Size and juice ? ?

[tcw]

Does the Bodyweight and Height of a BB have ANY bearing on "how much juice they should do?"

BB 1 is 5.8, weights 185lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

BB2. is 6.3, weights 210lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

1) SHOULD BB 2 be doing more than 1gram of Test per week?

2) How do you know how much test you should do?

thanks...

~T

[Big]

Nope

[tcw]

thanks...!

-can anyone else expound on this subject?

[D7M]

Big pretty much answered it.

Your second question is dependent on goals, experience, etc.

[LouHulk]

good question, I never thought about it. Although it would make sense that you would need more gear for more LBM but apparently that's not the case.

[Knockout_Power]

test is 1 peice of a large puzzle... how do the diets, training, rest and genetics of those 2 individuals differ?

Go into the members picture section, most of us run the same basic cycles and none of us look the same... some of us take very well to bulking, some cut really easily.

your question is way to vague to give an answer.

[tcw]

I see...

...so all those 10's of thousands of dollars the PRO's are spending on juice is a waste of money

...particularly if you can get the same results from 1 gram of juice vs. 5 grams...

ok...i got it now...

[AlphaGenetics]

Does the Bodyweight and Height of a BB have ANY bearing on "how much juice they should do?"

BB 1 is 5.8, weights 185lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

BB2. is 6.3, weights 210lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

1) SHOULD BB 2 be doing more than 1gram of Test per week?

2) How do you know how much test you should do?

thanks...

~T

Its recommended that everybody start at about 500mg's ew of test. Ive done from 250mg's to 750mg's ew. To be honest I diddnt notice a huge difference when I dropped down to 250. A slight drop in body weight and sex drive but nothing dramatic. Its weird. You have to play with it to see what you respond to as we all are different. gl

[Big]

Does the Bodyweight and Height of a BB have ANY bearing on "how much juice they should do?"

BB 1 is 5.8, weights 185lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

BB2. is 6.3, weights 210lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

1) SHOULD BB 2 be doing more than 1gram of Test per week?

2) How do you know how much test you should do?

thanks...

~T

I see...

...so all those 10's of thousands of dollars the PRO's are spending on juice is a waste of money

...particularly if you can get the same results from 1 gram of juice vs. 5 grams...

ok...i got it now...

what does your original question have to do with this response? show me a pro that's 6'3", 210lbs, 15%bf and spending 10's of thousands of dollars on gear. in your initial question you did not mention cycle history, possible receptor saturation, etc, just 2 relatively normal sizes as the basis for comparison.

[gymnerd]

I think it does play a part personaly. You know how everyone will say everybody is different etc? You just have to start out low and find out what dose works good for you. I know guys that can get bigger stronger on 300mg of enanth that would simply not be enough for me.

I guess everyone is different LOL

[Bio-Active]

I think it does play a part personaly. You know how everyone will say everybody is different etc? You just have to start out low and find out what dose works good for you. I know guys that can get bigger stronger on 300mg of enanth that would simply not be enough for me.

I guess everyone is different LOL

A lot has to do with receptor saturation.

[Hillary Clinton]

"Receptor Saturation"

I've heard that term before but its never been a proven concept. There is a rumor that your first cycle is your best cycle...but others have had different results.

There is even a "receptor up-mod" theory that states that more receptors are produced as more testosterone is taken.

[Knockout_Power]

I see...

...so all those 10's of thousands of dollars the PRO's are spending on juice is a waste of money

...particularly if you can get the same results from 1 gram of juice vs. 5 grams...

ok...i got it now...

you make no reference to past cycling, which compounds were cycled, how many years of cycling and then talk beginner vs a Pro...

what are you really getting at? Do you want to know if you pound in the gear a pro does will you be able to step on stage in 6 months and win Mr O?

Have fun with getting answers from now on.

[Big]

you make no reference to past cycling, which compounds were cycled, how many years of cycling and then talk beginner vs a Pro...

what are you really getting at? Do you want to know if you pound in the gear a pro does will you be able to step on stage in 6 months and win Mr O?

Have fun with getting answers from now on.

indeed, he's been a member for 5 years but comes across as a typical arrogant know-it-all n00b. I'll be ignoring the rest of his questions.

[D7M]

A lot has to do with receptor saturation.

I don't really buy into the receptor down-regulation/saturation thing.

Personally, I think it's more of matter that anything we put into our bodies for a prolonged period of time, we'll grow accustomed to it.

Here's a great thread for further reading, especially page 2:

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=209272

[Hillary Clinton]

bha ahaahah

Sounds like someone is having a bad day!

you make no reference to past cycling, which compounds were cycled, how many years of cycling and then talk beginner vs a Pro...

what are you really getting at? Do you want to know if you pound in the gear a pro does will you be able to step on stage in 6 months and win Mr O?

Have fun with getting answers from now on.

[tcw]

yeah really!

It was a question that was "general" in terms (Guess some people don't know how to give a general answer).

That's ok dudes...you don't have to answer any more of my questions....believe me...the world (and myself) will survive with out your Omnipotent knowledge!

~have a nice day!

bha ahaahah

Sounds like someone is having a bad day!

[Gaspari1255]

I think what the OP is trying to say is if you take two guys (Guy A and Guy B) who have been training for a long time and both have done a good amount of cycles and different compounds, and give them both the same amount of gear, what the end result be the same (in terms of weight gain) being that Guy B has 50+lbs and 6 inches on Guy A?

This is a very interesting question. Let's assume they both have a similar diet, a similar training program, and both get the same amount of rest and recovery. Obviously, the bigger you are, the more calories you need. Wouldn't it seem logical that the bigger you are, the more gear you need (assuming you're balls deep into gear)?

I wish I had an answer. This is funny because Dukk and I had this EXACT conversation about two days ago.

[tcw]

Exactly...it is a very good question ! ! !

But based on the "old pros" answer (to which i am sorry they got offended)....the answer is NO (sigh).

This can't be the truth

.

I already had a strong suspicion that "the larger you are, the more juice you require!." Its only logical, since you are working with over all greater muscle mass.

(however, i thought i would pose the question for others, as well as myself, to learn from).

MOREOVER, It stands to reason that, The More muscle you have to work with and "created" through hard work and AAS, the more receptors you have DEVELOPED...and "the more juice you would require" to stimulate and fill those receptors, NO MATTER WHAT YOUR HEIGHT.

Of course, there MUST BE a genetic limit to how big each of us can get and only through experience would one really know each of our potential for muscular development.

THE NEXT QUESTION IS ...what happens to receptors when they are not utilized because NOT ENOUGH testosterone has been injected?

"are you wasting your time by not doing enough juice...or is it utilized anyway...and your size is just reverted to previous growth stage?"

"how can you manipulate your genetic potential" to achieve the ultimate in muscular growth?"

Are you locked into doing a greatly quantity of juice as you move up the AAS consumption level?

I think D7M's reference goes into the receptor issue somewhat.

~T

I think what the OP is trying to say is if you take two guys (Guy A and Guy B) who have been training for a long time and both have done a good amount of cycles and different compounds, and give them both the same amount of gear, what the end result be the same (in terms of weight gain) being that Guy B has 50+lbs and 6 inches on Guy A?

This is a very interesting question. Let's assume they both have a similar diet, a similar training program, and both get the same amount of rest and recovery. Obviously, the bigger you are, the more calories you need. Wouldn't it seem logical that the bigger you are, the more gear you need (assuming you're balls deep into gear)?

I wish I had an answer. This is funny because Dukk and I had this EXACT conversation about two days ago.

[Matt]

First of all stop saying ASS, its AAS..

Second what makes you think pro's spend thousands on aas, show me where you get this data from????

[tcw]

I can't give you a source data reference Dude...if i showed you the math...i think i would be violation of the posting rules.

Come on guy...you know that pro's spend 50k per year or MORE on AAS...its a known fact.

MOREOVER, you are diverting the subject point.

What difference does it make have MUCH a pro spends vs. and amateur?

Are pro's consuming more AAS than amateurs?

Why do they consume more AAS?

First of all stop saying ASS, its AAS..

Second what makes you think pro's spend thousands on aas, show me where you get this data from????

[GymHero]

I can't give you a source data reference Dude...however i can give you some math.

Does a BB who does 1 gram a week of test spend $100 bucks (over here in the states they do). Now...multiple that by 5 and you get $500 now by 4 and you get $2k per mth. NOW...that's only Test.

Come on guy...you know that pro's spend 50k per year on AAS...its a known fact.

[Matt]

I can't give you a source data reference Dude...however i can give you some math.

Does a BB who does 1 gram a week of test spend $20 bucks (over here in the states they do). Now...multiple that by 5 and you get $100 now by 4 and you get $400 per mth. NOW...that's only Test. Throw in the NUMEROUS other AAS stimulants and you get well over 2k per mth.

Come on guy...you know that pro's spend 50k per year on AAS...its a known fact.

This is not a known fact, and until you have the data to prove what you are saying then its just wrong..

Look at it from this point of view.

Two men both 5'10, natural man 1 can push his body weight to 220lbs (lbm). The other can only reach 190lbs (lbm).
Now they both run a 12 week cycle of test at 500mgs ew, at the end of the cycle man 1 hits 260lbs (lbm) and man 2 gets to 210lbs (lbm).

Now it doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out that genetics, training and most important diet plays the most significant role here, your putting to much emphasis on aas. Your trying to explain why these guys get so big and you think the only reason they do is down to massive amounts of aas. Trust me, your looking in the wrong place...

[tcw]

NOT what i'm saying BIG MAN...not at All !

You didn't read the original post.

We are all aware of the role genetics plays and diet...

SIMPLE QUESTION: "Do you consume more AAS than when you first started?

Now WHY do you consume more AAS?

That's it...that's my question.

~T

This is not a known fact, and until you have the data to prove what you are saying then its just wrong..

Look at it from this point of view.

Two men both 5'10, natural man 1 can push his body weight to 220lbs (lbm). The other can only reach 190lbs (lbm).
Now they both run a 12 week cycle of test at 500mgs ew, at the end of the cycle man 1 hits 260lbs (lbm) and man 2 gets to 210lbs (lbm).

Now it doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out that genetics, training and most important diet plays the most significant role here, your putting to much emphasis on aas. Your trying to explain why these guys get so big and you think the only reason they do is down to massive amounts of aas. Trust me, your looking in the wrong place...

[Big]

Does the Bodyweight and Height of a BB have ANY bearing on "how much juice they should do?"

BB 1 is 5.8, weights 185lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

BB2. is 6.3, weights 210lbs, bodyfat of 15%, does 1 gram of test a week.

1) SHOULD BB 2 be doing more than 1gram of Test per week?

2) How do you know how much test you should do?

thanks...

~T

NOT what i'm saying BIG MAN...not at All !

You didn't read the original post.

We are all aware of the role genetics plays and diet...

SIMPLE QUESTION: "Do you consume more AAS than when you first started?

Now WHY do you consume more AAS?

That's it...that's my question.

~T

that wasn't your original question. you simply asked if a slightly larger individual needed more gear. you gave no reference to cycle history for either individual, etc.
it seems you aren't very clear at making your point and your question keeps changing based on what you consider unsatisfactory responses. based on your last post above mine, you state that your question is
"SIMPLE QUESTION: "Do you consume more AAS than when you first started?"
does that mean in your original question both guys are supposed to be the same guy, and after cycling he went from 5'8" 185lbs and 15%bf to 6'3" 210lbs and 15%bf? you aren't making a bit of sense.

[Bonaparte]

Cliffs:
-starting size has little impact on much AAS is needed to see max results.
-Past (and especially, recent) AAS use will affect how much AAS should be used, as will where one stands in regard to his genetic potential.

[Big]

Cliffs:
-starting size has little impact on much AAS is needed to see max results.
-Past (and especially, recent) AAS use will affect how much AAS should be used, as will where one stands in regard to his genetic potential.

Excellent, that should answer both of his "original questions" lol.

[tcw]

Thank you.

Your bullet points answer the original question.

So basically, you don't know your genetic potential until you experiment with different doses of AAS.

*assuming all things equal (diet, rest, routines, etc).

Cliffs:
-starting size has little impact on much AAS is needed to see max results.
-Past (and especially, recent) AAS use will affect how much AAS should be used, as will where one stands in regard to his genetic potential.

[Reed]

But all things will never be the same.

Some can train more frequently and gain quicker and others do not. We all react different to foods, certain foods for some they cannot have.

Drugs... some will have to take more than others.

With references to pros. In the competitive world all that truly matters on the day is who is better.

Not what it took to get there or how much and I didn't take as much AAS or what not and thats why I didn't win. Nope you didn't win, end of story

[Hazard]

Maybe a better question would be this.....

Lets say theres just one guy......

in 2008 he was 6'1" 240lbs at 10%BF and would cruise between cycles at 200mg's of test/wk. Now it's 2010 and the same guy weighs 285lbs at 10% BF..... would it take a higher cruising dosage to maintain 45 more lbs of mass than it did at the lighter weight - assuming everything else is on point?

Maybe another way to look at it is this..... could jay cutler and myself crusie on the same ammount of test? If I don't lose any mass while cruising at 250mgs/wk would jay? Or would his huge size require a larger dosage?

~Haz~

[Hazard]

I would like to note..... I havn't surpassed 750mg's of test per week since i've crossed to the dark side. I've grown each cycle off the same dossage of test.....

~Haz~

[Reed]

Maybe a better question would be this.....

Lets say theres just one guy......

in 2008 he was 6'1" 240lbs at 10%BF and would cruise between cycles at 200mg's of test/wk. Now it's 2010 and the same guy weighs 285lbs at 10% BF..... would it take a higher cruising dosage to maintain 45 more lbs of mass than it did at the lighter weight - assuming everything else is on point?

Maybe another way to look at it is this..... could jay cutler and myself crusie on the same ammount of test? If I don't lose any mass while cruising at 250mgs/wk would jay? Or would his huge size require a larger dosage?

~Haz~

You could cruise at 300mgwk of just test

And he could cruise on 200mg and low dose growth.

Too many factors

But in regardless to the first, I would say it would require a higher dose. HOWEVER you gotta add room in for superior genetics cause he may still could


You won't ever be able to answer any of these questions. Too many factors

[Hazard]

You could cruise at 300mgwk of just test

And he could cruise on 200mg and low dose growth.

Too many factors

But in regardless to the first, I would say it would require a higher dose. HOWEVER you gotta add room in for superior genetics cause he may still could


You won't ever be able to answer any of these questions. Too many factors

oh yeah..... genetics will always be the key point. It's like trying to tell someone how much weight they will gain before they cycle..... it just can't be done.

~Haz~

[Reed]

food is always what supports the weight however. we can agree of that. he'll definitely be eating more food thats for sure

[Hazard]

food is always what supports the weight however. we can agree of that. he'll definitely be eating more food thats for sure

LMFAO! this is true..... once I hit 240..... I got sick to my stomach from eating. I've been able to maintain it but i'm just now starting to feel better. Time to bulk again

In Kai's video - his partner bought him 40lbs of fish and said it would last Kai a week! Theres no freakin way I could ever do that..... it's gotta take something special lol

~Haz~

[stevey_6t9]

LMFAO! this is true..... once I hit 240..... I got sick to my stomach from eating. I've been able to maintain it but i'm just now starting to feel better. Time to bulk again

In Kai's video - his partner bought him 40lbs of fish and said it would last Kai a week! Theres no freakin way I could ever do that..... it's gotta take something special lol

~Haz~

kais stomach looks like hes just eaten 40lbs of fish. massive GH gut lol.

[tcw]

True Dat !

AAS "DEFINATELY" helps process and synthesize protein.

So Mechanically, MORE juice will lead to greater processing of protein to muscle.

food is always what supports the weight however. we can agree of that. he'll definitely be eating more food thats for sure