Tribulus Tribosten

**fballhoss51** · 08-14-2005, 07:41 PM

i plan on using this throughout my pct and maybe a little longer, i alwasy hear people running tribulus products at 1g-5g a day, and i asked if 3g a day would be fine with this and i never got an answer i understood, most people said "well u cant just say 1g cuz theyre all different"

http://www.thermolife.com/Products-Tribosten.html

thats tha product i will be using, its 250mg tribulus terrestris extract and 5mg Bioperine per pill

how many pills, or what dosage should i run this at per day to see a positive effect?

**TheMudMan** · 08-14-2005, 08:07 PM

Originally Posted by fballhoss51

i plan on using this throughout my pct and maybe a little longer, i alwasy hear people running tribulus products at 1g-5g a day, and i asked if 3g a day would be fine with this and i never got an answer i understood, most people said "well u cant just say 1g cuz theyre all different"

http://www.thermolife.com/Products-Tribosten.html

thats tha product i will be using, its 250mg tribulus terrestris extract and 5mg Bioperine per pill

how many pills, or what dosage should i run this at per day to see a positive effect?

I have never used that brand but every 4 of those pills = 1g............ You could start out lower say 1.5 to 2g ED and see how you fell....

**fballhoss51** · 08-14-2005, 09:00 PM

how long do u suggest for using this for? or u recommend using tribulus all tha time?

**Drummerboy** · 08-14-2005, 09:03 PM

bump. i would like to know how this stuff works and if it is better than clomid

**fballhoss51** · 08-14-2005, 09:06 PM

its not better than clomid but i dont use clomid in pct, only nolva, so i just thot id add a natural test booster in

**Drummerboy** · 08-14-2005, 09:06 PM

ahhh.... ok

**fballhoss51** · 08-14-2005, 09:07 PM

lol damn u replied quick, but even if it is no one on this board will tell u its better than clomid, everyone here uses clomid, i just have researched and really dont see tha point in seeing tha side effects it has when i dont need it

**Drummerboy** · 08-14-2005, 09:24 PM

ya, moody like a biatch on clomid, but nolva is up for arguement on its ability to bring you back to baseline,

**FlyByU** · 08-15-2005, 04:05 AM

Originally Posted by Drummerboy

ya, moody like a biatch on clomid, but nolva is up for arguement on its ability to bring you back to baseline,

Studies have shown that tribulus raises estrogen to a greater extent than testosterone , so it has no use for pct.

**armwrestler22** · 08-15-2005, 04:49 AM

i've used tribosten, not for pct but just by itself to try it out. i personally think its good stuff. i had 3 boxes and did 4 pills a day 2x2times a day for 6 weeks and got around 3 pounds heavier and had some decent strength gains. they taste like some ciggarette butts though. the delivery system most tribulus supplements use is called protodiascin and from what i've read, most trib supps have about 10-20% protodiascin and tribosten has 29.6% and is supposedly helping for better absorbtion. i was busting some thick nuts, peter north style on that sheeit, and wanted to bang 24/7, so i'm sure it will help get ur boys get ready for battle. i've never taken any other trip supps to compare it to and only ran tribosten that one time. i would say go for for it bro. -happy cycling-

**Drummerboy** · 08-15-2005, 12:16 PM

Originally Posted by FlyByU

Studies have shown that tribulus raises estrogen to a greater extent than testosterone, so it has no use for pct.

now that is an iteresting factoid... post the study if you can please

**doghunter** · 08-15-2005, 02:15 PM

yeah i have never heard anything like that with th e factor that flybyu posted i would like to see what i can find about that or if u can post something on it

**Alpha-Male** · 08-15-2005, 02:24 PM

the best study i've ever seen on trib. showed a 30% increase in serum T levels, which to me, cuz of the estrogen effects which are real, makes this shit a complete waste of money...ive seen better studies on Tongkat Ali, but have never used it personally...IMO, nolva and clomid is cheaper and WAY more effective...

**fballhoss51** · 08-15-2005, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by TheMudMan

Most of these studies are done on elderly men that already have higher estrogen levels because of the lack of testosterone production. So they are seeing alot of the symtoms that are part of having that problem. After the use of tribulus most of the subjects have increased libido and are able to hold errection. Also there were increased test levels that would indicate why they saw the benifits.

I'm not saying the estrogen can't be produced by using the product but too many studies are out there that indicate otherwise. The one that FlyByU read wasn't a study and also it was just what happen to one male.

in response to estrogen production by tribosten

**eGGz** · 08-15-2005, 02:27 PM

I think I'm gonna give Tongkat ali a try this time around instead of trib. As with any of the OTC compounds I've heard mixed reviews. Only one way to find out.

**fballhoss51** · 08-15-2005, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by eGGz

I think I'm gonna give Tongkat ali a try this time around instead of trib. As with any of the OTC compounds I've heard mixed reviews. Only one way to find out.

ill let u kno how trib goes for me

**eGGz** · 08-15-2005, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by fballhoss51

ill let u kno how trib goes for me

cool, likewise I'll post my tongkat review 4U.

**Alpha-Male** · 08-15-2005, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by fballhoss51

in response to estrogen production by tribosten

edited...nevermind, i actually don't care to argue this, waste your money

**Pump A Holic** · 08-15-2005, 02:42 PM

First of all, the study indicating an increase in serum estradiol levels also showed a more substanitial increase in testosterone . This study was conudcted using the original pharmaceutical Tribulus extract, TRIBESTAN(not TRIBOSTEN), made by the company Sopharma, Bulagaria.

Tribex and Tribestan are both STANDARDIZED Tribulus extracts(containing at least 10% PROTODIOCIN). THEY work well! I recover swiftly from all cycles using non-aromatizing steroids with JUST tribex. No side effects either.

i also use Eurycoma Longfolia(Tongkat) which drastically increases FREE Test levels by binding to SHBG...See some studies on this AMAZING herb!

http://www.herbal-powers.com/bodbuilfitre.html

**Alpha-Male** · 08-15-2005, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by Pump A Holic

Tribex and Tribestan are both STANDARDIZED Tribulus extracts(containing at least 10% PROTODIOCIN). [/url]

ahh, very true...

"Protodioscin is a phytochemical agent derived from Tribulus terrestris L plant, which has been clinically proven to improve sexual desire and enhance erection via the conversion of protodioscine to DHEA (De-Hydro-Epi-Androsterone).

Preliminary observations suggest that Tribulus terrestris L grown on different soils does not consistently produce the active component Protodioscin."

unfortunately, every positive study on tribulus has used Tribestan...everything else on the market is a gigantic crap shoot, and again, is a total waste of time and money.

**Pump A Holic** · 08-15-2005, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by Alpha-Male

ahh, very true...

"Protodioscin is a phytochemical agent derived from Tribulus terrestris L plant, which has been clinically proven to improve sexual desire and enhance erection via the conversion of protodioscine to DHEA (De-Hydro-Epi-Androsterone).

Preliminary observations suggest that Tribulus terrestris L grown on different soils does not consistently produce the active component Protodioscin."

unfortunately, every positive study on tribulus has used Tribestan...everything else on the market is a gigantic crap shoot, and again, is a total waste of time and money.

Yep, it has to be BULGARIAN.

Tribestan and Tribex are Bulgarian.

**FlyByU** · 08-15-2005, 05:50 PM

I don't have the study to post right now. I'll have to search for it. It wasn't done on elderly men and it wasn't just a study of one person. It found that standardized tribulus extract increased LH by 72% and testosterone by 41%, but estradiol by 80%! Tongkat ali increases estradiol even more so when you stop taking it because it the genuine tongkat ali has a more powerful effect on testosterone than tribulus. There is an inextricable negative feedback loop with all supplements and drugs that increase testosterone production. You cannot increase testosterone without also increasing estrogen. During pct, you want to limit estrogen as much as you can, so these supplements are not an option.

**Slic4788** · 08-15-2005, 06:13 PM

Yeah there have been people who got gyno with Trib and tongkat alone...

**diezell** · 08-15-2005, 06:36 PM

ive used the tribosten tribulus and it works well the only better tribulus that i have found is asts trioxalon i beleive it has 1 gram of tribulus per serving and its not that much more or cheaper then tribosten

**n4529359** · 08-15-2005, 06:54 PM

tribulus is shown to increase test levels by around 40% in subjects that had
already low serum test levels. Its showed little increase in subjects that had serum test levels already close to there genetic max. Tribulus also shows to widen the testosterone , estrogen ratio , by a greater increease in test.

thats what i've read

**n4529359** · 08-15-2005, 07:25 PM

also i ppl are worried about eostrogen levels with trib take clomid at the same time as the estr recep is already blockedby the clomid

**hatchblack** · 08-17-2005, 12:44 AM

Is the optimum tribulus any good or do you guys think it is junk...?

**Pump A Holic** · 08-17-2005, 01:31 AM

optimum tribulus = garbage

TRIBEX or TRIBESTAN...THATS IT!

NO ALTERNATIVES!

**gottis** · 08-17-2005, 03:05 AM

try avena sativa 1000 g 2 a day ,, for recovery best stuff i had,, i dont undertand how evey one uses clomid ,,i try that once trying to recover and it made me worst i had no energy and no sex drive hate clomid..

**Pump A Holic** · 08-17-2005, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by gottis

try avena sativa 1000 g 2 a day ,, for recovery best stuff i had,, i dont undertand how evey one uses clomid ,,i try that once trying to recover and it made me worst i had no energy and no sex drive hate clomid..

Right ON man! Avena Sativa is another active ingredient in the TRIBEX formulation. GREAT SHIT!

**xxSmartyPantsxx** · 08-17-2005, 01:58 PM

again:

The important thing is to get enough of the steroidal saponins at a dose of 500 - 2000 mg/day. So, just saying 3 grams per day doesn't really tell the story because you must include the quality of the product as well. The % of protodioscin is the quality indicator (the higher the better).

Here's a good read on the topic:

1 | Tribulus terrestris This herb is cultivated in many parts of the world--including the United States, Mexico and Asia--and it is used for treating sexual impotency, as well as for boosting muscle growth. Both of those effects stem from its ability to enhance testosterone levels in the body. Current research indicates that the dominant furostanolic saponin--protodioscin--is the active ingredient in Tribulus that affords it its testosterone -boosting effects.

This steroidal saponin appears to stimulate the release of luteinizing hormone (LH) from the pituitary gland. LH then travels via the bloodstream to the testicles, where it stimulates testosterone production. Protodioscin is also believed to increase dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) production by the adrenal glands. This steroid precursor becomes testosterone.

DOSE | Try 500-2,000 milligrams (mg), taken in two or three separate doses. On workout days, take one dose about an hour before you hit the gym. Follow a five-days-on/two-days-off regimen for eight weeks, then take two weeks off before cycling back on. Look for an extract that's standardized to no less than 45% protodioscin.

2 | Fenugreek The fenugreek herb is native to southern Europe, the Mediterranean region and western Asia. It has numerous health benefits, including increased libido, elevated testosterone and increased insulin release. As with Tribulus terrestris, this herb contains a high amount of furostanolic saponins. Therefore, fenugreek extract works in a manner similar to Tribulus--elevating testosterone via increases in the amount of LH and DHEA the body produces. Some bodybuilders report having a better appetite when taking fenugreek extract--a great benefit for hardgainers.

DOSE | Take 500-2,000 mg per day of furostanolic saponins from fenugreek or in combination with other saponin ingredients.

3 | Dioscorea deltoidea This climbing plant grown in Asia is used for numerous purposes--from treating asthma to killing lice. Its high concentration of furostanolic saponins makes it a good supplement for boosting testosterone levels in a manner similar to Tribulus terrestris and fenugreek.

DOSE | The effective dosage of these saponins appears to be 500 to 2,000 mg per day. Newer products are available that combine several types of saponin extracts, such as those from Tribulus terrestris, fenugreek and Dioscorea deltoidea. The benefit is that each may produce a slightly different effect within the body to optimize the amount of testosterone produced. Go for a total of 500-2,000 mg of furostanolic saponins daily--regardless of the sources. Again, follow a five-days-on/two-days-off program for eight weeks, taking two weeks off before using the product again.

Bottom line, if you go for the high end dose, you'd want 2000 mg of the furostanolic saponins/day - no matter what the source is. Check out a product called FUZE.

**Alpha-Male** · 08-17-2005, 04:13 PM

damn fellas, nolvadex has been shown to increase test levels by 150%, and is probably cheaper nowadays through some UG hookup...why the **** would you even wanna mess with this shit??????????? to each his own i suppose...still, this should probably be moved to the supplement forum, eh?

AM

**Pump A Holic** · 08-17-2005, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by Alpha-Male

damn fellas, nolvadex has been shown to increase test levels by 150%, and is probably cheaper nowadays through some UG hookup...why the **** would you even wanna mess with this shit??????????? to each his own i suppose...still, this should probably be moved to the supplement forum, eh?

AM

Why use TRIBEX rather than CLOIMID or NOLVA:

1.) NOT LIVER TOXIC
2.) DOES NOT HAVE OPTHOMOLOGICAL SIDES(VISION IMPARIMENT)
3.) SENSITIZES THE PITUITARY(CLOMID DESENSITIZES--BUT NOLVA SENSITIZES)
4.) CAN BE USED INDEFINITELY
5.) WORKS VERY EFFECTIVELY.
6.) HELPS WITH CHOLESTEROL AND LIVER ENZYMES.
7.) INCREASES ATP
8.) GREATLY ENHANCES LIBIDO
9.) ENHANCES MOOD
10.) IS CHEAPER

**FlyByU** · 08-17-2005, 06:47 PM

I'm not sure that it greatly enhances libido. Three weeks of nolvadex at 20mg ed week 1 and 10mg ed for weeks 2 and 3 would be a better bet after one of your 6 week tbol cycles than 8 weeks of trib and works out a lot cheaper too.

**hatchblack** · 08-17-2005, 10:33 PM

Why is the optimum junk if it is standardized to 40%...?

Doesn't that mean I just need to take a few more....?

**Alpha-Male** · 08-18-2005, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by Pump A Holic

Why use TRIBEX rather than CLOIMID or NOLVA:

1.) NOT LIVER TOXIC
2.) DOES NOT HAVE OPTHOMOLOGICAL SIDES(VISION IMPARIMENT)
3.) SENSITIZES THE PITUITARY(CLOMID DESENSITIZES--BUT NOLVA SENSITIZES)
4.) CAN BE USED INDEFINITELY
5.) WORKS VERY EFFECTIVELY.
6.) HELPS WITH CHOLESTEROL AND LIVER ENZYMES.
7.) INCREASES ATP
8.) GREATLY ENHANCES LIBIDO
9.) ENHANCES MOOD
10.) IS CHEAPER

nolva is not liver toxic; nolva is better than clomid and doesnt have these sides, and not everyone experiences these sides; using tribex indefinitely--why? it doesn't continue to increase your test levels, and after a measly 30-40% increase, you're surely not back to an acceptable level, and using nolva will get you there much faster without a need to continually use it; tribulus is NOT effective, as proven; nolva helps with lipid levels (check profile section); many things increase ATP and are much better at it than this shit; are you saying nolva and/or clomid don't enhance mood? finally, it is NOT cheaper...if you need a sourcecheck, just PM me

bottom line, it's SHIT, especially when there are cheaper, BETTER alternatives out there...the suppression brought on by aas use cannot be effectively remedied by the use of some BS herb, get ****ing real bro.

AM