Tbol only or test e for first cycle?

**john283** · 10-19-2014, 11:14 AM

Hey everyone, I had a couple of questions about Tbol. Not planning on starting for another six months, would rather start over summer.

My original plan was test e 500mg a week and hcg 1000 a week, arimidex as AI eod .25mg and PCT with nolva and clomid with a blood work done before 4 weeks in, and after.

However, recently, I saw a lot of tbol cycles. I don't know much of tbol at all and I just started researching it but was hoping someone could shed some light for me.

1) I know for anavar , people have run it without a test but it is recommended with test. Is tbol the same way? Is it recommended with test or can it be run without it?

2) Is the dosage of 80mg every day for 6-8 weeks good? Should you start low and work your way up or start at 80mg on the first day? (weight is 165lb)

3) Do you need arimidex for it? Would it be best to have it on hand just in case? I know it doesn't aromatize so it shouldn't cause gyno but I'm just making sure.

4) There would be no point of HCG since your testicles remain functioning while on tbol right?

5) Is tbol lighter on the HPTA than test?

The reason I'm contemplating this over the test is because I plan on cycling in April and I know test makes your face puffy and causes water retention and bloat. I am working at Calvin Klein for modeling this summer so that was the original reason why I wanted to gear but I don't think test would be a good idea now. GOALS: Just want to make some lean gains off of tbol without a large increase in body fat or bloating. Is there a better oral for this? Or is tbol the best bet.
I'm fine with pinning, I wouldn't mind pinning 4 times a week (test e and hcg) if I had to but I know test causes hair loss, acne, and puts your testicles on a "vacation" (can be prevented with hcg) but was wondering if tbol is milder and will not have those sides.

Diet would be 3000 calories (slightly over maintenance) with 210g protein and about 350-400g carbs (vegeterian so all my foods are complex carbs).

Thanks for the help everyone!

TBOL cycle (what I know so far from small bits of research):
60 or 80mg every day for 6 or 8 weeks
PCT after the 6 or 8 weeks with nolva and maybe clomid as well (have heard nolva is good enough). Should PCT be 2 weeks or 4 weeks for this?
Have taurine on hand in case of pumps
Any need for milk thistle or hawthorne berry or liv-52 just to be extra safe for the liver? Can you drink a bit while taking tbol?

**john283** · 10-19-2014, 11:15 AM

For the sake of avoiding starting a new thread, if I were on test e at 500 a week and arimidex .25mg eod and began to feel a lump in my chest, would it be best to start nolva then to prevent gyno and keep using it from that week all the way till the end of PCT? Or to up the arimidex? Just a bit confused, thanks!

**PistolPete33** · 10-19-2014, 11:22 AM

An oral only cycle is always a bad idea. Test is best. What are your stats? It's great that you're doing research just for what you're looking to accomplish it doesn't sound like cycling might not be a good idea for you. You won't get moon face on Test if E2 is in check.

**john283** · 10-19-2014, 11:31 AM

23 years old
195lb
13%body fat
5"10 height
Been lifting for 5 years

I still feel I may be developing a bit because I started late so I didn't really wanna take test. People have said tbol causes little to no acne, no bloat, no hairloss and is a good way to dip your feet into AS.

**marcus300** · 10-19-2014, 11:32 AM

Weight?
age?
yrs training?
bf?

**john283** · 10-19-2014, 11:38 AM

Posted ^

**john283** · 10-19-2014, 07:56 PM

bump

**reporich** · 10-19-2014, 08:09 PM

Read the stickies!

**john283** · 10-19-2014, 08:18 PM

I have mate, I know test e is widely renown for being the best cycle to start up on.

I'm not worried about pinning, it's just that I know the sides on test are harsher and, although the gains are greater, I'd rather stick to a very mild steroid for the first one to get my feet wet. People have reported no acne, hair loss, and since tbol hardly aromatizes, the chances of gyno and bloat are low as well. Just wondering if anyone has run tbol without test.

**PistolPete33** · 10-19-2014, 08:23 PM

You'll get next to no results doing an oral only cycle like this. You're better off just eating more and taking creatine.

**john283** · 10-19-2014, 08:27 PM

I've checked out various logs for tbol only and, generally, this compound stacks on 6-10 pounds that are kept after the cycle. I'm just trying to put on maybe 5-10lb of muscle without bloat or much addition to body fat for the summer.

**Slowhand** · 10-19-2014, 09:24 PM

Test P .75mg ED. You'll get used to pinning really quick! and you'll get that shit out of your system real quick to start PCT.

**lovbyts** · 10-19-2014, 09:58 PM

Originally Posted by john283

I've checked out various logs for tbol only and, generally, this compound stacks on 6-10 pounds that are kept after the cycle. I'm just trying to put on maybe 5-10lb of muscle without bloat or much addition to body fat for the summer.

People are lying. What they are not telling you is the tbol only will shut down your natural test production and you could have a very hard time recovering. ALL cycles should have test as the base and first cycle should be test only.