first cycle-Bulking phase- need to stay as lean as possible-Testosterone Enanthate?

[acadmia]

Hello everyone,

I am considering doing my first cycle. Here are my measurements

I am 30 years old. I have been training hard for 4 years now. When I started I was about 180 lbs with very high bf percentage. Now I am 145 lbs with about 9% bf. I am 5'8". I work out 5 times a week. My goal is to be 170 with about 7% bf. I was thinking to cycle Testosterone Enanthate for 10 weeks 400 mgs per week. Is that enough? Also should I inject the whole 400 mgs once, or should I divide it to 200 mgs twice. Also as far as calorie intake, how many calories should i consume? (I know what to eat). Note please, i wanted to be as lean as possible. I want to minimize adding fat as much as i can
Thanks a million

[upperhandy]

get thee to the diet section my friend... and stay away from the aas until you have THAT figured out

[stpete]

Your diet is way off. As mentioned, go to the diet section and post your diet for help. AAS won't help at all if you're diet isn't spot on.

[acadmia]

Replies seem to be a big joke. Members keep telling me my dieting is way off. However, i did not say what my diet is. It looks like all replies are fake.

[K_PIN]

Dude thats the way they are here. Almost everyone who is new and posts for advice gets told either they are too young for aas or their diet isn't in check.

To answer your question, yes Test E @ 400mg per week would be a great cycle for starters. And yes split your injections. inject twice per week. like monday and thursday. Make sure you have a good PCT lined up.

[smalltime7]

at 145 lbs these guys know you need diet to reach natural potential and if you were a fat 180 at one point you could certainly be a good 180

[acadmia]

Thanks a million guys, that help alot. What would guys recommend for PCT?

[K_PIN]

For PCT I would go with either tamoxifen or clomid. Or both if you like.

Tamox for 4 weeks 40/20/20/10
Clomid for 4 weeks 150/100/100/50

[amcon]

that was a lot of help??? are you serious?

yes you should shoot up 2x a week

no 400 is to low

no you shouldnt be using aas yet...

the advise that was given should be taken like this, untill you get your diet right (meaning you dont even know what to eat to gain muscle) you should hold off on the steroids

so to repeat that - go read up on diet, go put togather a diet for you to follow, post it here and we will give our in put

and your test cycle should be 12 - 14 weeks (start with 12)

and also go read up on pct post that to for our in put



as for the guy with 65 posts... saying that is a good cycle... are you really going to follow that advise? why? does he look the way you want?

[amcon]

let him do his own research, how else would he learn what to do? or y he should do it?

[amcon]

and about the diet :

your asking how to bulk and stay cut... doesnt work that way - there for diet needs to be researched...

[singing master]

could any one tell me if there are non testostrone based steroids..my brother said there are different kinds of winstrol and the one he giving me not testostrone based .. please i don't wanna lose my singing voice .and grow facial hair ..... btw i am a 20 year old girl

[amcon]

yes, pm me and i will show you how to get it... how much money do you have?

[singing master]

really need to know please can any one help me

[junkiescumbag]

and about the diet :

your asking how to bulk and stay cut... doesnt work that way - there for diet needs to be researched...

yyyyes it does mate, with a good diet and test its very possible

[Bonaparte]

Guys, the OP is 5'8" and weighs 145lbs! You really think AAS would be the best idea? How about a few years of lifting to build a natural base? If he cycles now, he'll probably just rebound like a mofo and get fat again, which is basically what happened here: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...-i-start-a-cut
So he's likely be back up to 180lbs and only a bit leaner and stronger, but still fat and weak (especially for someone who can't even say he's natural anymore).

And as for you, K Pin, shut up. If you don't like the way this site operates (as per the judgment and reasoning of your betters), go somewhere else and give all the shitty AAS advice in the world to fat and scrawny kids.

[MBMETC]

Replies seem to be a big joke. Members keep telling me my dieting is way off. However, i did not say what my diet is. It looks like all replies are fake.

dude from 180 to 145 at 5'8" thats alot of weight to drop especially if it was done in an unhealthy manner, these are replies of concern not humor. you need to set a diet and learn how to gain lbm through that diet which will take time to figure out. if you cycle and diet wrong you will gain more fat than muscle leaving you to get freaked out and start extreme dieting again which is unhealthy. build a solid diet foundation and then think cycle.
good luck

[acadmia]

It acutally took me 2 years to drop from 180lb to 132lb then i statred to gain some mucsle mass. My bf% went down to as low as 7%, but i gained a little bit of fat along with muscles. So i thought about Test E because my gain is way too slow at the moment. i will probably will take only one cycle or 2 at most. i dont want to get too big; i only want to be somewhere arround 170 lb with low bf%

[upperhandy]

you can (and should) get to 170lbs at your height and low bf% with out aas. in fact if you can't make it somewhere near there without aas you will never be able to keep what you desire.

aas will work even if you don't know what you're doing, but you will never keep your gains and will slip back to where you started.
if that is the case, then why even put your body through the stress?

you could do a cycle now... see some results... then go back to where you started.... OR
you could get your workout program and diet in line, get close to your goals naturally THEN
jump on a cycle and blow your expectations out of the water

which sounds better to you????

[cyounger100]

at 145 lbs these guys know you need diet to reach natural potential and if you were a fat 180 at one point you could certainly be a good 180

agree 145 lbs wow

[acadmia]

i know that i can do that without AAS, but it will take so long. I wanted to speed it up. Right now, i gain about 2 lbs a month (I am very hard gainer). it will take me about 15 months to get to my goal, but with one cycle i will jump up to 170 in 3 months. Then i wont cycle again.

[acadmia]

Will one cycle mess up my system? Based on my research, it won't. i am planning to have blood test every 4 weeks during the cycle.

[sleep.eat.train]

Whether you decide to cycle or not, get your diet in check. If you cycle without a proper diet you will gain weight but once your off the AAS you will go back to what you were or even smaller.

[WastedTalent09]

Guys, the OP is 5'8" and weighs 145lbs! You really think AAS would be the best idea? How about a few years of lifting to build a natural base? If he cycles now, he'll probably just rebound like a mofo and get fat again, which is basically what happened here: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...-i-start-a-cut
So he's likely be back up to 180lbs and only a bit leaner and stronger, but still fat and weak (especially for someone who can't even say he's natural anymore).

And as for you, K Pin, shut up. If you don't like the way this site operates (as per the judgment and reasoning of your betters), go somewhere else and give all the shitty AAS advice in the world to fat and scrawny kids.

Literally laughing my ass off right now

[K_PIN]

Guys, the OP is 5'8" and weighs 145lbs! You really think AAS would be the best idea? How about a few years of lifting to build a natural base? If he cycles now, he'll probably just rebound like a mofo and get fat again, which is basically what happened here: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...-i-start-a-cut
So he's likely be back up to 180lbs and only a bit leaner and stronger, but still fat and weak (especially for someone who can't even say he's natural anymore).

And as for you, K Pin, shut up. If you don't like the way this site operates (as per the judgment and reasoning of your betters), go somewhere else and give all the shitty AAS advice in the world to fat and scrawny kids.

I don't see where any advice I gave was shitty. He was asking if 400mg/wk of test is a good first cycle. Yes it is. I also advised him to split injections and let him know what good PCT would be. I think it's better than not answering him and he go throw some tren in there or some other dumb crap and not do pct. And the guy is 30, he is not a kid. Some people are not gifted genetically to have a 200lb natural build. Hell some aren't given the ability to have a 180lb natural build. I know people like this. One of my friends is 155 and he eats like none other and used to work out ALLL the time. He is still the same size he was in high school and he is 32. For some people it just isnt possible. And yes AAS will give them that little edge they need. For all you know this guy could have worked his ass off to get where he is. Yes telling him to go to the diet section is fine but why not answer his simple questions? Answering those will not hurt a damn thing.

[turk1968]

i know that i can do that without AAS, but it will take so long. I wanted to speed it up. Right now, i gain about 2 lbs a month (I am very hard gainer). it will take me about 15 months to get to my goal, but with one cycle i will jump up to 170 in 3 months. Then i wont cycle again.

I would love to naturally or even with aas gain 2 pounds every month .Thats 24lbs per year so in three years that would make me 340lbs !!!!!! God i would never of even touched aas if i could gain that . Bodybuilding is a long long long steady road !! . Take it from someone who is now 49 years young and still got my head in magazines and searching the internet for that extra edge. Life flyes by so fast so dont rush you will only regreat it. If you try to gain that 30 lbs in 3 months i will put money with you that you will lose the lot after the following 3 months . I wish it was as simple as : cycle-gain muscle -stop cycle - keep gains. Paradise my friend that none of us have found. I know its not what you want to hear but all of the post (especially upperhandys ) is what you want to keep in mind .

[Bonaparte]

I don't see where any advice I gave was shitty. He was asking if 400mg/wk of test is a good first cycle. Yes it is. I also advised him to split injections and let him know what good PCT would be. I think it's better than not answering him and he go throw some tren in there or some other dumb crap and not do pct. And the guy is 30, he is not a kid. Some people are not gifted genetically to have a 200lb natural build. Hell some aren't given the ability to have a 180lb natural build. I know people like this. One of my friends is 155 and he eats like none other and used to work out ALLL the time. He is still the same size he was in high school and he is 32. For some people it just isnt possible. And yes AAS will give them that little edge they need. For all you know this guy could have worked his ass off to get where he is. Yes telling him to go to the diet section is fine but why not answer his simple questions? Answering those will not hurt a damn thing.

Sure, that would be a good cycle for someone who is ready to use AAS. However, the OP clearly isn't, so he doesn't need AAS advice, and he sure doesn't need to be spoon-fed a cycle. There is no way in hell that he can't do better than a lean 145lbs at 5'8" naturally. And if that somehow is the case, then he should go see a doctor, because he likely suffers from a medical condition. Even many women could do better than that if they really tried to bulk up, and they have barely have any testosterone. So my point here is that an AAS cycle is not the immediate answer for him.

[dieselmuscle80]

Acamdia I'm still new to the board and I'm not bashing nor trying to tell u what to do but really bro it sounds like u need to try more options before ur first cycle. again this is just my 2 cents because right when u said u want to speed it up to me that says ur just looking for the quick fix. Cycling shouldn't be about that and to me that's like abusing the drug giving it a bad rep. Myself and others have bodybuild for years and for some us when we hit that point and couldn't gain anymore then the drug was used. Using the drug to gain ur muscle then laying off for ever will not help u in the long run. if that's the case you might wanna stick with OTC drugs. You might be a hard gainer but Im pretty sure a high calorie diet U will put some good lean muscle on if its done right. Even if u drink lean high calorie weight gainer mrp drinks the weight will pack on. Eat, sleep and lift. Now if u tried every option and you feel u are ready then just take test cyp at 500mgs broken up every 4 days. Test e is great for a first cycle but it will bloat u. Then again I always hated when people said they wanna do a bulk cycle and stay lean lol bulk and lean shouldn't be in the same sentence. Again just my two cents. If ur gonna bulk u need calories. To get or stay lean u need to watch calories. If ur gonna watch calories then don't even bother with test. Ur just gonna waste ur money. I've tried with different cycles to get the lean bulk and it was a waste. Run test and after pct run some clen or bronaid to reduce the fat. Keep a Anti on hand also to avoid any sides. Hope I didn't step on any toes and good luck. Keep us posted if u reached ur goals.

[amcon]

bull shit.... if you goint to bulk, you bulk!!!

if you are going to cut, then you cut!!!

yoiur going to cut or stay lean and do a tru bulk cycle???? shoe you pics i want to c what ya look like... you talk from experence right

[amcon]

i know that i can do that without AAS, but it will take so long. I wanted to speed it up. Right now, i gain about 2 lbs a month (I am very hard gainer). it will take me about 15 months to get to my goal, but with one cycle i will jump up to 170 in 3 months. Then i wont cycle again.

... bro trust me that is great!! 2lbs a month is great growth... what r you going to gain with aas? 4 lbs of lean muscle, maybe 2 a month of water, 2 a month of water) 8 lbs a month... i would take the 2 lbs any day!!!!

I would love to naturally or even with aas gain 2 pounds every month .Thats 24lbs per year so in three years that would make me 340lbs !!!!!! God i would never of even touched aas if i could gain that . Bodybuilding is a long long long steady road !! . Take it from someone who is now 49 years young and still got my head in magazines and searching the internet for that extra edge. Life flyes by so fast so dont rush you will only regreat it. If you try to gain that 30 lbs in 3 months i will put money with you that you will lose the lot after the following 3 months . I wish it was as simple as : cycle-gain muscle -stop cycle - keep gains. Paradise my friend that none of us have found. I know its not what you want to hear but all of the post (especially upperhandys ) is what you want to keep in mind .

agreed that would be 75 lbs after three years... om gosh!!!

[Far from massive]

Go to the diet section and honestly post up your diet, if the members there feel you diet is great and not the reason you can not gain, seek medical attention. Assuming the members see big improvements to your diet and you implelemt them take some time to grow naturally. If you go ahead and start a cycle after loosing this much wieght the likely outcome as well as temporary gains which have already been mentioned is serious injury as your connective tissue in your "down sized" (from the wieght drop) joints will not be able to keep pace with your instant growth from good nutrition and steroids.

If you think its hard to gain now, try to gain after a serious injury. As far as the diet its easy to reduce caloric intake and loose wieght (both fat and muscle) implementing a good diet too loose wieght and maintain muscle..well thats a little more difficult and thats why the diet board is so useful.

Good luck whichever course you choose,

FFM

[ss135]

maybe he has a very small, light frame being 5'8/145/8% body fat.. it's pretty a pretty standard weight for that scenario.. Most guys around here, who are 5'8, I'm sure have bigger frames, but what if this guy has less than 6" wrists and small joints/ankles.. He could weigh 110 without the muscle mass added to the equation.. He could have a high muscle mass/low body fat build, as compared to his frame, and you guys wouldn't even pay attention to any other variable but pure weight... 145 is not crazy and unheard of at that height, look at mma fighters; it's more about body composition.. 170, 8% BF is probably huge for his build..

take the 400mg test e twice a week mon/thurs, and eat a diet of oats, sweet potatoes, fruits (berries), vegetables, lean proteins at a macro ratio of 20/40/40, as consistent as possible, at 500-1000 above your TDEE.. and you'll gain lean mass on cycle..

PCT.. you'll have to keep that calorie count the same to adjust to your gains for 5-6 weeks, and then you'll want to taper it back to around maintenance, or you'll gain fat too fast after pct. Then you can assess the situation at hand to see what you want to do from there

[DamageDealer]

i know that i can do that without AAS, but it will take so long. I wanted to speed it up. Right now, i gain about 2 lbs a month (I am very hard gainer). it will take me about 15 months to get to my goal, but with one cycle i will jump up to 170 in 3 months. Then i wont cycle again.

are you fvcking kidding me? you can get to 180 lbs lean pretty fast, if you watch your diet. you won't get to 170 with steroids, you won't even get to 160lbs because you don't know how to eat period. and stop with this "i wont cycle again" shit, it makes me sick when people say that

[daem]

This thread is hilarious, and exactly the reason why I no longer come here for anything but a laugh.

The holier than thou attitude of people who have been members of this site for 2-3 years is amazing. Remind me again who any of you are?

The OP is 30 years old and therefore a grown ass man capable of making his own decisions. He has not posted his diet for any critique, so anyone commenting that it's shit is speculating.

At 145 lbs, he most likely isn't eating enough, but you just don't know. Period.

To the OP:
400 is on the low side, I'd bump it up to 500mg / wk. Enanthate can be taken all at once for convenience but I generally run it 2x a week.

As far as calories, you really want to eat as many as you can. The testosterone isn't going to allow you to store a great deal of fat, and you shouldn't worry about that if you are trying to get to 170. If you eat everything in sight with ample protein, 170 might be attainable.

In order to get there, eating has to be a full time job for you.

[darkcrayz]

i know that i can do that without AAS, but it will take so long. I wanted to speed it up. Right now, i gain about 2 lbs a month (I am very hard gainer). it will take me about 15 months to get to my goal, but with one cycle i will jump up to 170 in 3 months. Then i wont cycle again.

you know what hard gainer stands for? it means; "I dont know how to eat!" If you ate like you were suppose to based on your metabolism you wouldnt be a hard gainer. You are going to take steroids to grow muscle which requires food to happen. Without food you wont grow and reach your full potential naturally or enhanced.

[Bonaparte]

This thread is hilarious, and exactly the reason why I no longer come here for anything but a laugh.

The holier than thou attitude of people who have been members of this site for 2-3 years is amazing. Remind me again who any of you are?

You know what else is funny? Guys who come in and comment on a thread that is 16 months old.

[Sgt. Hartman]

This thread is hilarious, and exactly the reason why I no longer come here

Then don't come here. And if you just can't stay away then don't comment on year and a half year old threads.

[daem]

Then don't come here. And if you just can't stay away then don't comment on year and a half year old threads.

I check in from time to time to see the latest examples of groupthink, bad advice, and hostility towards people who don't deserve to be treated like dogs.

[adamjames]

I check in from time to time to see the latest examples of groupthink, bad advice, and hostility towards people who don't deserve to be treated like dogs.

I feel you man!!! Bringing that real shit to the board!!! I get flamed occasionaly by certain godly saints here who have somehow clocked up 5,000 posts in 6 months and go around telling everyone how to live and die.

They themselves are long term juicers yet they turn on anyone who does not follow there holy advise, most of these OPs will go ahead and do a cycle anyway yet the god men dont seem to understand that. Then the groupthinkers dive in like flies to shit to agree with the patronising warnings posted by the expert who has been on the board for 6 months just because he has a special name next to his avatar, all this eventually drives away the OPs and they end up worse off!!