Test E -- More Difficult to Cut

**MToption2** · 05-24-2017, 01:23 PM

Beginning of cycle bulked from 160 to 180 (5'8) in 6 weeks. Disturbingly effortlessly..whereas off cycle it would've been a struggle. Overall, I wasn't eating that much more.

In early May, my stomach was looking bad so I decided to cut. Past few weeks I've been eating at 1500-1750 calories yet am barely losing weight. Hovering at 177-178 now. But I don't think the last 2 pounds have been fat. My actual gut is near constantly flat now but I think it's all the food that's left. The pudgy stomach fat is the same I think. I know it's wayy to early to decide to reduce calories further.

Honestly, I think it's going along just fine but my question is does Testosterone make it more difficult to lose weight/easier to bulk regardless of caloric intake? I swear if I ate like this off cycle, I would be back down to 160 or less in no time. I was struggling to stay at that...

**Nephets** · 05-24-2017, 01:27 PM

I wouldn't waste the test cycle on a cut. im guessing you only have 6 weeks left. Id continue to bulk but maybe dial your calories back a bit if you are putting on fat that fast. how many calories were you eating in a day and whats your normal tdee.

**The Deadlifting Dog** · 05-24-2017, 01:39 PM

Are you using an AI?

**MToption2** · 05-24-2017, 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by Nephets

I wouldn't waste the test cycle on a cut. im guessing you only have 6 weeks left. Id continue to bulk but maybe dial your calories back a bit if you are putting on fat that fast. how many calories were you eating in a day and whats your normal tdee.

4 months (unemployed) pre-cycle ~2500k 160 lbs maintenance

6 weeks on cycle. Working 60 hrs a week standing. Some cheat days but caloric intake near similar. Probably a couple hundred calories more.
--
Macros same throughout 6 week bulk vs off cycle:

1. Raw egg banana protein powder smoothie ~1000k (morning)

2. Afternoon lunch
Or
2. Evening dinner

3. Quart of Kefir ~600k (before bed)
--
Now 2 weeks into cut: only
-One single moderate size meal (1000-1500 cals)
-50g protein can (250 cal)
--
Also on:
-Aromasin 12.5mg ED
-hCG 500iu E3D
-hGH 10iu E3D or EOD
-Proviron 50-100mg ED
--
Water intake and cardio same. Strength training days increased.
--
Got BW drawn a couple days ago. Will have results next week.

**Nephets** · 05-24-2017, 01:53 PM

if that's all your eating im going to say a lot of the weight you gained is water. that is very little food.

**ironbeck** · 05-24-2017, 01:54 PM

Test helps build muscle and burn fat. That why its harder to lose fat naturally as a male after 40 as opposed to 20.

**MToption2** · 05-24-2017, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by Nephets

if that's all your eating im going to say a lot of the weight you gained is water. that is very little food.

Yeah that could be it. I was eating above maintenance but nothing like 500+ over. Half my calories were drinkable. The 20 pound gain without trying was unexpected. Maybe it could've also been another hormone messed up?

I remember Clomid making it easy to bulk too.

**ironbeck** · 05-24-2017, 02:17 PM

Test is good for bulking as well as cutting....period. It's science.

**PT1982** · 05-24-2017, 03:01 PM

Test is test. Some swear that long esters tend to increase water retention vs the shorter esters. I've just never experienced this, and don't see any plausible data (scientific or otherwise) to support it. I could be wrong, but I always use long ester test to cut. I use a trt or lower dose though.

Are you using an AI?

At 180, even at 5'8", I don't see a reason for you to be cutting. We've all been there, planning for beach season. But 180lbs isn't much to cut from. I'd be willing to bet you'd look better just running the blast at maintenance calories or a little above to everyone. The cutting part, at your weight, is all in your head.

**MToption2** · 05-24-2017, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by PT1982

Test is test. Some swear that long esters tend to increase water retention vs the shorter esters. I've just never experienced this, and don't see any plausible data (scientific or otherwise) to support it. I could be wrong, but I always use long ester test to cut. I use a trt or lower dose though.

Are you using an AI?

At 180, even at 5'8", I don't see a reason for you to be cutting. We've all been there, planning for beach season. But 180lbs isn't much to cut from. I'd be willing to bet you'd look better just running the blast at maintenance calories or a little above to everyone. The cutting part, at your weight, is all in your head.

Yup I'm on an AI. Aromasin 12.5mg ED. BW results next week will know if I need to bump it up. I think I'm exactly at 20% bf now. Don't want to go any further. I'd be happy if I could hit ~12% or at least a visible four pack in the next 6-8 weeks.

**PT1982** · 05-24-2017, 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by MToption2

Yup I'm on an AI. Aromasin 12.5mg ED. BW results next week will know if I need to bump it up. I think I'm exactly at 20% bf now. Don't want to go any further. I'd be happy if I could hit ~12% or at least a visible four pack in the next 6-8 weeks.

Not to be a Debbie Downer, but dropping 8% body fat in 6-8 weeks is going to be impossible. I'm not trying to discourage you, so please don't take it as my being negative. However, you can get a great start to your goal in that amount of time, and it'll be enough to keep you motivated! That's the key. Keep expectations reasonable or you'll set yourself up for disappointment. I've learned to set my goals much lower than is actually possible in order that when they are reached, anything over is a bonus and makes me very happy! You'll get there no doubt. I have faith in you as long as I know you're doing everything it takes to make your goals a reality.

**Jphunter** · 05-24-2017, 09:09 PM

Originally Posted by MToption2

4 months (unemployed) pre-cycle ~2500k 160 lbs maintenance

6 weeks on cycle. Working 60 hrs a week standing. Some cheat days but caloric intake near similar. Probably a couple hundred calories more.
--
Macros same throughout 6 week bulk vs off cycle:

1. Raw egg banana protein powder smoothie ~1000k (morning)

2. Afternoon lunch
Or
2. Evening dinner

3. Quart of Kefir ~600k (before bed)
--
Now 2 weeks into cut: only
-One single moderate size meal (1000-1500 cals)
-50g protein can (250 cal)
--
Also on:
-Aromasin 12.5mg ED
-hCG 500iu E3D
-hGH 10iu E3D or EOD
-Proviron 50-100mg ED
--
Water intake and cardio same. Strength training days increased.
--
Got BW drawn a couple days ago. Will have results next week.

Your not eating enough ,raps which is causing your metabolism to stall .

**Jphunter** · 05-24-2017, 09:11 PM

Originally Posted by ironbeck

Test is good for bulking as well as cutting....period. It's science.

I just concur , I don't care what your taking , if your diet is not in check your missing out gaining or cutting !

**MToption2** · 05-24-2017, 10:46 PM

Originally Posted by Jphunter

Your not eating enough ,raps which is causing your metabolism to stall .

Raps? You're saying I should eat more to lose fat? My current protein is ~100 grams. Carbs about that and fat lower.

**PT1982** · 05-25-2017, 05:36 AM

Originally Posted by MToption2

Raps? You're saying I should eat more to lose fat? My current protein is ~100 grams. Carbs about that and fat lower.

100 grams of protein is 400 calories. You say you're eating the same in carbs, which is also 400 calories. That's 800. I'm assuming your fat is 50g, so that's 450 calories. That's 1250, way too low in my opinion. Eating too little during a cut can have poor results. You have to have the calories to have the energy to burn off. Keep the metabolism high.

**MToption2** · 05-25-2017, 11:38 AM

Originally Posted by PT1982

100 grams of protein is 400 calories. You say you're eating the same in carbs, which is also 400 calories. That's 800. I'm assuming your fat is 50g, so that's 450 calories. That's 1250, way too low in my opinion. Eating too little during a cut can have poor results. You have to have the calories to have the energy to burn off. Keep the metabolism high.

Ok. I will consider bumping it up. I don't know my current metabolic rate. Haven't had it tested professionally in a while. Electrolytes are in check. E2 unknown. Macro ratios ok.

Still at 178. It's been 2 weeks eating like this. Some days I'll nibble of some snacks. Right now I got a 2 pack showing upper stomach lol. Still got veins showing nicely when working out (arms). Not as prominent as before. I'm also on "HGH". My thinking is that and the Test act as a strong muscle sparing stack while cutting hard.

My plan is to cut then blast/bulk with low dose Tren E/Masteron E. Of course with Test E as a base.

**MToption2** · 05-25-2017, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by PT1982

Not to be a Debbie Downer, but dropping 8% body fat in 6-8 weeks is going to be impossible. I'm not trying to discourage you, so please don't take it as my being negative. However, you can get a great start to your goal in that amount of time, and it'll be enough to keep you motivated! That's the key. Keep expectations reasonable or you'll set yourself up for disappointment. I've learned to set my goals much lower than is actually possible in order that when they are reached, anything over is a bonus and makes me very happy! You'll get there no doubt. I have faith in you as long as I know you're doing everything it takes to make your goals a reality.

I didn't see this. Ok thanks!! That's why the hard cut (greater than or equal to 1000 cal deficit). I just didn't anticipate the metabolic stall. BW results next week will reveal a lot.