SARMS, Ralox, and Nolva/Clomid?

[ineedauser]

I got a little rebound gyno about 3 months after test cycle. I want to run S4 and Osta for 8 weeks. I want to run Ralox to rid myself of the gyno. But I also read that Nolva or Clomid would work great at low doses for 8 weeks while on SARMS ? Would any of these compounds conflict with each other? Any negative sides to worry about when combining these?

[jimmyinkedup]

I agree ralox is your best bet and you can run it without issue with sarms . Id rum 60-80mg/day.
Tamox would also work 20mg/day.
Clomid is not the best option for gyno treatment in my opinion. In a pinch it will help but tamox and esp ralox are more effective.

[snowblowjoe]

Are you sure you have to take that many milligrams of the raloxifene? In the studies they did to get rid of the gyno it was more like 5 milligrams a day

[jimmyinkedup]

^^ I think you are mistaken:


Volume 20, Issue 4, December 2004

Table of Contents 20-4

Raloxifene and Tamoxifen Treatment of Pubertal Gynecomastia :

Lawrence and colleagues report their experience with the use of either raloxifene or tamoxifen, both antiestrogenic agents, in reducing breast size in adolescent boys with benign gynecomastia. The data presented are from a retrospective review of 37 patients: 12 received reassurance alone, 10 received raloxifene (60 mg once daily for 3 to 9 months), and 15 received tamoxifen (10 to 20 mg twice dialy for 3 to 9 months). Baseline studies including LH, FSH, testosterone , and estradiol levels were normal in all subjects and there were no significant differences among the groups with regard to age at initiation of treatment, Tanner stage, BMI or baseline hormone levels. Significant reductions in breast diameter were measured with both raloxifene (2.5cm, 66% reduction) and tamoxifen (2.1cm, 46% reduction). However, a 50% or greater reduction was seen more often in the raloxifene treated group (86% vs 41%). No side effects of the medications were reported.

Telephone follow-up was attempted to determine the rate of surgical treatment following the study. Approximately 40% of subjects contacted in each group underwent surgery. The authors concluded that treatment with the estrogen receptor inhibitors, raloxifene and tamoxifen, is both safe and effective, but admit that surgical intervention occurred despite the treatment. They further suggest that future studies need to utilize more precise methods for measuring glandular breast tissue and also for evaluating the psychosocial impact of various treatments.

Lawrence SE, Faught KA, Vethamuthu J, Lawson ML. Beneficial effects of raloxifene and tamoxifen in the treatment of pubertal gynecomastia. J Pediatr 2004;145:71-76.

1: J Pediatr. 2004 Jul;145(1):71-6. Related Articles,



Beneficial effects of raloxifene and tamoxifen in the treatment of pubertal gynecomastia.
Lawrence SE, Faught KA, Vethamuthu J, Lawson ML.
Department of Pediatrics, University of Ottawa, Ontario, Canada.

[email protected]

OBJECTIVES: To assess the efficacy of the anti-estrogens tamoxifen and raloxifene in the medical management of persistent pubertal gynecomastia.

STUDY DESIGN: Retrospective chart review of 38 consecutive patients with persistent pubertal gynecomastia who presented to a pediatric endocrinology clinic. Patients received reassurance alone or a 3- to 9-month course of an estrogen receptor modifier (tamoxifen or raloxifene).

RESULTS: Mean (SD) age of treated subjects was 14.6 (1.5) years with gynecomastia duration of 28.3 (16.4) months. Mean reduction in breast nodule diameter was 2.1 cm (95% CI 1.7, 2.7, P <.0001) after treatment with tamoxifen and 2.5 cm (95% CI 1.7, 3.3, P <.0001) with raloxifene. Some improvement was seen in 86% of patients receiving tamoxifen and in 91% receiving raloxifene, but a greater proportion had a significant decrease (>50%) with raloxifene (86%) than tamoxifen (41%). No side effects were seen in any patients.

CONCLUSION: Inhibition of estrogen receptor action in the breast appears to be safe and effective in reducing persistent pubertal gynecomastia, with a better response to raloxifene than to tamoxifen. Further study is required to determine that this is truly a treatment effect.

PMID: 15238910 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]



-----

1) ............We decided to evaluate the effect of raloxifene in a series of patients with gynaecomastia. Twelve patients aged 18-84 years were treated. Breast enlargement was unilateral in 5 cases; its duration ranged from a few weeks (7 cases) to several years (5 cases). Four patients were hypogonadal by clinical criteria, and had low serum testosterone. In two patients there was a possible drug effect (prasterone in one, ranitidine in the other). The size of breast tissue ranged between 1.5 and 6.0 cm. All patients had normal testes by palpation, and normal serum levels of estradiol, lh - leutenizing hormone - , FSH - follicle stimulating hormone - , prolactin, and alpha-HCG - human chorionic gonadotropin - . Liver function tests and serum creatinine also were normal. The dose of raloxifene was 60 mg every other day in 4 elderly patients (age 70 years or more), and 60 mg daily in the remaining; the medication was given for 2-12 months. Hypogonadal patients received, in addition, i.m. injections of testosterone enanthate , 100 mg twice a month.

Raloxifene was well tolerated; only one young patient reported a slight decrease in sexual potency. No subject complained of hot flushes; there were no episodes of thrombophlebitis during follow-up. The analgesic effect of treatment was fast (2-4 weeks) and sustained among 9 patients with pain and tenderness. The size of the gynaecomastia was evaluated monthly by means of a caliper (all patients), and ultrasonography (7 patients). All patients responded: there was an average reduction in size of 61% (range: 34-100%); in 2 patients gynaecomastia disappeared. Six of 8 eugonadal patients (75%) had a reduction in the size of breast tissue of at least 50% (average, 73%). Among hypogonadal patients (all of them followed with ultrasonography) gynaecomastia disappeared in one, and size reduction in the remaining subjects ranged between 46 and 67% (this is particularly noteworthy, since testosterone replacement not infrequently causes or aggravates gynaecomastia due to local aromatization to oestrogens by mammary tissue). Maximal effect was observed during the first 2 months of treatment.

This open, observational study suggests that raloxifene may be a safe, well tolerated and effective therapeutic alternative for drug-induced or idiopathic gynaecomastia in men of all ages.

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/eletters/327/7410/301#36880

[Turkish Juicer]

^^^ Nice

[ineedauser]

Excellent post! Thank you!


But did you recommend taking tamox and ralox together for several months or until gone?

[jimmyinkedup]

Excellent post! Thank you!


But did you recommend taking tamox and ralox together for several months or until gone?

You are welcome. Id suggest taking one or the other - not both together.

[snowblowjoe]

Yes my mistake, thanks for the corrections

[jimmyinkedup]

Yes my mistake, thanks for the corrections

No Prob. So many compounds and dosages, easy to get mixed up.