Building Muscle Base w/ Juice???

**methtical126** · 01-17-2003, 12:11 PM

Been doing some research and noticed that everyone recommends waiting until you have built a solid base of muscle or have reached your natural peak before even considering 1st cycle. Does this mean that a person who is yet to build a solid muscle base won't recieve any benefits from juicing? I have lifted off and on for the past couple of years but haven't really made any significant gains, and I'm looking for a way to put on some bulk in a short period of time. I have read about people gaing 20-30 lbs. of muscle on their first sust cycle, and I want to know if I could expect gains like that even though I'm not even close to approaching my natural fitness peak. Also, does juicing allow you to work out longer and more frequently? I have a lot of time on my hands right now, and I'm willing to spend hours a day in the gym but I don't want to be wasting my time by over-training.

**BMANN** · 01-17-2003, 01:24 PM

If you have a solid base, then you tend to keep a more of the gains from your cycle. The way you've been working out isn't helping either. You should have your diet and routine in order before touching the juice. For my first cycle I didn't have my routine or diet in order, and although I did put about 20 pounds from sus, I did lose quite a bit because of poor diet and training.

**methtical126** · 01-17-2003, 02:20 PM

Thanks for the input BMANN... I'm planning on training hard for a couple of months before I even consider a cycle. I'll be doing a lot more research between now and then also. Right now I'm set on this cycle:

Weeks 1-5 – Dianabol (30mg/Week)
Weeks 1-10 – Sustanon 250 (500 mg/Week)
Weeks 1-10 - Deca -Durabolin 200 (400mg/Week)

I'm also considering throwing in some Winney for weeks 7-10... Is this too much for a first cycle? Also, I know it's important to start Clomid 3 weeks after last injection, but how much should be taken and for how long? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

**pin_cuzion** · 01-17-2003, 05:22 PM

your cycle looks pretty good, although maybe a little strong for your first one. you really seem to know about your gear, which is good to see. i recommend that you give it at least 3 solid months of training with heavy protein intake to build up your natural base and your natural strength. with that time under your belt you should find the gear to be more effective. with a cycle like that and the right protein and diet, you should expect to put on about 30-35 pounds. i did they same one except without the dbol and gained 37, and kept 31 of it. let us know how it goes man. good luck

**nj_** · 01-17-2003, 05:29 PM

Originally posted by methtical126
Thanks for the input BMANN... I'm planning on training hard for a couple of months before I even consider a cycle. I'll be doing a lot more research between now and then also. Right now I'm set on this cycle:

Weeks 1-5 – Dianabol (30mg/Week)
Weeks 1-10 – Sustanon 250 (500 mg/Week)
Weeks 1-10 - Deca -Durabolin 200 (400mg/Week)

I'm also considering throwing in some Winney for weeks 7-10... Is this too much for a first cycle? Also, I know it's important to start Clomid 3 weeks after last injection, but how much should be taken and for how long? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

If you are going to throw in winny, run it in wks 10-14 @ 50mg/ED. I'm guessing you meant 30mg/day for the dbol not 30mg/week.

As for why not to juice if you haven't hit a solid natural base is if you couldn't make/maintain those gains naturally, what makes you think you will be able to keep them after juicing? Most likely you are not gaining because you are overtraining or not consuming enough calories. Post your diet and let us take a look at it.

**Cubber** · 01-17-2003, 08:04 PM

yes.. the diet is critical. without a decent diet your wasting your time. I found this out first hand.

**Warrior** · 01-17-2003, 08:58 PM

It ain't just about having a solid base. It's about knowing what your limitations are as far as injury prone, somotype, ... It is about understanding diet and training theories. It's about knowing how to train and eat for results. Go ahead and move straight to the juice and run huge stacks if you want - but that is a poor descion IMO.