Is Hrt/trt Worth It??

**testosterona** · 10-27-2005, 10:19 PM

so i was just sitting back reading some horror stories about bad bloodwork results when i thought, why do we fear HRT so badly. what are the pro's and con's of being on replacement test for life? how does it effect you mentally and physically? most of you know my age and my cycling exp, so this is something i might be facing in the future. PINNACLE and others please chime in.

**testosterona** · 10-27-2005, 10:28 PM

get yo hands of my ba bump ba bump bump

**testosterona** · 10-27-2005, 10:51 PM

anyone??

**Defconx3** · 10-27-2005, 10:52 PM

I think this is an interesting and worthwhile question myself.

Bump for an answer.

**chest6** · 10-27-2005, 10:56 PM

Well..exogenous test will halt sperm production..but u can still get a girl pregnant. Depends if you want kids I guess..or if you ever want to return to natural..

**testosterona** · 10-27-2005, 11:18 PM

Originally Posted by chest6

Well..exogenous test will halt sperm production..but u can still get a girl pregnant. Depends if you want kids I guess..or if you ever want to return to natural..

that's a good point....anyone else who is currently on HRT?

**testosterona** · 10-28-2005, 12:16 AM

all the old timers sleepin already??

**chest6** · 10-28-2005, 12:19 AM

Originally Posted by testosterona

all the old timers sleepin already??

pinn's on year round...

**testosterona** · 10-31-2005, 12:17 AM

bump for anyone on trt/hrt

**testosterona** · 11-01-2005, 07:06 PM

damnit, where are all you hrt patients?!?!

**justtrnd40** · 11-01-2005, 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by testosterona

so i was just sitting back reading some horror stories about bad bloodwork results when i thought, why do we fear HRT so badly. what are the pro's and con's of being on replacement test for life? how does it effect you mentally and physically? most of you know my age and my cycling exp, so this is something i might be facing in the future. PINNACLE and others please chime in.

I would like to know also. Being 40 years old and have 2 kids and won't be having anymore is it worth being off cycles for as long as you are on at this age. I am definately not looking forward to going through pct.

**cb25** · 11-01-2005, 09:40 PM

Originally Posted by chest6

Well..exogenous test will halt sperm production..but u can still get a girl pregnant. Depends if you want kids I guess..or if you ever want to return to natural..

most people on legitimate HRT are over 40 and not exactly worried about having any more kids, so this should be a virtual non-issue. again, i said "most" not "all"

i'm curious to hear some of the responses to this too -- although i realize most of the members here are of the "young" crowd.

**JUICING** · 11-01-2005, 10:06 PM

I've done decided if I have a hard time when I come off my current cycle then I will be on HRT forever. I guess I will run a cycle and then when I'm off run a dose of 100 to 200 mg's a week of cypionate or anthate. I'm curious to hear everybody's thoughts as well. I'm 29 and definetely don't want no more kids. Test is cheaper than child support! LOL!

**cb25** · 11-01-2005, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by JUICING

I've done decided if I have a hard time when I come off my current cycle then I will be on HRT forever. I guess I will run a cycle and then when I'm off run a dose of 100 to 200 mg's a week of cypionate or anthate. I'm curious to hear everybody's thoughts as well. I'm 29 and definetely don't want no more kids. Test is cheaper than child support! LOL!

understand this though, brotha.

using test, or being on HRT is NOT, i repeat...NOT a substitute for birth control. MANY people have fathered children while on cycle.

**mranak** · 11-01-2005, 10:12 PM

Originally Posted by testosterona

damnit, where are all you hrt patients?!?!

Many of them stick to an HRT forum rather than an AAS forum.

I'm 27 and I'm on TRT. One of the big misconceptions is that it has to be for life. That just isn't true. I can stop my TRT at any point in time and go back to feeling like shit, no problem.

There is a bit of hassle involved with TRT and it mostly has to do with finding a decent physician that is willing to give you the right regimen (exogenous test+hCG ) and run the proper bloodwork (this includes the most sensitive estradiol assay).

But if you have symptoms of hypogonadism and they are eliminated with proper TRT, then TRT is generally well worth it.

Proper TRT does not make a fertile man unfertile.

**JUICING** · 11-01-2005, 10:42 PM

[QUOTE=cb25]understand this though, brotha.

using test, or being on HRT is NOT, i repeat...NOT a substitute for birth control. MANY people have fathered children while on cycle.[/QU Dammint it a good think my wife did not stop taking birth control

**cb25** · 11-01-2005, 10:45 PM

[QUOTE=JUICING]

Originally Posted by cb25

understand this though, brotha.

using test, or being on HRT is NOT, i repeat...NOT a substitute for birth control. MANY people have fathered children while on cycle.[/QU Dammint it a good think my wife did not stop taking birth control

lol...yea, my girlfriend is looking for ANY excuse to stop taking birth control. i've repeatedly had to explain to her why test alone is NOT adequate birth control.

the studies they've done on Testosterone as birth control were combined with a GnRH agonist (such as Lupron) and that had promising results.

**JUICING** · 11-01-2005, 11:07 PM

You learn something new everyday! If it weren't for you guys I may would have another kid. Thank God for that! MRANAK If you don't mind list your TRT doses. Like how much test do you take when your not on a cycle and how much HCG and how often? I'm with a bogus HRT clinic but I've never meet the doctor I just talk to a sales rep and I can tell by talking to him that I know more than he does. It's just a legal way to sell supplements.

**zircon** · 11-02-2005, 03:02 AM

ok. What could be unhealthy about taking 100mg test E a week for the rest of your life ? How does it afefct you negatively? WHat are the possible dangers of it?

thanks

**mranak** · 11-02-2005, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by JUICING

MRANAK If you don't mind list your TRT doses. Like how much test do you take when your not on a cycle and how much HCG and how often?

Most of the TRT guys need a dose of roughly 100mg (of testosterone cyp or enan) each week, so that is a good starting dosage. However, followup bloodwork is essential for determining the appropriate dosage. Some guys need less than 100mg/week....as low as 50mg/week and some guys need 200mg+/week in order to get to the upper part of the normal range.

hCG is often run at 250-500iu two days/week. A popular option is to inject the hCG the day before and the day of the testosterone injection. This helps to bring up serum testosterone levels when they are lowest and thus maintain more stable serum testosterone levels. Many guys literally feel very positive effects from the hCG....so hCG helps in more ways than simply maintaining fertility and keeping the balls from skrinking.

Originally Posted by JUICING

I'm with a bogus HRT clinic but I've never meet the doctor I just talk to a sales rep and I can tell by talking to him that I know more than he does. It's just a legal way to sell supplements.

Sadly, many men go to these so-called HRT clinics under the impression that they really are getting HRT and not an AAS cycle. In some respects this can be blamed on the medical community as a whole in that many physicians refuse to diagnose and then treat hypogonadism (low testosterone ) in an good and appropriate manner. For example, if:

1) The patient has symptoms of hypogonadism
2) The patient's free testosterone is low-normal
3) The symptoms of hypogonadism disappear after administration of appropriate TRT

Then that patient needs TRT in my opinion.

In particular, endocrinologists have a _tendency_ to be very bad at identifying and treating hypogonadism. To make matters worse, many of them refuse to listen to reason. General physicians actually tend to be better here.

Regadless, prescribing an AAS cycle is not an appropriate solution to hypogonadism. This is common sense. Men are not going to recover from hypogonadism after an AAS cycle....rather, they are going to go back to feeling like shit after the cycle is over. This is very good for business at these so-called HRT clinics, however as it keeps the customers coming back for more.....at ridiculous prices, I might add.

**mranak** · 11-02-2005, 10:58 AM

Originally Posted by zircon

ok. What could be unhealthy about taking 100mg test E a week for the rest of your life ? How does it afefct you negatively? WHat are the possible dangers of it?

thanks

Did somebody say there is anything unhealthy with taking 100mg of testosterone cypionate or enanthate for the rest of your life?

Proper bloodwork is essential for appropriate TRT and total testosterone should be maintained within the normal range.

The most common problem that I can think of is hemoglobin which tends to rise with TRT. As long as it is kept under 18.0, this isn't an issue and it can often be maintained at reasonable levels by donating blood on a regular basis.

**smiler** · 11-02-2005, 11:07 AM

I'm on test 4 ever. cool doc. (small town family doc) my test was way low. started at 200 mg ew (test cyp) I bitched it wasn't helping, went to 400 mgew. finally got him to prescibe 600 mg ew. thats right, no typo. been about a yr and a half. I feel great. he also gave me a-dex .5mg ed. might not always run 600. may go to 300 for a couple months

**mranak** · 11-02-2005, 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by smiler

I'm on test 4 ever. cool doc. (small town family doc) my test was way low. started at 200 mg ew (test cyp) I bitched it wasn't helping, went to 400 mgew. finally got him to prescibe 600 mg ew. thats right, no typo. been about a yr and a half. I feel great. he also gave me a-dex .5mg ed. might not always run 600. may go to 300 for a couple months

This is a perfect example of what TRT is NOT. What you are doing is long-term AAS.

Just curious, have you gotten follow-up bloodwork, including:
CBC
Comprehensive Metabolic Panel
Total and free testosterone
Estradiol, Sensitive
Lipid Panel (Cholesterol)

**smiler** · 11-02-2005, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by mranak

This is a perfect example of what TRT is NOT. What you are doing is long-term AAS.

Just curious, have you gotten follow-up bloodwork, including:
CBC
Comprehensive Metabolic Panel
Total and free testosterone
Estradiol, Sensitive
Lipid Panel (Cholesterol)

of course. actually thats when I bagan a-dex, my estogen was way high. and yes test is through the roof as well. I love it. btw I never claimed this is trt. but thats how it started.

**BUYLONGTERM** · 11-02-2005, 11:47 AM

Well I grew up with low test levels. a couple of years ago, I was put in HRT. It makes a HUGE difference in my life!!!! I think better, feel better, and my sex drive is crazy!!! I've run Test at 100mg EW and I've run Test as high as 2g a week. The only major thing I can think of as far as running Test constantly (at higher doses) is my cholesterol went through the roof. (311) Test will raise your levels, but again, I'm sure it had to do a lot with running higher levels of it during my HRT thearpy. So, I'm not sure what doses of Test begin to raise your cholesterol.

I have been off test now for almost 3 months and I HATE IT. I'm going back in for bloodwork to see where my Cholesterol is at. If It has lowered dramatically, I will begin to start HRT at very low levels then after a few months get bloodwork done again. That way I can see if my cholesterol jumps up at a low dose. During the year and a half of running it, I got NO testicular shrinkage, I never really broke out and never gained any water weight (even running large doses) My PSA levels were always normal as well.

***JohnnyB*** · 11-02-2005, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by testosterona

so i was just sitting back reading some horror stories about bad bloodwork results when i thought, why do we fear HRT so badly. what are the pro's and con's of being on replacement test for life? how does it effect you mentally and physically? most of you know my age and my cycling exp, so this is something i might be facing in the future. PINNACLE and others please chime in.

If you have medical reasons, there's nothing wrong with it. It can be a drag having to inject once a week or every 2 weeks, it's not something you look forward to after years of being on HRT. Knowing that if you don't take that shot, you'll be moody, depressed, fatigued and/or have no sex drive. It's not fun being dependent on a drug to make you feel normal, I wish I didn't have to be on it. I never juiced before being on HRT, so if you're juicing and need normal test levels when you started do everything you can to keep those levels normal.

Use HCG during a cycle, do the proper PCT and don't limit PCT to a number of weeks, do it until your sex drive is back in full swing. Once it's back, wait the amount of time you were on before starting again, Yes, after PCT is done wait 12 more weeks if you did a 12 week cycle, 10 if you were on a 10 week cycle, you get the point. Time on=time off, starts after PCT is complete, it does not include the time it took for PCT. You want your hormones back to normal, for the same amount of time that you were on. Do this and you stand a better chance of not being put on HRT, because believe me it's not fun, it's a burden.

JohnnyB

**JUICING** · 11-02-2005, 10:40 PM

Mranak thanks for your input.But if I don't care about being fertle do need to run HGC in HRT

***JohnnyB*** · 11-02-2005, 11:25 PM

Originally Posted by JUICING

Mranak thanks for your input.But if I don't care about being fertle do need to run HGC in HRT

No it doesn't increase your sperm count, clomid is what they put you on

JohnnyB

**testosterona** · 11-03-2005, 12:09 AM

thanks for the reply johnny. interesting stuff

**mranak** · 11-03-2005, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

No it doesn't increase your sperm count, clomid is what they put you on

JohnnyB

Well, clomid and hCG are both used to treat infertility. Usage of hCG for this purpose is extremely common in both women and men. hCG is effectively LH. If that doesn't work, then the next step is often HMG, which is LH and FSH....at a much higher cost compared to hCG.

**mranak** · 11-03-2005, 10:11 PM

Originally Posted by JUICING

Mranak thanks for your input.But if I don't care about being fertle do need to run HGC in HRT

You don't need hCG , but many men on TRT feel a boost from the hCG and love the stuff. It also have the nice effect of keeping the balls from shrinking to the size of raisins.