You'll want to read this!

[Ronnie Rowland]

sorry if it seems off topic. i am new to the whole prohormone and steroid world but very excited about being a part of it. so my question is if i am taking a prohormone called warrior which contains superdrol tren and epistane for about six weeks. what do i need to do for a pct? thanks a lot

If you have used any hormone, for any length of time, you should do PCT.
A PCT is necessary for any cycle of prohormones or real steroids.

A good approach to increase LH would be to use Tamoxifen Citrate at around 20 mgs for first week of PCT and for the 2nd week run around 10 mgs. To be safe run Clomiphene Citrate to raise natural test levels. 100 mgs per day during first week and 50 during second week.

Anti-es alone are not always adequate to fully restore natural test levels-hence HCG can be used at 1500-2500 mgs eod for 14 days.

[tripper]

amazing thread good read!going to give it a go myself, answers alot of queris av had top man

[dosXX]

Thank you sir for this very informative thread.

[bifda]

way to go imo, ill be using it when i am ready, thanks ronnie.

[VASCULAR VINCE]

few more questions ronnie...please explain what you are trying to get out in more depth?....

Quote from Ronnie Rowland; "All to often I see people thinking they need to do 20-25 work sets per muscle group. Now I want to drive this point home-If you cannot break down your muscles to the max with 6-12 intense work sets total for the week (warm up sets not included) whether you train them once a week or twice a week you have a serious problem!"


Quote from Jonathan Perez
Certified ACE / IAFF / IAFC Firefighter Peer Fitness Trainer

"Every pro bodybuilder does only 1 set per exercise to failure to gain muscle mass.....whether they say so or not.

I'm going to answer one of the most asked, most contradicted questions about how to train to gain weight around:

"How many sets does it take to gain muscular size and development?"

Now, I'm referring to sets per exercise.

When you perform a set in a "certain" manner, with the correct amount of weight and for a very "specific" rep range, you will have induced the maximum growth in that muscle.

Anything above and beyond that is just a waste.

The problem today is that when you pick up any bodybuilding or weight gain magazine / book, they all recommend several sets per exercise.

Not only is this very misleading to us average, skinny "hardgainers", but when you see every top pro doing set after set after set, it's no wonder that 99.9% of the average weight training population feels that it takes many sets to get the job done.

Well, to get straight to my point, look very closely at how the pros train, not what they say.

An excellent example is Jay Cutler.

If you ever read his articles, Muscle-Tech ads, or watch his training dvds, you see he follows a very high volume, high set training routine.

He does anywhere from 15-25 sets per muscle!

So, anyone looking at that might say, "Jay's a beast. If he does a ton of sets, then so will I!".

Well, I want you to go and read for yourself an ad that's running in some of the mags, the one titled "A Legacy In The Making".

In there he discusses his training routine.

In there he says, quote, ".....Obviously, you can't train to failure on every set.

I try to put in 100% effort on the last set of each exercise.

For example, if I'm doing chest, I usually do a weight I can handle for 8 to 10 repetitions for 3 sets and maybe a forth set where I go all out........the fourth set is the only set where I go to failure."

So, if he is doing 4 sets for an exercise, the first 3 are pretty much a bunch of warm-ups.

Only the fourth and last set is the one where he goes all-out, 100%, to failure.

As a matter of fact, I remember reading in Muscular Development that he calls these first sets "feeler" sets.

Well, "feeler" sets have got nothing to do with gaining muscle mass, it just serves as a warm-up.

This is the same case with every other pro.

They may say they do 3, 4, 5 sets per exercise, but they only go all-out, to failure on the last set.

In other words...............1 set per exercise to failure.......the one and only set that puts the muscle weight gain wheels into motion.

Observe, my friend, real closely what people do, not what they say, because it can be very misleading.

You may read in an article in a mag and see an individual's training routine, usually inside of a box, containing the name of the exercise, the number of sets and reps.

Well, if you didn't know any better, you would assume that these guys are going all-out, to the max on each and every one of these sets.

That only leads to over-exhaustion, over-fatigue, and overtraining for you and I."

[VASCULAR VINCE]

can you show us why protein cycling during deload works for muscle building?????

[Ronnie Rowland]

can you show us why protein cycling during deload works for muscle building?????

I copied this from another thread of mine-


VERY IMPORTANT: Your main goal while using steroids or pro-hormones is to add mass while minimizing fat gains. It's not the drug but the diet that makes this happen! I believe there are still a lot of people on this board taking steroids that are not consuming enough protein to make it happen.


In regards to dieting to put on maximum muscle mass your main objective is to take in 1.5-2 grams of protein per pound of body weight during reloads. When you deload simply cut protein intake by about half and replace it with fats, carbs or both inorder to remain at maintenance level. I wanted to toss something out there for all you guys taking anabolic steroids. If you have read through the Slingshot Training System article you know I believe in protein cycling. Protein cycling while using anabolics is nothing new! Dave Palumbo suggest that protein cycling is anabolic. Vince Gironda was pushing periods of lower protein intake years ago. Tom Platz talked about it in his book "Big Beyond Belief." I believe that constantly taking in high amounts of protein (for i.e.: 2 grams of protein per pound of body weight year round) can make the body become efficient at getting rid of it as waste rather than utilizing it for muscle growth regardless of what you may be using to promote protein systheis. Why? For starters the liver becomes stressed and gains can slow down. Ammonia is a product formed during amino acid deamination and is very toxic to the body. Constanlty overloading your body with excessive amounts of protein in order to achieve more growth does not work as well as one might think.

The key to getting the body to store more protein in the mucles is to first remove excess toxins from kidneys and liver by way of a deload ( a lower volume training phase). This helps the organs to become efficient at storing amino acids in the body rather than getting rid of them as waste. In addition, increasing healthy fat intake while simulataenously lowering carbs/protein during a deload will help increase insulin sensitivity. When insulin sensitivity is high-more amino acids can be accepted into the muscle cells. Fats allow for additional calories to be ingested without decreasing insulin sensitivity like tons of carbs do. And healthy fats do not put undue stress on organs like heavy amounts of protein. The *****-3 fatty acids are somewhat anabolic and significantly improve glucose disposal in both diabetics and healthy humans.

I have learned the best time to load up on protein and carbs is during higher volume training phases (called a reload) where their is a larger demand for such. It's simply not needed during lower volume training phases (deload) unless you are an ectomorph or involved in sports. As with training volumes- protein/carb cycling causes the body to become more efficient at storage of either. I believe lowering protein during a deload tricks the body into becoming very sensitive to the anabolic effects of amino acids just as lowering training volume during a deload encourages the body to become more sensitive to higher training volumes during a reload.. If the body is always being overloaded with large amouts of protein it can down-regulating protein storage. The body is an adaptive machine so realize taking in too much protein or carbs can actually decrease absorption over a period of time. The same rule applies to training volumes!

There are 3 different ways to employ the Slingshot Mass Diet. The key is to keep fats and carbs separated for the most part regardless of the method you choose. You have the option of adding 1 hyperinsulinemia meal (combining saturated carbs and hi gi carbs) once a day. I think most know that Dave Palumbo was known for going to McDonalds once a day and eating fries and burgers for his once a day hyperinsulinemia meal. The rest of his off-season diet consisted of separating carbs and fats to a large degree. Dave's super fast metabolism allowed him to eat a large high calorie meal composed of both fats/carbs on a daily basis. Obvioulsy, not everyone has the metabolic rate to do this. But, if you do have a fast metabolism I would take in this hyper meal either for breakfast in the form of something like whole eggs and pancakes/waffles or during an evening meal post workout for something like red meat and potatoes. Some have such a slow metabolic rate they have to limit hyperinsulin meals to 1-3 times per week. Eat to match your metabolism!


If you are taking in 2 grams of protein per pound of body weight during a reload then you would go down to around 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight during a deload. I usually go down to right at 1 gram with a deload because it gives my body a needed break from the 2 grams during a reload. It's hard on the stomach trying to digest 2 grams of protein per pound of body weight day-in, day-out.

Note: 8 time mr. olympia Lee Haney rarely took in more than 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight each day during his lifting career. I wanted to throw that out there for those who are afraid of losing muscle when decreasing protein during a deload. If you are using only about 1 gram of protein per pound during reloads then around .5 grams of protein per pound of body weight during a deload will work. Lowering protein intake during deloads is only going to help you increase size over time!


NOTE: NATURAL TRAINERS WILL NOT BE ABLE TO STOMACH 2 GRAMS OF PROTEIN PER POUND OF BODY WEIGHT. NO ONE KNOWS THEIR EXACT PROTEIN NEEDS BUT I BELIEVE IT'S BEST TO ERR ON THE SIDE OF HAVING ENOUGH THAN HAVING TOO LITTLE. I HAVE WITNESSED SOME AMAZING TRANSFORMATIONS WITH GUYS USING ANABOLICS ONCE THEY GOT THEIR DIET IN ORDER-MEANING THEY INCREASED BOTH PROTEIN AND CALORIC INTAKE ). THE MAIN GOAL WHILE USING STEROIDS IS TO ADD MASS WHILE MINIMIZING FAT GAINS. IT'S NOT THE DRUG BUT THE DIET THAT MAKES THIS HAPPEN! A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE STILL NOT EATING ENOUGH PROTEIN TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN! I WANT TO DRIVE THIS POINT HOME BECAUSE I BELIEVE THERE ARE STILL A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THIS BOARD AND OTHERS THAT ARE NOT CONSUMING ENOUGH PROTEIN AND CALORIES TO MAKE THINGS HAPPEN!






An interesting interview with Nasser El Sonbaty which supports the principles behind the Slingshot Training System!!!" ]
"You once said that you can maintain your massive size on as little as 100 grams of protein per day. How exactly do you do this and not lose muscle mass?

I have been in this sport for over 25 years now. And as I mentioned before I have been on diets - strict pre contest diets - for 18 years. I should maybe sit down one day and make a crazy calculation of how many chicken breasts I have consumed in all these years, obviously during dieting more than while training off-season. I just got tired of forever eating protein to keep my size up or building it.

If you are on a high protein and low carb, low fat diet, then you have to bump your protein way up (at least up to 300 grams per diet day; and if you are a very big bodybuilder like myself, then you have sometimes/or at least should take about 600 grams of protein per day) otherwise you shrink too much and the uses its own muscle as fuel.

Because I am so sick and tired of protein as a food source, as amino acids and as supplement drinks I decided to eat more carbs off-season in order to compensate for the lack and the lower amount of protein I am taking in. But again, pre contest I just force feed my body to get the highest possible amount of protein into my system. But off-season I do intentionally neglect my daily protein intake.

If you have no problems taking protein in, just go ahead. The more protein, the better the muscles will build up. My off-season weight goes up to 330 pounds. With a higher protein intake off-season, I probably would be even bigger. Also I do have a so-called mesomorph type of body and was very athletic from beginning. And my metabolism is not too fast and not too slow.

If you are for example more an ectomorph type of person, your metabolism is very fast. You have to then eat way more calories than I do and you have to also eat way more frequently than I do. To recap what Nasser said-"The more protein, the better the muscles will build up."


The best time to take in large amounts of protein is during your reloads/higher volume training phases. Like Nasser also stated-he needed a break from all the high protein because it can get old trying to stomach around 1.5-2 grams of protein per pound of body weight every day. This is where the deload comes into play! After 8 weeks of consuming high amounts of protein your digestive enzymes will be ready for a 1-2 week break.



The main take home point is to decrease protein during a deload so that when you come back to a reload you can better stomach the needed protein to make the best gains possible. The second take home point is to keep carbs and fats seperated for the most part adn cut them off at night. If you function better on more carbs you'll need to take in less fats. If you do best taking in more fats you'll need less carbs. Combine these principles with protein cycling and proper periodization in your workouts and you will make the leanest and fastest gains possible.

I realize this is the drug forum but drugs aren't very effective without having the proper nutrition. The veterans on this board are constanlty preaching such but it tends to fall on death ears. I hope people will take the time to study what is written in this thread. I've seen some amazing transformations by guys using steroids when these principles where applied. My motto is if you are going to do something then do it right or don't do it at all..


Workout days:

Meal 1-protein/carbs
Meal 2-protein/fats
Meal 3-protein/carbs (pre-workout meal)
Workout
Meal 4 protein/carbs (post workout protein shake/fast acting carbs)
Meal 4 extended protein/carbs (post workout meal)
Meal 5-protein/fats
Meal 6-protein/fats

Non-workout days:


Meal 1-protein/carbs
Meal 2-protein/fats
Meal 3-protein/carbs
Meal 4 protein/fats
Meal 5-protein/carbs
Meal 6-protein/fats

The first 3 melas can also be p/c while the last 3 p/f. If you are having trouble gaining weight take in one meal each day combined of both carbs and fats. Later in the day is best because eating fats/carbs together are hard to digest and can prevent you from eating enough meals. These c/f meals can be fast foods if desired but try to eat as healthy as possible to keep cholestrol in check. Steroids combined with too much fast food is very hard on your heart due to steroids lowering your healthy cholesterol. Cardio done 2-3 times per week for 15-30 mins on non-leg training day will both increase appetite and reduce bad cholesterol.Carbs and fats will be eaten together in one to seven meal per weeks (hyperinsulinemia meal) as opposed to separating them like you should in a cutting phase. Combining fats and carbs in some of the same meals during an off-season blast will create a better muscle building effect and increase energy output so you can lift heavier weights. Increased insulin levels obtained by combining hi gi carbs and saturated fats during a blasting mass phase will help suppress the muscle wasting hormone cortisol which induces protein synthesis. Elevated insulin levels will also down regulate SHBG (Sex Hormone Binding Globulin). High SHBG levels are one of the main culprits when testosterone is no longer working in conjunction with a good training program. SHBG prevents testosterone from fitting into the receptors. (Bound testosterone) equals about 97-99 percent of total testosterone circulation while (free testosterone) equals about 1-3 percent of total test. When SHGB levels are kept low it allows free testosterone to fit into the receptor and make muscles grow at a faster rate. Therefore, making a low carb diet or low fat diet, less than optimal during a bulking up phase! There's no value in mixing a lot of carbs and fat together in one meal (except the once daily hyperinsulinemia meal) because doing so will slow down the digestive tract and cause bloating-hence preventing you from eating enough clean foods to put on size! It can also cause cause health problems and fat gain. My definition of "hyperinsulinemia" is simpy an insulin spike to the utmost from combining carbs and saturated fats in the same meal

Important Note: If you can't do the diet then I say hold off on taking steroids and pro-hormones until you can get the mindset to do things right.

[Ronnie Rowland]

few more questions ronnie...please explain what you are trying to get out in more depth?....

Quote from Ronnie Rowland; "All to often I see people thinking they need to do 20-25 work sets per muscle group. Now I want to drive this point home-If you cannot break down your muscles to the max with 6-12 intense work sets total for the week (warm up sets not included) whether you train them once a week or twice a week you have a serious problem!"


Quote from Jonathan Perez
Certified ACE / IAFF / IAFC Firefighter Peer Fitness Trainer

"Every pro bodybuilder does only 1 set per exercise to failure to gain muscle mass.....whether they say so or not.

I'm going to answer one of the most asked, most contradicted questions about how to train to gain weight around:

"How many sets does it take to gain muscular size and development?"

Now, I'm referring to sets per exercise.

When you perform a set in a "certain" manner, with the correct amount of weight and for a very "specific" rep range, you will have induced the maximum growth in that muscle.

Anything above and beyond that is just a waste.

The problem today is that when you pick up any bodybuilding or weight gain magazine / book, they all recommend several sets per exercise.

Not only is this very misleading to us average, skinny "hardgainers", but when you see every top pro doing set after set after set, it's no wonder that 99.9% of the average weight training population feels that it takes many sets to get the job done.

Well, to get straight to my point, look very closely at how the pros train, not what they say.

An excellent example is Jay Cutler.

If you ever read his articles, Muscle-Tech ads, or watch his training dvds, you see he follows a very high volume, high set training routine.

He does anywhere from 15-25 sets per muscle!

So, anyone looking at that might say, "Jay's a beast. If he does a ton of sets, then so will I!".

Well, I want you to go and read for yourself an ad that's running in some of the mags, the one titled "A Legacy In The Making".

In there he discusses his training routine.

In there he says, quote, ".....Obviously, you can't train to failure on every set.

I try to put in 100% effort on the last set of each exercise.

For example, if I'm doing chest, I usually do a weight I can handle for 8 to 10 repetitions for 3 sets and maybe a forth set where I go all out........the fourth set is the only set where I go to failure."

So, if he is doing 4 sets for an exercise, the first 3 are pretty much a bunch of warm-ups.

Only the fourth and last set is the one where he goes all-out, 100%, to failure.

As a matter of fact, I remember reading in Muscular Development that he calls these first sets "feeler" sets.

Well, "feeler" sets have got nothing to do with gaining muscle mass, it just serves as a warm-up.

This is the same case with every other pro.

They may say they do 3, 4, 5 sets per exercise, but they only go all-out, to failure on the last set.

In other words...............1 set per exercise to failure.......the one and only set that puts the muscle weight gain wheels into motion.

Observe, my friend, real closely what people do, not what they say, because it can be very misleading.

You may read in an article in a mag and see an individual's training routine, usually inside of a box, containing the name of the exercise, the number of sets and reps.

Well, if you didn't know any better, you would assume that these guys are going all-out, to the max on each and every one of these sets.

That only leads to over-exhaustion, over-fatigue, and overtraining for you and I."

Things I have learned:

1) Pros do not do 20-25 intense work sets to all out failure for each bodypart even though it's claimed in many muscle magazines. Warming up the muscles with multiple warm up sets is very important for injury prevention once someone reaches the pro-level. The magazines are counting warm-up sets and these are not work sets that stimulate muscle growth!

2) Once an area has been injured and/or the stronger you become, the more warm up sets that are required to prevent tendon/joint injury. For example, a beginner or someone with good knees may need only 1 high warm up sets for squats before going heavy but an advanced trainer or someone with knee problems may need upwards of 5 sets before even thinking about hitting it hard.

3) After warming up, a total of 6-12 intense work sets taken to good failure is all that's needed for the entire week. These sets can be done all at once by training each muscle once a week or split in half and training the muscle twice a week.

4) If someone feels the need to perform more than 6-12 intense work sets per muscle group for the entire week they are not training nearly hard enough within each set and are simply going through the motions.

[UncleTim]

Damn good post!!! I'll have to re-read this a couple of times.

[johnq]

Ronnie, i started slingshot training and my cycle 3weeks ago am on reload at the moment everything going well except for the pain in my shoulders.
my cycle is
test e 750 week 1 to 8
deca 400 week 1 to 8
arimidex .50 eod
ive also been on hgh for 9weeks started on 2ius and built myself up to 6ius a day 5on 2off, ill run the hgh for 6months or more
am taking arimidex to prevent gyno which i had in my last cycle.
but am suffering from shoulder pain in both shoulders. so am stopping the arimidex from now. how long do you think it would take for my shoulders to get back to normal and is there anything i can take to make my shoulders feel better.
Cheers Ronnie very good info.

[Ronnie Rowland]

Ronnie, i started slingshot training and my cycle 3weeks ago am on reload at the moment everything going well except for the pain in my shoulders.
my cycle is
test e 750 week 1 to 8
deca 400 week 1 to 8
arimidex .50 eod
ive also been on hgh for 9weeks started on 2ius and built myself up to 6ius a day 5on 2off, ill run the hgh for 6months or more
am taking arimidex to prevent gyno which i had in my last cycle.
but am suffering from shoulder pain in both shoulders. so am stopping the arimidex from now. how long do you think it would take for my shoulders to get back to normal and is there anything i can take to make my shoulders feel better.
Cheers Ronnie very good info.

john, I need to know specificially where your shoulders are aching and which exercises you are doing for chest and delts! Also, do you feel it hurting wrose during the performance of any specific chest or shoulder exercises?

[johnq]

john, I need to know specificially where your shoulders are aching and which exercises you are doing for chest and delts! Also, do you feel it hurting wrose during the performance of any specific chest or shoulder exercises?

the pain is in the joint between the shoulder and my delts same place on both sides, i have the pain all day, every time i move my arms or lift them up i find it uncomfortable when am sleeping, i need to warm up twice as much as normal when i do chest or shoulders i need to do 100reps of light weight, then when increase the weight and carry on with my routine the pain stops, i find my shoulders hurt more when i do everyday things.
the pain getting worse everyday.
am sat here doing pressing movements and my shoulders dont hurt but if i twist n turn my elbows up it hurts alot.
i dont think the pain as got anything to do with my training or exercises.

chest routine
bench press flat
dumbell press incline with DB
flat flyes with DB

shoulder
DB press seated
upright rows
DB side raises

[Ronnie Rowland]

the pain is in the joint between the shoulder and my delts same place on both sides, I AM GOING TO ASSUME YOU MEAN THE PAIN IS LOCATED IN THE PEC/DELT TIE- IN LOCATED IN THE ANTERIOR REGION OF THE SHOULDFER GIRLDLE? i have the pain all day, every time i move my arms or lift them up i find it uncomfortable when am sleeping, i need to warm up twice as much as normal when i do chest or shoulders i need to do 100reps of light weight, then when increase the weight and carry on with my routine the pain stops, i find my shoulders hurt more when i do everyday things. HOW LONG HAS THIS PAIN BEEN GOING ON AND DO YOU REMEMBER INJURING THEM AT ONE POINT? WE ALL KNOW THAT ARIMIDEX CAN CAUSE SEVERE JOINT PAIN BUT HAVE YOU EVER HAD AN INCREASE IN PAIN FROM TAKING GH?
the pain getting worse everyday. YOU NEED TO STOP ALL PRESSING MOVEMENTS UNTIL THIS THING CLEARS UP!
am sat here doing pressing movements and my shoulders dont hurt but if i twist n turn my elbows up it hurts alot.
i dont think the pain as got anything to do with my training or exercises.

chest routine
bench press flat (CAN BE BAD) YOU NEED TO DO A SLIGHT DECLINE PRESS USING A SMITH MACHINE IF AT ALL POSSIBLE.

dumbell press incline with DB (WHAT ANGLE OF INCLINE) BAD FOR TIE-IN IF ANGLE IS HIGH OR DUMBBELLS ARE BROUGHT DOWN TOO DEEP
flat flyes with DB (CAN BE BAD) TOO MUCH STRETCH ON TIE IN. BEST OFF USING A MACHINE AND LETTING ELBOWS COME BACK ONLY TO PARALLEL WITH BODY.
shoulder
DB press seated (CAN BE BAD FOR NOW) YOU NEED TO STICK A MACHINE AND LOWER YOUR HANDS ONLY TO THE EAR LOBES
upright rows
DB side raises

I asked a few more question above to try and get more information about your situation and I provided some suggestions.

You'll need to stop all pressing movements until this thing clears up. Once you get back to training, some exercise adjustements will need to be made and your form must change. What your going to need to do is use less weight and do slower repetitions using meticulous form. This means concentrating on the muscle being worked more than trying to lift more weight. You'll want to keep reps high as well.

We all have to make certain adjustments from time to time and if you keep going you could develop permanent tendontitus which could involve getting frequent cortisone shots or worse.

[johnq]

I asked a few more question above to try and get more information about your situation and I provided some suggestions.

You'll need to stop all pressing movements until this thing clears up. Once you get back to training, some exercise adjustements will need to be made and your form must change. What your going to need to do is use less weight and do slower repetitions using meticulous form. This means concentrating on the muscle being worked more than trying to lift more weight. You'll want to keep reps high as well.

We all have to make certain adjustments from time to time and if you keep going you could develop permanent tendontitus which could involve getting frequent cortisone shots or worse.

thanks for the suggestions ill take it all on board, my training form as been good ive never had any injuries before, now you mentioned hgh my joints have felt sore since starting hgh.
this is the pain level from 1to 10 of how much it hurts. been on hgh for 9 weeks
week 3 to week 7 pain level 3 out 10
week 7 to week 9 pain level 7 out 10
yesterday i was in pain but today they feel alot better,
i think it must have something to do with the hgh, then when i added arimidex the pain got worse.
do you think my joint pain will improve if i carry on taking hgh or get worse?
am starting week 4 of my deca and test cycle, i heard that deca helps with joint pain if so that should start kicking soon.
just been reading on the side effects of hgh. if you take to much or increase your dose to quick it can coarse these side effects
aching and stiff joints
swollon hands and feet
water retention
pins n needles in hands
i have all of the above sides, shall i drop the dose back down to 2ius then increase the dose slowly like 1iu a week?
or shall i carry on doing 6ius a day and hope my sides will improve?

Ronnie thanks alot, cheers for your advice.

[**MC*LB**]

ok so i am new to all this...and as such i am beyond confused. What roids should i use? How should i use them? Can i loose fat and gain muscle in time for football in January? What exactly is stacking...basically...i need to know everything...thanks for your help

[Ronnie Rowland]

ok so i am new to all this...and as such i am beyond confused. What roids should i use? How should i use them? Can i loose fat and gain muscle in time for football in January? What exactly is stacking...basically...i need to know everything...thanks for your help

It all depends on your age and how long you have been lifting! If you are not old enough or have yet to do some things as a natural I would wait on using steroids.

500 mgs a week of test enanthate is good for a first cycle if your gear is not underdosed.

You can gain muscle and lose fat at the same time during a first cycle if you focus on consuming a lot of lean protein but it's best to bulk during a first timer if possible.

Maximum gains are made during weeks 4-8 while reloading with steroids. During the following 2 week deload one should keep a base of testosterone in the equation and then up test dosages and/or add in other compounds for another 8 week reload and so on. This turns out to be one extended cycle and gains are much more pronounced.

The concept of using for 12 weeks and then taking off for 12 weeks is a sure-fire way to loss your gains. You've got to stay on something pretty much year round to keep gains.


Stacking entails combining various steroids together to produce a more anabolic state while experiencing less side effects.

[johnq]

cheers Ronnie, ill take your advise and see how it goes.

[VASCULAR VINCE]

please explain how you gain... during 2 week deload...is this a 10 week cycle total???

[Ronnie Rowland]

please explain how you gain... during 2 week deload...is this a 10 week cycle total???

Slingshot Training should be looked at as a 10 week anabolic blast cycle! This 10 week anabolic blast is comprised of 8 weeks of reloading and 2 weeks of deloading. The majority of gains are generally made during weeks 4-8 (reload) while gains are finalized during weeks 8-10 (deload).

It's common for some people to feel they make more gains during the short deload (weeks 8-10). This has to do with them hitting a second growth spurt when they decrease training volume from weeks 8-10.

[Ronnie Rowland]

cheers Ronnie, ill take your advise and see how it goes.

Please keep us updated!

[mayan_king]

Hi Ronnie Rowland. THanks for the information.
I want to make my second cycle.. i did the begginer cycle
Dbol and Test enanth,
My last cycle a guy stallion helped me. but i couldnt find his account.


I want to do a test with deca 8 weeks like you put in this ...
can you help me a little i have something like this

1-8 Weeks 500 mg Test Enanth
1-8 Weeks 400 mg Deca

i start my pct 1 week after my last injection.
PCT
1 Week 40mg clomid 20 mg nolva
2-4 week 20 mg clomid 20mg nolvadex.

Can you just help me finishing this =S
and give me some advice maybe add something else.
Thanx man.

[mayan_king]

i want some tips for choosing test. the enanthate
give me alot of nipple problems the last time. in 2 days my nipples started hurting alot maybe i should try other one. Help Please.

[chrisx]

Ronnie, I would greatly appreciate your help and advice.

I am 22yrs old, 5'8, 153pds, and have 16% body fat. I have been working out for the past 3 and a half yrs, the past 2 very consistently (working out each body part ATLEAST once a week).

The reason I am on these forums is that I want to get to 190 pds (for football), in about 6 months. A friend of mine just introduced me to steroids about 2 weeks ago, and he recommended I do a cycle of Test and Decca, for 12 weeks. THEN I get to these forums, and yall's recommended novice cycle consist of Test and Dbol. THEN, I read your forum! (Which I told my friend about, and he said to NOT cycle for 8 weeks on/ 2 weeks off.) He recommended if I cycle for 8 weeks, then I should be off for 8 weeks.

Ronnie, I'm kind of confused. With your knowledge, can you once and for all recommend the best cycle for me, considering it will be my first, with the info. you have on me and my history. (I also have a pic of myself I can show you so you can see where I'm at right now physically, I just first have to find out how to post it.)

Ronnie your help will be greatly appreciated!

[Ronnie Rowland]

Ronnie, I would greatly appreciate your help and advice.

I am 22yrs old, 5'8, 153pds, and have 16% body fat. I have been working out for the past 3 and a half yrs, the past 2 very consistently (working out each body part ATLEAST once a week).

The reason I am on these forums is that I want to get to 190 pds (for football), in about 6 months. A friend of mine just introduced me to steroids about 2 weeks ago, and he recommended I do a cycle of Test and Decca, for 12 weeks. THEN I get to these forums, and yall's recommended novice cycle consist of Test and Dbol. THEN, I read your forum! (Which I told my friend about, and he said to NOT cycle for 8 weeks on/ 2 weeks off.) He recommended if I cycle for 8 weeks, then I should be off for 8 weeks.

Ronnie, I'm kind of confused. With your knowledge, can you once and for all recommend the best cycle for me, considering it will be my first, with the info. you have on me and my history. (I also have a pic of myself I can show you so you can see where I'm at right now physically, I just first have to find out how to post it.)

Ronnie your help will be greatly appreciated!

Honestly, at 22 years of age you are at a boderline age for using steroids and should not need steroids to hit 190 lbs. Do you understand what I am saying?


Now if you are dead set on using them I might as well help. Anabolic steroids add some temporary water weight but unless you eat more calories you are only going to get harder near your current weight, not shoot up to 190 lbs. I just want to let you know this upfront. Diet and training plays a big role but steroids can help you put on muscular weight faster when you do everything else right.

Your friend is not wrong in what he says. It's okay to do 8 weeks on/8 weeks off. However, it's not optimal for those wanting to make the most gains possible over time. With Slingshot Training you can follow many approaches and at your age 8 weeks on/8 weeks off would be fine but double that will provide better gains before PCT. You would basically be using anabolics to hit your natural genetic potential faster then trying to hold onto the gains during the 8 weeks off period.

I do not recommend 12 weeks of using the same dosages because for most gains stop around 8 weeks. Gains can be made for an additional 2 weeks during the deload.

For a first time cycle you would only need 500 mgs of test per week. D-bol and deca are not needed.

Any more questions? I'll be glad to help and if it were me I would gain more size before touching steroids.

[chrisx]

How long should I do the 500mg of Test cycle for?

And when I'm done with that, how long should I wait to do the next cycle and What should that cycle consist of?

And I appreciate your help!

[Ronnie Rowland]

i want some tips for choosing test. the enanthate
give me alot of nipple problems the last time. in 2 days my nipples started hurting alot maybe i should try other one. Help Please.

Test is test! Changing over to a different type is not going to help.

You may need to add a little arimidex or aromasin for estrogen control if you are prone to gyno. I've seen several people start out with symptoms when they began steroids but once they got adjusted their gyno symptoms went away on their own. I've also seen people who never got over gyno symptoms once they begun. IMO it's better to be safe than sorry since you are already having issues.

[mayan_king]

Thanks so much man. i will start it in 2 months i have to find the stuff first.
Thanks again for the help. and well... in any question i will come to you.
Hugs. See ya Later man

Test is test! Changing over to a different type is not going to help.

You may need to add a little arimidex or aromasin for estrogen control if you are prone to gyno. I've seen several people start out with symptoms when they began steroids but once they got adjusted their gyno symptoms went away on their own. I've also seen people who never got over gyno symptoms once they begun. IMO it's better to be safe than sorry since you are already having issues.

[Juicedupmonkey]

Thank you again for the reply, I'll think about doing a 20 week cycle a bit, I'm trying to look around to see if people found it promising or to just stick with a cycle 10-14. I guess I'll either have to try it for myself to see really what is best for me... As long as HCG is used to keep my boys working? Is it just best to do it for the deloads? Instead of small amounts throughout the entire 20 weeks? And STS works just the same if you were doing it natural just alot less gains from the lack of gear.

[Ronnie Rowland]

Hi Ronnie Rowland. THanks for the information.
I want to make my second cycle.. i did the begginer cycle
Dbol and Test enanth,
My last cycle a guy stallion helped me. but i couldnt find his account.


I want to do a test with deca 8 weeks like you put in this ...
can you help me a little i have something like this

1-8 Weeks 500 mg Test Enanth
1-8 Weeks 400 mg Deca

i start my pct 1 week after my last injection.
PCT
1 Week 40mg clomid 20 mg nolva
2-4 week 20 mg clomid 20mg nolvadex.

Can you just help me finishing this =S
and give me some advice maybe add something else.
Thanx man.

If you are going to take some time off after your cycle it would be good to run it as follows:

RELOAD: 1-8 Weeks 500 mg Test Enanth
RELOAD: 1-8 Weeks 400 mg Deca
DELOAD: 8-10 Weeks 300 mgs of Test Enanthate

PCT: Weeks 11-14
hCG at 2500 iu eod for 2 weeks
clomid at 50 mgs once per day for 4 weeks
nolva 20 mgs per day for 4 weeks

[BJJ]

If you are going to take some time off after your cycle it would be good to run it as follows:

RELOAD: 1-8 Weeks 500 mg Test Enanth
RELOAD: 1-8 Weeks 400 mg Deca
DELOAD: 8-10 Weeks 300 mgs of Test Enanthate

PCT: Weeks 11-14
hCG at 2500 iu eod for 2 weeks
clomid at 50 mgs once per day for 4 weeks
nolva 20 mgs per day for 4 weeks

Wouldn't that cause an istologic decay which may lead to a malignant tumour?

[Ronnie Rowland]

Wouldn't that cause an istologic decay which may lead to a malignant tumour?

The PCT I handed out was actually developed by doctors for people who where in need of full recovery after using steroids. You can do a search on Dr. Michael Scally and find where he has been successful using this approach.

I would not use such an aggressive approach on a frequent basis but it's proven to work-hence maintain your gains as much as possible and that's what people are after.

[BJJ]

The PCT I handed out was actually developed by docotors for people who where in need of full recovery after using steroids. You can do a search on Dr. Michael Scally and find where he has been successful using this approach.

I would not use such an aggressive approach on a frequent basis but it's proven to work-hence maintain your gains as much as possible and that's what people are after.

Thank you for the explanation.

[chrisx]

Thanks Ron, you da man!

I hope your still here when I'm ready for my 3rd cycle!

[Ronnie Rowland]

Thanks Ron, you da man!

I hope your still here when I'm ready for my 3rd cycle!

I'll be here!

[chrisx]

Ron just curious why do you suggest Deca instead of Dbol?

[Ronnie Rowland]

Ron just curious why do you suggest Deca instead of Dbol?

I feel deca is much milder and has fewer side effects. Deca is liver friendly where as d-bol is not. Deca will not raise blood pressure like d-bol and deca will help lube your joints. Some feel very lethargic on d-bol and can barely function. About the only thing you will have to worry about with deca is your sex drive and you can always gets some prami or caber to help fix that if it becomes a problem.

[charlesriley]

thank you , i look up to guys like you who have thier shit together, it can get confusing at times till a dude comes by and clears out the garbage. i will pm you when i have a dire need. thanks bro!

[VASCULAR VINCE]

thank you , i look up to guys like you who have thier shit together, it can get confusing at times till a dude comes by and clears out the garbage. i will pm you when i have a dire need. thanks bro!

you got it!!! everyone should rate ronnies thread....5 star....

[sbordelon]

Well after reading alot about and making the final decision to start it, i have a few questions, that i have not been able to find thru the postings. And out of all the goods and bads it seems Ron has his knowledge and facts straight. So I'll wait for a response back from him on the correct info I'm looking for.

I'm having a friend who is capable of getting me what I need. After reading, it seems the best to start out with is Test and Deca. I understand the reload and deload process very well, but like i said, i'm new to this and need to find out a few things. i'm reading reports that i need to be doing 600mg of test a week and 400mg of deca a week, so what does that require me to do per week. Does that mean inject 100mg of test for 6 days and 100mg of deca for 4 days, or do i give myself the injection 2x a week equaling whats recommended. Also if i'm doing test and deca, so can i combine the two in one injection or does each require a different injection site, as i know some chemicals can't be mixed together. So if you can tell me the basics of what to take per week and how, i would be appreciate it. info like how many cc's of test per shot to be taken and how many times per week. Thanks

[bigg_86]

i loved ur post, im going to try it out starting in january, but before i need some advice.....

ive been working out for 3 years now n i started using steroids when i saw i could not gain any more weight and i was stuck lifting the same weight for months....
i was 130lbs when i started working out n im now at 165lbs
i was only able to put 12lbs on protein shakes n creatine alone until i could not gain any more weight n kept 10lbs from my gains...
i have done a cycle of 8 wks using test e n deca n put on 15lbs, kept 10.
after a few months i tried 4wks of tren, prop, dbol n had pretty good gains, went from 150 to 171, lost 6lbs, after 5 months i started another cycle of test e n deca n went up to 184lbs but hurt my shoulder really bad in wk7, ive been off the gym n steroids for 5 months bcuz of my shoulder n personal financial problems i had, about 2 weeks ago i got a hernia at work, got surgery last week n lost 6lbs since then.... im at 165 now.
during every cycle i got extremely lean n strong, my body fat % was always between 12-14.5....

i want to do the next cycles using this program

reload - wk 1-8 test e + deca (how many mgs of each do u recommend for my weight?)
deload - wk 9-10 (need advice) i can only get comid n nova for pct if any is necessary
reload - wk 11-18 Tren n prop (mgs?)
deload - wk 19-20 (need advice)

now should i use the same compounds ive been using or should i try some other type of test....oh almost forgot, i want to run dbol during the 1st 4wks during reloads.... can u help me out? my goal is to get up to 195-205 n keep 190

Thanks!