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Thread: Tren without Mast Assistance

  1. #1
    wango's Avatar
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    Tren without Mast Assistance

    Pre Covid in 2019, I ran Tren w/mast, Test, NPP & HGH (used a coach). I went as high as 150 mg/wk of tren. BP was a tad higher & mood was getting nastier. Really enjoyed the results and dug the tren. I used Nolvadex as a precaution (again, recommended by the coach).

    Since then, lost all muscle gains, added 25 pounds of fat due to Covid and having a hard time getting on track in 2021.

    However, over the past 17 weeks, after a ridiculously rigid diet, cardio 5-6x/wk and lifting/gym 4-5x/week, the 25 pounds of fat are gone & I regained the lost muscle. Currently around 13%BF at 202 pounds. BP doing nicely. Still adding strength and adding muscle, but the scale is almost stagnant (which means Iím still losing some fat, but itís now slow going). Only used 75 mg./test and .25 mg./arimidex 2x/wk. I like my estrogen on the lower range (at 64 and with the body fat, it works for me).

    Mast fíd with my hair and want no part of it. Iím tempted to pull the trigger on whatís below now or wait till I slowly drop 5 more pounds, but I havenít been this lean in 5-6 years & it ainít getting any easier at this age.

    Thinking of bumping to 100 mg test eod.
    Want to start at 30mg. tren A eod, bump up to 40 mg. eod, and again to 50 mg.eod, depending on tolerance.
    Nolvadex at 5 mg./day and Arimidex at .25mg/ eod.
    I use cabergholine 2x/week due to an old Pituitary adenoma, and my prolactin is currently in normal range.
    My balls are like raisins already, so donít care about HCG .

    Thinking 8 weeks.

    Am I off on anything? Appreciate the feedback, TY!

  2. #2
    Franco C is offline New Member
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    Why the use of Nolva? From my understanding it’s not something you want to incorporate as it negatively effects igf unless you have gyno like symptoms and as a last resort

  3. #3
    redz's Avatar
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    Ancillaries have side effects too. I’m quite frankly shocked at how low the steroid dosing is compared to ancillary use.

    Have you tried running these things without nolva, adex and caber?
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  4. #4
    Honkey_Kong's Avatar
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    The doses are so low, I wouldn't bother. I would lower the test to 250-300mg per week, but the 50mg of tren EOD = 50 *3.5 = 175mg of tren per week. And I'm assuming you're using tren ace too? I would start at 100mg eod.

    I'm also not a believer in tren being this "Jekyl and Hyde" type mood altering hormone. If I was any more irritable, it'd be because I didn't get enough sleep at night. Which brings me to the next point. Have something on hand to help you sleep supposing you have some insomnia. I used Benedryl tablets a lot, but there are other choices out there.

    And instead of messing with the caber and adex, I would keep them on hand in case of necessity and instead do 50mg of proviron ed. It'll help prevent sexual side effects and it has a strong afinity to bind to the aromatase enzyme so it'll keep your estrogen level controlled (to a good degree).
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  5. #5
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    tren is the fucking devil.

    but throw some tren ace in with mast and magic happens. i do quick little 4 week runs, 6 if i can handle it but the tren really fucks with my head.

    agree with above, why continue to run the Ancillaries if may not be needed. at ur age everything changes, maybe give it a try without to start and have ready just in case.
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  6. #6
    wango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Honkey_Kong View Post
    The doses are so low, I wouldn't bother. I would lower the test to 250-300mg per week, but the 50mg of tren EOD = 50 *3.5 = 175mg of tren per week. And I'm assuming you're using tren ace too? I would start at 100mg eod.

    I'm also not a believer in tren being this "Jekyl and Hyde" type mood altering hormone. If I was any more irritable, it'd be because I didn't get enough sleep at night. Which brings me to the next point. Have something on hand to help you sleep supposing you have some insomnia. I used Benedryl tablets a lot, but there are other choices out there.

    And instead of messing with the caber and adex, I would keep them on hand in case of necessity and instead do 50mg of proviron ed. It'll help prevent sexual side effects and it has a strong afinity to bind to the aromatase enzyme so it'll keep your estrogen level controlled (to a good degree).

    Yes I have used tren ace before and will be using it again. I wonít say who set up my cycle/dosages, but letís just say that he has a good head for gear. I did make gains with those dosages, but the thinning hair came from the mast and was the only side that didnít reverse itself after coming off the cycle. My objective is not to turn heads, but to see some changes in my physique that I canít get naturally (ok, with TRT). If Iím tolerating the dosages & my wife hasnít told me to move out or stop, due to me being an a-hole, I can go higher if my BP stays within reason. Edible pot can knock me out if sleep is an issue.

    I have to use caber. When I was diagnosed with that tumor, my breasts were quite swollen/fat & the Endo was surprised I wasnít lactating. The pecs lost some of their fat, but the nolvadex is to help prevent any more from being added. The docs were also surprised I wasnít going blind (the optic nerve is near the pituitary and the first MRI said it was overgrown by over a centimeter). Caber is for life. Neither Caber or Arimidex has given me ED, old age has & viagra ďperks me right upĒ.

    I appreciate your input HK, thanks very much.

  7. #7
    wango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mooseman33 View Post
    tren is the fucking devil.

    but throw some tren ace in with mast and magic happens. i do quick little 4 week runs, 6 if i can handle it but the tren really fucks with my head.

    agree with above, why continue to run the Ancillaries if may not be needed. at ur age everything changes, maybe give it a try without to start and have ready just in case.
    I agree regarding the magic and after 17 weeks of this routine and changes with just the TRT, I want to see the magic as a reward.

    As I mentioned to HK in the last post, Caber is for life due to that tumor, the Nolvadex and the Arimidex is to ensure my pecs donít get any fatter (they never recovered 100%).

    If I had a decent looking/shaped head, Iíd gladly go the shaved look, but God put hair up here so I donít look like a space alien. The mast put a hurting on it or Iíd use it again.

    My last run was for 8 weeks & I was a happy camper when I got that stuff out of my system (but wanted to go right back, due to the changes), if I have to shut it down early itís likely my wife will let me know veryquickly. After almost 40 years we can read each other and their moods in a couple of seconds. My shoulders are so fíd, she has to inject one of my Delts for me and she is capable of using the needle like a weapon without hesitation, lol.

    Greatly appreciate the assistance Moose, thank you!
    Last edited by wango; 08-17-2022 at 09:29 AM.

  8. #8
    wango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redz View Post
    Ancillaries have side effects too. Iím quite frankly shocked at how low the steroid dosing is compared to ancillary use.

    Have you tried running these things without nolva, adex and caber?
    Caber is for life due to the tumor, Nolvadex and Arimidex prevent the fat from returning to my already puffy pecs.

    The lower dosages worked well fo me before, but if all is well with tolerance, Iíll go a little higher.

    Thank you Redz, appreciated.

  9. #9
    redz's Avatar
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    If a doctor agrees with the ancillaries than that makes sense I guess. I was thinking more for the average person. Caber is almost never needed.
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  10. #10
    Honkey_Kong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wango View Post
    I agree regarding the magic and after 17 weeks of this routine and changes with just the TRT, I want to see the magic as a reward.

    As I mentioned to HK in the last post, Caber is for life due to that tumor, the Nolvadex and the Arimidex is to ensure my pecs don’t get any fatter (they never recovered 100%).

    If I had a decent looking/shaped head, I’d gladly go the shaved look, but God put hair up here so I don’t look like a space alien. The mast put a hurting on it or I’d use it again.

    My last run was for 8 weeks & I was a happy camper when I got that stuff out of my system (but wanted to go right back, due to the changes), if I have to shut it down early it’s likely my wife will let me know veryquickly. After almost 40 years we can read each other and their moods in a couple of seconds. My shoulders are so f’d, she has to inject one of my Delts for me and she is capable of using the needle like a weapon without hesitation, lol.

    Greatly appreciate the assistance Moose, thank you!
    From what I hear, proviron is a lot more tolerated as far as hairloss goes than masteron . I can't really speak from experience since I've lost that battle before I've done either (unless we're counting superdrol which started my path to baldness).
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