Advice requested on doing a first cycle

**rusty84** · 03-26-2011, 07:44 PM

G'day guys,

Just wondering if anyone can help with a couple of questions that I have. I have been training seriously for the last 3 years and although I have made sufficient gains and I lift well - I'm still not happy with the physique that I have. I have a strict diet set by my trainer and follow it religiously. I have a well respected trainer in the industry of bodybuilding and prior to approaching him I thought I'd check with the forums. My stats are as follows:

Age: 27
Height: 5'11"
Weight: 87kgs / 190lbs

I train four days a week with my trainer.

I have heard that stacking Deca with Sustanon 250 isn't a bad stack for a first cycle. Is this true? I have read enough articles and forum responses to know that some form of oestrogen blocker is required as not to suffer from gyno. Can anyone recommend one?

I appreciate that my questions seem juvenile but I'd prefer to know everything and the options available to me before doing a cycle.

Any assistance that anyone is willing to provide is greatly appreciated.

Cheers

**Lemonada8** · 03-26-2011, 09:17 PM

u can use a AI or a SERM for the gyno issues, but i'd wait to see if u get it then order it...

thats a ok cycle sus is a combo of tests and deca is popular.

u need to get a PCT set also. ---> nolva and HCG

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 12:06 AM

Thanks.

Any other advice as to dosage?

**manblue** · 03-27-2011, 12:12 AM

i use 0.25 each other day (Anastrozole) i had a tiny bit of natural gyno too and it seems to be clearing up with this but if gyno gets worst ill up it to 0.50 eod ! most ppl will recommend you Aromasin (from the posts ive read)

id check with a more experienced member for the doses though just to be sure before you use it but i think 0.25 is correct.

**manblue** · 03-27-2011, 12:16 AM

Also you probably wanna do just 1 compound on your first cycle so if you run in to problems you know which compound it came from, i was recommended just doing a test only cycle @300 mg a week but some do 500 a week

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 12:20 AM

Ok. So for the first time I should try testosterone enanthate ?

**sixoner** · 03-27-2011, 12:21 AM

Originally Posted by Lemonada8

u can use a AI or a SERM for the gyno issues, but i'd wait to see if u get it then order it...

thats a ok cycle sus is a combo of tests and deca is popular.

u need to get a PCT set also. ---> nolva and HCG

I hate to call you on this lemonade but this advice IMO is reckless. a better course of action would be to have your ancilliary compounds and pct on hand before proceeding with a cycle, because shit happens and its best to have a plan and be prepared to deal with the problems that can arise. instead of waiting desperately for something to come through when you need it most. time and time again you can read on these forums how guys get in a jam then come on here screaming help!!!! because they don't have their shit squared away before proceeding with a cycle. dont be that guy. be smart.

also I would not follow your hcg /nolva pct either after running the compounds the op is suggesting.

much respect

OP there are a bunch of stickies in the pct section on this board definitely worth reading read swiftos stuff it should give you a very good understanding..there are also stickies up in this section that outline a beginner cycle in great detail as well...do some research and avoid rushing into things before you commit, the outcome of fooling around with these compounds could change your life.

**manblue** · 03-27-2011, 12:29 AM

Well im running test e , but it takes 4 weeks to properly kick in so some people do take 4 weeks of dbol to kick start your cycle but i wasn't recommended for same reasons i put before.

down to you really, you could run the cycle you have planned (funnily enough i was recommended same cycle from a friend before joining this forum)

but if you run into any bad side effects you wont know which compound it came from so bit of a gamble really.

and clomid and nova for pct

and like sixoner said get all your stuff before you pin so a disaster doesn't happen !

good luck

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 12:29 AM

Originally Posted by sixoner

I hate to call you on this lemonade but this advice IMO is reckless. a better course of action would be to have your ancilliary compounds and pct on hand before proceeding with a cycle, because shit happens and its best to have a plan and be prepared to deal with the problems that can arise. instead of waiting desperately for something to come through when you need it most. time and time again you can read on these forums how guys get in a jam then come on here screaming help!!!! because they don't have their shit squared away before proceeding with a cycle. dont be that guy. be smart.

also I would not follow your hcg /nolva pct either after running the compounds the op is suggesting.

much respect

Thanks Sixoner.

I have continued to read through the forum and many people suggest using test enanthate as a first time cycle. I have a couple of mates who just finished up on sustanon /deca who look awesome who have never run a cycle before. Just trying to decide on which path to take.

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 01:23 AM

I'll check out the stickies. Thanks for all the advice guys.

If any one else is able to provide their thoughts and experiences on sus/deca stacks and test e it would be awesome.

Cheers.

**Lemonada8** · 03-27-2011, 02:29 AM

I was hasty in my original response :P

Yes you should have your PCT items on hand before u start ur cycle. If gyno starts to flair up u can take a low dose of Nolva (Start at 10mg ED for a few days and see from there, just dont freak out and take like 100mgs cuz ull bloat like crazy and pop out in acne horribly cuz it will increase sides. Moral of the story, keep it low dose :P ) to help while u wait for the AI to come. Prolly should have been more clear.

IMO just run a Test only cycle. Save the add-ins for later
Ur choice on the test (test e, Sust, or other) is ur own choice. ive heard bad mojo with sust. but there are people who love it, its all personal preference, u gonna have to make a choice and stick with it.
Personally, i'd recommend Prop cuz of ED shots (seem like a daily motivator and fast acting and quick short burst-ish cycle)

As for ur PCT, on a Test only you can use a Nolva + HCG combo, you prolly dont need clomid (thats a lil agressive, used for more HPTA depressing cycles)
Nolva - 4 weeks 40/40/20/20
HCG - After 2 weeks in cycle to 2 weeks in PCT at 250iu 2x week (if u notice extreme shrinkage, move it to 250ius e2d... again dont go crazy and take alot)

Good Luck! Eat right and Train hard and ull get the body u want/like

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 03:08 AM

I have been reading that some people take a low dose of Nolva or alike throughout the whole cycle - Does this sound right or can this be done.

If doing a test only cycle I'm thinking that I'll do test e or sust. In regards to Prop and doing everyday shots - Since its my first cycle and the whole injecting thing is a little new I'd prefer to stick to something that I'd be able to do or at least get a little help with where I wont be pissing anyone off for continually asking someone to jab me. Make sense?

I'm all about eating and training right - I'm going to continue to use my trainer and be up front and honest with him when I start my cycle.

Thanks again for everyones advice - Please keep the opinions coming. All the information is fantastic.

**Lemonada8** · 03-27-2011, 03:16 AM

People who do that are erring on the side of caution. Perhaps they are prone to excess sides and want to prevent them. it can be done, although if u develop gyno during a cycle 95% chance its gonna go away completely when ur done. If u add in the AI or SERM on cycle, you can help it go away sooner.

I had no issues shooting prop, just alternate shooting sites. I found if i shot like 10 min before i worked out that i rarely/(if ever) has pain issues. but then again im more comfortable with needles than the average person lol.

Be sure to inject below the half life of the test ester u r gonna use. (every 3.5 day for test E i know, Sust i think is EOD or E2D? ull have to check on that one)

good luck!

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 03:42 AM

Originally Posted by Lemonada8

People who do that are erring on the side of caution. Perhaps they are prone to excess sides and want to prevent them. it can be done, although if u develop gyno during a cycle 95% chance its gonna go away completely when ur done. If u add in the AI or SERM on cycle, you can help it go away sooner.

I had no issues shooting prop, just alternate shooting sites. I found if i shot like 10 min before i worked out that i rarely/(if ever) has pain issues. but then again im more comfortable with needles than the average person lol.

Be sure to inject below the half life of the test ester u r gonna use. (every 3.5 day for test E i know, Sust i think is EOD or E2D? ull have to check on that one)

good luck!

Thanks.

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 05:10 AM

If anyone else has any recommendations or advice it would be greatly appreciated.

Still reading and researching - So any further ideas about a first cycle and options would be great.

**mtlbiceps** · 03-27-2011, 06:09 AM

Originally Posted by rusty84

If anyone else has any recommendations or advice it would be greatly appreciated.

Still reading and researching - So any further ideas about a first cycle and options would be great.

In terms of a first cycle its best to keep it simple. If you have everything in place no matter WHAT you take you'll make awesome gains. Everyone does on their first cycle. Now, you diet and training have to be well developed prior to beginning the cycle also! It does not matter how much test your taking you need to increase those calories and don't be afraid of losing that ab definition during the cycle.

I strongly recommend taking test only during your first cycle. That is the smart way to proceed. You have no idea how it will react with your system. Also, have PCT purchased prior to the first injection! Don't begin ANY cycle till you have everything in order, no matter how tempting it may be!

Remember, diet is 10x more relevant that your gear.

My first cycle was a combination of test E and deca with a 4-week front load of dbol . I don't remember the specific amounts but I gained about 20 - 25lbs after 12 weeks and used PCT properly to maintain most of my gains. It was overkill and I probably would have made great gains with 500mg of test /week.

Years later my cycles usually consist of varying levels of test for longer periods of time. In my view the old saying of test is best is usually true.

So, my advice is eat a shit load of calories, (not crap, good quality meals and a lot of shakes in between) and begin with a test only cycle. I know the more knowledgeable guys would probably say about 300mg/week or so to be safe but I would probably take 500mg/week.

MTLBiceps

**rusty84** · 03-27-2011, 08:30 PM

Hopefully everyone will excuse my ignorance. In doing anywhere between 300-500mg per week would this be in one dose or balanced across the week? Or are things like that personal preference?

**Lemonada8** · 03-27-2011, 10:27 PM

THis is where u have to do some math, dont worry tho its easy

you get ur dosage planned and then look at the ester. You NEED to shoot it no less than every half life (test e 3.5 days, test p 1.5 days, etc)

to be on the safe side, inject less more often = more stable levels.

**manblue** · 03-27-2011, 10:42 PM

yeah research intra muscular injections on the forum and watch the videos on youtube its important to know what stuff you need too because you dont want to get a infection !

I do test e and pin every 3.5 days in the glute don't feel a thing with a 23g needle.

first time you pin is a bit scary but seems to get easier every time !

do a lot more research before jumping in the deep end though because when you've done your research you will relise how important it was in the first place to do it !

im still learning too and this forum is a great place for all the info you need!

**warchild1721** · 03-27-2011, 11:47 PM

Test cyp or eth for first cycle just to see how you react. Its always better to be safe than sorry bro. 300-500mg seems fine bit id take the lower once a week to start. Pct can very. Seen nov the most but had a buddy if mine say nov and clomid both for pct. Check around the boards for everyones pct. There's a lot of types and all very in results. Good luck bro

**rusty84** · 03-29-2011, 08:46 PM

Hey guys,

Thanks for all the advice that everyone has given relating to my first cycle and the approach I should take. I have finally grown some balls and sat down with my trainer to see what he though about my options. After lengthy discussions he recommends that I cycle Sustanon and Deca , starting with 250/300mg Sust and Deca once a week. I train with him a couple of days a week at the moment and that will increase to 4 to 5 times a week and an increase of food. He suggests that I bulk up first and then as I start to diet down I commence my cycle.

Just putting it out there to see what everyone else thinks.

Cheers.