Hey Nark,
What are your views on drinking pasteurized liquid eggs vs. cooking them?
Ya know, the whole you only absorb about half of the nutrients when you drink them as compared to cooking and eating them...
CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
Hey Nark,
What are your views on drinking pasteurized liquid eggs vs. cooking them?
Ya know, the whole you only absorb about half of the nutrients when you drink them as compared to cooking and eating them...
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Before I reply, please clarify... Is your question:Originally Posted by xlxBigSexyxlx
1. w/ regard to the bioavailability of the protein in cooked v.s. pasteurized eggwhites?
2. w/ regard to the body's response to liquid calories as compared to that of ingested solid foods?
Let me know.
-CNS
New Member
Id say im at around 18% bf atm.
Mon: Chest / Tris
Tues: Legs + 30 mins Cardio
Wed: Off
Thurs: Shoulders + 30 mins Cardio
Fri: Back / Bis
Sat: Cardio AM
Sun: Off
I dont think im ready for a cycle just yet, so no anabolics. Still a lot of room natural growth.
Guess I overestimated my goals? Maybe you can shed some light on my plan and help me achieve a more realistic goal.
Thanks bud
Associate Member
Thanks for the help, I'll get crackin' on a diet plan and see what ya'll think.
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
^^Rock on buddy.
Hit us up with progress reports.
-CNS
New Member
Any ideas on my diet nark?
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
I think your goals are unrealistic.
I think your diet is overkill calorically.
I think your bodyfat percentage is also way too high.
165 lbs @ 18% bf = 128 lbs LBM.
3100 kcals?
Overkill.
Furthermore, at 18% BF... your bodyfat percentage places you in a position where you're more likely to gain more bodyfat than lose any.
My thought?
Well.. I won't touch your diet at all, because I don't think it's applicable to you at all personally.
Get your bodyfat level down to 10% max...
Eat @ maintenance... not hypercaloric.
Bump cardio etc.
..and get that bodyfat down.
Then you can attempt a hypercaloric diet.
-CNS
New Member
Hmm ok good points.
Guess ill postpone the bulking until I drop down to a more suitable bf %. I'll also bump up the cardio to every day pwo and am on non work out days.
So if I were to eat at maintenance calories would I calculate my bmr using the 165 lbs or the 128 of lbm I have? Maintenance at 165 lbs would be around 2.8k cals for me right?
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
More like 2k actually.
-CNS
Anabolic Member
To add what Narky said, your body is at an optimal anabolic state when it is in the 10-14% BF range, some even narrow it down to 10-12%. This is one of the two reasons we see more and more, if not all, pro-BB being close to competition shape. Another being that it is much easier to lose ~6% BF versus ~10%BF.
New Member
Ok guys thanks for setting me on the right track. Hows this look for my new diet considering my stats?
8:00 Meal 1: Pro/Carb
4 egg white (12 / 0 / 0)
1 scoop whey (23 / 3 / 2)
2 wheat slices (10 / 40 / 2)
45g protein / 43g carb / 4g fat
12:00 Meal 2: Pro/Fat
5 oz tuna (30 / 0 / 1)
2 tbsp natty pb (8 / 6 / 16)
38g protein / 6g carb / 17g fat
3:00 Meal 3: Pro/Carb
5oz tuna (30 / 0 / 1)
3/4 cup cooked brown rice (3 / 32 / 1)
Veggies
33g protein / 32g carb / 2g fat
6:00 Meal 4: Pro/Carb
6oz chicken breast (36 / 0 / 4)
3/4 cup cooked brown rice (3 / 32 / 1)
Veggies
39g protein / 32g carb / 5g fat
Workout
9:00 Meal 5: PWO
PWO shake (48 / 60 / 3)
48g protein / 60g carb / 3g fat
11:30 Meal 6: Pro/Fat
2 turkey patties (40 / 0 / 18)
40g protein / 0g carb / 18g fat
Totals: 2.1k cals / 243g protein / 173g carb / 49g fat
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Cut the pwo shake in half... and bump the ppwo meal to 10 p.m.
Remember the role of the pwo shake is to initiate recovery... by curbing catabolism.
It is a catalyst.. Not the end of the journey.
Overall the diet looks pretty good.
I don't like meal 1..and i'm not a fan of some of the other ones.
But.. it's a decent recomposition diet.
-CNS
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Agreed.
Additionally, getting lean seems to establish a set-point.
Once you've been there, it's easier to get back there.
-CNS
Anabolic Member
Yup, I noticed the hard way.
Snook~ AR Lounge Monitor
Hey nark can you take a look at this, i am looking for general advise as i don't count macros...yet
Typical day
6:00am
4 eggs (3 yokes) 2 slices whole wheat bread
Bowl of oats
Multi
o mega3 sub
9:00-30am
about half cut brown rice
one chicken breast
11:00-30
more rice (half cup)
chicken breast/or fish
12:00 Workout
during i sip dextrose/water (i know u dont like dextrose but im trying it)
1:00pm
PWO shake 48g protein
dextrose (total dextrose during/after is only 40g)
3:00pm
chicken
with carrots
celery sticks with natty PB (two tablespoons)
5:30pm
2 burgers 93%lean with some cheese
baked beans
8:00-9:00
One protein shake 48 grams again
then bed time.
i am normally snacking between meals with ether almonds, or sunflower seeds.
I been reading about cutting carbs once your activity is getting ready to slow down for the day. Normally at 3:00pm i would take in more rice but i figured with all the rice that i have already taken in i should be fine. Now on days where i add cardio i would maybe add another serving of oats/rice an hour or so before.
What do you think ? Again i know its general cause i am not counting everything but just trying to get an idea of when/what to eat. My mentality with now is always focus protein, add carbs when going to be active, then remove carbs towards end of day.
27 5'6 cut down to 165lbs.
Last edited by DSM4Life; 05-20-2008 at 09:23 PM.
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Get to counting.
Too many carbs and fats in one meal.
With no knowledge of your macros, I'd say it looks like a decent couple of meals.
I saw your rationale for doing so on another thread.
I don't agree with it.
Especially given your current weight/LBM.
Overkill.
The dex would be better served consumed pwo if the amount consumed in total is the total outlined above.
Short critique?
Your meals are all over the place.
You're combing concepts...and personally I think the outcome is a mess.
Again.. pointless.
You're eating regularly...and already more fat than you need by my estimate.
Why then are you exacerbating the situation (and potentially blunting your insulin response and sensitivity) by snacking between meals?
I do not like the diet at all.
Before you can 'tweak' the diet.. you need to have it laid out in a solid format.
You do not have such a format.
My thoughts?
Don't waste the fat-loss you've achieved by bulking in an erratic manner.
The diet you outlined falls into that vein.
-CNS
Snook~ AR Lounge Monitor
Nark/nova what are you thoughts on dextrose ? I was thinking about giving it a try
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=344762
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Not a fan of spiking insulin pwo.
I believe that's been discussed somewhere else on this thread.
My dieting style adheres to the precept that insulin is best maintained below a certain threshold.
So again... I don't like dextrose.
If you're using a nutrient-partitioning agent like insulin or (to a lesser degree) IGF-1, cool.
But... my dieting style isn't structured around ergogenic use.
-CNS
Snook~ AR Lounge Monitor
A bowl of oatmeal and 2 slices of bread is too many carbs ?
What do you mean by my meals are all over the place ?
Can you sort of recommend certain combos on where i am going wrong.
I want to get on the ball with this ASAP.
The chicken breast at cut from the store and there are no macros listed on the package. Its perdue chicken.
Again thanks for the time and suggestions Nark, I know most people post and don't follow through but i do and i think i am lucky to have people like you willing to devote their time to help other members where they might be lacking.
Last edited by DSM4Life; 05-22-2008 at 06:15 AM.
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
You're 165 lbs... bodyfat percentage unlisted.
To maintain weight you need about 2000 kcals.
Let's say: 200 gr pro; 200 gr carbs; 45 gr fat.. split over the course of a day... more or less equally over a number of meals.
a 'bowl' of oatmeal could be anywhere from 30 to 70gr of carbs.
2 slices of bread supply 25gr.
3 egg yolks are about 14gr fat...and then both bread and oats add fats as well.
Clearly in the first meal you're taking in a large percentage of your daily allotment.
It's a badly planned meal.
See above:
Some meals loaded with carbs and fat, some meals loaded with fat and protein.. some 'lean'.
Looks like you combined a number of dieting styles like i alluded to.
See above and previous posts.
1. calculate LBM
2. Calculate TDEE/BMR..so as to establish that you need to intest.
4. Split your total kcals over the course of the day.
5. Don't let fats exceed 20% of daily kcal allotment..
6. Don't let fats drop lower than 15% of daily kcal allotment.
No macros listed?
Get a scale... weigh your foods.
You know 'what' your chicken is.. but not what's in it...right?
This is simply recitified...
Go to calorie-count.com.
Input: "perdue chicken"
Voila:
http://caloriecount.about.com/cc/manufacturer/983.html
http://caloriecount.about.com/cc/item/85734.html
etc.
np.
-CNS
Last edited by Narkissos; 07-03-2008 at 12:13 AM.
Knowledgeable Member
Nark can you help me out with my diet? I am just coming off a lean bulk and want to drop some body fat without sacrificing my hard earned muscle. Stats: 5’-10”, 206 lbs., about 12-13% bf (estimate, can see abs but I hold a lot of fat around the “love handle” region). My goal is to cut down to 190 lbs. @ 8% bf. Can I achieve my goal by eating at maintenance level and upping the cardio? I figured my maintenance cals to be around 3300. Here’s my diet:
Food---cals---fat---carbs---protein
Meal 1: 7:00 am
Whey protein shake---240---2---6---48
1 cup Oatmeal----------250---5---45---9
Totals--------------------490---7---51---57
Meal 2: 9:00 am
1 can of tuna------------125---3---1---28
3 egg whites--------------48---0---0---10
½ cup Oats---------------150---3---27---5
Totals---------------------323---6---28---39
Meal 3: 11:00 am
Grilled Chicken Breast---240---13---2---26
1 cup Brown Rice---------170---1---35---4
Broccoli-----------------------30---0---4---1
Totals------------------------440---14---41---31
Meal 4: 1:30 pm
Whey protein shake--------240---2---6---48
½ cup Oats------------------150---3---27---5
Totals-------------------------390---5---33---53
Meal 5: (Pre-workout) 3:30 pm
1 can of tuna----------------125---3---1---28
3 egg whites------------------48---0---0---9
1 cup Oatmeal--------------300---6---50---10
Totals-------------------------473---9---51---47
Workout: 4:30-6:00 (including cardio)
Meal 6: (PWO) 6:00 pm
PWO Shake w/--------------486---2---66---48
Whey and WMS
Meal 7: 7:30 pm
8 oz. Talapia-----------------200---2---0---42
Swt. Potato-------------------215---2---44---5
Broccoli-----------------------30---0---4---1
Totals-------------------------445---4---48---48
Meal 8: 10:00 pm
Bedtime Shake w/------------360---9---9---48
Casein, 1/2 cup cottage Cheese, 1 tbls. Natty PB
Grand Total----------------------3407---56---327---371
Fat = 16%
Protein = 44%
Carbs = 40%
CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
Hey Nark/Nova: Currently I'm 200lbs, 5'11'', probably 15-17% BF
Due to some recent setbacks (Pm'ed you Nark), my diet has gone out of whack. Im looking just to eat clean and healthy, and shed a few pounds, so I guess you can say Im cutting. My macros will follow as (Cals,F,C,P), respectively being (Calories, Fats, Carbs, Protein). I will leave the supplements out until the end.
Meal 1
-pack of oatmeal........................................... ...(100,2,15,4)
-fruit/egg smoothie (blueberries,raspberries,egg beaters,milk)..................................... ..............(370,0,42,35)
TOTALS: (470,2,57,39)
Meal 2
-28 almonds............(160,14,3,6)
-1 oz beef jerky.......(80,.5,5,14)
TOTALS: (240,14.5,8,20)
Meal 3
-chicken breast....(120,3,0,22)
-veggies
TOTALS: (120,3,0,22)
PWO: consisting of WMS, orange juice, and ON's Pro Complex
TOTALS: (610,.5,90,62)
Meal 5
-lean beef patty.........(180,10,0,23)
-1cup Kashi go lean....(140,1,20,13)
-veggies
TOTALS: (320,11,20,36)
Meal 6
-MHP's Probolic-SR......(260,8,6,40)
-2 tbsp flax oil...........(260,28,0,0)
-8 oz skim milk.........(80,0,12,8)
TOTALS: (600,36,18,48)
From what I calculated, I want to take in about 2,400-2,500 calories.
The day totals come out to be (2360,67,193,227)
Im thinking I might need 200 or so more calories, but I don't know of what or where to put them.
This also, comes to 29 grams of fiber, plus whatever the veggies give me.
I will be drinking 1.5 gallons everyday
Supplements:
-Lipoflame
-GNC Mega Men Multi
-Glutamine
-BCAAs
-Liquid Aminos
-RALA (before my carb meals)
Well, there it is. I might be missing something, but I tried hitting it all. Critique away!!!!
Thanks guys
Last edited by xlxBigSexyxlx; 05-22-2008 at 05:28 PM.
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
'Probably' is a bad word in these here parts mate
Get 'er tested...and get back to us ASAP.
Got the PM.. Sorry i didn't get back to you on it.
Been tied up with applying my hell week protocol (the template for shredding a client up during the last week of his contest prep) to a client of mine. It's been a fun ride... Well, for me at least.
Another bad word... Sureties mate...that's what we're about.
Ok... I say you're cutting, so I'll disregard the rest of the paragraph and get down to the meat of the matter.
Ok... The kcals are about right.
Please note that @ 200 lbs and 17% BF.. your LBM is 166 lbs or thereabout.
Back to your diet:
1. total fat is too high. You're at 26% of calories at present... drop that down to 20%
2. You aren't noting the vegetable portion size, or the carbs/kcals they contribute. This'll throw your totals.
3. I suspect your diet, as it is laid out, is high in sugar.
Not counting PWO, meals 1,2,5 and 6 all contain sources of sugar.
4. Milk should not be in a cutting diet.
Again, a decent recomposition diet... Relaxed...not too intensive.
Toss some cardio in there.. plus a GDA, and you've got something that could work for about 6 weeks.
-CNS
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
I'll try.
Noted.
1. 13% BF puts you at 180 lbs LBM... and it is THIS figure which should be the basis of your BMR calculations.
2. Guesstimating is like shooting yourself in the foot.. unless you have a lot of practice taking bodyfat percentages for other people and yourself.
Most people tend to underestimate how much fat they're carrying.
To a point.. Yes.
Development/Progress isn't linear however... So eventually you'll plateau.
At this point, you'll have to manipulate one variable or another.
Based on what?
Unless your activity is particularly high, I'd estimate your maintenance to be right around 2500 kcals.
Please supply information to support your estimation.
Seeing that I think your calories are too high... I'll only comment on the meal composition.. as opposed to the kcal count
The good:
1. Good food choices.
2. Decent ratios.
The not-so-good:
1. Calories are spread unequally.
Now my thoughts.
If you kept to this diet... and bumped cardio, you'd get a recomposition effect.
Ultimately you'd plateau however..and would have to lower calories to get fat loss going again.
Overall... solid 'lean bulking' diet... or recomposition diet.
Try it for 6-8 weeks... then modify it.
-CNS
Knowledgeable Member
To obtain my maintenance calories I used the Katch-McArdle formula, which I believe you suggested in an earlier post.
Formula: BMR = 370 + (21.6 X lean mass in kg), based on a LBM of 180 lbs = 82 kg
= 370 + (21.6 X 82)
= 2141.20
I have a desk job but I lift weights 5 days a week and perform cardio PWO 4 days a week. Which I believe would put me moderately active = 1.55 (multiplier)
So… 2141.20 X 1.55 = 3318 cals
Nark, is my math off? How did you get my maintenance cals to be 2500 cals?
I am going to work on spreading my cals more evenly once I am certain what my maintenance cals are. Nark, thank you for taking the time to post this thread and helping everyone out!
Snook~ AR Lounge Monitor
Nark,
I am going to start counting macros starting now and will post a new diet up after i get all my info needed. Also going to get LBM checked tomorrow at the gym to get an idea at where i am.
Now onto the carbs. I take most of my carbs during the day because i am active at work, then go to the gym on my lunch break then return right back to work being active again. I know the more active i am the more calories i should be taking in (i am a "hard gainer" to begin with). When it comes to taking carbs for my pre workout i guess an eating complex carbs (brown rice) and hour before should carry over into my workout correct ? Then after the workout should i ingest more complex carbs ?
I been trying the dextrose thing but something doesnt seem right with adding all this sugar so i am giving it up.
and do you believe in post post carbs ?
(u need a write up)
Last edited by DSM4Life; 05-22-2008 at 07:26 PM.
Banned
HI Nark, great thread.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
I would like some crtiques on my diet/goals.
Stats- 5"10, 185 lbs, 18% bodyfat
Goals-11% body fat with minimal muscle loss
Activity- weight training 4x week cardio 5x week ( empty stomach)
BMR 1930.75
TARGET ???? -500 to cut???
20 min Cardio (emty stomach) approx 200 kcal spent
Kcal Pro Carb Fat
1 180 Grams Egg Beaters 90 18 3 0
3 Sausage Links 170 7 1 14
Water 0 0 0 0
Total 260 25 4 14
2 175g Chicken Breast 6 oz 240.4 52 0 3
Mixed Vegetables(1 cup) 30 1 5 0
Water
Total 270.4 53 5 3
3 2 Tbsp Nat Peanut Butter 200 9 6 9
1/2 cup of Oats 150 5 27 3
Water
Total 350 14 33 12
WORKOUT******************************************* ********
4 2 Scoops Whey Protein 240 46 7 3
1 orange 62 1.2 15.4 0
8oz gatorade 55 0 14 0
Total 357 47.2 36.4 3
5 Steak 6 oz 266 35 0 14
Mixed Vegetables(1 cup) 30 1 5 0
Water
Total 296 36 5 14
Totals Kcal Pro Carb Fat
1533.4 175.2 83.4 46
Knowledgeable Member
Where you at Nark?
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Thanks mate.
Will try.
Noted.
<>150 lbs LBM
Goals: 170 lbs w/ 11% bf (i.e. <> 150 lbs LBM)
kcals re-adjusted for desired bodyweight.
1. Maintenance adjusted to: 2040
2. Manipulate expenditure.
Bump to 45 minutes.
1. Kcals too low. Seeing that you're averaging about 300kcals/meal, it'd take two more meals to meet your kcal requirements.
2. Too much protein in some meals.. not enough in others.
3. too much fat in some meals.
4. Think consistent supply... Spread your kcals and macros equally over the course of the day.
-CNS
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Hey buddy.
Great.. bump for the verdict!
Noted.
Yep...to a point.
That depends on the nature of the complex carb...as well as what else is ingested alongside it.
The short answer would be 'no' however...or rather 'not entirely'.
If you were to say take in boiled white potatoes (no protein nor fat added) an hour before working out.. yea it'd carry over.I've experienced this first hand as have my clients. (particularly those who are on carb-timing diets)
However, add a protein or fat source (or combination of both) to that meal and while gastric emptying would be delayed only slightly, this'd be enough to slow assimilation and utilization.
So to your question... While the meal you have pre-workout will have some effect, it will not be as pronounced as say the same amount of carbs spread over 2-3 meals prior to training.
You get what I'm saying?
Yes.
Good stuff.
Yep.
Of what nature?
-C
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Right here.
I have some clients who're mid-contest prep at the moment... So i haven't been able to respond to the last couple diets posted.
I must remind posters that this is an advice thread... as opposed to a 'give me a new diet' thread.
Note the difference...and bear with me.
-Narkissos
AR-Hall of Famer ~ Cocky motherF*cker!
Who the f*ck is Novastepp?
Nice of you to have this thread C.
(Marketing) :-)
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Thanks B
-C
Have You Picked a Fight Lately?
hello pinnacle. i think you should definitely add to this thread. i have been away for a while due to a few problems that needed solved in my life and i have been handling the majority of the PM's coming through this thread. i hope to add to this thread at a much more regular interval. i know everyone holds Nark in very high regard along with myself, but with his aid i have come to understand and utilize this form of dieting and hope to help all those who willingly seek help.
AR-Hall of Famer ~ Cocky motherF*cker!
Ahh... looking at your screen name, I remember you now. Nice to see you again.
Although my dieting philosophies are similar to C's, this thread is for you guys to explain your ideologies, and I also understand the reasoning as to why this thread is here too. :-)
I do understand the responsibility of a thread like this for the fact I have a very popular Q & A elsewhere that requires a lot of time (that I don't always have). So props to both you guys for making time here to answer questions/help guys out.
Pinnacle
Associate Member
When supplementing chromium, how much should be taken and when???
BTW, nice work Nark and Nova. Keep it up
Associate Member
Also...
I know I'm off topic here, but I was reading a post of yours (Nark) from 2005 about you cycling theories (perpetual cycling). In another post, which had a link to said post, you stated that you would later revise your theory and put it into practice to test its applicability. Just curious if this ever happened and if there was a post with your revisions and results.
peace
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
That'd depend on the purpose for taking it, as well as the training/eating phase you're in...
For carb loads: 200 mcg + 40 mg Vanadyl sulphate @ each carb-containing meal.
For cutting: 200 mcg + 100 mg B-complex @ every other meal. (starting at meal 3... as meal 1 will normally be taken with a multivitamin. Generally multis contain 100 mcg chromium + b-complex)
For cheat meals: 1000 mcg chromium w/ cheat meal.
Off-season: 200 mcg chromium + 2-3gr vitamin C pwo.
Carb-cycling: 200 mcg chromium w/ every meal
Carb-depletion: 200 mcg chromium w/ every meal
That's off the top of my head.
Thanks mate.
Ah... This post surprised the hell out of me.
I had to do a double-take at your registration date...because that's an old, old hypothesis.
Interesting enough, I'm running a similar experiment at present.
...and will be for another year probably.
Send me a friend request so that the system allows you to PM me...and we can talk in more detail via PM or email.
-CNS
Snook~ AR Lounge Monitor
Cal / PRO / CARBS / FATS
6:00am
4 eggs (1 yoke) 118 / 16.8 / 1.6 / 4.8
oatmeal (1/2 cup) 150 / 5 / 27 / 3
Flaxseed oil sub
mutli
8:30am
6oz chicken breast 180/ 33 / 1.5 / 3.75
carrots (2) 70 / 2 / 8 / 0
10:30-11
6oz chicken breast 180/ 33 / 1.5 / 3.75
brown rice half cup 150 / 5 / 27 / 3
workout
1:00-
PWO
6oz chicken breast 180/ 33 / 1.5 / 3.75
brown rice (1/4 cup) 170 / 4 / 35 / 1.5
3:00pm
1 chicken breast 120 / 22 / 1 / 2.5
Olive oil 1 Tbsp 120 / 0 / 0 / 14
celery (2) 38 / .16 / 7.2 / .4
5:30pm
4oz tilapia fillet -baked 93 / 21 / 0 / 1
veggies.
8:30pm
Shake (1 scoop ) 117 / 24 / 2 / 2
Olive oil 1 Tbsp 120 / 0 / 0 / 14
BED
So then for a average day i have
Cal pro / carbs /fats
1768/ 215 / 106 / 57
chicken will be sub with lean ground beef and/or turkey. Can't have chicken that often everyday.
Also thanks to pinn for help.
AR-Hall of Famer ~Diet Guru~
Looks good overall... Slightly low in calories.
Optimally, 1980kcals should be your average per day for the week.
You have one of two options.
You can bump your diet's kcals on a daily basis... Or you can add in a high carb (all low glycemic) low-fat refeed once per week.
Good to have B around again
-CNS
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