Test E, Dbol, Oral Tren doable?

[Rainshaker]

Hey all, brand new here to the forums, but not new to lifting or gear. My last cycle was a Test E/Oral Tren cycle a little over a year ago. Anyway reaching a ceiling in my natural gains even with excess calories so I'm looking at firing up another cycle. Really enjoyed the test/tren cycle but would like to beef it up a little more.

Here's what I am considering:

Weeks 1-4
Test E - 500mg per week
Dianabol - 20mg per day

Weeks 5-6
Test E - 500mg per week

Weeks 7-10
Test E - 500mg per week
Oral Tren - 500mcg per day

My support and PCT supplements include:
Nolvadex, Arimidex, DIM, DAA, Grape Seed, Milk Thistle, Dandelion Root, Tribulus and im sure a few others I'm missing.

Anyway I knownits never a good idea to do more than one oral on cycle but I'm wondering if with the 2 week break in between orals and all the liver support I would be ok.

Thoughts, questions, comments....

[The Deadlifting Dog]

I wouldn't touch oral tren.

I have heard horror stories about it.
I have heard it is very liver toxic and basically just a harsh compound overall.
And when you are dealing with a drug that is dosed in such small amounts and you are dealing with UGL you can easily end up dosing more than you intend.

[i_SLAM_cougars]

I’d just run like 150-350mg of Tren Acetate through the entire cycle and leave out the methyl tren. You’ll get more out of it running the entire length anyway

[charger69]

I’d just run like 150-350mg of Tren Acetate through the entire cycle and leave out the methyl tren. You’ll get more out of it running the entire length anyway

Come on ISC- be a little more adventuresome. Try 2x that. LOL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[i_SLAM_cougars]

Come on ISC- be a little more adventuresome. Try 2x that. LOL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

From the looks of the cycle (Test & Dbol) he’s planning on gaining mass. I feel like Tren above those levels raises your TDEE and nerfs your appetite too much to be productive towards that.

Now if he’s cutting up? Yep run Charger levels with a bunch of other anxiety inducing drugs. That’s fun ��

[Rainshaker]

From the looks of the cycle (Test & Dbol) he’s planning on gaining mass. I feel like Tren above those levels raises your TDEE and nerfs your appetite too much to be productive towards that.

Now if he’s cutting up? Yep run Charger levels with a bunch of other anxiety inducing drugs. That’s fun ��

Honestly my idea was to use the Dbol at the start to up the bulk and then the Methyltrienolone at the end to harden things back up. I have tons of stuff right now and I just really cant make up my mind. I guess I'm so stuck on the methyltrienolone because I've seen the results time and time again and nothing compares.

Sometimes I really wonder if all the negatives on this are actually just because the strength of it and they are scared if they dont make us think its deadly, then we will all use it and become gods.

[Windex]

Agree with deadlifting dog. It's a great compound to use before a strongman or powerlifting competition, or maybe the blue moon heavy duty workout with a partner for maximum failure. Outside of that, I don't feel it's going to add value to a cycle.

[Rainshaker]

Thanks for the responses guys. I understand the not wanting to touch the oral tren, I know its known as one of the harshest. That being said I have run oral tren 4 times and have never had any issues with it. Have run both tren a and e in injectable form and was not at all impressed, would never spend my money on it again but that's me. I will also add that I had my bloodwork done during week 3 of a cycle of oral tren and my liver barely showed any elevated levels.

I'm by no means saying oral tren is safe in the least bit of a way, but I was really hoping to get answers to if the cycle is doable instead of lessons on what oral tren is.

Also can anyone tell me what it is that makes oral tren any harsher than dianabol or any other methylated c17aa oral? I keep hearing this but cant seem to find any supportive science.

Anyway would love to hear from anyone who has tried these compounds and isnt terrified of oral tren

[Windex]

If your liver enzymes weren't elevated then you had extremely under doses or a different product. It's mechanism of action causes systemic inflammation in the body, makes it biologically impossible not to elevate lipids sky high.

Even with perfect liver genetics and pharmaceutical help to protect the liver like Udoyxl and Injectable Glutathione

[Rainshaker]

Rather then just say things like the mechanism of action causes systemic inflammation or it is impossible for it to not elevate levels of lipids sky high, can you actually give me some science. If you can tell me the action by which it causes these effects in every human that takes it, I'd be far more inclined to hear you. To think that any compound could affect every biologically unique human the same is crazy in my mind, but again I believe what I can be shown. Real data speaks and I'm always willing to learn, but I'm never willing to be told

Anyway back on topic assuming that the danger from orals comes from the fact that they are methylated (proven science, anyone can go learn the step by step of how this process happens and why it's hard on your liver) do you think a 2 week break between the orals would be enough to rest the liver? I mean worst case I'll drop the Dianabol and just run my normal Test E/Methyltrienolone cycle.

[Rainshaker]

Sorry guys I'm really not trying to be a dick but constantly hearing how harsh the oral tren is but then seeing people have no issue munching down Dianabol like its flintstones gummies just bugs the shit out of me. Then everyone wants to say its because oral tren is so harsh, but not one person can give you the science of how its harsh other than being methylated.

[Rainshaker]

Sorry islamcougars missed your response. I have run tren a for 10wks before and I was not very impressed. Would have rather spent the money on more Test and run a stronger test only cycle. Tried the same cycle with Tren e with same results. Maybe it's because I tried the oral before the injectable but the oral is so much more active for me. If im not mistaken the oral is more active because of a better affinity for binding to the androgen receptors. Plus I'm trying to use up some of what I have on hand already. I also have some M1T but I'm honestly as scared of it as everyone else seems to be of oral tren.

[Chicagotarsier]

Sorry guys I'm really not trying to be a dick but constantly hearing how harsh the oral tren is but then seeing people have no issue munching down Dianabol like its flintstones gummies just bugs the shit out of me. Then everyone wants to say its because oral tren is so harsh, but not one person can give you the science of how its harsh other than being methylated.

If for no other reason there is a clear path to medicate via intermuscular injection vs digestion. What do you hope to acheive by using an outdated process instead of what has been proven as best?

I can answer that.

You want to save money and get the same result.

If you cannot ante up and buy the standard then you dont have the cash to be in the game.

My 2-cents.

[Rainshaker]

I hope to achieve the same results I have come to expect. Flat out injectable tren will never be able to touch the results of the oral. I understand it has its downfalls but sadly nothing I have tried had even remotely compared. I could care less about money, that is a 0% issue for me. You say I want to get the same results, maybe you missed the part where I wasn't happy with the results of injectable tren combined with test, but have been thrilled with the results of the oral.

Chcagotarsier I dont think you have the intelligence to even read through the posts so your thoughts dont really concern me at all. Yet again more shit talk and no science. I should retitled this thread "where pussies come to talk shit on oral tren with no science"

[redz]

If you’re not impressed with injectable tren you are doing something wrong or the gear is bunk. Having said that I have dabbled with methyl tren and it is a very strong compound but I wouldn’t make a habit of using it. It’s not only the liver toxicity you need to consider with it. There was a forum member that was messing around with it that died though I’m not in the know of the exact details. Just know it is most definitely more dangerous but if you don’t care about the risk that is your call.

[Rainshaker]

If you’re not impressed with injectable tren you are doing something wrong or the gear is bunk. Having said that I have dabbled with methyl tren and it is a very strong compound but I wouldn’t make a habit of using it. It’s not only the liver toxicity you need to consider with it. There was a forum member that was messing around with it that died though I’m not in the know of the exact details. Just know it is most definitely more dangerous but if you don’t care about the risk that is your call.

I have always bought Geneza so I know there is nothing wrong with my gear. Again I'm by no means saying that injectable tren doesnt do anything, just simply put I do not like the way it makes me feel for the results I get. I do understand the danger with Methyltrienolone just as I do with all c17aa orals. I dont think what I am proposing is by any means crazy.

We are talking 250mcg 2x per day for max 4 weeks. I'd even be ok with cutting it down to only 3 weeks at the end of cycle and giving my liver 3 weeks between the orals.

Again have milk thistle, tudca, dandelion root and tumeric extract to help support my liver throughout and as always if I start feeling like shit I will stop the orals and have my doc run my bloodwork to see what's going on. Will probably have bloodwork done after the first 4 weeks of Dbol as well just to see where my values are at. If they are overly elevated I will skip the Methyltrienolone all together this cycle.

Assuming that i do end up skipping it what would be something else good to throw in at the end of the cycle to help harden up some of the bloat gains from Dbol/Test?

Again guys I'm by no means an idiot and certainly not looking to do serious damage to myself. As far as a forum member dying from it, I'd need more details before I'd concern myself.
He may have been way overdosing or mixing with other toxic orals. Lots of things are deadly at the right dose, including H2O.

I'd also consider knocking the Methyltrienolone down to just one 250mcg tab split daily, just for extra safety. I really just want something to harden everything up at the end and still help push the gains to the max.

Appreciate the response from someone who has real experience to go off of rather than just spewing things you read at me.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

Rainshaker...

I truly suggest you check your attitude at the door.
Everyone here has truly tried to help you.

[Rainshaker]

Rainshaker...

I truly suggest you check your attitude at the door.
Everyone here has truly tried to help you.

I truly suggest you find other threads to reply to if you do not like my "attitude". I personally do not appreciate your attitude of pushing me to accept your biased opinion or be treated as an asshole. But again I am not choosing to come onto your threads to force my opinion or "lurk" without reason, so maybe you could show me the same respect?

[The Deadlifting Dog]

I truly suggest you find other threads to reply to if you do not like my "attitude". I personally do not appreciate your attitude of pushing me to accept your biased opinion or be treated as an asshole. But again I am not choosing to come onto your threads to force my opinion or "lurk" without reason, so maybe you could show me the same respect?

Ha!! You're a funny one.

Listen... your original question was can you take 20mgs of dbol with test, then test, then test and oral tren.
You then proceeded to state that you have taken oral tren in 4 cycles already and tren A and tren E at least once each.
So you have had at least 6 cycles of tren...
And you are asking if it is OK to take 20mg of dbol?!?!?!?
20mg of dbol is a baby cakes compared to tren cycles.
The sheer fact that you are asking leads me to believe that you don't know shit and you haven't taken tren 6 times already.

Then you go to say... well maybe I will drop the tren and do proviron.
As it was pointed out to you... oral tren is in an entire differnet league.

Everyone here has stated not to do the oral tren.
Some have taken oral tren. Others know people who have.

If you don't like their advice then you don't have to take it but you can at least thank people for their opinions.

And I quote you after you laid out your proposed cycle...
"Thoughts, questions, comments...."

Your words. We followed them. And you then bitched.

[Rainshaker]

Ha!! You're a funny one.

Listen... your original question was can you take 20mgs of dbol with test, then test, then test and oral tren.
You then proceeded to state that you have taken oral tren in 4 cycles already and tren A and tren E at least once each.
So you have had at least 6 cycles of tren...
And you are asking if it is OK to take 20mg of dbol?!?!?!?
20mg of dbol is a baby cakes compared to tren cycles.
The sheer fact that you are asking leads me to believe that you don't know shit and you haven't taken tren 6 times already.

Then you go to say... well maybe I will drop the tren and do proviron.
As it was pointed out to you... oral tren is in an entire differnet league.

Everyone here has stated not to do the oral tren.
Some have taken oral tren. Others know people who have.

If you don't like their advice then you don't have to take it but you can at least thank people for their opinions.

And I quote you after you laid out your proposed cycle...
"Thoughts, questions, comments...."

Your words. We followed them. And you then bitched.

Yes that was the original question although it sounds odd with all the "thens" in there. I was curious if it would be reasonable to take dbol on the front 4 weeks of a 10 week test cycle and Methyltrienolone (most commonly referred to as oral tren) on the back 4 weeks of the cycle, essentially leaving a 2 week period in the middle of just the test for my liver to catch a break.

Yes I have taken oral tren (Methyltrienolone) on four 10 week cycles of test for 4 weeks. 1 it was on the front end the other 3 were on the back end, found I like it much better on the back end. When I was younger and far more ignorant to these things oral tren was my first ever, ran 2 cycles of it for 4 weeks each time with nothing else. Keep in mind this was purchased at GNC at the time and I knew nothing . Obviously I realize now how utterly stupid this really was, but i was lucky enough to only really deal with sweats and back pumps. I think honestly that's where I fell in love with the stuff.

However I didnt touch anything for a solid year after that and really focused hard on my diet and forcing extra calories. With tons of hard work and an ungodly amount of calories (hard gainer), I was able to get myself up to 160 but then hit a hard wall. I remembered the good old tren and decided to educate myself on how this shit really works and how to do it right. I started back in with an 8 week cycle of just Test E for 8wks. Followed this with a proper pct and although I enjoyed it, just wasnt like the oral tren.

From there my next cycle was Test E/Tren E. Better than just the Test for gains but honestly the injectable tren made me feel more like shit than the oral. Thought it might be the ester so ran Tren A with the next cycle with same feeling. From here I messed around a bit on my next cycles, always running Test but tried things like superdrol and halo, which didnt make it through 2 weeks of either because they made me feel nasty as hell.

So what did I do broke down and went back to Methyltrienolone but ran it with Test and proper pct. Fell in love with the combo and that's why it has been my last 4 cycles. I really was just curious about trying Dbol on front end and Methyltrienolone on back end, but obviously understand how toxic these have been reported to be. I could find the info on the c17aa and how they are hard in that regards on your liver. What I couldn't find is any clear information on why one c17aa could be so much harsher than another c17aa so I came here hoping that maybe somebody could fill in the gap for me.

I did ask and I'm sorry again if you think I'm trying to be a dick. I do value everyone's opinion. Sorry any phrase that start with "I've heard.." just gets me. It's like at that point your giving me someone else's opinion that could have even been somebody else's opinion. If you would have came at me with "man everything I have read and researched shows this stuff to be very harsh for these reasons... thus I cant reccomend taking it at all let alone with another oral." I probably would have been more receptive.

Again I'll openly admit I didn't know shit about Proviron, or many others for that matter, but I also never claimed I did and never even said it was a replacement or comparable to tren. I simply stated that another person recommended if I'm just looking to cut some bloat at the end Proviron would possibly help and isnt so nasty as Tren. I came here to double check the info and see what anyone could tell me.

I did receive a very valuable response in regards to the Proviron and you'll notice I accepted it gratefully and thanked him for the info.

Seriously guys I do appreciate the opinions, but if i disagree or want to discuss those opinions. Don't be sad if I ask for more than "so I've heard", it's just the way I am. I do apologize for being pissier then need be but man I almost felt attacked the second I started getting responses. Like seriously just because I come here looking for intellectual conversation, I get treated like I know nothing. I was well aware it's not oral tren and is Methyltrienolone, but I think we all can agree it is most commonly referred to as oral tren. I'm also aware what is said about its toxicity.

So again sorry to all I may have offended, it was never my intention. I do value your opinion and thank you for it. Obviously my decision came out the same as your recommendation to not take the shit. It's just a shame I had to get a valid answer from another forum where the dude was happy to fill me in with the needed info, because everyone here was busy trying to force their "opinion" that it's too harsh down my throat.

Seriously guys you may all think I'm stupid, but I can assure you that is not the case. Have I messed with as many things as you guys have? No, doesnt mean I don't know shit just means I found what I liked and have stuck to it. However I'm now wanting to broaden my horizons and try something new. I just hate giving up my Methyltrienolone because it is my favorite so far, hands down.

[Windex]

Smarten up and toss the entitled crybaby attitude.

[Rainshaker]

Smarten up and toss the entitled crybaby attitude.

I am very happy with my intelligence level actually but thanks for yet another opinion. As far as cry baby i guess I dont see where I have been crying. Almost seems like others are crying because I don't value their opinion. I've re-read this entire thread and it seems to me that anytime anyone has provided me with real information based in facts and science, I thank them and consider and adjust based upon the provided info.

I truly hope the Staff that is below your name does not refer to being staff for this forum. If so I must say forcing opinions upon people is not a good color on any staff member/moderator. Again I'm sorry I don't value your opinion, but that's just me man. As far as I know I'm not breaking any forum rules by not taking opinions without info, I will say though there are multiple members flirting with "trolling" at this point on my thread.

I've already decided against the Methyltrienolone due to REAL science I was helped to find on another forum with far less opinion pushing members. I don't quite grasp why you guys just keep coming back if you've given your 2 cents and still don't have anything of value to provide to the discussion.

[Wannabhuge14]

I am very happy with my intelligence level actually but thanks for yet another opinion. As far as cry baby i guess I dont see where I have been crying. Almost seems like others are crying because I don't value their opinion. I've re-read this entire thread and it seems to me that anytime anyone has provided me with real information based in facts and science, I thank them and consider and adjust based upon the provided info.

I truly hope the Staff that is below your name does not refer to being staff for this forum. If so I must say forcing opinions upon people is not a good color on any staff member/moderator. Again I'm sorry I don't value your opinion, but that's just me man. As far as I know I'm not breaking any forum rules by not taking opinions without info, I will say though there are multiple members flirting with "trolling" at this point on my thread.

I've already decided against the Methyltrienolone due to REAL science I was helped to find on another forum with far less opinion pushing members. I don't quite grasp why you guys just keep coming back if you've given your 2 cents and still don't have anything of value to provide to the discussion.

You’re such a clueless idiot, do you even have balls or know what they are? You come off as a stuck up jerk that has been pampered his whole life. Do oral tren, in fact do 10g per day so your liver will shit down and we never have to hear from your dumbass again. You’re not as smart as you think you are you prick. All responses you’ve received have been from vets that have been in the game a long time. You ask for advice and then have a rebuttal for every response you get, fuck you you brain dead moron.

[Rainshaker]

You’re such a clueless idiot, do you even have balls or know what they are? You come off as a stuck up jerk that has been pampered his whole life. Do oral tren, in fact do 10g per day so your liver will shit down and we never have to hear from your dumbass again. You’re not as smart as you think you are you prick. All responses you’ve received have been from vets that have been in the game a long time. You ask for advice and then have a rebuttal for every response you get, fuck you you brain dead moron.

Lol thanks for joining, every thread needs a shit talking little bitch You know nothing of my history or my life. Last I checked you haven't even given any advice or opinions so not sure why you stumbled in anyway. You insult my intelligence but I can tell just by the personal attack, the way you type and your fantastic vocabulary that you must be smarter then me right? L O FUCKIN L man. You really shouldn't post things like take 10mg of oral tren even if it's meant to be nasty toward me, someone could see that not read the rest and seriously kill themselves. NOT OKAY you asshole. It's a shame I never run into people like you in real life to settle these matters.

[Wannabhuge14]

Lol thanks for joining, every thread needs a shit talking little bitch You know nothing of my history or my life. Last I checked you haven't even given any advice or opinions so not sure why you stumbled in anyway. You insult my intelligence but I can tell just by the personal attack, the way you type and your fantastic vocabulary that you must be smarter then me right? L O FUCKIN L man. You really shouldn't post things like take 10mg of oral tren even if it's meant to be nasty toward me, someone could see that not read the rest and seriously kill themselves. NOT OKAY you asshole. It's a shame I never run into people like you in real life to settle these matters.

I said 10g if you read properly to begin with. I’ve seen you’re other threads and you ask very stupid questions that a beginner would ask. You pretend to have a vast knowledge of the aas world, yet you do not.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

Thanks for the response.

So what did you decide?
test dbol
then test
then test proviron

You can easily do anavar or tbol at the end instead of proviron.

And FYI:
You say you're a hard gainer.
Tren can be the worst choice for hard gainers.
Hard gainers generally have a fast metabolism and/or don't eat enough.
Tren speeds up your metabolism and causes heartburn.
Not the best thing for gaining weight.

State what your goals are exactly and then pray that GH responds again.
Crazy man but he knows his shit about gear.

[Rainshaker]

Thanks for the response.

So what did you decide?
test dbol
then test
then test proviron

You can easily do anavar or tbol at the end instead of proviron.

And FYI:
You say you're a hard gainer.
Tren can be the worst choice for hard gainers.
Hard gainers generally have a fast metabolism and/or don't eat enough.
Tren speeds up your metabolism and causes heartburn.
Not the best thing for gaining weight.

State what your goals are exactly and then pray that GH responds again.
Crazy man but he knows his shit about gear.

Decided just to try the Dbol with the Test, but might run the Dbol for 6 weeks instead of 4 but I always go based off how it makes me feel. I'm never afraid to stop something if it makes me feel like trash and just ride out the Test.

I'd like to try maybe the Anavar or Tbol but I only really like to play with one new thing at a time. That way if I feel like trash I know what the culprit is. Next cycle I may try the Tbol in place of the Dbol. Definitely curious about the Anavar.

It's funny you say that because that is one other symptom that I've always had while on Tren. I get heartburn anyway though so I guess I never really associated it with the Tren. Makes perfect sense though.

Yes I am a very very very hard gainer, started my journey at 126lbs 6' tall less than 5% BF, technically considered malnurished/emaciated by MD's but healthy in all other regards. I'm not joking when I say I have to consume near 7k calories a day if I want to keep my weight. Most of it is clean but sadly I do supplement with ON Serious Mass just because I literally dont have the time to eat that much food.

I'm sure he is and I love to hear feedback. My main goal right now is to break through the current wall I'm at. Stuck at 178lbs right now and can't seem to add any weight to my lifts. My initial goal was 180lbs when I started all this but now I'm feeling 190 couldn't hurt anything, mostly just want to blow past this strength wall and keep the weights increasing. Hence the reason for trying the Dbol, heard it was great for strength gains and amazing pumps. Have also heard all the negative about the bloat though and dont want to be all puffed up. More than anything I guess I'm looking for a replacement for my favorite the "oral tren".

[XnavyHMCS]

Decided just to try the Dbol with the Test, but might run the Dbol for 6 weeks instead of 4 but I always go based off how it makes me feel. I'm never afraid to stop something if it makes me feel like trash and just ride out the Test.

I'd like to try maybe the Anavar or Tbol but I only really like to play with one new thing at a time. That way if I feel like trash I know what the culprit is. Next cycle I may try the Tbol in place of the Dbol. Definitely curious about the Anavar.

It's funny you say that because that is one other symptom that I've always had while on Tren. I get heartburn anyway though so I guess I never really associated it with the Tren. Makes perfect sense though.

Yes I am a very very very hard gainer, started my journey at 126lbs 6' tall less than 5% BF, technically considered malnurished/emaciated by MD's but healthy in all other regards. I'm not joking when I say I have to consume near 7k calories a day if I want to keep my weight. Most of it is clean but sadly I do supplement with ON Serious Mass just because I literally dont have the time to eat that much food.

I'm sure he is and I love to hear feedback. My main goal right now is to break through the current wall I'm at. Stuck at 178lbs right now and can't seem to add any weight to my lifts. My initial goal was 180lbs when I started all this but now I'm feeling 190 couldn't hurt anything, mostly just want to blow past this strength wall and keep the weights increasing. Hence the reason for trying the Dbol, heard it was great for strength gains and amazing pumps. Have also heard all the negative about the bloat though and dont want to be all puffed up. More than anything I guess I'm looking for a replacement for my favorite the "oral tren".

I love this....!!!

Did you guys read this?

He, "started my journey at 126lbs 6' tall less than 5% BF, technically considered malnurished/emaciated by MD's but healthy in all other regards."

He sounds like he is on work release from Auschwitz... And he is experimenting with Tren and slinging barbs at some of the most knowledgeable members on the forum... WHERE THE FUCK IS Obs, WHEN WE NEED HIM?

With the quarantine, the forum just keeps getting better and better...

[Rainshaker]

I love this....!!!

Did you guys read this?

He, "started my journey at 126lbs 6' tall less than 5% BF, technically considered malnurished/emaciated by MD's but healthy in all other regards."

He sounds like he is on work release from Auschwitz... And he is experimenting with Tren and slinging barbs at some of the most knowledgeable members on the forum... WHERE THE FUCK IS Obs, WHEN WE NEED HIM?

With the quarantine, the forum just keeps getting better and better...

Lol so because I started at a different place then yourself, that makes it funny? Just seems to me like I've put in a shitload of hard work. So when I take tren its experimenting with tren, but when you take it we just call it regular use. Get over yourself man, we are all experimenting every day.

[charger69]

Lol so because I started at a different place then yourself, that makes it funny? Just seems to me like I've put in a shitload of hard work. So when I take tren its experimenting with tren, but when you take it we just call it regular use. Get over yourself man, we are all experimenting every day.

No just because your a self righteous and you have no idea, but you think you do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GearHeaded]

Decided just to try the Dbol with the Test, but might run the Dbol for 6 weeks instead of 4 but I always go based off how it makes me feel. I'm never afraid to stop something if it makes me feel like trash and just ride out the Test.

I'd like to try maybe the Anavar or Tbol but I only really like to play with one new thing at a time. That way if I feel like trash I know what the culprit is. Next cycle I may try the Tbol in place of the Dbol. Definitely curious about the Anavar.

It's funny you say that because that is one other symptom that I've always had while on Tren. I get heartburn anyway though so I guess I never really associated it with the Tren. Makes perfect sense though.

Yes I am a very very very hard gainer, started my journey at 126lbs 6' tall less than 5% BF, technically considered malnurished/emaciated by MD's but healthy in all other regards. I'm not joking when I say I have to consume near 7k calories a day if I want to keep my weight. Most of it is clean but sadly I do supplement with ON Serious Mass just because I literally dont have the time to eat that much food.

I'm sure he is and I love to hear feedback. My main goal right now is to break through the current wall I'm at. Stuck at 178lbs right now and can't seem to add any weight to my lifts. My initial goal was 180lbs when I started all this but now I'm feeling 190 couldn't hurt anything, mostly just want to blow past this strength wall and keep the weights increasing. Hence the reason for trying the Dbol, heard it was great for strength gains and amazing pumps. Have also heard all the negative about the bloat though and dont want to be all puffed up. More than anything I guess I'm looking for a replacement for my favorite the "oral tren".

the reason Tren causing heart burn is that in a lot of people there is a histamine effect and your body is trying to respond to the 'toxicity' load by detoxifying itself via increase of stomach acid. some people detoxify with sweat, through their skin (get acne), though their breath, kidneys, etc.. and with some people your body over produces stomach acid.
some guys can solve this with histamine blockers and PPI (proton pump inhibitors that lower stomach acid production). . maybe why you ever wondered why guys take Benadryl in contest prep and on high dosages of Tren (helps with both sleep and blocking histamine response) .


Deadlifting Dog is correct .. Tren is not something ideal for hard gainers. it can be used for adding size but has to be used with precision.. you have to couple it with higher amounts of estrogen and "bloat" and the ability to take in lots of food. if you have a fast metabolism and you have problems getting down lots of food or your estrogen sensitive , then Tren isn't going to work for you for putting on size.

speaking of "bloat" .. thats not a negative side effect brother . thats part of the growing process.
see my post here on Osmotic super compensation .

https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...pensation.html


if you want to add size you have to run the "wet" compounds and let the process take its place and then get your body to reach a new set point and acclimate to what you put on..
part of that has to do with getting that water weight on you. letting it set in. then acclimating to it and letting the anabolic processes do their job (which takes months).. you have to get "bloated" , push some heavy ass weight, eat tons of red meat and clean carbs, and just stick with that for awhile.


playing with things like methyltren etc. is not the answer.

[i_SLAM_cougars]

So if you wanna put on some size, here’s what I’m doing and I put on five pounds last week.

Test - 1000mg/wk
(500mg cyp / 500 prop)
Primo - 400mg/wk
DHB - 400mg/wk
Dianabol - 25mg pre workout
MK677 - 25mg before bed


I eat 2-3 pounds of red meat or fish (chicken is fine, I’m just kinda over it for awhile) per day with 1-2 whey shakes.

Around 400mg of carbs mostly made up of bagels and red potatoes (sometimes fries )

[Rainshaker]

So if you wanna put on some size, here’s what I’m doing and I put on five pounds last week.

Test - 1000mg/wk
(500mg cyp / 500 prop)
Primo - 400mg/wk
DHB - 400mg/wk
Dianabol - 25mg pre workout
MK677 - 25mg before bed


I eat 2-3 pounds of red meat or fish (chicken is fine, I’m just kinda over it for awhile) per day with 1-2 whey shakes.

Around 400mg of carbs mostly made up of bagels and red potatoes (sometimes fries )

Sounds like a nice cycle, but I've never used Dbol before so I'm going to stick to just the 2 for this run. Probably look at adding in some of the others on next cycle, when I know how the Dbol affects me. Thanks for the input though

[charger69]

So if you wanna put on some size, here’s what I’m doing and I put on five pounds last week.

Test - 1000mg/wk
(500mg cyp / 500 prop)
Primo - 400mg/wk
DHB - 400mg/wk
Dianabol - 25mg pre workout
MK677 - 25mg before bed


I eat 2-3 pounds of red meat or fish (chicken is fine, I’m just kinda over it for awhile) per day with 1-2 whey shakes.

Around 400mg of carbs mostly made up of bagels and red potatoes (sometimes fries )

I assume that this is a long cycle. Why the mixing of esthers? If it is just at the beginning of the cycle, have you ever tried frontloading?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Rainshaker]

the reason Tren causing heart burn is that in a lot of people there is a histamine effect and your body is trying to respond to the 'toxicity' load by detoxifying itself via increase of stomach acid. some people detoxify with sweat, through their skin (get acne), though their breath, kidneys, etc.. and with some people your body over produces stomach acid.
some guys can solve this with histamine blockers and PPI (proton pump inhibitors that lower stomach acid production). . maybe why you ever wondered why guys take Benadryl in contest prep and on high dosages of Tren (helps with both sleep and blocking histamine response) .


Deadlifting Dog is correct .. Tren is not something ideal for hard gainers. it can be used for adding size but has to be used with precision.. you have to couple it with higher amounts of estrogen and "bloat" and the ability to take in lots of food. if you have a fast metabolism and you have problems getting down lots of food or your estrogen sensitive , then Tren isn't going to work for you for putting on size.

speaking of "bloat" .. thats not a negative side effect brother . thats part of the growing process.
see my post here on Osmotic super compensation .

https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...pensation.html


if you want to add size you have to run the "wet" compounds and let the process take its place and then get your body to reach a new set point and acclimate to what you put on..
part of that has to do with getting that water weight on you. letting it set in. then acclimating to it and letting the anabolic processes do their job (which takes months).. you have to get "bloated" , push some heavy ass weight, eat tons of red meat and clean carbs, and just stick with that for awhile.


playing with things like methyltren etc. is not the answer.

Thanks GH, great info as always. I have already decided against the Methyltrienolone. Going with your advice and running just the Dbol on a taper for the full 12 weeks with my Test. Also wont be using Adex at all, going to let the E2 do its work and keep myself from getting Covid as well

[magic32]

This is becoming gratuitous.

Sounds like you're an aas veteran, that you've run Test + Oral Tren cycles with satisfactory results, and would like to know if adding Dbol (by whatever name) as a kickstart would be safe and effective.

Yes to both, you are correct. Enjoy the cycle, and post your results for posterity.

Best to you.

[Rainshaker]

This is becoming gratuitous.

Sounds like you're an aas veteran, that you've run Test + Oral Tren cycles with satisfactory results, and would like to know if adding Dbol (by whatever name) as a kickstart would be safe and effective.

Yes to both, you are correct. Enjoy the cycle, and post your results for posterity.

Best to you.

I wouldn't say veteran by any means but been through my share of cycles now with what I have found I like. That is exactly what I was wondering is if adding Dbol would be safe and effective. Also if the 2 week break in between would be enough of a rest on the liver.

At this point I've had so much negative comments I literally can't tell if you are honestly giving me your opinion that it would be safe and effective or if you are just saying that.

I have already decided against the oral tren, somebody on another forum was able to provide me with some solid science on why it is harsher than other orals. That being said not sure I want to keep taking that risk. I still am confused though why if it acts this way, my values were not crazy out of whack when I had bloodwork done on week 3 of it.

Either way think I'm going to pass on it this round and see how I like the Dbol. If you really do think it would be safe and effective maybe I will give it a try next round.

I will say if it makes any difference I take damn good care of my liver. Haven't had a drop of alcohol, other than a tincture, in over 7 years. Take zero medications other then the obvious things I'm asking about here. Drink tons of water and black coffee.

I'm hoping this was a legit response and I'm not going to look like an idiot for responding to it as such, but either way man thanks a lot for the input. Nice to see somebody willing to go against the popular answer.

Will definitely post end results and if there is a place to keep a cycle log I can definitely do a log during cycle as well.

[Cuz]

Post up a pic lets see what you’re workin with.