Hgh

[50%Natural]

AMEN BRO, Amen!!!!!! I'm getting tired of arguing with this guy! If he wants to try his theories on himself, go ahead, but do NOT preach it to other people on the board.

That is basically what I was trying to say in my past couple posts. A lot shorter BLT but the same thing.

[Foxy Sphinx]

fucking idiots.

the fact that HGH works more potently the younger you are is not my theory, its a proven fact, every doctor and his grama will tell you that.

You people are god damn idiots. Your experience doesnt help you in this situation at all, did you ever use HGH during puberty? Didnt fucking think so, and since thats the point that im arguing right this moment, your little 'experience' comebacks are insignificant to the argument.

Im not going to list off the name of every book ive read, I dont even remember half the names, nor do I particularly care in providing you with that information as I know you will not use it in any beneficial way (for isntance -- taking the book out).

Now because ive proven my intellect over yours, you try to bash me by calling me a 'geek' and such. This is the most pathetic arguemnt I have EVER seen on any webboard anywhere, you guys lack more intelligence, inquisitiveness, research, and knowledge than even the morons on elite fitness. Pathetic, absolutely pathetic. Do yourselves all a favor, and never reply to another post I make, unless your going to provide 1/100th the evidence I provide. Ive told you where to look to see that im right, but I know you are all too lazy of fucks to do it, you'd much rather stick to your ignorant, stubborn, AND HORRIBLY FUCKING WRONG opinions, rather than stick your nose in an article or two for a few minutes of your life. I could provide you half baked morons with the factual evidence right to your face, feed it to you with a diamond glazed spoon for all its worth, like the little immature, incapable of understanding babies you are, but I know it'd goto waste when you vomitted it up incapable of interpreting the research.

All the names you call me I see as affirmation of my knowledge, since the only defense you have left is to insult my avatar, and makeup false accusations about my past. The more you insult me the more you feed my ego because the more I can see you struggling to win a losing arguement, you have nothing to fight me with except what you learned back in gradeschool... sad.

[Grant]

psycho........

[BUYLONGTERM]

Once again your missing the point. Why would someone who is growing normally during pueberty need GH? Give me one Dr. that says thats fine. Nobody is saying that GH doesn't work great in younger people (thats why the stuff was made to help people who have growing problems) I'm saying GH would be MORE beneficial in someone that is in there 30's vs someone in there early 20's. Why? Well simple. My GH levels are less then someone in their early 20's Thats a FACT. Your levels decline the older you get. You are the first guy on this site that is doing a GH cycle to grow taller. Your cycle doesn't make one bit of sense. Why is it that you honestly think your a genius and the rest of the 10,000 members are idiots?

[BUYLONGTERM]

Oh yeah, Please tell us again why you would waste your time on this site if we are all idiots????

[octagon]

hey foxy, i'm going to do as u ask and challenge your ideas instead of your experience. even if there are studies that show that GH has tremendous effects during puberty, that still doen't justify a blanket statement like "the younger you are the better it works" it may very well give a kick ass effect during puberty...but there is also a lot of evidence that it has a kick ass effect for the old. the twenty somethings get good effects, but nothing spectacular. if you graphed the effects by age it would not be straight downward sloping line graph (which would show "the younger the better"), or a straight upward sloping line (older the better) it would be a bowl shaped graph, high then low then high...showing both sides of this argument have merit. it works great for older people AND it works great for younger people.

all this assumes your basic research and the studies u looked at r valid (i still haven't deen them)

[Foxy Sphinx]

Valid response Octagon.

GH exists for the purpose of use in adolescents for height problems. Height problems, yes. On any GH manufacturers website, they like to say not to use GH after the growth plates have closed. Why?

Well some people seem to beleive GH doesnt cause Acromegaly. Thats the dumbest thing ive ever heard. Of course giving ur body more GH than its meant to have will identically replicate the same effect as Acromegaly, hence the same side effects. The manufacturers know this, and they know Acromegaly is a far more dangerous condition than Gigantism. Gigantism is characterized by massive strength, skeletal, and muscoskeletal anatomy and structures. Acromegaly is characterized by giant foreheads, carpal tunnel syndrome, swelling of the extremeties, and many other not too beneficial side effects.

When I speak of GH being more effective, I speak of its effects to create new muscle, new bone, less fat, and so forth. I speak of its effects relative to bodybuilding and physique enhancement. The side effects of recreating Gigantism, are generally the effects somone wishing to enlarge their physique to beyond genetic limits seeks. Im not saying GH is useless the older you get, im saying no matter what age you become post-puberty, theres no possible way ever you could acheive what you could acheive during puberty with excess chronic GH exposure. For you cannot recreate Gigantism after puberty, but you can during puberty simply by exogenous supplies of GH which exceed what your genetics have predetermined for you.

When your in puberty, your body is demanding to grow. Its demanding, thats why you have higher hormone levels, as a way to meet that bodies demand. Its demanding these because it wants to grow more bone and more muscle. When your done puberty, your body isnt exactly up for making new bone, nor does it particularly put as much effort into proliferating new muscle cells. Puberyt is a growth phase, post puberty is a MAINTENANCE stage. The body becomes more inclined to maintain what was given during pubertal growth, rather than continue the growth. This is why, to acheive superhuman freakish proportions that would blow today's Mr O bodybuilders out of the water, you must intervene during the bodies most substantial time of growth, puberty. I wouldnt be surprised if somone with the disease Gigantism had twice as many muscle cells (not hypertrophic size/volume) as a pro bodybuilder, simply due to having chronic GH exposure during puberty. IF andre the giant had his goals set on being the next Mr O... Im sure he could have acheived it. He was truly gifted, gifted with a disorder that has everything you slave in the gym for, given naturally. Im positive I can recreate this same disorder very easily, and will do so in myself.

This hasnt been done, because its clearly un-ethical, and the science community would never want to promote creating or simulating diseases/disorders in people for the purposes of vanity. The difference is, Im not the science community, nothing is here to stop me, theres no law I wont break, and no price I wont pay. I like to call it underground science. I can do the things im sure many scientists have thought of, and have always been intrigued by trying, but have been unable to do due to their profession.

When I refer to younger, I refeer to pubertal adolscents.

Octagon, the point you make about the 'bowl' graph of effectiveness I would consider a very accurate representation. However, its not quiet as simple as a bowl, the side of the bowl where puberty is, would without a doubt be higher than the side when ones GH levels have severely declined. In your 20's, post puberty (center of the bowl), you still have decent GH levels, but your body is no longer inclined to undergo such immense growth as during pubertal growth spurt. Once GH levels declined, the body wears away, so providing a spike back to GH levels when you were 20, or even higher lvls, would definetly make a HUGE notice in your growth relative to the growth undergone for the previous few years of your life prior to the middle-aged GH supply. But even then, even with more GH than when you were 20, you could still, never ever, EVER, acheive what you could where you to do the same during puberty, because as ive said and will say again, the body doesnt want to.

In the simplest view, it would logically appear that giving yourself more GH post puberty than you had during puberty should mean more growth than in puberty. This isnt true, definelty not true, as the body has many other mechanisms of growth, such as autocrine and paracrine systems, as well as neural transcriptions and neurotransmitters which send signals and all this complex jargon to individual cells to promote localized growth factor/hormone production within the cell itself, as well as the many other factors/hormones like Platelet-derived growth factors, morphogenic proteins, etc. The brain controls all their neuro signals, and the brain controls puberty, and ultimately, no matter how much juice you take, the brain controls growth.

Endocrinology goes hand in hand with physiology, which goes hand in hand with neurology. To understand endocrinology, you need to understand physiology, to understand physiology, you need to understand neurology. Bodies one gigantic system of signals and processes and hormones.

[JohnnyB]

did you ever use HGH during puberty?

Why don't you answer that question Foxy, have you?

JohnnyB

[big N]

Why don't you answer that question Foxy, have you?

JohnnyB

johnny bro forget it !!! this kid is a tool and a tottal waste of time .trying to argue to make him self look smart ,but in reality ,is just a little kid with to much time on his hands .ok sonny reeces is over !

[JohnnyB]

johnny bro forget it !!! this kid is a tool and a tottal waste of time .trying to argue to make him self look smart ,but in reality ,is just a little kid with to much time on his hands .ok sonny reeces is over !

Remember d00fy? he reminds me of him. Just trying to use his own question and apply them to him.

JohnnyB

[octagon]

BTW foxy, do u really think you'll be able to gain that much height? to those who don't know, GH has been approved for the treatment of the extremely short children. average growth after YEARS of injections was only 2-4 inches. granted, this was for people already predisposed to being very short (bottom 1% of the population) and i don't know their dosages, but it doesn't sound to promising.

[Da Bull]

BTW foxy, do u really think you'll be able to gain that much height? to those who don't know, GH has been approved for the treatment of the extremely short children. average growth after YEARS of injections was only 2-4 inches. granted, this was for people already predisposed to being very short (bottom 1% of the population) and i don't know their dosages, but it doesn't sound to promising.

Bro,in his profile he says he's 5% bf,what does he need HGH for?

[big N]

Remember d00fy? he reminds me of him. Just trying to use his own question and apply them to him.

JohnnyB

of course how can i forget !!this kid is a lost cause !hey cupcake YOUR A LEGEND IN YOUR OWN MIND !!

[raoul3]

Valid response Octagon.
Im positive I can recreate this same disorder very easily, and will do so in myself.

Andre Rousimoff, (as well as others) DIED from that disease and you wish you could recreate it??? LMAO I'm sure there are more effective (and cheaper) ways to commit suicide...

[Foxy Sphinx]

Wow theres alot to address here.

Okay ill start with Raouls post.

RESEARCH BEFORE YOU GUYS MAKE COMMENTS, AS ALL IM ABOUT TO SAY YOU COULD FIND IN RESEARCH IF YOU TOOK THE TIME
Andre the giant started off with Gigantism. He had the common case of Gigantism, GH excess exposure. Beleive it or not theres 2 'forms' of Gigantism if you may. One is because of excess GH exposure, wether its caused by excess GHRH production, or a tumor on the pituitary, it doesnt matter, the outcome is the same. The second has NOTHING to do with GH, but rather estrogen, in which a mutation of the estrogen receptor-alpha or the aromatase gene results in a NEVER OCCURING closure of the growth plates.

In the first form, the person has incredible growth rate, but they eventually stop growing, and once the plates fuse, Gigantism becomes Acromegaly. This is what happened to Andre the Giant, he went from Gigantism to Acromegaly. In the second form, they never ever stop growing for the rest of their lives, hence they stay in a state of Gigantism for their entire life, never entering acromegaly (although if they underwent epiphyseal fusion they wouldnt have acromegaly as they have no GH excess).

Acromegaly is what killed Andre the giant, years, and years, and years, and YEARS of acromegaly is what killed him. Not 6 months, not 5 years, it TAKES A LONG time to kill somone.

In my cycle, and my 'creation' of Gigantism, I am taking BOTH forms of Gigantism, and combining them. An anti-aromatase brilliantly (not perfectly as that'd require 100% aromatase) recreates the second form I mentioned, while exogenous supraphysiological supply of HGH/IGF-1 identically recreates the first form. The result? My hypothesis is a never occuring (or occuring whenever YOU decide) closure of the epiphyseal growth plates combined with GH excess chronic exposure allowing one to stay in a potent state of Gigantism for as long or as little as they want.

To address JohhnyB, of course not you already knew the answer to that so whyd you ask the question? Pointless semantics.

Octagon, yes one thing to note is that GHD (growth hormone deficient) children are given GH to replace the GH they are deficient in. They are not brought into a state of Gigantism. Compare the results in linear growth rate and total height between a GHD child being treated with HGH and a child of the same age who suffers from Gigantism. The difference is like day and night. GHD deficient childern are given carefully suggested dosages of GH to bring them to what the mean ng/ml HGH concentrations are for children their age (hence theyre trying to be brought up to the physiological growth rate, NOT supraphysiological). Someone suffering from Gigantism has ng/ml HGH concentrations far beyond what the average is for their age. By giving a healthy individual a supraphysiological dosage of GH ontop of their already sufficient endogenous GH levels, you recreate Gigantism.

So then, based on Gigantism which is what my cycle intends to recreate (although more potently), growth rate should far exceed the growth rate of a GHD GH treated child. 1 Inch would be incredible to me to gain in 1 years treatment, I think 5,000 dollars is worth 1 inch, but I beleive I will gain considerably more than that.

Also something that should be noted, in cases of excess chronic GH exposure in Gigantism, when it is coupled with hypogonadism, the linear growth rate rockets up EVEN more. I still havnt found out why that is, but I beleive based on my other research, that it has something to do with aromatisation of T to estrogen, and if that truly is the case, then the two forms im combining should recreate this, and then some, as a result of still being able to have testosterone .

Is that everyone or did I miss something? Ah well im sure you'll post again

[JohnnyB]

To address JohhnyB, of course not you already knew the answer to that so whyd you ask the question? Pointless semantics.

Not pointless you just put yourself in the same category as the people you are chastising. I hate to be redundant but you force the issue, Post the studies, until you post those your only giving your opinion.

JohnnyB

[Foxy Sphinx]

Why don't you ask the question that was given to you instead of some bullshit reply like you have been giving. He merely asked you which books you have been reading and yet all you say is "a page of a book" COME ON.

Okie dokie. Is this more to your liking, just took this, this is what Im currently reading, takes me on average 5-7 days to read a 1,000 pages.

The blue book is university chapters on child development, adolescents, and psychology, the other book concerns HGH.

[johnsomebody]

"I am the 1% of whom think for themselves."

No, actually you're an arrogant 18 year old twit.

And that's not my theory, it's a FACT. This thread is enough proof for anyone.

[Polska]

Foxy Sphinx,

Actual hands on experience teaches you more than all the books you could ever read. if you believe you're right and everyone else is wrong because of your vast and incredible knowledge when it comes to steroids then why are you even on this board. Obviously you don't have anything to learn from us so why bother? Do us all a favour and find a new home bro.

[jdog55]

Foxy is right. Gh doesn't work better as you get older. A 60 year old taking GH would merely be duplicating what he probably produced himself at age 20. A 20 year old taking GH would be producing what he produces naturally + what he injects so he has more GH in his system than the 60 year old. More GH = more growth.

Jdog55

[email protected]