first trt appointment

[Flier]

Hehe...predictions of your test level on the 18´th is all over the place.
I say you will be in the gutter, just like you wanted.
Ofcourse your LH will be 0, indicating either Hypothalamus or Pituitary failure. Which again should have given you a range of other symptoms, with the appearance of an Aids patient on his last days.
However you look like a monster, so you are either a genetic freak or from outer space...
So don´t insult him by coming up with any BS.
I´m sure he get juicers in there trying to BS him on a weekly basis.

I like your original plan, quit 18 days before, so your BW will justify TRT(Give him a medical/clinical reason to put you on TRT, not just because of a sad story), then tell him exactly what has led up to you sitting in his office.

[flatscat]

^^^^ agree but the more days you can add to 18 the better - you can be honest AND low at the same time bro.

[dec11]

From what I've found, It's all luck of the draw. Every doctor can be drastically different. Also, insurance matters. If you have insurance you will need to have a test that shows low T for them to cover it. Some docs require you to get blood work from them, some dont care. I've seen doctors refuse to treat people who explained that they were low T from running cycles, or, refused anything but the gell. I'm not sure that's even legal, but Ive seen it. Myself? I just walked into the doctors office with lab work I already had, and he prescribed me the test. Gave me 6 months work and said come back when I need more. I went back, and he bumped my dose to 300mgs/week without even seeing new bloodwork. If your doctor really knows his shit, he probably wont stone wall you, but he may try dropping your dose a bit. If he's decent, he'll understand that your levels are permanently screwed anyway.

not for me, im in the UK health care system, scripts and treatment are free and Nebido is the in thing for trt esp with the doc im seeing.

i agree with you in the fact that if any of these docs know their stuff, he''ll know im in shit street after being on for 2yrs. i might even say its 3yrs.

[zaggahamma]

^^^^ agree but the more days you can add to 18 the better - you can be honest AND low at the same time bro.

good point but its beyond me why the importance of trying to say WHY your levels might be where they are when you yourself know..its not like you/we need a diagnosis

[JD250]

^^^^^^ x2

[dec11]

good point but its beyond me why the importance of trying to say WHY your levels might be where they are when you yourself know..its not like you/we need a diagnosis

i dont follow, you saying that docs should just go on our word on this?

[zaggahamma]

i dont follow, you saying that docs should just go on our word on this?

the cards on the table theory...dont see the need

the doctor(s) NEVER asked me WHY my test was low they just treated the fact that it was...luckily

[dec11]

the cards on the table theory...dont see the need

the doctor(s) NEVER asked me WHY my test was low they just treated the fact that it was...luckily

you still reckon im better going in 'clean' from my own self trt and bloods showing low/no test? i thought if he heard the reasons why im low he would say 'well yes, thts the problem you've blown your natural system and now you need synthetic'.

i'd hate if i end up on a rigmarole of him trying to restart my natty system when i know fine well im completely up the creek.

ah bugger it, i know theres no answer but to wait and see what the guy says. i just hope i get it, so its all legit if i ever decided to emigrate out of penniless old Ireland.

[TBrah]

thanks for making this thread dec im pretty much in the same boat as you and watch to switch over to prescription for the same reasons im not sure if i should go in for bloodwork 20 something days after my last pin or be upfront with him i dont want to have my levels crash though my lifting numbers will go to shit

[dec11]

thanks for making this thread dec im pretty much in the same boat as you and watch to switch over to prescription for the same reasons im not sure if i should go in for bloodwork 20 something days after my last pin or be upfront with him

what? you only turned 18 this year!

[TBrah]

what? you only turned 18 this year!

i started juicing 1 month after i joined the gym ~17 i want to be a strongman competitor not just as a hobby man but for real. My test levels were like 390 before i ran anything but the doctor said they were within normal range but I think ideally they should have been 800's. I've only done 2 or 3 cycles but I cruised on 250mgs a week for a long time just to keep myself from crashing

[dec11]

i started juicing 1 month after i joined the gym ~17 i want to be a strongman competitor not just as a hobby man but for real. My test levels were like 390 before i ran anything but the doctor said they were within normal range but I think ideally they should have been 800's. I've only done 2 or 3 cycles but I cruised on 250mgs a week for a long time just to keep myself from crashing

big big mistakes, id say you've no hope of trt at 18. your big concern is your weights lowering? you've bigger things to worry about

[RaginCajun]

yeah dec11, i do not know what to say about this one. he needs a psychiatrist and an endo!

[Standby]

boy oh boy

[TBrah]

big big mistakes, id say you've no hope of trt at 18. your big concern is your weights lowering? you've bigger things to worry about

ill see what happens if i dont get it ill work around it i was having the same dilema as you so i came in here to see what you were doing

[Flier]

ill see what happens if i dont get it ill work around it i was having the same dilema as you so i came in here to see what you were doing

TBrah, man you do not have the same dilemma as Dec, you´re in a whole different category!
First of all why was your test 390 at the age of 17? What was the conclusion from endos/docs?
What course of action did they suggest? What made you make the decision to start self medicating at the age of 17?
Get off, start PCT!
Make a thread

[SlimmerMe]

Good luck Dec however you decide to go about this....

[dec11]

Good luck Dec however you decide to go about this....

cheers slim

[ecdysone]

No offense intended, but you don't seem like the kind of guy who is going to be happy on Nebido.

If your Dr. follows normal dosing guidelines, it will work out to no more than 100mg test-undeca/week which is something like 90 mg test-cyp equivalents.

And, by the end of the 3 months or so, your test levels are going to be awfully low.

[Brohim]

that is not true ec. Obviously you don't know anything about Nebidio. There are two guy's on this forum who posted bloodwork. AT the end of 12 weeks their test values were still in the upper level. It is very slow releasing. One guy never dropped below 600. And if you know anything about trt most guys feel the best at mid to upper level's not at the very top.

Nebidio seems to act differently than cyp. I have only heard good things. Have you taken it yourself? Or you just SWAGGIN it on your last sentence. I would thinkt he latter.

[Brohim]

DEC it works different here in the US. So we can't say for sure. But honesty is always the best policy. Tell him your situation and if he can help you out. Now if you were in the US different story. We set our healthcare system up here where it's not based on care but $$. So insurance companies run things and force the docs to suck the insurance companies pee pees. And they have lawyers swarming around too so they are scared to prescribe things like test unless they are have a trt speciality, which seems like your physcian has. So you have a good shot. (No pun intended)

[zaggahamma]

honesty isnt ALWAYS the BEST policy but its ALWAYS the most honest...what gets you what you want/need is the BEST policy
we've seen it all too many times

[ecdysone]

Obviously you don't know anything about Nebidio..

Obviously you know less.

Maybe look around, read some of the studies - anecdotal reports are notoriously inaccurate.

Might have occurred to you if the levels were in the "upper end" at 12 weeks, the suggested time between doses would have adjusted by the manufacturer to have been much greater.

[zaggahamma]

i prefer the weekly control than what nebido offers myself...one injection a week is super convenient to me...and has worked so well for me that it would be hard to convince me on nebido

[Flier]

For what it´s worth, Nebido does everything it claims, and is the superior TRT compound out there.
And yes, 12 weeks, it gives u a stable high level for the duration.

[Brohim]

yep all the studies ive read along w/ guys who are on the protocol report the same thing. Some studies are 9 years long so I wouldn't call that anecdotal. EC what makes you an expert? Please back up your claim that his test would be "awefully low" at the end of 12 weeks. All of the other studies and actual people on the protocol report otherwise with blood test to back it up.

[ecdysone]

"Expert"...hardly. Actually, less than hardly!

I could probably pull up any number of studies like this one:
http://www.j***.endojournals.org/con.../5429.full.pdf [where the *** is The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism]
that shows the 12 week level to be in the mid 400's.


Point was, a man like Dec, who has keen appreciation for nice, elevated test levels might have an issue when 3 month troughs fall to abnormally low levels for his age (just guessing he's not a older guy).

Your point that guys would be in the "upper level" at the 12 weeks is not going to be supported by any one except a few internet forum fellows. It's misleading at best.

Manufacturers who sell this stuff are no different the ones who sell test-cyp: they realize at the end of the recommended dosing protocol the levels are going to suck.

Might also ask yourself why the FDA never approved the stuff and why it will probably never get approved here.

One clue: shooting 4 cc of anything in your ass is going to give elevated test levels for months to come with few other benefits.

[Flier]

Who cares about these studies.
Maybe it will work for Dec maybe not. Maybe it depletes faster in some than others.
Why not just try and find out.
It worked for me.
Tried 10 weeks, cause I was wary, but had to back off till 12.
I would have to look up the BW, but brought me up to low 20´s on a (8-35)
Good shit!

[JD250]

Who cares about these studies.

Most everyone in this forum....emperical evidence requires BOTH experience and observation......that's what these threads do, help piece together enough of both to provide an objective view of the facts.

I can appreciate the fact that you think it's "good shit" but a posting of your complete blood panel taken at different times through the cycle would go much further towards being useful information than saying it's "good shit"

[Brohim]

I think what he meant was who cares about 1 study someone posted (can't even click on the link) when he is on the protocol, it works great for him (it's the shit) and he has blood work to prove it.

There are other member's here with great reviews of Nebidio w/ posted blood work of 900 total test and test around 600 the day before the next shot.

[ecdysone]

Most everyone in this forum....

lol...isn't what this is all about, thanks for your input!

I think we are all here [the TRT guys] to help each other out.

I'm not going to post anything more...

good night bros - Merry Christmas [shopping)!!

[Flier]

Hmmm......I mean, show me any study you want. Doesen´t change the fact that Nebido worked as claimed for me, like for millions of others.
What are theses studies anyway? Studies to disprove the effects of Nebido or something? Done by who? A competitor?
Like during the election, the Democrats spending millions on ads trying to convince us that Republicans suck....hehe
"Empirical evidence"....never heard of it so I had to look it up. And piece together facts....etc. Ofcourse you should, I agree, but dude we´re talking about Nebido here, a pharmaceutical compound, used successfully by millions, not an unknown research chem. we know little about, so why make this one so hard, just try it and see. They claim Nebido has a half life of 90 days with injection to be admin. every 10-14 weeks which I found to be correct.
This shit worked for me, add that to your empirical evidence.
If you guys really question the legitimacy of Nebido, then make a thread and have guys share their experiences and post their BW...etc.

[Flier]

"Expert"...hardly. Actually, less than hardly!

I could probably pull up any number of studies like this one:
http://www.j***.endojournals.org/con.../5429.full.pdf [where the *** is The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism]
that shows the 12 week level to be in the mid 400's.


Point was, a man like Dec, who has keen appreciation for nice, elevated test levels might have an issue when 3 month troughs fall to abnormally low levels for his age (just guessing he's not a older guy).
A guy at my gym shoots Nebido with a lot shorter than recommended intervals. So I guess one can adjust to suit one´s needs.

Your point that guys would be in the "upper level" at the 12 weeks is not going to be supported by any one except a few internet forum fellows. It's misleading at best.

Manufacturers who sell this stuff are no different the ones who sell test-cyp: they realize at the end of the recommended dosing protocol the levels are going to suck.

Might also ask yourself why the FDA never approved the stuff and why it will probably never get approved here.
I saw why, but can´t remember, something stupid non-essential. Like with administration of the compound, not the effect or sides of it.
The US FDA is more liberal than here, so if it is approved here, I wouldn´t worry.

One clue: shooting 4 cc of anything in your ass is going to give elevated test levels for months to come with few other benefits.

You have to ask DSM about that one.