Weakness - loss of strength/mass on cycle

[adude006]

I started my cycle of Test E 600 5 weeks ago. Was supposes to run EQ at 600 also but my source delayed the shippment for EQ until last week so I finally started EQ last week at 800 for 2 weeks then will run it at 600mg.

Plan was to run the cycle for 15 weeks. But now i'll be running the EQ for 15 weeks & test for 19 weeks (due the 4 week early start for the test). Im also running var at 100mg for 6 weeks. Then will take 6 weeks off and run var again at the end for 6 weeks at 100mg.

I have used EQ, Test & var during my last cycle and gained amazing strength/size.

Problem is this cycle I'm not gaining much at all. Even though the var & Eq were started a week ago, the test has been on for 4 weeks now. I feel weak through out the day and at the gym my strength levels are the same as my pre cycle levels. Not gaining any size (not even a small amount). Infact I've lost a bit mass since i came on cycle.

Last cycle my doses for all 3 compounds were lower than this and yet i was pumped for the entire 12 weeks and strength was way more. Could easily do dumbell press of 110's for 8 reps. Now I can barely manage 4-5 reps of 80's...

There are two issues I can think of:
1) I'm using Finsdt at 2.5mg a day for my hair so maybe the reduction in DHT is causing it? (I was on duta for 2 months prior to my cycle)
2) My carbs is kinda low. I'm mainly eating Oats & wheat bread only for that. Protein is right up at the 350 mark. so could that be a factor?

Or can you think of anything else?

The gear is good, a top lab so no doubt on that.
Training is: 2 body parts a day - each part twice a week.

stats are 5'6, 175.

[sonnygll]

Protein looks good. What are your carbs and calories? What is your workout like? Normally, for me, I can eat a lot of protein and lift heavy and still cut carbs to lose fat without losing any muscle 100% natty. Are you sure you lost some muscle?
Normally when people lose mass they are eating a lot less without really cleaning up the diet and then doing an assload of cardio. But even then, when your on gear you should be able to go crazy with the diet, do an assload of cardio and still keep your muscle.

So I'm really thinking workout. What are the details with exercises, sets, reps and % of 1 rep max you are loading?

[XNathan]

Fake gear! If you dont test it you cant say its good.

This problem grow everywhere. And we know why.

You are natural now and you are overtrain. Just cut your training volume and add carbs.

[crazyhorse666]

mt test dont kick in till week 6 or 7

[adude006]

Hm, i think the gear is real, the lab is very well known... I'll try changing brands in a few weeks though just to be sure...

I don't count my carbs but i know it's less than what i was consuming last cycle. I eat meals every 2 hours. every second meal has oat meals & the other has about 2 silces of wheat bread. That's pretty much my carbs!

Strength is down because my weights are down. Size is down because I used to rip out from my tshirts, now most of them are very loose.

Although i can think of one exercise i started which i feel could be pulling my upper body inside - weighted pull ups. I go upto 55lbs. But i've stopped it from this week because i feel my body isn't ready for this.

I don't have my workouts written down, I know the routine in my mind. As for the weights because of the weakness, some days i can go really heavy somedays i go light, so i'm unable to maintain a proper weights routine.

This is the schedule I follow:

Day 1: Chest + Tri
Incline bench
Incline Dumbells
Flat Dumbells
Decline Dumbells
lying Overhead dumbell press
Fly Machine

Close grip bench
Skull crushers
One hand dumbell skull crusher
Close grip pull down
dips


Day 2: Shoulders + Legs + Traps
Military Press
Dumbell Press
Raises (front / sides)

Shrugs
Front/Back barbell shrugs

Squats
Seated press
Hamstrings machine
Quads machine
2 Calf exercises


Day 3: Back + Bi
Barbell Curls
Alt dumbell curls (seated)

Chin / Pull ups
Deadlifts
Closegrip barbell rows
Pull downs
Dumbell rows

Day 4: OFF

Repeat...

[XNathan]

Thats to much just a close look on your chest.. to much exercise and I can just speculate about count of your series.

Use basic. I do just 9-10series on each small muscle group (tri, bi, chest, delts). And never spend more than 60min in gym.

My test kick in 3th week with weight and strength when its long ester or in one week if its short ester. Cant imagine wait so long for results (6-7wks). Maybe we each think diferently about sence of kick. I mean first noticable changes maybe you mean maximum effect.

[vitor]

Finasteride will kill strenght. The reduction in DHT will give your CNS a much weaker response to your muscle, so to speak...

Are you really prone to hairloss?
If not, get off the Finasteride, and your strenght will go through the roof pretty soon, as it might be a little early for the test to have kicked in yet also...

[sonnygll]

Yea, your workout looks like a muscle separation type thing. Are you bulking or cutting or what? Your talking like your doing a bulk, but you cycle looks like a cutter. First, you don't need flys. Incline and flat is fine. Just do dips and close grips for tris. For shoulders pick military or dumbbell overhead, but not both. You don't need front raise because you already got anterior delts with overhead. Laterals and shrugs are fine. Add some rear delt rows. Legs should go by itself. So split your shoulders up. Do overhead with chest, rear delts with back, and you can go either way with lateral delts and traps. Change hamstring machine to Romanian deadlift. Do all your back work BEFORE ANY biceps. drop pulldowns, do some of your rowing underhand for bicep development, and just pick 1 bicep exercise. And don't work out more then 2 days in a row. I'd try something different, like maybe go lower reps and lift real heavy.

From what your saying about inconsistent weight, I would think you might need more carbs because it sounds like you use your glycogen up well before your workout is done. But then again your going overboard on the amount exercises too.

[adude006]

I figured if you are on cycle you can increase the number of exercises, sets & reps too hence I try to incorporate many exercises while on cycle & try for about 1hr 30mins to 2 hr workouts. It's a bulk cycle...

Yup i am prone to hair loss. Last cycle i didn't use anything except nizoral, everything was ok until 4 weeks after my pct then all of a sudden a massive amount of hair loss occured and frontal hair lines got screwed too so i went on avodart for 2 months, it pretty much stopped the loss. I didn't like the idea of killing so much DHT so i switched to Finasteride. but i stopped it from today, hoping the spiro will do the trick. If the hair loss starts again then i'll get back on it.

I'll experiemnt a bit by changing my diet, workout routine for a few weeks.

[sonnygll]

I would just do more sets of the more effective exercises. Like for example I'd do more bench press instead of adding in dumbbell flys, pec deck and crossovers for a pure mass building cycle. You can do a little more on cycle, but remember your intensity is going to go way up too.

If you are bulking you need more carbs. It is going to kind of depend on your body type. If your an endomorph I can see taking it easy a bit. But you still need the post workout and breakfast carbs. You might need some carbs preworkout as well, because it really sounds like your out of glycogen well before you finish. Maybe take a carb drink with you too. Whatever you have to do to fuel the workout.

How much are you eating anyway? That tends to be a big culprit.

[adude006]

Meals usually follow something like this. for the most part i follow it, some days i get lazy..

Meal 1 (10am)
Chicken breasts
4 Wheat breads
1 glass fat free milk with 1 scoop whey
1 veg (usually carrot or a tomatoe)

Meal 2 (12pm)
8 egg whites
Oat meal (I fill the bowl to half it's size)
1 glass fat free milk
1 fruit

Meal 3
Repeat Meal 1 (2pm)

Meal 4 (4pm)
Open Meal
1 glass fat free milk

Meal 5
Repeat Meal 2 (6pm)

Pre Workout Meal 6(7:30)
1 scoop whey with water
1 slice cottage chese
Oat Meals

Post Workout (10)
1.5 scoops whey with fat free milk
60gms complex carb powder

Post wrkout Meal 7(10:30)
Open meal (sometimes my cheat meal)

Meal 8 (1am)
1 scoop whey with fat free milk
Sliced chciken ham
1 slice fat free cheese

[perfectbeast2001]

try dropping thae VAr. It made me feel weak and shitty at a much lower dose than your running

[sonnygll]

Yea your diet looks fine to me.

[adude006]

Last cycle var was the best thing i ever took, along with the test/eq, i used it at 80mg for 6 weeks and the pumps/strength was just amazing, which is why i decided on going for 100mg this cycle for 12 weeks (6 week split)

I might drop out the second 6 week part of it if i don't see the same pumps/strength within the first 6 weeks..