Need some help with what to take

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 09:50 PM

Age: 21
Height: 5'3 ft
Weight: 140 lbs
B/F: 8%
Experience: Been lifting for the last 7 years of my life and other then Whey Protein and the occasional Creatine I have been clean.

My goal is to achieve a ripped appearance, most notably the 'washboard' abes that, without genetics, are near impossibly to achieve without supplements.

1) I have read a ton of the stickies on these forums so I have learned a lot and did attempt to do my own research. Forgive me if I still get things wrong.

2) I have been consistently lifting hard 3x a week for the last year, whilst taking minimal breaks. I know that steriods would not strengthen my tendons and that it is very important to have strong tendons, amongst everything else while lifting to help prevent injury.

3) Everything that I list will be taken orally, not anabolically. I am aware that orally taking steriods are not as effective as anabolically but, for now, this is my only choice.

The things that I have been looking into taking are;

HGH Factor - I read Redbarons article on HGH and it has peaked my interest. However I am unsure if the HGH will be able to satisfy my goals of becoming ripped.

Winstrol-V - I have read a lot about how this steroid can give your muscles a lean and ripped appearance relatively quickly.

Other possibilities are Anadrol , Dianabol , Deca -Durabolin , Primobolan , Sustanon , and Anavar .

I need help finding out what would be my best bet to take. Also is testoserone needed for these things? From what I have read it somehow makes steriods react better with your body.

I planned on taking Milk Thistle for some help with keeping my liver intact.

For the PCT I planned on used HCG .

Also I am curious if I take these steroids for the recommended 6-8 weeks if during the PCT I will lose everything I would have worked hard to gain; muscle, appearance, strength, ect.

For those interested im currently in the pogress of getting a Biology degree so this kind of stuff is of great interest to me, whether I take it myself or not.

***FireGuy*** · 05-11-2010, 09:54 PM

Originally Posted by Zein

Age: 21
Height: 5'3 ft
Weight: 140 lbs
B/F: 8%
Experience: Been lifting for the last 7 years of my life and other then Whey Protein and the occasional Creatine I have been clean.

My goal is to achieve a ripped appearance, most notably the 'washboard' abes that, without genetics, are near impossibly to achieve without supplements.
1) I have read a ton of the stickies on these forums so I have learned a lot and did attempt to do my own research. Forgive me if I still get things wrong.

2) I have been consistently lifting hard 3x a week for the last year, whilst taking minimal breaks. I know that steriods would not strengthen my tendons and that it is very important to have strong tendons, amongst everything else while lifting to help prevent injury.

3) Everything that I list will be taken orally, not anabolically. I am aware that orally taking steriods are not as effective as anabolically but, for now, this is my only choice.

The things that I have been looking into taking are;

HGH Factor - I read Redbarons article on HGH and it has peaked my interest. However I am unsure if the HGH will be able to satisfy my goals of becoming ripped.

Winstrol-V - I have read a lot about how this steroid can give your muscles a lean and ripped appearance relatively quickly.

Other possibilities are Anadrol , Dianabol , Deca -Durabolin , Primobolan , Sustanon , and Anavar .

I need help finding out what would be my best bet to take. Also is testoserone needed for these things? From what I have read it somehow makes steriods react better with your body.

I planned on taking Milk Thistle for some help with keeping my liver intact.

For the PCT I planned on used HCG .

Also I am curious if I take these steroids for the recommended 6-8 weeks if during the PCT I will lose everything I would have worked hard to gain; muscle, appearance, strength, ect.

For those interested im currently in the pogress of getting a Biology degree so this kind of stuff is of great interest to me, whether I take it myself or not.

You are claiming to have 8% bodyfat and your goal is to be ripped and have washboard abs? If you are 8% you are already ripped and your abs would have came in 12lbs ago.

**Big** · 05-11-2010, 09:56 PM

according to your post, you already met your goals, well done.
next?

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 10:04 PM

I'm sorry if I came off cocky saying 8% body fat but thats what I have. I had to get a b/f test for college wrestling and with that test they tell us how much weight we can and cannot lose/week. Anyways I don't have abes at all unless I flex...and even then they're not that great.

Anyways I don't plan on wrestling my junior year in college so I don't need to worry about taking steriods . If I could get any help as to what I should take it would be wonderful because I have tried to learn from reading other posts and stickies on this forum, as well as using google, however I still need help with what I should take and how I should take it.

**Big** · 05-11-2010, 10:07 PM

post a pic and show us what base you are starting with

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 10:12 PM

Of my abes? If so just give me a hr or so I have company over and don't want to take a picture of myself with them all standing around lol

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 10:16 PM

Alright well one of my friends is running another home so I guess I can go ahead and do it.

**Big** · 05-11-2010, 10:20 PM

no not just abs, show us what your build is like

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 10:21 PM

Oh lol. Sure give me another minute to take a different picture.

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 10:30 PM

Told you I wasn't ripped. Oh and I am not joking about the body fat...I realize I may look a little chubby to have 8% but thats what I have. Lying here would hurt no one other then myself anyways.

**Big** · 05-11-2010, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by Zein

Told you I wasn't ripped. Oh and I am not joking about the body fat...I realize I may look a little chubby to have 8% but thats what I have. Lying here would hurt no one other then myself anyways.

you have around 18%bf

**gixxerboy1** · 05-11-2010, 10:33 PM

the person who told you that you were 8% has no clue on how to check bf. You are nowhere near it. Whats your diet like?

**Big** · 05-11-2010, 10:38 PM

this guy is around 8%bf and similar stats, just for comparison...

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 10:43 PM

Wow, well I am sorry if it appears I was lying. But that's what I was told.

Diet - Well since wrestling ended I pretty much eat what I want. However I don't drink pop, mostly stick to water and 2% Milk, and I don't snack or eat a lot of candy either. I was actually going to post for help with dieting in a different section but if I can get help here that would be great too because I am used to not eating everything I want and believe dieting and getting more protein will help immensly.

So any suggestions as far as the supplements are concerned?

**Zein** · 05-11-2010, 10:46 PM

It 1 A.M here so I am going to head to bed but I'll be back tomorrow. Tomorrow is also a lifting day :]

**Big** · 05-11-2010, 10:48 PM

we didn't think you were lying, just misinformed.

**cherrydrpepper** · 05-12-2010, 03:08 AM

Zein a few thoughts

First you are only 21 so don't feel overwhelmed. It takes time to diet and train like a pro. Only a few can make the switch overnight.

You need to eat 6 times a day. Examples:

Meal 1
1 and 1/2 cups oatmeal mixed with skim milk (I dont even cook it anymore)
1 banana
6 egg whites

Meal 2
8 ounces of chicken, turkey or lean fish
1 and 1/2 cups brown rice
2 cups assorted vegetables you can change it up

Meal 3
Small steak
Medium sweet potato

Meal 4 PREWORKOUT
2 scoops whey protein mixed with skim milk
1 tablespoon peanut butter

Meal 5
1 scoop protein with skim milk
chicken, turkey or lean fish
again some vegetables

Meal 6
2 cups fat free yogurt or cottage cheese
1 glass skim milk
2 cups beans or peas

This may be a little too large of portions for your size but you get the idea. To give you a little motivation I was the same weight at your age and similar body fat. Today at 28 I am 195 lbs and around 15 % bf (I have abs/ obliques / v cut at my current fat state.. but am naturally predisposed that way. I also have a slight double chin from being too heavy right now)

The biggest, and I mean THE BIGGEST MISTAKE I made at your age was not eating often enough or the right things. You have a huge source of natural testosterone right now you need to tap into. But it will be wasted if you don't eat and lift.

As far as AAS my personal opinion is I would not mess with them yet. You will make serious gains IF YOU EAT. Also this crap about a 6 pack.. its your life but you would have to cut to about 125 lbs. This is not the way you want to go right now. Right now you need to bulk up with clean foods, then cut later. Just my opinion. You could try counting your calories and minimizing your fats and making lean gains or replacing fat with muscle so to speak. Some people are able to do it. In my opinion they are minimizing their muscle gains at the same time. Thats just my opinion.

**Zein** · 05-12-2010, 05:30 AM

Wow Cherry I really appreciate that thoughtout response!

After reading through what you eat...well I can't believe it. Does eating like that really contribute to building more muscle? I realize its not crap that I'll be eating like McDonalds or something but it's still a lot of food! If eating like that can really help me look good then looks like I'm going to be heading to the grocery store soon lol.

Some quick questions. The six egg whites do you just eat them raw? I have done it before and being a Bio major I know all about stuff like Salmonella and how low the actually risk of getting it actually is (1/20,000?). Plus having the shit's doesn't bother me...just gotta stay hydrated.

I'm also curious as to how food increases testoserone levels and if I you eat this way everyday or just on workout days? And at what times would be good for eating all these meals. Time is not a problem I am more then willing to get up at 5-6 A.M to down some eggs/oatmeal and a banana

Also multivitamins like Megamen from GNC are good to continue taking as well right?

Assuming I don't take AAS because I am young would there be a problem in taking HGH like HGH Factor?

Thanks for everyone's help in advance lol!

I'm not sure how much this will help you guys help me but this is my workout. I'll be getting a full time job soon (hopefully) since its summer and schools out but this is what I'll be doing. BTW I am open to ideals I love to learn and if you guys think adding/taking away anything would help me just let me know. I am open to criticism.

I break my workout down into core and noncore lifts.

My core lifts are; Bench Press, Squat, Power Cleans, and Deadlifts.

Noncore lifts (examples); Pull-Ups, Dips, Push Press, Military Bench, Curls, Forearm Rolls, G.H, and Lat-Pulls

Mondays - Bench Press, Squat
Wednesdays - Power Cleans, Deadlifts
Fridays - Pyramid Bench (10,9,8,7..2,1,1,2..7,8,9,10 reps)

After doing cores I do a variety of the noncore (auxiliary?) lifts.

I change my sets/reps weekly in cycles for my cores.
Week 1 - 3x3
Week 2 - 5x5
Week 3 - 5-4-3-2-1
Week 4 - 10-8-6

My lifts, these will fail in comparison to everyone else on this forum, currently are...
Bench Press - 235lbs
Squat - 420 lbs
Power Cleans - 210lbs
Deadlift (I use a straight bar instead of a hexbar) - 340 lbs
Pull-Ups - ~40, I consistently break 30 but have never gotten more then 40.

On top of lifting 3 days a week and switching over to all this food I also plan on putting in some cardio. I ran 3.5 miles yesterday and plan on continuing to run on nonlifting days when time permits. I'm getting in shape for my own sake because, with the amount of time required for my classes, I don't plan on competing in college sports anymore however I still want to be healthy, fit, and look good.

**Zein** · 05-12-2010, 05:35 AM

Hey Cherry in one of your threads you talk about using Dawn to help control acne. Your not talking about the dishsoap are you?

**sonnygll** · 05-12-2010, 05:36 AM

Nice numbers. If you are that strong, and work out like that, all you have to do is eat more.

**Kibble** · 05-12-2010, 05:38 AM

Originally Posted by Zein

Wow Cherry I really appreciate that thoughtout response!

After reading through what you eat...well I can't believe it. Does eating like that really contribute to building more muscle? I realize its not crap that I'll be eating like McDonalds or something but it's still a lot of food! If eating like that can really help me look good then looks like I'm going to be heading to the grocery store soon lol.

Some quick questions. The six egg whites do you just eat them raw? I have done it before and being a Bio major I know all about stuff like Salmonella and how low the actually risk of getting it actually is (1/20,000?). Plus having the shit's doesn't bother me...just gotta stay hydrated.Just boil the eggs, and take the yolks out. Remember, you are only getting half of the protein and amino acids. So six egg whites would equal 3 whole eggs. You would need to add more protein imo

I'm also curious as to how food increases testoserone levels and if I you eat this way everyday or just on workout days? And at what times would be good for eating all these meals. Time is not a problem I am more then willing to get up at 5-6 A.M to down some eggs/oatmeal and a banana

Also multivitamins like Megamen from GNC are good to continue taking as well right?A daily multivitamin is always a good idea

Assuming I don't take AAS because I am young would there be a problem in taking HGH like HGH Factor?

Thanks for everyone's help in advance lol!

I'm not sure how much this will help you guys help me but this is my workout. I'll be getting a full time job soon (hopefully) since its summer and schools out but this is what I'll be doing. BTW I am open to ideals I love to learn and if you guys think adding/taking away anything would help me just let me know. I am open to criticism.

I break my workout down into core and noncore lifts.

My core lifts are; Bench Press, Squat, Power Cleans, and Deadlifts.

Noncore lifts (examples); Pull-Ups, Dips, Push Press, Military Bench, Curls, Forearm Rolls, G.H, and Lat-Pulls

Mondays - Bench Press, Squat
Wednesdays - Power Cleans, Deadlifts
Fridays - Pyramid Bench (10,9,8,7..2,1,1,2..7,8,9,10 reps)

After doing cores I do a variety of the noncore (auxiliary?) lifts.

I change my sets/reps weekly in cycles for my cores.
Week 1 - 3x3
Week 2 - 5x5
Week 3 - 5-4-3-2-1
Week 4 - 10-8-6

My lifts, these will fail in comparison to everyone else on this forum, currently are...
Bench Press - 235lbs
Squat - 420 lbs
Power Cleans - 210lbs
Deadlift (I use a straight bar instead of a hexbar) - 340 lbs
Pull-Ups - ~40, I consistently break 30 but have never gotten more then 40.40 pullups? If that is true, then you are a goddamn animal

On top of lifting 3 days a week and switching over to all this food I also plan on putting in some cardio. I ran 3.5 miles yesterday and plan on continuing to run on nonlifting days when time permits. I'm getting in shape for my own sake because, with the amount of time required for my classes, I don't plan on competing in college sports anymore however I still want to be healthy, fit, and look good.

Stay away from HGH imo. In order to run an effective dose, you will spend thousands. Use those thousnds of dollars for food

**lovbyts** · 05-12-2010, 05:44 AM

Originally Posted by Zein

It 1 A.M here so I am going to head to bed but I'll be back tomorrow. Tomorrow is also a lifting day :]

Lifting day? Isnt every day lifting day? LOL

6-8 weeks? LOL try 10-12 and yes if your diet is not spot on, you dont keep a good workout routine you will loose it all.

Also only being 21 you risk fusing your growth plates prematurely. You risk causing yourself ED/libido issues doe to shutting down your natural test production when it is at it's peak and your hormones are not yet stable before 24/25 so you can experience many other side effects like a lot of acne. Also with 18% body fat you have a higher chance of gyno and water retention.,

***FireGuy*** · 05-12-2010, 12:22 PM

Squatting 420lbs while weighing 140lbs??? I am going to categorize this in the same place I categorized your 8% bodyfat, cause if its true you one of maybe 100 people on planet earth doing triple bodyweight squats. I do believe you have placed 420lbs on your back and I do believe "movement" occurred. I just dont believe it was a Squat.

**matty boy** · 05-12-2010, 12:32 PM

lol....thats funny what a bullshiter

**Zein** · 05-12-2010, 03:38 PM

@Fireguy - I realize my b/f was way off. I didn't do my own test, let alone read it so I was just going off what I was told. However I am being legit about my lifting. I have no reason to lie...I get nothing out of watching my e-penis grow. If you don't believe me that's fine I'm not trying to impress anyone just trying to seek help. I really don't see whats unbelievable about me doing triple weight squats when there are people bench pressing 2-3x their body weight?

@Matt boy - Your sure helpful...

And for clarification regarding squats
Yeah I have done 420lbs on squat before, it was a school record back in high school the summer leading up to my junior year (So I was 16). I was a long distance runner putting in 5 miles a day 4x a week, and to boot I was even lighter then I am now, wrestling that summer at 125. So I did 420 on squat when I was 5 years younger, and 15 lbs lighter then I am now. I had 3 coaches and a group of students watching/spotting me as I did it. After wards I was even a little cocky and tried 450 and couldn't stand back up with it...thankfully the bars were right there to hold the weight lol because it would have crushed me. All and all I got my name written on our weight room wall :]

Also @ bigkuntry and lovbytes thanks for the help guys. I guess I'll boil my eggs now lol...maybe :P

And don't give me all the credit. Those are the weights and reps I am doing without AAS or HGH supplements but I believe I wouldn't had been able to do any of them without God. I am a big time Jesus Freak, even though I don't always act like it, and even go as far as to ask God for help in the weight room lol.

**Zein** · 05-12-2010, 03:47 PM

@Bigkuntry - There is actually a cheap, orally taken, HGH called HGH Factor. I believe they have a website up somewhere and it was on like NBC or something. I think it runs a little under $100 a month but I don't know how legit it really is. If anyone knows how good HGH Factor is and could let me know it would be great because it seems to good to be true...and, like most things, when its to good to be true its a scam.

@Lovbytes - I was asked to get a bone xray by my endocrinologist just last Tuesday to check to see if my bone plates have fused. She was considering giving me HGH (anabolic kind) if my growth plates were still unfused. I have yet to get the xray done because I haven't grown at all in 5-6 years and it seems like it would be just a waste of money. Plus the lack of insurance would make me have to pay for HGH out of pocket.

**gixxerboy1** · 05-12-2010, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by Zein

@Bigkuntry - There is actually a cheap, orally taken, HGH called HGH Factor. I believe they have a website up somewhere and it was on like NBC or something. I think it runs a little under $100 a month but I don't know how legit it really is. If anyone knows how good HGH Factor is and could let me know it would be great because it seems to good to be true...and, like most things, when its to good to be true its a scam.

@Lovbytes - I was asked to get a bone xray by my endocrinologist just last Tuesday to check to see if my bone plates have fused. She was considering giving me HGH (anabolic kind) if my growth plates were still unfused. I have yet to get the xray done because I haven't grown at all in 5-6 years and it seems like it would be just a waste of money. Plus the lack of insurance would make me have to pay for HGH out of pocket.

oral hgh is a waste of money and doesnt work

**Matt** · 05-12-2010, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by gixxerboy1

oral hgh is a waste of money and doesnt work

X2, wouldnt use it if i got it free......

**gixxerboy1** · 05-12-2010, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by 007

X2, wouldnt use it if i got it free......

i have a few bottles i can send you for free are you sure?

**russiandave** · 05-12-2010, 04:38 PM

You have gotten some greattt advice in this thread. At your age just workout hard and eat like an animal and you are sure to grow. If you keep reading stickies on this forum and take the vets advice you will be a monster in a few years. Good luck