About to start my Test Prop Cycle some last minute questions

**goodoldmg** · 04-14-2014, 08:55 AM

Stats
27 y/o
6'2
218
15% BF

I have my cycle and diet laid out below along with some last minute questions. Did 3 cycles in my life test e only when I was 22, prop and tren when I was 23 and test and eq when I was 24. Haven't touched anything in almost 4 years. Looking to bring body fat down as much as possible the next 8 weeks while also maintain and gain some lean muscle mass.

Weeks 1-8 100mg test prop EOD
Weeks 1-8 250IU HCG 2x per week
Weeks 1-8 Arimidex .25mg every day

PCT with Nolva 40/20/20/20 and Clomid 100/50/50/50 start 3 days after last injection

Couple questions. I've read that you can safely mix hCG with test in the same shot. Is this true? Also if I take this route is there any reason i cant do HCG SQ on days that i am not doing test? What i mean is does it matter if i do my hcg sometimes IM with my test and sometimes SQ? Lastly it has been years since i have done this again so what barrel size is ideal for test and hcg? i know the length for IM depends on the site. I will alternate between shoulders and asscheeks as I remember prop hurts like a bitch.

Diet:
Total cals 2900 (baseline 3500)
320g protein
225g carbs
80g fat
1 day a week: 1g protein/lb, very low fat intake and increase carbs to 325g-350g
Will decrease these numbers as my weight falls but i have set it up to keep around -1lb per week

Stairmill 20-30 minutes 4-5 times per week

What do you think????

**clarky.** · 04-14-2014, 09:09 AM

Yes you can mix your hcg and test in the same barrel and it's ok to do some IM then sub Q on non test day and a 2ml barrel will be fine.

Have you got insulin syringes for you hcg ?

**tren_monster** · 04-14-2014, 10:22 AM

Never heard of hcg being done IM. You need a better pct than just Nolva and clomid. That pct is old school and over exaggerated on its effectiveness. Much better supps to run for a solid pct.

**goodoldmg** · 04-14-2014, 10:51 AM

Originally Posted by clarky.

Yes you can mix your hcg and test in the same barrel and it's ok to do some IM then sub Q on non test day and a 2ml barrel will be fine.

Have you got insulin syringes for you hcg ?

I havent ordered them yet. Can you recommend a good site? Possibly something with overnight delivery? I need to order both insulin and regular pins.

**clarky.** · 04-14-2014, 01:29 PM

Originally Posted by tren_monster

Never heard of hcg being done IM. You need a better pct than just Nolva and clomid. That pct is old school and over exaggerated on its effectiveness. Much better supps to run for a solid pct.

And what is better than a nolva & clomid pct ?

Originally Posted by goodoldmg

I havent ordered them yet. Can you recommend a good site? Possibly something with overnight delivery? I need to order both insulin and regular pins.

AR-R top of the page mate.

**MuscleInk** · 04-14-2014, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by tren_monster

Never heard of hcg being done IM. You need a better pct than just Nolva and clomid. That pct is old school and over exaggerated on its effectiveness. Much better supps to run for a solid pct.

The more common medically prescribed delivery IS intramuscular.

**Wizwell** · 04-14-2014, 04:51 PM

I too would like to know T-monster's supp pct???? Nolva and Clomid are old school???
I've always done my Hcg subQ.
MuscleInk, I don't mean to hyjack this thread. Just curious if the IM Hcg injections are more painful due to the water it's reconstituted with?

**drake4243** · 04-14-2014, 04:57 PM

Originally Posted by tren_monster

Never heard of hcg being done IM. You need a better pct than just Nolva and clomid. That pct is old school and over exaggerated on its effectiveness. Much better supps to run for a solid pct.

What? Much better supps for PCT, are you just going to make that statement and leave or do you plan to enlighten us on these much better supps. If you divulge such a profound criticism it would be nice to follow that critique up, with you answer on what is much better.

**MuscleInk** · 04-14-2014, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Wizwell

I too would like to know T-monster's supp pct???? Nolva and Clomid are old school??? I've always done my Hcg subQ. MuscleInk, I don't mean to hyjack this thread. Just curious if the IM Hcg injections are more painful due to the water it's reconstituted with?

No sir. I've given HCG injections to myself and patients using both SQ and IM injections. IM injections are slightly more uncomfortable but due to depth and trauma to muscle but difference is negligible if performed correctly. Saw is simply easier for many but absorption is a bit faster with IM as expected.

**pumping_iron86** · 04-15-2014, 12:31 PM

If you are to go the sq route, the abdominal adipose absorbs at a much faster rate...

**tren_monster** · 04-15-2014, 01:12 PM

tamoxifen exhibits two conflicting characteristics. It could act either as an anti-estrogen or as an estrogen. Therefore, while tamoxifen is anti-estrogenic to the breast, it also acts as an estrogen to the uterus and, to a lesser extent, the heart, blood vessels and bone. So, although it initially showed the tendency to counter breast cancer recurrence, it would soon be revealed that it also promoted particularly aggressive uterine and liver cancers, caused fatal blood clots and interfered with many other functions.

even if nolva boosts T (which I believe is false) the sides far outweigh the benefits. the guys around the net who push nolva are always guys on TRT.. i think that tells the story right there. the whole nolva/clomid PCT is so out of date its laughable. as someone who actually cycles on and off my recovery is the #1 thing.. and for me simply running the proper ancillaries on cycle, with HCG and HMG as a kickstart and then running a natty test booster does the trick for me every time.

To each their own. Nolva was used throughout the 70's and 80's but so where vcrs and cassette tapes. I'm not gonna throw out my DVD player. For every "trial" that shows the benefits there's 100 that are discrediting it. For everyone who is against natty boosters and claim they don't work. prove it. I get bloods ran before during and after cycle and pct. I run formeron hcg DAA unleashed and post cycle.

**Schwarzenegger** · 04-15-2014, 01:39 PM

Originally Posted by tren_monster

tamoxifen exhibits two conflicting characteristics. It could act either as an anti-estrogen or as an estrogen. Therefore, while tamoxifen is anti-estrogenic to the breast, it also acts as an estrogen to the uterus and, to a lesser extent, the heart, blood vessels and bone. So, although it initially showed the tendency to counter breast cancer recurrence, it would soon be revealed that it also promoted particularly aggressive uterine and liver cancers, caused fatal blood clots and interfered with many other functions.

even if nolva boosts T (which I believe is false) the sides far outweigh the benefits. the guys around the net who push nolva are always guys on TRT.. i think that tells the story right there. the whole nolva/clomid PCT is so out of date its laughable. as someone who actually cycles on and off my recovery is the #1 thing.. and for me simply running the proper ancillaries on cycle, with HCG and HMG as a kickstart and then running a natty test booster does the trick for me every time.

To each their own. Nolva was used throughout the 70's and 80's but so where vcrs and cassette tapes. I'm not gonna throw out my DVD player. For every "trial" that shows the benefits there's 100 that are discrediting it. For everyone who is against natty boosters and claim they don't work. prove it. I get bloods ran before during and after cycle and pct. I run formeron hcg DAA unleashed and post cycle.

Got an article to back up nolva and estrogen relation? I'm curious with the relation, never heard this before

**ironbeck** · 04-15-2014, 02:02 PM

Needle size for your IM go with 22g-25g x 1 1/2"
For your sq I recommend using a insulin syringe/needle its much more comfortable.
Good luck on your cycle bro

**FapOLantern** · 04-15-2014, 02:51 PM

Nolva does indeed boost Testosterone . It stimulates the pituitary to produce LH, which in turn stimulates the testes to pump out more testosterone. That's why Tamoxifen can be used for a SERM restart in hypogonadal men (much like Clomid, but with less side effects). That's basically what PCT is, a restart so your body can produce hormones on its own after suppression.

Also, just because you have an easier time recovering from a cycle (in no small part thanks to hCG , I wager), many people don't have the same luck. You'd get the same results without any "test boosters", is my take.

Ancilliaries on cycle just prevent the conversion of T into E. SERMS actually increase E2 serum levels due to one less place for the E2 to bind. That's why combining them with an AI is important.