On gear while on blood thinners?

[bigjaylow]

Are there any complications on body when on gear and thinners?

[markdbg]

i dont see a problem with blood thinners and gear, a few buddys have been on gear so long they need to take blood thinners cause the gear has made there blood so thick they were put on heart and stroke watch, so i cant see a problem with it.

[Pac Man]

Hmmm, if you have a pre existing issue that requires the use of blood thinners than AAS could have a negative effect by thickening your blood even more.
I would be careful.

[bigjaylow]

Thanks guys

[bigjaylow]

My buddy had a clot after knee surgery and they put him on them!

[gixxerboy1]

i dont see a problem with blood thinners and gear, a few buddys have been on gear so long they need to take blood thinners cause the gear has made there blood so thick they were put on heart and stroke watch, so i cant see a problem with it.

If he has a prior condition causing him to require blood thinners he can have a problem. Yes blood thinners and aas wont interact. But the aas could cause his original problem to be worse.

Hmmm, if you have a pre existing issue that requires the use of blood thinners than AAS could have a negative effect by thickening your blood even more.
I would be careful.

Thank you. I agree

[sxxen]

i dont see a problem with blood thinners and gear, a few buddys have been on gear so long they need to take blood thinners cause the gear has made there blood so thick they were put on heart and stroke watch, so i cant see a problem with it.

So let me get this straight ...

you're saying there is no issues with it, yet your friends have thick blood because of steroid use ?

So ... you're saying its fine to cycle when he needs to take blood thinners for a reason we can assume?

[Big Kat]

From a medical perspective it depends on how long since the clot and if the clot has been verified by ultrasound to be resolved. If ur talking a dvt (deep vein thombosis) post surgery it can take months to resolve and if u thickening ur blood while the clot is still there ur raising ur stroke or pulmonary embolism risk from moderate WITH thinners to moderately high. Those complications (stroke and pe) are both real and very serious WITHOUT gear and can be fatal at worst and permently disabling. If its a dvt type clot do not touch anything until its verified to be 100% resolved with a totally negative ultrasound or cat scan. If the clots resolved and of the dvt type
(Which are caused by immobility after surgury allowing lower extremety veinous stasis) then ur good to go. Be sure, its his life at stake. I've seen a 25 year old drop dead from a piece of a clot breaking off 2 weeks after orthoscopic knee surgery. It's no joke

[R1Guy]

Anabolic steroids may increase sensitivity to oral anticoagulants. Dosage of the anticoagulant may have to be decreased in order to maintain desired prothrombin time. Patients receiving oral anticoagulant therapy require close monitoring, especially when anabolic steroids are started or stopped.

[oscarjones]

From a medical perspective it depends on how long since the clot and if the clot has been verified by ultrasound to be resolved. If ur talking a dvt (deep vein thombosis) post surgery it can take months to resolve and if u thickening ur blood while the clot is still there ur raising ur stroke or pulmonary embolism risk from moderate WITH thinners to moderately high. Those complications (stroke and pe) are both real and very serious WITHOUT gear and can be fatal at worst and permently disabling. If its a dvt type clot do not touch anything until its verified to be 100% resolved with a totally negative ultrasound or cat scan. If the clots resolved and of the dvt type
(Which are caused by immobility after surgury allowing lower extremety veinous stasis) then ur good to go. Be sure, its his life at stake. I've seen a 25 year old drop dead from a piece of a clot breaking off 2 weeks after orthoscopic knee surgery. It's no joke

Anabolic steroids may increase sensitivity to oral anticoagulants. Dosage of the anticoagulant may have to be decreased in order to maintain desired prothrombin time. Patients receiving oral anticoagulant therapy require close monitoring, especially when anabolic steroids are started or stopped.

Two very conflicting points.

Some information for you to read.

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Clin Appl Thromb Hemost. 2010 Apr;16(2):228-31. Epub 2008 Oct 30.

Pulmonary embolism associated with protein C deficiency and abuse of anabolic-androgen steroids.

Alhadad A, Acosta S, Sarabi L, Kölbel T.

University of Lund, Vascular Center Malmö-Lund, Malmö University Hospital, Malmö, Sweden.

Abstract

We present the case of a 19-year-old male athlete with protein C deficiency who developed proximal deep venous thrombosis and pulmonary embolism while abusing anabolic -androgenic steroids . Anabolic-androgenic steroids have been reported to have anticoagulatory and profibrinolytic effects in patients with protein C deficiency. Despite these antithrombotic effects, the patient developed repeated venous thromboembolism during treatment with low-molecular-weight heparin. The net effect of anabolic-androgenic steroids on the haemostatic system may change from antithrombotic to prothrombotic in male abusers of anabolic steroids with protein C deficiency.

PMID: 18977778 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

~~~~~~~~

Wien Med Wochenschr. 1993;143(14-15):401-2.

Interactions of anabolic steroids.

Kopera H.

Institute of Experimental and Clinical Pharmacology, Karl Franzens-University, Graz, Austria.

Abstract

Drug-drug interactions, or interference between drugs and other treatments, depend on many factors and are therefore difficult to predict. However, a number are clearly established in the case of anabolic-androgenic steroids. The beneficial interactions between anabolic steroids and radiotherapy or cytostatic drugs respectively are of therapeutic value. Adjuvant treatment with anabolic compounds in patients undergoing radiation and/or cytostatic therapy is beneficial because it can prevent or reduce depression of erythropoiesis, granulopoiesis and thrombopoiesis. It also diminishes protein catabolism, supports recovery, improves the general condition of the patient and minimizes radiation sickness. Potentially adverse interactions with anabolic steroids must be expected in the case of oral anticoagulants and antidiabetic drugs, since sensitivity to each of the latter is increased. This makes it particularly advisable to monitor patients receiving either oral anticoagulants or antidiabetic treatment concurrently with anabolic drugs.

PMID: 8256458 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

~~~~~~~~

Med Hypotheses. 1991 May;35(1):27-31.

Anabolic/androgenic steroid abuse and thrombosis: is there a connection?
Ferenchick GS.

Michigan State University, E. Lansing 48824-1319.

Abstract

Anabolic/androgenic steroid abuse is an increasing medical and public health problem. The uncontrolled use of these agents has been associated with numerous toxic side-effects including deleterious cardiovascular changes. The most widely reported to these latter changes include the development of adverse lipid profiles and hypertension. Acute thrombosis has only recently been linked to androgen abuse. Such a causative link has been proposed in reports of acute myocardial infarction and stroke in several athletes using androgens. Unfortunately, there exists no direct evidence that androgens are thrombogenic in humans. However, indirect experimental data suggests that androgens affect platelet aggregation, coagulation proteins and the vascular system in ways that facilitate thrombosis. Androgens also increase several anticoagulant and fibrinolytic proteins. However, they have not been shown to protect from thrombosis in high risk patients. Existing data supports a possible thrombogenic effect of exogenous androgens. Further studies are needed to clarify the hemostatic influence associated with androgen abuse in weightlifters. The abuse of these agents may diminish if acute thrombosis becomes clearly and scientifically associated with their uncontrolled use.

PMID: 1921773 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

~~~~~~~~

Folia Haematol Int Mag Klin Morphol Blutforsch. 1990;117(5):699-707.

Nebulized heparin and anabolic steroid in the prevention of postoperative deep vein thrombosis following elective abdominal surgery.

Zawilska K, Tokarz A, Misiak A, Psuja P, Wisławski S, Szymczak P, Meissner J, Karoń J, Lewandowski K, Lopaciuk S, et al.

Department of Haematology, Academy of Medicine, Poznań, Poland.

Abstract

One hundred eighty three patients, all over 40 years old, who underwent major abdominal surgery, were randomized into 3 groups: Group I received a single dose of nebulized heparin (800 IU per kg b.w.) administered by inhalation one day prior to surgery. Group II besides the above, also received a single injection of 50 mg of long acting anabolic steroid (nandrolone phenylpropionate) intramuscularly. Group III received 5000 IU heparin subcutaneously on hr prior to surgery as well as every 12 h for the next 5 postoperative days. Postoperatively the patients were evaluated for deep vein thrombosis (DVT) using the 125-I-fibrinogen test. The occurrence of DVT was determined as: in Group I--16%, in Group II--7.9%, in Group III--7.8%. Haemorrhagic complications (clinically important) were observed in 7.8% of patients from Group III, but only in 1.7% of patients in Group I and 1.6% in Group II. For DVT prophylaxis following abdominal surgery a single application of nebulized heparin and long acting anabolic steroid is as effective as conventional low-dose subcutaneous heparin administration, but gives less haemorrhagic complications. This method is also more advantagenous in term of acceptance by the patients and represents considerable saving of nursing time.

PMID: 1709*** [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

~~~~~~~~

Information is skewed.

[Big Kat]

Bottom line, if u have a dvt male sure its gone before u add more variables to the equation. Not worth the risk. Were not talkin gyno or elevated liver enzymes stuff here, were talkin stroke and sudden death type problems. Green veggies can interfere with thinners man, veggies! Don't take the chance till he's cleared. Just my opinion.