there are many civilian Drs who don't know trt either. My original Dr felt the same way about just being in range. Never tested free test or even estradiol. When I mentioned HCG he looked at me and said for what? It took me some time before I found my Dr now who is pretty well schooled in trt. He is also on trt, so maybe that's why he is well schooled. But here is the kicker, he's not an endo. He is a primary Dr and by luck I just happened to get new insurance where he is covered. Was going to pay out of pocket before the change. I have found in my time with the service that most of the really good Drs usually get out of the service and go private. They are not on the cutting edge as the private sector is. This has been pretty much a proven fact anywhere you look. Everyone thinks the Canadian system is the model but no one reports on the negatives of that system. Long lines, long waits, people waiting for surgery taking pills until their number is called. Sure, maybe for someone with a choice between no coverage at all and that might not seem too bad. But for those of us who are able to have elective surgery on demand or whatever procedure is needed, it will weigh heavy on us. This is not information I picked up on the internet in an article, although there was a piece on a news network some time ago, can't remember which, but is relayed directly to me by several Canadians I have met down here as well as people I personally know who spent some years in Canada. I again harp back on a high ranking Canadian official electing to have a heart procedure done in the U.S. And pay approx $20,000 to do so when it was available for no charge in his country. The media can try and spin it anyway they want by I assure you he is not ignorant or mis informed, on the contrary, he is well informed and chose not to put HIS life in their hands. We would not have that choice.

[2Sox]

2sox I respect you but you are way off track here ! You offer herasay from friends as a statement and I promise you it is not a fact ! The VA offers basic medical care fore basic 1st aid and anything that requires real specialist are the Dr. who can't get a real job in the real world . I know you are a liberal and drink the Obama Kol-Aid but for Christ sake ? What real qualified Dr would work for the VA . . . because he has a heart for vets . . . .I think not and even if that is the case !! I know from hands on treatment aything that requires real spelized medicine is out sourced and sent to a real hospital !

Oh and try to receive pain management from the VA ? NOT !
Try to get TRT from the VA ? NOT !
Try to go to an appointment and get there on time and spend less that 7 hours there at the VA ? NOT !
As a vet you can live in the low rent district and be close to the VA or drive 100 + miles round trip for basic treatment ?
Is it really free when they put a banana on your ear and say you are well ?

So on that statement I am qualified to call BULL $HIT !

Buzz,
I respect what you express here. I have no doubt what you say is the truth - and you'll hear no further debate from me on this subject. Not being a veteran and not having first hand experience with the VA, I can only go on what has been related to me by my friends. I hope I made that clear. I feel bad that you've had such bad experiences there. I hope this administration and those in the future work to improve whatever is wrong at the VA. Our veterans deserve nothing less than the best care we can give them.

[BuzzardMarinePumper]

Buzz,
I respect what you express here. I have no doubt what you say is the truth - and you'll hear no further debate from me on this subject. Not being a veteran and not having first hand experience with the VA, I can only go on what has been related to me by my friends. I hope I made that clear. I feel bad that you've had such bad experiences there. I hope this administration and those in the future work to improve whatever is wrong at the VA. Our veterans deserve nothing less than the best care we can give them.

lol Buddy I thought you might be a warrior hater and not everyone is cut from the same cloth ! There are many codes in thr Corps that are not official USMC Memos But protect themselves is one of them live today to fight again another day and Marines are to fight for and protect those who can't protect themselves ? Oh and one is no Marine below the rank of E2 is allowed to think or use his brain only die and do as ordered

But if he get wounded is is 100% covered by Insurance