Best way to rebound out of a show

[Livinlean]

So, what's your favourite way to rebound out of a show?

Do you start eating anything and everything? Do you drop all your drugs or switch to off season AAS like deca , eq etc? Maybe take some time away from the gym and go on vacation?

I've tried the method Chad Nichols prescribes most of his clients (or did at least) which is essentially to gain as much weight as possible as fast as possible. This theory works really well if you have a short off season because it wouldn't make sense to use someone like Andrew Vu's method of slowly rebounding out of the show and keeping lean gains if time if of the essence. The problem with the first method is that it will really mess your blood pressure up, in my case even with fasted cardio in the mix.


I don't think theres any right or wrong way of doing this as we all have different goals and not to mention, our bodies are all different but I'm still curious to see what works for you guys and what you liked best.

[5millionbucks]

Yea this is a question I do have also; say you want to get shredded or just did a show and dropped a shit ton of bodyfat while using some/alot of anabolics. I do see the bridging off cycle protocol on here; say if you went completely off everything(meaning super high cortisol low test high estro etc.) how would you prevent on getting fat or adding on too much bodyfat without risking muscle loss during PCT after getting shredded or coming out of a show? Like supplement wise and nutrition wise what would be best; maintenance calories, using a cortisone killer like humanoforte or lean extreme?

[GearHeaded]

this is person and situation dependent .. but I'll give some broad basic points based on information I've received and clients I've worked with over the years

- you do NOT want to 'water rebound'. at the amateur level most guys are having to make weight. so between making weight and wanting to come in as dry as possible and using water cutting techniques and diuretics , you can easily 'water rebound' hard. this can easily land you in the ER with cardiac edema or even possibly cardiac arrest.. gaining 25 pounds of water weight post show is not good.
if you had to water cut hard to either make weight or get really dry, then you need to ease out of the show. don't go crazy with junk food and cheat meals.. increase your calories (they were likely already increase coming into the show because of the carb load) with the foods you have been eating the whole prep.. adding in a bunch of 'new foods' you have not been eating will just cause inflammation and water retention. so if you celebrate post show with 'cheat food' do it with only one meal and keep your food simple.. you can also utilize a diuretic like a half dyazide a day post show for a couple days.

keep water retention in check. ramp up calories and slowly put new tissue on. I don't believe in ''reverse dieting" for most people . you need to get your size and body fat % back up fairly quickly , but you just want to limit the water retention and inflammation aspect


- as for drugs/AAS . well depends on when your next show is or if your going into an off season. you could keep on the androgenic drugs you were using going into the show to help limit the water retention rebound post show (androgens can help off set water retention).. but I would NOT immediately jump onto a bulking cycle with highly retentive drugs (like deca , dbol , anadrol , high dose test) .. stepping back into a 6 week cruise phase using a bit of Primo is the best bet . THEN go into your off season cycle

- utilizing growth factors (like HGH, Insulin , Mk677, IGF, etc) post contest during your cruise on going into your off season bulk is a good idea as well .. you will be hyper responsive to them coming out of your cut/show. just don't start these too soon post show because of possible water retention..

if you guys are following Chargers log and my coaching of him. you'll see that after his last contest we cruised for awhile , and then implemented the growth factors protocol going into the off season and he immediately jumped up 30 pounds. the water retention came later, not right away (not post show).
water retention is fine and will actually help you grow . but again you have to ease into it.


- for women. reverse dieting is more prevalent and a more viable option.. mainly because metabolic stress is much higher with women getting super shredded then it is with men.


- AND last NOTE .. DON't DIE post contest.. I'm serious. you don't hear this on the news, but every year at some show a bodybuilder will die post contest. happens often. off the top of my head I know of 2 that died this summer post contest.
what happens is mainly incorrect usage of diuretics. they get dry and shed a ton of water and look good on stage,, then the post show re-bound kills them.
they die of a heart attack or cardiac failure a day or two after the show. its not just the diuretics, its their own fault and the food they gorge themselves on afterwards. the reason their heart stops is from hyper-aklemia (too high of blood potassium). potassium regulates electro impulses in the body and the beating of the heart , too low of potassium your heart will stop beating, too high of potassium you'll go into cardiac arrest.

these people die because they over use potassium sparing diuretics (thinking they are safer when they actually are not).. they strip a ton of water from their body and all that potassium is left behind . THEN post show they begin eating everything in sight.. all that yummy cheat food and carbs have a ton of potassium in them. their potassium is already too high to begin with cause of the diuretics.. they get hyper-aklemia and go into cardiac arrest and die.


so yeah, the last point . don't die post contest.. !! also don't get overly advanced with the drug protocols and diuretics and water cutting techniques without a good coach on your side helping you out . if your doing things alone just keep it simple and don't gorge yourself post show.

[5millionbucks]

this is person and situation dependent .. but I'll give some broad basic points based on information I've received and clients I've worked with over the years

- you do NOT want to 'water rebound'. at the amateur level most guys are having to make weight. so between making weight and wanting to come in as dry as possible and using water cutting techniques and diuretics , you can easily 'water rebound' hard. this can easily land you in the ER with cardiac edema or even possibly cardiac arrest.. gaining 25 pounds of water weight post show is not good.
if you had to water cut hard to either make weight or get really dry, then you need to ease out of the show. don't go crazy with junk food and cheat meals.. increase your calories (they were likely already increase coming into the show because of the carb load) with the foods you have been eating the whole prep.. adding in a bunch of 'new foods' you have not been eating will just cause inflammation and water retention. so if you celebrate post show with 'cheat food' do it with only one meal and keep your food simple.. you can also utilize a diuretic like a half dyazide a day post show for a couple days.

keep water retention in check. ramp up calories and slowly put new tissue on. I don't believe in ''reverse dieting" for most people . you need to get your size and body fat % back up fairly quickly , but you just want to limit the water retention and inflammation aspect


- as for drugs/AAS . well depends on when your next show is or if your going into an off season. you could keep on the androgenic drugs you were using going into the show to help limit the water retention rebound post show (androgens can help off set water retention).. but I would NOT immediately jump onto a bulking cycle with highly retentive drugs (like deca , dbol , anadrol , high dose test) .. stepping back into a 6 week cruise phase using a bit of Primo is the best bet . THEN go into your off season cycle

- utilizing growth factors (like HGH, Insulin , Mk677, IGF, etc) post contest during your cruise on going into your off season bulk is a good idea as well .. you will be hyper responsive to them coming out of your cut/show. just don't start these too soon post show because of possible water retention..

if you guys are following Chargers log and my coaching of him. you'll see that after his last contest we cruised for awhile , and then implemented the growth factors protocol going into the off season and he immediately jumped up 30 pounds. the water retention came later, not right away (not post show).
water retention is fine and will actually help you grow . but again you have to ease into it.


- for women. reverse dieting is more prevalent and a more viable option.. mainly because metabolic stress is much higher with women getting super shredded then it is with men.


- AND last NOTE .. DON't DIE post contest.. I'm serious. you don't hear this on the news, but every year at some show a bodybuilder will die post contest. happens often. off the top of my head I know of 2 that died this summer post contest.
what happens is mainly incorrect usage of diuretics. they get dry and shed a ton of water and look good on stage,, then the post show re-bound kills them.
they die of a heart attack or cardiac failure a day or two after the show. its not just the diuretics, its their own fault and the food they gorge themselves on afterwards. the reason their heart stops is from hyper-aklemia (too high of blood potassium). potassium regulates electro impulses in the body and the beating of the heart , too low of potassium your heart will stop beating, too high of potassium you'll go into cardiac arrest.

these people die because they over use potassium sparing diuretics (thinking they are safer when they actually are not).. they strip a ton of water from their body and all that potassium is left behind . THEN post show they begin eating everything in sight.. all that yummy cheat food and carbs have a ton of potassium in them. their potassium is already too high to begin with cause of the diuretics.. they get hyper-aklemia and go into cardiac arrest and die.


so yeah, the last point . don't die post contest.. !! also don't get overly advanced with the drug protocols and diuretics and water cutting techniques without a good coach on your side helping you out . if your doing things alone just keep it simple and don't gorge yourself post show.

what about if you want to come of all anabolics after a show and PCT; would your bridging method be enough to prevent one from getting too fat even if they ramped up their calories; or should they adjust their calories to maintenance based on their new tdee because of not being on anabolics no more? Like is it possible to rebound a good amount of glycogen, water and muscle naturally after coming off a cutting cycle with anabolics because cortisol and estro will be out of whack during PCT.

[GearHeaded]

what about if you want to come of all anabolics after a show and PCT; would your bridging method be enough to prevent one from getting too fat even if they ramped up their calories; or should they adjust their calories to maintenance based on their new tdee because of not being on anabolics no more? Like is it possible to rebound a good amount of glycogen, water and muscle naturally after coming off a cutting cycle with anabolics because cortisol and estro will be out of whack during PCT.

well first off , if your peak week went well , you should of glycogen rebounded and be retaining a super compensated level of glycogen on the day you stepped on stage ,, not after. so really the glycogen load happens before the show and not after,, though often times glycogen keeps loading days after the show as well (and its not always just glycogen being replenished that gives the fullness, its also inter cellular triglycerides .. which is why I'll often times add fats to a contest prep clients carb up process)

post show, I would definitely NOT go right into a PCT .. just by dieting down that hard you've already put yourself in a catabolic state. going right into PCT is just going to further drive that catabolic state. this is why real "natural" pro bodybuilders are so small, the average pro natural is 150 pounds on stage, yes 'pro' level (not amateur), their hormones completely shut down getting that lean and they thus lose a ton of muscle and size.. we have an andvatage being enhanced in that we can get that lean and just simply exogenously manipulate or hormone/androgen/estrogen levels and keep plenty of size and muscle getting lean.. so there is not reason to go right from post contest into PCT (and thus crashing hormone levels).. I would stay on cycle for at least 4 weeks until your body weight starts climbing back up to maintenance .

of course the most optimal for gains is just to bridge from post contest cycle to off season cycle

[5millionbucks]

well first off , if your peak week went well , you should of glycogen rebounded and be retaining a super compensated level of glycogen on the day you stepped on stage ,, not after. so really the glycogen load happens before the show and not after,, though often times glycogen keeps loading days after the show as well (and its not always just glycogen being replenished that gives the fullness, its also inter cellular triglycerides .. which is why I'll often times add fats to a contest prep clients carb up process)

post show, I would definitely NOT go right into a PCT .. just by dieting down that hard you've already put yourself in a catabolic state. going right into PCT is just going to further drive that catabolic state. this is why real "natural" pro bodybuilders are so small, the average pro natural is 150 pounds on stage, yes 'pro' level (not amateur), their hormones completely shut down getting that lean and they thus lose a ton of muscle and size.. we have an andvatage being enhanced in that we can get that lean and just simply exogenously manipulate or hormone/androgen/estrogen levels and keep plenty of size and muscle getting lean.. so there is not reason to go right from post contest into PCT (and thus crashing hormone levels).. I would stay on cycle for at least 4 weeks until your body weight starts climbing back up to maintenance .

of course the most optimal for gains is just to bridge from post contest cycle to off season cycle

What about say if you were just coming out of a cut; like for a photoshoot or something or just wanted to get shredded(not pro conditioning) like 7-8% bodyfat; would same logic go; or would it be alright to go into pct and start introducing more food from their(not like a crazy bulk or anything)?

[GearHeaded]

What about say if you were just coming out of a cut; like for a photoshoot or something or just wanted to get shredded(not pro conditioning) like 7-8% bodyfat; would same logic go; or would it be alright to go into pct and start introducing more food from their(not like a crazy bulk or anything)?

even for people doing this just for fun , I don't advocate going from a cut directly into pct. your way better off going into a maintenance phase or cruise phase for a good 4-6 weeks

pct is generally one of the most catabolic things you can do and should be limited

also , the mind set of .. bulk, cut, bulk, cut, bulk cut, etc. is not optimal . your better off bulking and then maintaining and acclimating to those new gains for several months before going into a cut phase..

[5millionbucks]

even for people doing this just for fun , I don't advocate going from a cut directly into pct. your way better off going into a maintenance phase or cruise phase for a good 4-6 weeks

pct is generally one of the most catabolic things you can do and should be limited

also , the mind set of .. bulk, cut, bulk, cut, bulk cut, etc. is not optimal . your better off bulking and then maintaining and acclimating to those new gains for several months before going into a cut phase..

I see I might then extend my cycle; cause I was just trying to doing something for 6-8 weeks to get really lean; then bulk up natty. To be honest if my bodyfat goes up like 1-2% in PCT I wouldn't really mind it that much. Some people I hear say taking either low dose osta or clen coming after a cycle whether you were bulking or cutting would help minimize that extra fat gain. I guess its all about cortisol and estrogen control after coming off.

[Kyle1337]

At what point when bulking, is to much BF%? Where do you draw the line and say ok, need to add mass, but max is 12% BF when doing it, etc..

[Livinlean]

this is person and situation dependent .. but I'll give some broad basic points based on information I've received and clients I've worked with over the years

- you do NOT want to 'water rebound'. at the amateur level most guys are having to make weight. so between making weight and wanting to come in as dry as possible and using water cutting techniques and diuretics , you can easily 'water rebound' hard. this can easily land you in the ER with cardiac edema or even possibly cardiac arrest.. gaining 25 pounds of water weight post show is not good.
if you had to water cut hard to either make weight or get really dry, then you need to ease out of the show. don't go crazy with junk food and cheat meals.. increase your calories (they were likely already increase coming into the show because of the carb load) with the foods you have been eating the whole prep.. adding in a bunch of 'new foods' you have not been eating will just cause inflammation and water retention. so if you celebrate post show with 'cheat food' do it with only one meal and keep your food simple.. you can also utilize a diuretic like a half dyazide a day post show for a couple days.

keep water retention in check. ramp up calories and slowly put new tissue on. I don't believe in ''reverse dieting" for most people . you need to get your size and body fat % back up fairly quickly , but you just want to limit the water retention and inflammation aspect


- as for drugs/AAS . well depends on when your next show is or if your going into an off season. you could keep on the androgenic drugs you were using going into the show to help limit the water retention rebound post show (androgens can help off set water retention).. but I would NOT immediately jump onto a bulking cycle with highly retentive drugs (like deca , dbol , anadrol , high dose test) .. stepping back into a 6 week cruise phase using a bit of Primo is the best bet . THEN go into your off season cycle

- utilizing growth factors (like HGH, Insulin , Mk677, IGF, etc) post contest during your cruise on going into your off season bulk is a good idea as well .. you will be hyper responsive to them coming out of your cut/show. just don't start these too soon post show because of possible water retention..

if you guys are following Chargers log and my coaching of him. you'll see that after his last contest we cruised for awhile , and then implemented the growth factors protocol going into the off season and he immediately jumped up 30 pounds. the water retention came later, not right away (not post show).
water retention is fine and will actually help you grow . but again you have to ease into it.


- for women. reverse dieting is more prevalent and a more viable option.. mainly because metabolic stress is much higher with women getting super shredded then it is with men.


- AND last NOTE .. DON't DIE post contest.. I'm serious. you don't hear this on the news, but every year at some show a bodybuilder will die post contest. happens often. off the top of my head I know of 2 that died this summer post contest.
what happens is mainly incorrect usage of diuretics. they get dry and shed a ton of water and look good on stage,, then the post show re-bound kills them.
they die of a heart attack or cardiac failure a day or two after the show. its not just the diuretics, its their own fault and the food they gorge themselves on afterwards. the reason their heart stops is from hyper-aklemia (too high of blood potassium). potassium regulates electro impulses in the body and the beating of the heart , too low of potassium your heart will stop beating, too high of potassium you'll go into cardiac arrest.

these people die because they over use potassium sparing diuretics (thinking they are safer when they actually are not).. they strip a ton of water from their body and all that potassium is left behind . THEN post show they begin eating everything in sight.. all that yummy cheat food and carbs have a ton of potassium in them. their potassium is already too high to begin with cause of the diuretics.. they get hyper-aklemia and go into cardiac arrest and die.


so yeah, the last point . don't die post contest.. !! also don't get overly advanced with the drug protocols and diuretics and water cutting techniques without a good coach on your side helping you out . if your doing things alone just keep it simple and don't gorge yourself post show.

Just read thru Chargers log, thanks for directing me to there.

I think post show this time around I will run low dose test + EQ, like 250 each for about 2 weeks until the water weight subsides and then add insulin and MK677 for another 4 weeks so kind of a cruise for 6 weeks there before adding more compounds like Deca + Anadrol + HGH. I had done something similar to this in the past with pretty good results. The mistake I made in the past however was that I didn't not really make set plans and rather made changes as I went along which can be beneficial as well but I think i'll try sticking to a plan this time to better evaluate my results.

As long as either my lifts are going up or the scale is moving up, I won't be adding any compounds or raising dosages as it wont be necessary. I own a meal prep company so my diet is clean other than the occasional cheat meal to end my day.

[GearHeaded]

At what point when bulking, is to much BF%? Where do you draw the line and say ok, need to add mass, but max is 12% BF when doing it, etc..

I tell guys to just go by the mirror . going from a soft six pack to a 4 pack is fine. but when your seratus and your top two abs become blurry then your gaining too much fat and you need to scale things back .

also, monitoring blood glucose. if your lean fasted blood sugars generally run say 77 , and you've been bulking for months and now your fasted blood sugar is say 105 , then its time to scale back (theres generally a good correlation between body fat level increases along side blood sugar and insulin in-sensitivity increases).. <--- thats independent of drugs like MK677 or HGH that will skew those numbers

[GearHeaded]

I see I might then extend my cycle; cause I was just trying to doing something for 6-8 weeks to get really lean; then bulk up natty. To be honest if my bodyfat goes up like 1-2% in PCT I wouldn't really mind it that much. Some people I hear say taking either low dose osta or clen coming after a cycle whether you were bulking or cutting would help minimize that extra fat gain. I guess its all about cortisol and estrogen control after coming off.

bulking during PCT or when off cycle is a WAY better option then trying to cut or diet down during pct/off cycle.. having down regulated anabolic hormones during a cut (ie, nutrient deficiency) is a great way to lose muscle .
thats why natty bodybuilders when getting to 5% body fat are generally skinny and look like aids patients

no thank you . I'm not going to diet down without a ton of AAS