Doctors and e2

[devildog1967]

How many of you find that there doctor dismisses high E2 and dont prescribe a AI ? Or is it just me..lol

[steroid.com 1]

Devildog - Unless they are trained by the right TRT specialists most won't get it.

That's why finding the right Doc is 90% of the cure.

BTW, how are you these days?

E2 levels?

How ya feeling?

Been thinking of you...

[devildog1967]

Not sure what my E2 levels are as im waiting for the endo to at least see me..lol
since i started doing 75mg every 4 days with AI .5 the day after my shot iv been doing well and feeling great... now fingers crossed that i have found my sweet spot..lol

thanks for asking GD..

[sirupate]

I asked my endo not too long ago about AI's and HCG . He dismissed both concepts...either as risky, or would not be covered by my insurance. He doesn't bother to test for E2, as he refuses to treat for it. So yes, I am in that boat currently. I would guess that the percentage of doctors...even specialists, who get how to properly treat us is disturbingly small.

[flatscat]

I asked my endo not too long ago about AI's and HCG. He dismissed both concepts...either as risky, or would not be covered by my insurance. He doesn't bother to test for E2, as he refuses to treat for it. So yes, I am in that boat currently. I would guess that the percentage of doctors...even specialists, who get how to properly treat us is disturbingly small.

this always cracks me up - geeze....

maybe you should ask him how good his malpractice insurance is when you end up with gyno.....

[lvs]

My Endo does not support HCG , but is concerned about E2 and will prescribe an AI, however she has been reluctant to run the sensitive E2 test because she says it is very expensive... go figure...

[SEOINAGE]

how expensive is very expensive, my blood test before last I tried to get the doctor to do the E2 test but he didn't include it, and my blood work was still 700 dollars. And my last visit with the endo didn't have the e2 test either. Wouldn't they seriously want to look at this before prescribing TRT? Especially if the person has already developed gyno?

[lvs]

I wish I knew how expensive. She just tests for estrogen total serum. I think i am going to insist on the sensitive assay.

[Mario L]

http://www.privatemdlabs.com/
Sensitive test for $68. Not to bad really.

[steroid.com 1]

God how I hate these threads; Docs who don't test for or treat elevated levels of E2. Don't understand the mechanisms of HPTA shutdown and not back filling pathways and staving off testicular atrophy with hCG .

Mistreatment of men only hurting them and Flasts is correct; ask about their malpractice insurance when you get hurt and need repair...not kidding. They swore and oath not to hurt...and they are.

[sirupate]

this always cracks me up - geeze....

maybe you should ask him how good his malpractice insurance is when you end up with gyno.....

I know... Gyno hasn't been a problem for me so far. Maybe the dose is too low to have that effect (8 pumps of the 1% gel/day), or I just react differently than some others do. He does make sure I have enough test on hand...that part is good. AI is available UGL and HCG from foreign sources. So that is my dilemma. Go "doctor shopping" at random, or drive up to see Crisler for better treatment (10 hour round trip).

[lvs]

Not bad at all... I don't understand these docs...I have been to two endos so far, using the lesser of two evils I guess, don't like doc shopping because it takes so much time and it's like a box of chocolates you don't know what you are going to get...

http://www.privatemdlabs.com/
Sensitive test for $68. Not to bad really.

[steroid.com 1]

I know... Gyno hasn't been a problem for me so far. Maybe the dose is too low to have that effect (8 pumps of the 1% gel/day), or I just react differently than some others do. He does make sure I have enough test on hand...that part is good. AI is available UGL and HCG from foreign sources. So that is my dilemma. Go "doctor shopping" at random, or drive up to see Crisler for better treatment (10 hour round trip).

My vote: Dr. John.

Your health is worth far more than 10 hours in a car and you will be much much better for it sirupate.

[bass]

Not bad at all... I don't understand these docs...I have been to two endos so far, using the lesser of two evils I guess, don't like doc shopping because it takes so much time and it's like a box of chocolates you don't know what you are going to get...

you also get a 15% coupon code from them!

for me, i go through a clinic so they subscribe test, AI, hCG and tons of bullshiet stuff!

[steroid.com 1]

you also get a 15% coupon code from them!

for me, i go through a clinic so they subscribe test, AI, hCG and tons of bullshiet stuff!

Most TRT/AA clinics "get it" but the patient needs to see through the "other stuff" they want to sell.

Only need Test, hCG and AI where indicated.

[Logonzo]

Well understanding how everything works should he given for these docs. Treating it is another story. My doctor doesn't want to prescribe an AI for the simple fact that, the endo-society's guidelines do not consist of treatment outlines with them.

[steroid.com 1]

Well understanding how everything works should he given for these docs. Treating it is another story. My doctor doesn't want to prescribe an AI for the simple fact that, the endo-society's guidelines do not consist of treatment outlines with them.

That's usually the case and why men are not put on correct protocols. For starters, for most they are not trained in TRT protocols nor how to monitor levels. It's not their fault; they're just not trained. This is where men need to be armed with all the information they can get their hands on to understand TRT therapies, impact on the endocrin system and the health of men.

If your Doctor does not understand the processes of aromatization and increases in E2 levels and how an AI used off label can manage these levels in men then it's the mans responsibility to teach his Doctor the best he can before finding the right care.

Ask the right questions without being condescending:

Do they understand about HPTA shutdown and it's affects on male hormone pathways?
Controlling aromatase enzymes to control E2?
hCG to back-fill pathways and prevent testicular atrophy?
The need for Pregnenolone and DHEA?
The need to balance all other hormones on a protocol...?

If you can have these discussions with your Doctor and provide him with copies of TRT protocols administered by some of the top physicians in the field that can teach him/her new methodologies...and your Doc has an open mind...you just may get him/her to convert.

The only other options for men are to seek out physicians who understand correct TRT protocols and become their patient.

It's one or the other if one is seeking proper and correct care IMO.

[kelkel]

My Endo does not support HCG, but is concerned about E2 and will prescribe an AI, however she has been reluctant to run the sensitive E2 test because she says it is very expensive... go figure...

SHE, doesn't have testicals. Nuff said.

[lvs]

Lmfao! Oh just to add the 2nd endo I went to, that did have testicals, wondered why I would be asking about HCG and didn't understand why I would be concerned with testicular atrophy.... wtf?

she, doesn't have testicals. Nuff said.

[boxingfan30]

I was JUST at my Endo and he looked at my test levels and said they were "normal". I asked him about E2 test.. he said "no we don't need it" I asked why.. he asked "are you growing boobs?" I was rather irritated as yet again I have had 2 or 3 blood tests and none of them have included this test.

How important is it? I am guessing it's part of the hormone balancing between test and E2?

[devildog1967]

If your E2 is too high or too low it has the same affects of low T . And its funny when woman get tested for HRT they check both E and T ..

[MPhoenix]

I have the same issue. My doc looked at me sideways when I asked about E2. Interesting you say it's the same as having low T because he's happy with my blood levels but I keep telling him the symptoms that started this whole process are only marginally better. Sad part is it would all be covered if he prescribed it.

[steroid.com 1]

I have the same issue. My doc looked at me sideways when I asked about E2. Interesting you say it's the same as having low T because he's happy with my blood levels but I keep telling him the symptoms that started this whole process are only marginally better. Sad part is it would all be covered if he prescribed it.

You need to educate him...there's no other way.

Email him Dr. Crisler's paper on succesful TRT protocols. Dr. John wrote it for just this reason.

[BigIce]

I spoke to my doctor about Arimidex and he said "pff thats just for cancer patients" so no its not just you

[BigBadWolf]

I spoke to my doctor about Arimidex and he said "pff thats just for cancer patients" so no its not just you

You can get them online if you have to.

[Logonzo]

That's usually the case and why men are not put on correct protocols. For starters, for most they are not trained in TRT protocols nor how to monitor levels. It's not their fault; they're just not trained. This is where men need to be armed with all the information they can get their hands on to understand TRT therapies, impact on the endocrin system and the health of men.

If your Doctor does not understand the processes of aromatization and increases in E2 levels and how an AI used off label can manage these levels in men then it's the mans responsibility to teach his Doctor the best he can before finding the right care.

Ask the right questions without being condescending:

Do they understand about HPTA shutdown and it's affects on male hormone pathways?
Controlling aromatase enzymes to control E2?
hCG to back-fill pathways and prevent testicular atrophy?
The need for Pregnenolone and DHEA?
The need to balance all other hormones on a protocol...?

If you can have these discussions with your Doctor and provide him with copies of TRT protocols administered by some of the top physicians in the field that can teach him/her new methodologies...and your Doc has an open mind...you just may get him/her to convert.

The only other options for men are to seek out physicians who understand correct TRT protocols and become their patient.

It's one or the other if one is seeking proper and correct care IMO.

Very well said; ATM I am still searching for literature from any endo or endo society with information using a AI. Dr. Chrisler is a DO, no disrespect at all, my endo will not consider it all the same. I am going to do what you said though, bring a shit ton of lit in there, hopefully he will respond with a positive approach. Thanks

[boxingfan30]

If a person has decent test levels, but still has issues losing fat in the chest, ab and lower back area is this a possible E2 issue?

[steroid.com 1]

Very well said; ATM I am still searching for literature from any endo or endo society with information using a AI. Dr. Chrisler is a DO, no disrespect at all, my endo will not consider it all the same. I am going to do what you said though, bring a shit ton of lit in there, hopefully he will respond with a positive approach. Thanks

Many of the top Physicians practicing male restorative medicine are not Endo's or Uro's. Endo's are not being taught this is med school and why there is such ignorance. Look at the roster of Doc's in A4M and you will see all kinds of different medical backgrounds.

[Drmagic]

Had to reply to this thread, I've found that most Endos are worthless. There is so much disparity in what doctors are comfortable with and generally we are light years behind other parts of the world when it comes to anti-aging medicine. That is changing but I am amazed how many of my patients come back from their specialists and PCPs who tell them I am a quack for doing what I do. I treat a lot of women as well and the OB/GYNs are the worst. Most think HCG is only for fertility treatment and that anastrozole is only for breast cancer treatment. It does however keep me in business...Keep looking, you'll find the right doc eventually, just don't let them rape you on charges for labs, My cash contract for a full lab panel is $250 and that is what I charge the patient (sometimes it's cheaper to pay cash even if you have insurance but many of my patients only pay a copay.

[bass]

Had to reply to this thread, I've found that most Endos are worthless. There is so much disparity in what doctors are comfortable with and generally we are light years behind other parts of the world when it comes to anti-aging medicine. That is changing but I am amazed how many of my patients come back from their specialists and PCPs who tell them I am a quack for doing what I do. I treat a lot of women as well and the OB/GYNs are the worst. Most think HCG is only for fertility treatment and that anastrozole is only for breast cancer treatment. It does however keep me in business...Keep looking, you'll find the right doc eventually, just don't let them rape you on charges for labs, My cash contract for a full lab panel is $250 and that is what I charge the patient (sometimes it's cheaper to pay cash even if you have insurance but many of my patients only pay a copay.

who is more advanced than us? i thought the best anti aging doctors are here in the US! $250 is a killer deal, what does that include?

[devildog1967]

The uk are advanced...lmfo

[Drmagic]

My point of the "light years," was more what is standard of care, stem cells for instance in parts of Europe - they are extracting stem cells and culturing them to grow tissue specific products for patients, not legal in the US, yet. There are great anti-aging docs around (and some idiots too who are only in it for the money) but is seems to be few and far between. I have patients from all over the country (and some other countries as well) because patients cannot find anyone who is willing to treat them. The above post is right about docs without testicals, even in A4Ms fellowship program, the ones who are doing the teaching are preaching that "injections are not physiologic," and that creams are the best way to go. Like anything we do is close to being "physiologic." I've always thought it is because they have never felt what it is like to have a test level in the upper end of normal. The lab deal is: lipids, CBC, CMP, CRP, test panel, estadiol, IGF-1, DHEA-s, thyroid panel, vitamin D, ferritin, LH and B12 - I think that is everything.
"

[lvs]

The Endocrine Society must preach that about injections because we have tried Axiron, Testim and now Androgel 1.62% for 4 weeks, and came back with TT 179 (250-1100) and FT 34.3 (35-155). The only thing she did is move to 4-pumps instead of 2. It is clear especially with Androgel my body is not absorbing the test. Frustrating to say the least and expensive.

My point of the "light years," was more what is standard of care, stem cells for instance in parts of Europe - they are extracting stem cells and culturing them to grow tissue specific products for patients, not legal in the US, yet. There are great anti-aging docs around (and some idiots too who are only in it for the money) but is seems to be few and far between. I have patients from all over the country (and some other countries as well) because patients cannot find anyone who is willing to treat them. The above post is right about docs without testicals, even in A4Ms fellowship program, the ones who are doing the teaching are preaching that "injections are not physiologic," and that creams are the best way to go. Like anything we do is close to being "physiologic." I've always thought it is because they have never felt what it is like to have a test level in the upper end of normal. The lab deal is: lipids, CBC, CMP, CRP, test panel, estadiol, IGF-1, DHEA-s, thyroid panel, vitamin D, ferritin, LH and B12 - I think that is everything.
"

[kelkel]

Question: does anyone know the proper LabCorp test code for their E2 Sensitive Assay. Doc? I know they've screwed mine up as the tech's aren't used to it and put it down wrong. Getting more done soon and would like to walk in with the proper code instead of watching them scramble and guess, again. Not trying to hijack but I'm sure I'm not the only one who's had problems with this....

[Drmagic]

will have to look it up on Monday, is that the exact name, I usually just monitor estradiol levels, the testing is pretty accurate now, people get caught up with the ultra sensitive but I'm not sure it is that much better from a clinical standpoint

[kelkel]

That's part of my problem. Not sure exactly what I should call it that's why I would love to know the proper code # for now and the future to be consistent and get in range. Had two tests so far, first one came back on report as:

Estrogen Metabolism Assessment:
2-Hydroxyesterone <20 (no range given)
16 alpha-Hydroxyesterone 423 (no range given)
2/16 alpha-Hydroxyesterone: Non reportable due to analyte outside the reportable range
**Underlying comment on report: Ref ranges for estrogen metabolites were determined with serum samples from women with a normal 2:16 alpha-hydroxyestrone ratio, who were not using hormone repla***ent therapy. <<friggen lovely! Yes, I looked up that crap but it's not worth explaining.

Repla***ent test titled: Estradiol, Sensitive

Results: <3 Low pg/ml Ref interval 3-70
this one actually broke down male/female by age groups with males >15yrs range 3-70. So, I'm leaning toward this one being possibly correct but not really sure. Therefore, my dilemma and hoping for a code to nail it.

Thanks!

[FONZY007]

How many of you find that there doctor dismisses high E2 and dont prescribe a AI ? Or is it just me..lol

just seen my endo doctor and asked him about e2 levels, my acne, and bloat he just said go from 100mg a week to 100mg every 2 weeks? ugh no help might changed doctors!!

But he requested me do blood work in 4 1/2 months and see him in 5 months, i have the blood work paper, but doesnt say anywhere about e2, what would it be called?

[bass]

just seen my endo doctor and asked him about e2 levels, my acne, and bloat he just said go from 100mg a week to 100mg every 2 weeks? ugh no help might changed doctors!!

But he requested me do blood work in 4 1/2 months and see him in 5 months, i have the blood work paper, but doesnt say anywhere about e2, what would it be called?

thats absolutely crazy! find a new doc bro. find out of you live near dr. magic

[Drmagic]

just seen my endo doctor and asked him about e2 levels, my acne, and bloat he just said go from 100mg a week to 100mg every 2 weeks? ugh no help might changed doctors!!

But he requested me do blood work in 4 1/2 months and see him in 5 months, i have the blood work paper, but doesnt say anywhere about e2, what would it be called?

should just be called estradiol, that is the most common test done.

[Mario L]

labcorp code for estradiol,sensitive is 140244