Cardio Fat Burn after weights workout??

**bradhore** · 11-12-2009, 09:20 AM

I dont really get the time to do a cardio only workout session..

Should i have my weights workout, have a protein shake, then do a cardio fat burn on the treadmil??

Or should i just do weights, cardio, then protein shake?

Just worried that if i do a weights session, then a 45min cardio fat burn, its going to be too late for the protein intake..

**LeroyB** · 11-12-2009, 10:08 AM

I have to say from my experience don't try to do both so close.
Most of the research says a minimum of 6 hours between lifting and cardio.
You will need a dedicated workout for each. Anything less and you sacrifice muscle (and weep accordingly)

.
Cheers!

**dec11** · 11-12-2009, 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by LeroyB

I have to say from my experience don't try to do both so close.
Most of the research says a minimum of 6 hours between lifting and cardio.
You will need a dedicated workout for each. Anything less and you sacrifice muscle (and weep accordingly)

.
Cheers!

oh dear no, do 30mins cardio strait after workout, then quick release carbs and then 20mins l8a take your shake and then solid protein food sorce an hour afta tht

***D7M*** · 11-12-2009, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by bradhore

I dont really get the time to do a cardio only workout session..

Should i have my weights workout, have a protein shake, then do a cardio fat burn on the treadmil??

Or should i just do weights, cardio, then protein shake?

Just worried that if i do a weights session, then a 45min cardio fat burn, its going to be too late for the protein intake..

if you have to do it that way, train, then cardio then pwo nutrition.

if the rest of your diet is on, you shouldn't loose that much muscle doing low intensity pwo cardio.

**jcosley** · 11-12-2009, 10:15 AM

This is always debatable. But from what I have read...if you have already one the heavy weights before cardio the hypertrophy has already occurred in the muscles regardless and still will need to be rebuilt (aka during sleep) so doing cardio after isnt going to "burn all your muscle" . I would just do PWO shake after you are totally done with everything.

**energizer bunny** · 11-12-2009, 10:17 AM

doing cardio after weights is fine.......i train then cardio then PWO shake......if i had the money id take BCAAs during training and cardio.

**dec11** · 11-12-2009, 10:17 AM

dont 4get the carbs b4 protein, or some tht protein is gona be wasted replenishing energy stores!!

**energizer bunny** · 11-12-2009, 10:19 AM

Originally Posted by LeroyB

I have to say from my experience don't try to do both so close.
Most of the research says a minimum of 6 hours between lifting and cardio.
You will need a dedicated workout for each. Anything less and you sacrifice muscle (and weep accordingly)

.
Cheers!

not trying to be an asshole...but id like to see the research that says this...if you have it.

**dec11** · 11-12-2009, 10:20 AM

Originally Posted by energizer bunny

not trying to be an asshole...but id like to see the research that says this...if you have it.

yep, me too. complete bs

**M302_Imola** · 11-12-2009, 11:09 AM

Originally Posted by energizer bunny

doing cardio after weights is fine.......i train then cardio then PWO shake......if i had the money id take BCAAs during training and cardio.

Yeah, invest in some BCAA's either in the powder or pill form. Pop a few BCAA's at the very end of your weights session and that should help you preserve muscle while your doing your cardio.

**chuckt12345** · 11-12-2009, 11:15 AM

dont see how you would have energy to cardio after workout,, at least not after my workouts

**big_k** · 11-12-2009, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by energizer bunny

not trying to be an asshole...but id like to see the research that says this...if you have it.

I believe the research is considered broscience.

There are many successful bodybuilders AND countless individuals who got ripped by cardio after weights. I am not going to go into the science because I don't feel like citing articles, but I believe it has been stated that PWO cardio is primetime for fat burning.

Furthermore if you had to follow a 6 hour in between protocol, for guys doing 2 a days with cardio, that would mean going to the gym 3 times a day.

And lastly, as everyone stated I will just reiterate PWO Shake AFTER cardio & weights.

**spywizard** · 11-12-2009, 11:55 AM

stay with me here

10min high intensity pre workout.. intervals this will drive the blood from your digestive system into your body

30-45min strength training this uses the glycogen stores that are stored in the muscle and the liver if intense enough

30 minutes of low intensity training by staying low intensity your body will not burn ammino acids for energy, it will.. yep burn fat... but you must not exceed 60-65% on the heart rate scale.. (it's pretty hard to do) the only thing should be added to this, consume BCAA between resistance and the low intensity cardio..

Hows that..

**urbanbody** · 11-12-2009, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by spywizard

stay with me here

10min high intensity pre workout.. intervals this will drive the blood from your digestive system into your body

30-45min strength training this uses the glycogen stores that are stored in the muscle and the liver if intense enough

30 minutes of low intensity training by staying low intensity your body will not burn ammino acids for energy, it will.. yep burn fat... but you must not exceed 60-65% on the heart rate scale.. (it's pretty hard to do) the only thing should be added to this, consume BCAA between resistance and the low intensity cardio..

Hows that..

Perfect!

**workoutfreak078** · 11-12-2009, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by big_k

I believe the research is considered broscience.

There are many successful bodybuilders AND countless individuals who got ripped by cardio after weights. I am not going to go into the science because I don't feel like citing articles, but I believe it has been stated that PWO cardio is primetime for fat burning.

I agree. I am one of those people that got shredded from doing cardio after weights. I do high-intensity cardio though. I never lost a pound of muscle doing this. I would lift for about 45 minutes to an hour, then I would do high-intensity cardio for 20 minutes, then have my PWO nutrition. It works wonders.

**LeroyB** · 11-12-2009, 12:26 PM

Originally Posted by energizer bunny

not trying to be an asshole...but id like to see the research that says this...if you have it.

Been a while but i will source it up for you. Watch this space..

Edit Below---
Might I add - This was information I got from all natural people when I was also all natural. So a lot of the stuff I researched could go out the window with the addition of AAS.
I am a total AAS noob. The just of what I learned that if I got to the gym and crush my workout = to failure and beyond, then start into cardio I am simply going to burn muscle as well as fat at a rate that wasn't worth while.
On top of that my pre-workout meal and PWO shake/ meals were different for lifting vs cardio because its really two different things.
Cardio = catabolic = Eating to encourage cutting, Lifting = anabolic = eating to encourage bulking or maintenance.
AKA
catabolic on the fat is good, on the muscles, bad
anabolic on the muscles good, on the fat, bad

My workout was (when I was doing this research):
M-F Cardio 6:45 AM , Lift 5:30 PM
S & S - OFF
In summary - I think some of that depends on the type of cardio you do as well, as Hiit depletes muscle glycogen more than moderate intensity cardio. My cardio was 50 - 60 minutes @ 65% heart rate and that was going to make me to catabolic.

Wow this post is a mess, hope you can follow me. I will keep digging for the detailed information.

**tronics** · 11-12-2009, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by M302_Imola

Yeah, invest in some BCAA's either in the powder or pill form. Pop a few BCAA's at the very end of your weights session and that should help you preserve muscle while your doing your cardio.

Yep, i take a pack that has bcaa's and eaa's before and right after workout and then go into my cardio and have a protien shake with simple carbs right after cardio with glutamine and leucine

**dec11** · 11-12-2009, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by LeroyB

Been a while but i will source it up for you.
Watch this space..

its complete rubbish

**LeroyB** · 11-12-2009, 12:47 PM

Originally Posted by declan11

its complete rubbish

Following a workout, muscle glycogen stores are depleted, and many muscle
proteins are also broken down, leaving us in a deficit state in respect to both of these crucial nutrients.
As more and more glycogen and glucose is burned up for energy, blood glucose
levels begin to drop-off, which in turn cause insulin levels to drop drastically.
That is a very vital step to grasp because of the properties insulin has in relation to protein synthesis and anabolic hormone production.
These drops give rise to the catabolic hormone Cortisol.

Source (PDF)
So I assume we can all agree here that this is the state your body should be in after a devastating workout. If this is TRUE (Please say if yous ay its not) and you decide to go jump on the tread mill you are going to jack up your Cortisol, and your body is going to digest muscle tissue and carry on doing damage until you get some food. Correct?

**big_k** · 11-12-2009, 01:25 PM

Originally Posted by LeroyB

Source (PDF)
So I assume we can all agree here that this is the state your body should be in after a devastating workout. If this is TRUE (Please say if yous ay its not) and you decide to go jump on the tread mill you are going to jack up your Cortisol, and your body is going to digest muscle tissue and carry on doing damage until you get some food. Correct?

This is true, but what real results tell us, is that the increase in Cortisol is not detrimental and in general "Muscle digestion/catabolism" is grossly over-exaggerated when it comes to cardio.

This is a bad study to support my arguement but I gotta run, basically it states that Cortisol levels are increased during High Intensity Prolonged Exercise (Sprinting) But lower intensity does not have as big of an impact on cortisol level.

http://informahealthcare.com/doi/abs...65518009101862

**CaliPhotog** · 11-12-2009, 02:58 PM

Originally Posted by workoutfreak078

I agree. I am one of those people that got shredded from doing cardio after weights. I do high-intensity cardio though. I never lost a pound of muscle doing this. I would lift for about 45 minutes to an hour, then I would do high-intensity cardio for 20 minutes, then have my PWO nutrition. It works wonders.

Agreed! Same here. Never had any problems doing either high or low intensity after workout session. I got better results from high intensity and lower volume than I did with low intensity and higher volume. Sprints shredded me up real good and it seemed to shape my quads really nicely.

***FireGuy*** · 11-12-2009, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by big_k

This is true, but what real results tell us, is that the increase in Cortisol is not detrimental and in general "Muscle digestion/catabolism" is grossly over-exaggerated when it comes to cardio.

This is a bad study to support my arguement but I gotta run, basically it states that Cortisol levels are increased during High Intensity Prolonged Exercise (Sprinting) But lower intensity does not have as big of an impact on cortisol level.

http://informahealthcare.com/doi/abs...65518009101862

Word!

**El Corvino** · 11-12-2009, 03:40 PM

I was always told if you do cardio after weights to drink grape juice... the natural sugars help prevent the wasting of muscle...

**bradhore** · 11-12-2009, 04:44 PM

Originally Posted by spywizard

stay with me here

10min high intensity pre workout.. intervals this will drive the blood from your digestive system into your body

30-45min strength training this uses the glycogen stores that are stored in the muscle and the liver if intense enough

30 minutes of low intensity training by staying low intensity your body will not burn ammino acids for energy, it will.. yep burn fat... but you must not exceed 60-65% on the heart rate scale.. (it's pretty hard to do) the only thing should be added to this, consume BCAA between resistance and the low intensity cardio..

Hows that..

So at what point should i consume protein, and should it be protein and carb shake or will just protein do?

**CaliPhotog** · 11-12-2009, 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by FireGuy1

Word!

FireGuy, are you not a fan of Sprints or do they just not appeal to you? I'm no where near your level of knowledge or real world experience, but I did get FANTASTIC results from sprints. When I say results I am saying that I was able to drastically lower my bf in a short period of time while still maintaining strength. Not sure if I may have sacrificed a bit of size, but I got shredded up pretty good.

**ArmedHammerd** · 11-12-2009, 07:18 PM

Originally Posted by big_k

I believe the research is considered broscience.

There are many successful bodybuilders AND countless individuals who got ripped by cardio after weights. I am not going to go into the science because I don't feel like citing articles, but I believe it has been stated that PWO cardio is primetime for fat burning.

Furthermore if you had to follow a 6 hour in between protocol, for guys doing 2 a days with cardio, that would mean going to the gym 3 times a day.

And lastly, as everyone stated I will just reiterate PWO Shake AFTER cardio & weights.

I agree with this 100% thats the way i do it

**spywizard** · 11-12-2009, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by workoutfreak078

I agree. I am one of those people that got shredded from doing cardio after weights. I do high-intensity cardio though. I never lost a pound of muscle doing this. I would lift for about 45 minutes to an hour, then I would do high-intensity cardio for 20 minutes, then have my PWO nutrition. It works wonders.

that may have worked for you, or your perception.. however science does not support that..

but good for you.

**workoutfreak078** · 11-12-2009, 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by spywizard

that may have worked for you, or your perception.. however science does not support that..

but good for you.

I said I was one of those people who had success from it. I never stated scientific facts or anything. I have read some articles stating that it can be catabolic doing this, and some stating that it won't burn off muscle if you do not exceed 20 minutes post-workout.

I even did this during PCT, and months after my cycle, without losing strength or muscle. It can work for some people, so it can't be a scientific fact that it doesn't work.

**big_k** · 11-12-2009, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by spywizard

that may have worked for you, or your perception.. however science does not support that..

but good for you.

theoretical science based on physiology and blood tests, there is also physical science that could potentially disprove the real "science" behind it. By that I mean like workoutfreak is stating, Yes he is increasing his cortisol level and theoretically setting himself up for catabolism, but in real world application he is not (he's not the only one) so there is some validity to it. Perhaps it is the true impact of cortisol, or other physiological implications... Albeit we don't have an actual study of this actual mode of exercise, and its stimulus and result relationship.

**dec11** · 11-13-2009, 06:28 AM

Originally Posted by LeroyB

Source (PDF)
So I assume we can all agree here that this is the state your body should be in after a devastating workout. If this is TRUE (Please say if yous ay its not) and you decide to go jump on the tread mill you are going to jack up your Cortisol, and your body is going to digest muscle tissue and carry on doing damage until you get some food. Correct?

still complete bollocks and always will be despite wat crap you find on the internet and post it as "science". no offense intended

**kojak_x** · 11-13-2009, 07:00 AM

Originally Posted by spywizard

stay with me here

10min high intensity pre workout.. intervals this will drive the blood from your digestive system into your body

30-45min strength training this uses the glycogen stores that are stored in the muscle and the liver if intense enough

30 minutes of low intensity training by staying low intensity your body will not burn ammino acids for energy, it will.. yep burn fat... but you must not exceed 60-65% on the heart rate scale.. (it's pretty hard to do) the only thing should be added to this, consume BCAA between resistance and the low intensity cardio..

Hows that..

Out of all the posts your the only one that seems to really know what your talking about, ss much misinformation.

**dec11** · 11-13-2009, 07:21 AM

Originally Posted by kojak_x

Out of all the posts your the only one that seems to really know what your talking about, ss much misinformation.

yep, i agree totally, so much crap spouted by ppl who dont know wat they talking about. and to anyone complaining of my "jumping" on the thread, i think 16yrs in training and sport science degree tells more than some stupid internet article

**tarzenbond** · 11-13-2009, 10:05 AM

I would suggest,

If you want to BURN your fat then you should take ur protein shake after your Weights+cardio (30-40 mins) later protein

And if you want to gain weight , try scheduling cardio on other day as 4 day weights and cardio 3 days ( 2 days pure cardio empty stomach + 1 day during weight traning day),you have to adjust ur weight schedule respectively.

and your protein intake should be exactly after your workout.

this is as per my opinion..it may vary person to person.