First cycle (Equipoise, Test E, Winnie)

[madbull]

Hey guys,

I am new to these forums but have been lingering and reading here for quite some time.

Just to give you brief info about me, I am 25 and have been lifting religiously for about 5 years now. In 09, I entered into a powerlifting competition with no little power lifting knowledge and totalled 660kg. Squat (220) Bench (160kg) and Deadlift (280kg).

Anyways my close friend and Personal Trainer at my gym is a bodybuilding competitor here and I will start my 1st cycle. He recommended for a 1st cycle the following and wanted to know your thoughts.

Week 1 - 12: Boldenone (Equipose) - 200mg
Week 1 - 12: Test Enanthate - 250mg
Week 6 - 12: Winstrol tabs 20 - 30mg/day

I have HCG for PCT and Nolvadex ready on hand. Also he suggested to include Clen after cycle.

I know that the dosages are quite low and have read that for Bold anything below 400mg is useless, and Test E, one should be getting at least 500mg. Could I get further opinion to this for experienced users. I always go by start slow and work your way up. Just in case there are any reactions or side effects. I was also considering if all goes well in the first few weeks to up the dosage for the remaining weeks of the cycle.

Keep the dosage the same through out? Up the dosage later in the week if all is well? Up the dosage to begin with?

What is your advice and suggestion?

First week had a shot of bold and test e on delts and so far so good.

Kind regards,
MadBull

[auswest]

Hey guys,

I am new to these forums but have been lingering and reading here for quite some time.

Just to give you brief info about me, I am 25 and have been lifting religiously for about 5 years now. In 09, I entered into a powerlifting competition with no little power lifting knowledge and totalled 660kg. Squat (220) Bench (160kg) and Deadlift (280kg).

Anyways my close friend and Personal Trainer at my gym is a bodybuilding competitor here and I will start my 1st cycle. He recommended for a 1st cycle the following and wanted to know your thoughts.

Week 1 - 12: Boldenone (Equipose) - 200mg
Week 1 - 12: Test Enanthate - 250mg
Week 6 - 12: Winstrol tabs 20 - 30mg/day

I have HCG for PCT and Nolvadex ready on hand. Also he suggested to include Clen after cycle.

I know that the dosages are quite low and have read that for Bold anything below 400mg is useless, and Test E, one should be getting at least 500mg. Could I get further opinion to this for experienced users. I always go by start slow and work your way up. Just in case there are any reactions or side effects. I was also considering if all goes well in the first few weeks to up the dosage for the remaining weeks of the cycle.

Keep the dosage the same through out? Up the dosage later in the week if all is well? Up the dosage to begin with?

What is your advice and suggestion?

First week had a shot of bold and test e on delts and so far so good.

Kind regards,
MadBull

Couldn't of been lingering and reading for too long bud, people can't help you with out your stats, and it is recommended day in day out to stick to test only on first cycle to gauge how you respond to it, and so you're not playing guessing games when trying to work out what may be causing certain sides.
You may also want to read up on correct pct and the use of hcg and ai's during cycle. I'm unsure what threads you say you have been reading if you don't have the basics.
Impressive lifting stats btw

[madbull]

Okay, maybe I could have done more reading. I have just searched on several websites which I won't mention on here about those 3 in particular which I mentioned above. From what I read, these appear quite mild and will be more of a slow, steady gains. My aim is to bulk up and increase in strength.

My stats are as follows:

Age: 25
Height: 5'7
Weight: 81.5kg.

I did read about including some of the HCG and AI during cycle but also heard that because Test E and Boldenone are relatively low in aromatising that it would not necessarily be needed. I do have them for backup just in case I start to see negative symptons.

You are right in that I could probably have done more reading, theres always more to learn and that is part of the purpose why I made an account and share my thoughts with experienced guys here. Thanks in advanced.

[Turkish Juicer]

Run Test E alone at 500mg EW for 12 weeks.

You do not need to bring other compounds into the picture for your first cycle, for various reasons.

FYI, if you know how to eat and train, you will grow more with the proposed beginner cycle above than you may actually think.

I would strongly recommend that you have a solid AI and enough HCG to last throughout the cycle for combating estrogen related side effects as well as maintaining regular testicular functions, which guarantee an overall better, faster post-cycle recovery.

Do more research on AI, HCG and PCT before you start your cycle.

[madbull]

Thanks for your replies guys so far.

Just wondering, do you believe that it is necessary to include Tamoxifen Citrate mid way through the cycle? The trainer that I buy from mentioned that it's a good idea to around Week 6. He said don't worry about HCG until PCT.

I must confess that I was a bit silly about it and made a hasty decision and took my trainer's word.

He has given me a shot of:

Bold (200mg).
Test e (250mg).

I'm guessing there is no harm in completely stopping use of Bold if already started?

As for the AI, i have Tamoxifen Citrate and HCG ready.

[madbull]

Hi Guys,

Could someone please give me some feedback/guidance regarding HCG and it's use.

I have been reading a lot of controversy and people suggest to take it before ending the cycle, whilst others are saying to take it during PCT?

I am a little confused as to when to take it exactly that would be most optimum for the stack I will run. Suggestions?

In addition, I heard that with the stack above, taking Nolva starting around Week 6 would be a good idea? Can someone confirm this?

Hope someone can provide some guidance/help.

Kind regards,
MadBull

[shredded]

Start HCG now at 500iu twice a week until end of cycle, this will help prevent testicular atrophy.

[madbull]

Thanks for your reply. Any one else second that?

So I should add HCG 500iu twice until end of cycle which is around another 6-7 weeks. How about Nolvadex?

Does that mean I should not bother with HCG during PCT?

Also does it matter when to take it? I'm guessing taking it day after or before Test E shot and Bold shots?

Kind regards,

[shredded]

Run Aromasin (Exemestane) 10mg/ED on cycle incase of estrogenic sides.

PCT :
week 1-6 Tamox 20mg/ED (40mg/ED week 1)
week 1-6 Clomid 25mg/ED (50mg/ED week 1)
Tribulus 1g/ED

Do more research on AI, HCG and PCT before you start your cycle for future references. Only run HCG while on cycle. Start PCT 14 days after last Injection of Test. Save Nolvas for PCT

[MR10X]

How long has your trainer been using steroids,how long has he been bodybuilding.

[madbull]

Thanks for the reply.

He has been training for almost 12 years and been on the gear for about 5 - 6 years. He is a competitor as well as a personal trainer.

He mentioned not to bother with HCG till PCT, however in week 6 he said I can start taking Tamoxifen 1g/day before bed.

I'm still a little confused, is there a reason why he would suggest not taking HCG till PCT?

[Turkish Juicer]

He mentioned not to bother with HCG till PCT, however in week 6 he said I can start taking Tamoxifen 1g/day before bed.

Wow, just another terrible advice here.

OP, you really need to stop taking advice from this guy...

[shredded]

Turkish Juicer has got the right idea.

If you can prevent testicular atrophy whilst on cycle why wouldn't you do so.

Wow, just another terrible advice here.

OP, you really need to stop taking advice from this guy...

[Mouser]

my .02 on the hcg would be 250iu's twice a week at 500 its more likely to aromatize

[madbull]

I see,

So you guys recommend taking 250iu hcq twice a week?

Turkish Juicer: Do you disagree with adding tamoxifen while on cycle?

How about PCT? Should I take HCG, Tamoxifen as well?

Hope I can clear this up. Really appreciate your help!

Just to re-iterate

I have:

Week 1 - 13
Boldenone 200mg/week
Test E 250mg/week

Week 6 - 13
HCG - 500iu / week (2 X 250iu)
Stanozolol - 30mg/day

PCT 2 weeks after last test e shot:
Week 1 - 6
Tamoxifen - 20mg/day
Vitamin E

Week 1-3:
HCG, 500iu/day.

MadBull

[MR10X]

Thanks for the reply.

He has been training for almost 12 years and been on the gear for about 5 - 6 years. He is a competitor as well as a personal trainer.

He mentioned not to bother with HCG till PCT, however in week 6 he said I can start taking Tamoxifen 1g/day before bed.

I'm still a little confused, is there a reason why he would suggest not taking HCG till PCT?

I would follow your trainers instructions,you have someone you can see and talk to when you need to. He has enough experience to guide you if you need help,you dont know anyone here for all you know they my have only been using steroids for a couple of cycles and dont have enough actual experience. The cycle he has planed for you is a fairly safe/mild cycle and you should have good results with it.As for the HCG,some people use it during a cycle and some dont,i would sart using it the last 4 weeks before PCT to jump start your test production.

[Turkish Juicer]

I was afraid that someone would come around and tell the OP to take advice from his trainer who designed a stack that consists of 2 injectables and an oral for a first cycle and told him to ''start taking Tamoxifen 1g/day before bed 6 weeks into the cycle.''

Oh yeah, he is someone ''you can see and talk to when you need to'' after all, which is an incredibly intelligent rationalization of why you should take advice from him since he will be there for you to listen when your estrogen has crashed and whatnot.

[Bonaparte]

Get a new trainer. A gram of nolva??!! You only need 20mg (1/50th of that dose).

[madbull]

Hi guys,

I have just finished my cycle of Test E/Eq/Win as above.

Yes I have top taking advice from the trainer and have been chatting with another. During this cycle, I didn't take the HCG although now that I read it would have probably been the most optimal too. Today is 14 days after my last Test E shot. According to my new source, he reckons I should still take the HCG. Could I grab some feedback?

Another thing is that the HCG only comes in one 5000iu ampule and once opened you cannot reseal. I read that taking 5000iu in one shot once a week is way too much, but then I saw that this is also okay. I have 10ml of BA water and before mixing it or even using it I would like the opinion of you guys?

Is it too late to take HCG now 14 days after last Test E shot?
If I take it, what are your thoughts of taking 5000iu all in one shot?

Thanks in advanced guys.

[Bonaparte]

You can still take the HCG (hopefully you've also started your Nolva and/or Clomid), but not all in one shot.

You're supposed to combine it with the bac water in a vial and keep it refrigerated.

[madbull]

Thanks for the info. I have started my Nolva now.

So I should combine HCG with nolva everday?

Regarding the HCG, I don't have a sterile vial and after opened, there is no way to store it again. Would it be possible to use the empty Equipose bottle. After mixing the 10ml BAC water with 5000iu HCG i transfer it to the Equipoise bottle and refrigerate it? Is that reasonably safe and has anyone done something similar?

So I should divide the shots of HCG into 3 a week to total 5000iu/week? I have a total of 2 bottles of 5000iu HCG so should only use it for 2 weeks after that continue with the Nolva, what do you think?

Really appreciate your advice.

[marcus300]

You was told what to do by Turkish juicer on the 3rd post but you ignored his advice. Don't take advice from your friends or someone you know ask here and listen then you wouldn't of wasted a cycle.

[madbull]

I understand that and will surely seek advice and follow religiously for next cycle. However I could not get the BAC water as it is not readily available where i live. Now that it is over and done with I was hoping to get further advice on my question above. So please could someone clarify further guidance on the issue above as it would be very much appreciated.

I don't think it was a complete waste of cycle as I got great gains and increase in strength as my diet is second to none and have been very strict in training and nutrition.

[gonzo6183]

So you came and asked for advice, you got good advice (only do the test E) yet you didnt listen and ran it anyway. Why bother coming back?

[madbull]

Ok anyone who doesn't want to bash on me and provide further advice willing to help me out?