Turinabol question??

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 05:34 PM

I'm wondering if Turinabol shuts down your HTPA i've read that it doesn't but i've also read that you need a pct for it, so i'm sure it does.
I understand that Turinabol only cycle is crappy, but for informative reasons I'd like to know more. The main reason steroids are bad for (under 25) is because it shuts down your HTPA and you never come back the ''same'' and risk of HRT in the future? If Turinabol doesn't shut you down wouldn't it be safe for under 25's? Also I've read at another place that it decreases your production slowly 90%-80%-70% etc... What if you did extremely short cycles of it?

Thanks!

**MickeyKnox** · 11-01-2012, 05:49 PM

Oral only cycles are not recommended.

Yes, Tbol is a mild steroid . But although it may not shut you down completely,(depending on dose amount) it will suppress you.

So, its very difficult to give a cut and dry answer to these type of questions about Tbol and Var ect. Youre best not to do an oral only and stick with a test base to ensure your test levels are up. Include hCG on cycle and you won't have to worry about Testicular Atrophy.

**MuscleInk** · 11-01-2012, 05:52 PM

Tbol and var are the two least hepatotoxic orals, but I still never recommend running them alone. Each will suppress your endogenous testosterone (ANY exogenous test will) but as Mickey said, the amount and how fast you are suppressed correlates with dosage and duration.

At 18, I don't know why you would want to do that anyway!?!

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 08:32 PM

Originally Posted by MuscleInk

Tbol and var are the two least hepatotoxic orals, but I still never recommend running them alone. Each will suppress your endogenous testosterone (ANY exogenous test will) but as Mickey said, the amount and how fast you are suppressed correlates with dosage and duration.

At 18, I don't know why you would want to do that anyway!?!

I don't want to do that. If I were to do something, it wouldn't be orals only. And i am WAY far away from what i want to look like. Actually, my desired look is aesthetic and is achievable without gear. I am just extremely interested in all of it. Assuming that the dosage/duration were monitored to make sure the person never reaches 'shut down' would they not be safe to use? Also, to Mickey or whoever, what are the dangers if someone were to have proper gear/dosages, pct, and hcg during cycle? (under 25 ofc.)

Thanks!

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 08:36 PM

Also on a side note, I read a lot of things were they give a placebo to group A and group B gets some sort of steroid ... How is this even legal, if steroids were harmful? I've never read that the people studied were any age above 25?

**10nispro** · 11-01-2012, 09:00 PM

Doing everything by the book, as some might say, still doesn't 100% guarantee you will be perfectly fine after any cycle. You are playing a game with substances that can or will effect your body in various ways even after you are mature. So why even risk damaging something(HPTA) before its even mature.

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 09:17 PM

Also, for shut down of HTPA, is shut down - shut down? Or is there a difference between dbol shutting you down compared to a diff steroid ?

**10nispro** · 11-01-2012, 09:22 PM

Pct's are designed to bring back your natural testosterone production but it you destroy your HPTA, you will be not just shut down but shut off. Hence TRT or HRT for life. I promise you, you will find guys on here that wish they were not on trt.

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 09:24 PM

With proper pct, how does someone ''destroy'' their htpa?

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 09:31 PM

Originally Posted by dylan111557

With proper pct, how does someone ''destroy'' their htpa?

Because yours hasn't fully developed and matured yet and by shutting it down iyou risk it never reaching its peak

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 09:34 PM

It's peak? so you are saying it doesn't get destroyed it 'doesn't reach it's peak'. Basically saying that instead of being 100% developed at 25+ it will be x<100% developed? Assuming someone didn't want to be above 190lbs, what harm would that be if he reached that with the help of steroids early, and just maintained?

Thanks!

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 09:39 PM

Originally Posted by dylan111557

It's peak? so you are saying it doesn't get destroyed it 'doesn't reach it's peak'. Basically saying that instead of being 100% developed at 25+ it will be x<100% developed? Assuming someone didn't want to be above 190lbs, what harm would that be if he reached that with the help of steroids early, and just maintained?

Thanks!

No,

There isn't an exact age were we all stop developing and growing because this is determined by our genes and DNA, we are all genetically programmed individually and we inherit our genes from our parents. To give an exact age we stop growing would be incorrect because everyone's genetic blueprint is different.The main development of our bodies is up to the age of 21yrs of age but this can vary between individuals. There are parts of our bodies what carry on developing and adjusting slowly up until the age of 25yrs old, an example of this is the brain. The Endocrine system is a part of the brain what is very complex and keeps our bodies in a homeostasis state. Our testosterone levels start raising and roughly peak around 25yrs old and then start to slowly decline, so even though some of us may have stopped growing at the age of 21yrs old, others may still be developing up until the age of 25yrs old.

I have recently spoken to my Endo regarding this matter and he tells me that the HPTA is very sensitive and as many pathways how it regulates the human body, he states steroids disrupt the normal balance of hormones in the body which can cause reversible and irreversible changes at any age but risks are far more if you administrate exogenous androgens during development, this will put you in a very unnatural environment at a crucial time and your hormones should be treated with care especially in the early stages of maturity. The adverse effects can be erratic behaviour of the HPTA and potentially therapy when your older.

I did ask him what age he would think would be the safest as far as risk to damages and he said many endocrinologist suggest full maturation is reached by 25 years of age and this would also give the HPTA time to be established with your natural hormone balance and patterns. I personally feel 24-25yrs old would also be ideal starting point to get bloodwrok drawn to see exact what your natural levels are before starting any kind of cycles and waiting till you have reach your testosterone peak would be a good starting point, for me there is to much evidence over the forums and what I've seen personally over the last 25yrs I've been bodybuilding. Obviously it isn't going to be all 19- 21yr old bodybuilders who suffer side effects what are irreversible but I am edging on the side of caution what age I advice to the newbies.

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 09:46 PM

Thanks for the response, i've read that post from you before! Do people find out about hrt later in life, or do they know right after there cycle that something is wrong?

thanks!

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 09:50 PM

Sometimes it takes one cycle and some recover fine. Your risk but imho it isn't worth it. Achieve your goals by diet and training because at your age these areas will need a lot of work.

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 09:53 PM

So what is your opinion on anavar or turinabol or primobolan ? Also, what do you think about Clen . I've been doing EC stack and it's working great.

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 09:57 PM

My opinion is don't do any steriods at your age, that's what I've tried to explain to you in my posts. You want to gain size and muscle address your diet and use what you have naturally and don't shut it down, will be a big mistake if you do.

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 10:08 PM

Well your explanation to ''why'' is invalid.. if anavar or turinabol wouldn't shut you down(on low dose/time on it).... But like stated before i'm just trying to find answers and not ''don't do it'' because I am not doing it. It's a mix of curiosity and wanting to widen my knowledge about the subject. If you don't want to answer the questions properly than I'll ignore your post.

thanks.

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 10:10 PM

They will shut you down

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 10:21 PM

''So why else may you keep such a high proportion of what you gained on var? Well, I think it may be due to its relatively light impact on the HPTA, which brings me to my final point; Anavar will not totally shut down your HPTA, especially at lower doses (unlike testosterone , which will eventually do this even at a 100mg dose, or deca which will do it with a single 100mg dose). This could be due, at least partly, to the fact that Anavar doesnt aromatize (convert to estrogen).''
Got that from the information on this site, is it invalid?

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 10:30 PM

To run var at a dose and length what will help build some tissue it will shut you down. Remember your hpta isn't fully developed its not even running at peak so by suppressing it and shutting it down will probably cause you problems... if you can't gain size and tissue at your age then your diet isn't adequate enough its that simple and even if you used steriods it will be pointless because your diet won't support the new tissue so you will lose the gains...

Your the newbie asking people who know about steriods and you have started a few threads asking the same questions and you have had the same answers over and over but you still asking until you get the answers you want to hear.

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 10:35 PM

You don't have to get defensive, I am just asking Questions. If I never did I would be a newbie for ever. I hope you understand that even YOU were a newbie before.

Also ''your diet won't support the new tissue so you will lose the gains...'' What do you mean by that?
Thanks!

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 10:43 PM

It's not defensive, your only seeing it like that, I'm actually trying to help you from harming yourself.

If you can't gain muscle at your age and stats then using steriods will be pointless because after you come off cycle the diet your using isn't adequate enough to support any new tissue so you will lose the gains. You can gain another 20-30lbs naturally if you start eating like a bodybuilder should. No matter how much steriods you use if your diet can't support the new tissue your wasting your time.

**dylan111557** · 11-01-2012, 10:47 PM

Wouldn't my diet be changing throughout my cycle to continue gains, and once i'm at the end of my cycle my diet would be there as well no?

And as for using, I am not interested any time soon trust me. I went from 164-200lbs in 7 months and my gains have not been slowing down. But my life is very pre-planned/organized. I do my research when I can and save it for future use, I've done it when I first got interested in cars when I was 13, and when I was 16 for post-secondary school. This research and answers is no different.

**marcus300** · 11-01-2012, 10:53 PM

Change your diet now and use what you have naturally instead if shutting it down. The risks are not worth it imho and your time and research would be better suited in the diet section and come back to look at steriod in a few years.