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  1. #1
    gunner27 is offline Junior Member
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    Low-Dose Cycle Advice Needed

    First my stats:

    32, 5'10", 205 lbs, 10-15%BF, lifting for 7 years, 3 seriously. One cycle so far, 300 mg deca for 10 weeks, with 20 mg dbol ed first 4 weeks, 50 mg winstrol weeks 11-12, followed by clomid theraphy.

    I finished the cycle just over a year ago, and am looking at starting my second one in January. I deliberately went low-dose with my first cycle and loved the results. I gained 20 lbs and kept about 15 of them, along with most of my strength gains. For my second cycle, I'm looking at the following:

    wk 1-10: 200 mg deca & 200 mg test (cyp or enth)
    wk 11-12: 30-50 mg winny ed
    followed by clomid

    My goals for this cycle are to end up keeping 10-15 lbs, regardless of how much total I gain during the cycle, and making some decent strength gains. My question is are these goals realistic with the amounts I am looking at taking, assuming good diet, etc.? I definitely want to stick with the low-dose route, but am wondering if this is too low for any real results.

  2. #2
    Da Bull's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunner27
    First my stats:

    32, 5'10", 205 lbs, 10-15%BF, lifting for 7 years, 3 seriously. One cycle so far, 300 mg deca for 10 weeks, with 20 mg dbol ed first 4 weeks, 50 mg winstrol weeks 11-12, followed by clomid theraphy.

    I finished the cycle just over a year ago, and am looking at starting my second one in January. I deliberately went low-dose with my first cycle and loved the results. I gained 20 lbs and kept about 15 of them, along with most of my strength gains. For my second cycle, I'm looking at the following:

    wk 1-10: 200 mg deca & 200 mg test (cyp or enth)
    wk 11-12: 30-50 mg winny ed
    followed by clomid

    My goals for this cycle are to end up keeping 10-15 lbs, regardless of how much total I gain during the cycle, and making some decent strength gains. My question is are these goals realistic with the amounts I am looking at taking, assuming good diet, etc.? I definitely want to stick with the low-dose route, but am wondering if this is too low for any real results.
    THink you should up the test to 400mg and winny 8-12

  3. #3
    TheMudMan's Avatar
    TheMudMan is offline Retired~ AR-Hall of Famer
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    You ran 300mg a week of Deca so why run less this time around? I would run more test then you are deca. I also think running winny for 1 week is a waste.

    This is how I would run it......... If you're only going to run the winny for a week I would save my money and not run it.

    1 - 10 Cyp 400mg or 1 - 11 Enan 400mg
    1 - 10 Deca 300mg
    8 - 13 Winny 50mg ED
    1 - up to PCT 10mg Nolva ED

    1 day after last winny dose start PCT Clomid and Nolva and run for 4 weeks..... Clomd 300/100/50 and Nolva 20mg ED

  4. #4
    gunner27 is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMudMan
    You ran 300mg a week of Deca so why run less this time around? I would run more test then you are deca. I also think running winny for 1 week is a waste.

    This is how I would run it......... If you're only going to run the winny for a week I would save my money and not run it.

    1 - 10 Cyp 400mg or 1 - 11 Enan 400mg
    1 - 10 Deca 300mg
    8 - 13 Winny 50mg ED
    1 - up to PCT 10mg Nolva ED

    1 day after last winny dose start PCT Clomid and Nolva and run for 4 weeks..... Clomd 300/100/50 and Nolva 20mg ED
    My thinking about less deca now than before was that I will be running test with it, unlike last time. I'll be getting more juice total in my body (400 mg vs. 300 mg for most of last cycle), and half of it will be test--stronger than deca.

    With the winny, I would actually be running it for 2 weeks--weeks 11 and 12--and using it mainly to harden up gains and bridge the gap between stopping injectables and starting clomid and possibly nolva.

  5. #5
    TheMudMan's Avatar
    TheMudMan is offline Retired~ AR-Hall of Famer
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    Theres no benifit of running winny for 2 weeks either 6 minimum. I would run the deca at what you did last time or more not less. You should always run test in all cycles.

  6. #6
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    usualsuspect is offline Anabolic Member
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    running winny for 6 wks is waste let alone just 2.

    Take Mud's suggestion on the dosages...he know's his stuff and plus I think you will be much happier in the long run.

    ~US~

  7. #7
    gunner27 is offline Junior Member
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    Bump

    Any feedback is appreciated, but I'm particularly interested in hearing from people who have done or advocate low-dose cycles.

  8. #8
    goldenear is offline Associate Member
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    Well I like low dose cycles because I respond extremely well to low doses. However, my approach is different than your's. I like to run low dose cycles for very long periods of time for a couple of reasons: it's healthier, less side issues to deal with, gains will come slow but they will typically be of a higher quality, it's easier to maintain those gains, and the body composition transformation is nothing short of amazing.

    If I have read between the lines of your post correctly, you may be interested in checking out a thread we recently discussed over at musclechemistry.com.

    Here it is:
    http://board1.mantisforums.com/uploa...eferrerid=3339

    Check it out and let's discuss this further if you're so inclined. If I have mistaken your intentions, then I apologize for wasting your time. (It is a good read, though, lol.)

  9. #9
    50%Natural's Avatar
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    I think you should follow mudman's advice.

  10. #10
    JohnnyB's Avatar
    JohnnyB is offline AR-Hall of Famer / Retired
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    How about test at 350 a week, 250mg e5d for 12-14 weeks. Nothing else just test.

    JohnnyB

  11. #11
    jersey juice is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyB
    How about test at 350 a week, 250mg e5d for 12-14 weeks. Nothing else just test.

    JohnnyB
    I agree, I don't use anything BUT test anymore. I definitely believe in low doses. I have done large doses, but I find that it is easier to keep 5-10lbs of good quality muscle then gain 20-25lbs and be disappointed when you lose alot of that during readjustment period. The most I have kept off a heavy cycle was 15lbs but I have kept a good 7lbs off low dose cycles. You know your gonna do more cycles so why try to sprint for 5 miles and wear yourself down when you can jog....

  12. #12
    gunner27 is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldenear
    Well I like low dose cycles because I respond extremely well to low doses. However, my approach is different than your's. I like to run low dose cycles for very long periods of time for a couple of reasons: it's healthier, less side issues to deal with, gains will come slow but they will typically be of a higher quality, it's easier to maintain those gains, and the body composition transformation is nothing short of amazing.

    If I have read between the lines of your post correctly, you may be interested in checking out a thread we recently discussed over at musclechemistry.com.

    Here it is:
    http://board1.mantisforums.com/uploa...eferrerid=3339

    Check it out and let's discuss this further if you're so inclined. If I have mistaken your intentions, then I apologize for wasting your time. (It is a good read, though, lol.)
    It's an interesting thread, and definitely not a waste of my time. I have to admit that I'm not completely comfortable with the idea of running a cycle for an extremely long period of time, but am open to the idea of lengthening this one. Something to think about.

  13. #13
    gunner27 is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyB
    How about test at 350 a week, 250mg e5d for 12-14 weeks. Nothing else just test.

    JohnnyB
    Definitely something I'll think about. I have to admit that I'm partial to including deca in my cycle because I enjoyed the results last time--no bad sides, lubrication of my joints (particularly my shoulders), and an overall mellow feeling, probably from the low androgenity of it.

  14. #14
    JohnnyB's Avatar
    JohnnyB is offline AR-Hall of Famer / Retired
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    Add 200-300 of deca to that test

    JohnnyB

  15. #15
    djsir007's Avatar
    djsir007 is offline Associate Member
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    I highly recommend low doses and I like your doses, but I would go with MUDMANs structure. Just keep the doses like you started.

  16. #16
    custom fit is offline Member
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    I'm going to be redundant about my statement (quoting this like 20 times), but my next cycle is going to be 18 weeks long. T-400 300mg weeks 1-16, EQ 300mg weeks 1-15, and Winn for the last 6 weeks.

    If your going low dosages, go with something in the 14-18 range. my last cycle i gained almost everything in weeks 8-12, ans you may shorten then best part when your ending the cycle at week 10 or so.

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