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  1. #1
    Jackman's Avatar
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    liquidex or nolva?

    i tried searching on pros and cons of liquidex and nolva couldnt find ne thing? so what are the pros and cons of using each? also i heared some people can reduce the size of gyno they already have with nolva does the same apply with liquidex???

  2. #2
    Ntpadude is offline Anabolic Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackman
    i tried searching on pros and cons of liquidex and nolva couldnt find ne thing? so what are the pros and cons of using each? also i heared some people can reduce the size of gyno they already have with nolva does the same apply with liquidex???
    Good idea to use both. Here's why:

    Liquidex prevents testosterone from converting to estrogen. When taken properly, you have the best defense from estrogen, you are not masking the effects of estrogen, you simply dont have any at all in your blood stream or very low levels. If you goof up and allow estrogen levels to climb, liquidex will not do anything about the estrogen you get in your blood street, it will only just prevent more from converting into estrogen. Estrogens are slow to be removed from your system, takes about 3-4 weeks. Its also possible that liquidex can work "too well" and you have not enough estrogen in your system to maintain your health and growth, this is where Nolva can help, Nolva itself is a very weak estrogen and can replace estrogen shortages from using too much liquidex.

    Nolva doesnt stop estrogen from converting from testosterone, however it completely masks the effects of estrogen. Since it does not remove the estrogen, you have to maintain a nolva level in your body until the estrogen levels subside. Nolva is very effective at making your breast tissue, male organs and fat cells non-responsive at all to estrogen, however its troubling to think you can have astronomically high levels of estrogen in your body even if Nolva can block the estrogen's action. What if you attempt to end your PCT before all the estrogen has left your body? This is where people attempting to quit PCT on the 4th week and find their nipples getting raw and perkey have to go back on. I like using Liquidex all thru the cycle because if you enter PCT with only 1/3 the estrogen in body as compared to not using Liquidex, it wont be as dangerous for gyno when you eventually quit the entire PCT altogether. Also a shortage of estrogen during PCT along with testosterone can also help trigger the restarting of your testes to make testosterone as your body is starving for hormones.

  3. #3
    Pinch's Avatar
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    taximofen aka nolvadex and liquidex are the same thing

    pills are better though IMHO

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinch
    taximofen aka nolvadex and liquidex are the same thing

    pills are better though IMHO
    They are both anti-e's but are not the same thing

    Liquidex = Blocks the conversiona all together

    Nolva = Keeps estrogen from binding to receptors

  5. #5
    Jackman's Avatar
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    so if i took liquidex throughout the cycle and nolva at the end would this be a good idea? because i have heared nolva inhibits gains and that way i can keep my estrogen levels way they are now during the cycle and take away ne excess extrogen after the cycle? plus its good for PCT right? bump for more responses

    Ntpadude thanks for the great response apreciate it

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    Pheedno is offline Respected Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinch
    taximofen aka nolvadex and liquidex are the same thing

    pills are better though IMHO

    One is an inhibitor, one is a SERM. They have totally different mechanisms of action. RESEARCH

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackman
    so if i took liquidex throughout the cycle and nolva at the end would this be a good idea? because i have heared nolva inhibits gains and that way i can keep my estrogen levels way they are now during the cycle and take away ne excess extrogen after the cycle? plus its good for PCT right? bump for more responses

    Ntpadude thanks for the great response apreciate it
    Nolva will not hinder your gains. You have to remember your estrogen levels will rise and not stay as they are today.

    Either use Nolva/L-dex, Nolva, or L-dex durring your cycle this way you will be to keep estrogen related sides to a minimum...... IMO Nolva/L-Dex is a good combo to use durring your cycle and then Nolva/Clomid for PCT

  8. #8
    Jackman's Avatar
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    ok bro ill use liquidex throughout the cycle and use nolva with my PCT. sounds good thank you

  9. #9
    Pheedno is offline Respected Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackman
    so if i took liquidex throughout the cycle and nolva at the end would this be a good idea? because i have heared nolva inhibits gains and that way i can keep my estrogen levels way they are now during the cycle and take away ne excess extrogen after the cycle? plus its good for PCT right? bump for more responses

    Ntpadude thanks for the great response apreciate it

    Nolva does not inhibit gains. It is impossible to alleviate estrogen in the body, unless you were taking insane amounts of inhibitors that would have more serious effects.

    If estrogen is reduced by a severe amount by L-dex, Nolva acts as a ER agonist, as opposed to an antagonist thus mimicking estrogen in the body.

    The only argument that can be made in terms of Nolva effecting gains is that Nolva lowers IGF production, but in the doses we use, this is pretty insignificant

  10. #10
    Ntpadude is offline Anabolic Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackman
    so if i took liquidex throughout the cycle and nolva at the end would this be a good idea? because i have heared nolva inhibits gains and that way i can keep my estrogen levels way they are now during the cycle and take away ne excess extrogen after the cycle? plus its good for PCT right? bump for more responses

    Ntpadude thanks for the great response apreciate it
    No Nolva and Liquidex will either prevent or get rid of the estrogen related water bloating. This amounts to about 5 lbs. So you gain 15 lbs in a cycle instead of 20 lbs... a well Nolva/Ldex'd cycle doesnt loose weight when going off PCT, but with less of these you are happy to see scale higher but you are risking breast tissue growth, damage to your nuts as estrogen shrinks your nuts 5 times as fast as simply taking a break from testosterone production will do, and then when you PCT, you loose that water bloat just the same.

    I would never depend on Liquidex by itself... if you screw up and get too much estrogen in your system. You are just helpless to sit back and watch your manly pecs turn into Dolly Parton's - therefore be sure to have Nolva and or Clomid on hand as these 2 drugs will stop and possibly reverse progressive gyno. Liquidex should only be taken as a complement to Nolva/Clomid and I do beleive if you start suffering from estrogen shortages caused by Liquidex, you'll have to go on the Nolva or Clomid just to replace the estrogen that you "need". One way to tell if while on L-Dex, if you stop getting morning hard-on's and notice a drop in sex drive, then take some Nolvas and notice all the sex drive has returned... there you have it, L-Dex was crashing ALL of your estrogen and you DO need some estrogen in some form in order to have normal sex drive, and for muscles to develop, you just dont want the estrogen levels of a pregnant woman in a man's body, this is bad, bad, bad for you.

  11. #11
    Jackman's Avatar
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    i have 1 more questions my cycle looks like this
    EQ 400mg weeks 1-12
    Test prop 75ed weeks 1-14
    Fina 75mg ed weeks 7-14

    How much liquidex is recomended for this iv heared both .25mg and .50 mg. And should i only use the nolva if i start feeling estrogen side effects? i mean during cycle im def using it post cycle

  12. #12
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    I would change the cycle a little:
    EQ 400mg weeks 1 - 12
    Test prop 75ed weeks 1 - 15
    Fina 75mg ed weeks 5 - 12
    l-dex .25 of a cc/ml ED 1 - 15

    And if you want 1 - 15 Nolva 10mg ED

  13. #13
    Jackman's Avatar
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    so should i just take nolva throughout the cycle instead of getting ne liquidex? and what do u mean by messing up liquidex?

  14. #14
    Jackman's Avatar
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    o i thought i should run the fina up to the prop but i know u know hell lot more than i do. thanks MM

  15. #15
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    Bro the best bet is to use .25 l-dex and 10mg Nolva ED through your cycle. All bases are covered....... and there will be no hindering of gains.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackman
    o i thought i should run the fina up to the prop but i know u know hell lot more than i do. thanks MM
    You can run fina up to PCT but it will make recover that much harder for you...... Run the fina up to the EQ and the prop 3 weeks past that and recovery should be a lot easier.

  17. #17
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    ok i will def do that thanks for all the advice i am proud to say i am 100% ready do my cycle now all is cleared up -peace-

  18. #18
    Jackman's Avatar
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    sorry for all the questions just wanted to be 100% sure with what to do haha thanks to everyone who replied

  19. #19
    Ntpadude is offline Anabolic Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackman
    so should i just take nolva throughout the cycle instead of getting ne liquidex? and what do u mean by messing up liquidex?
    Messing up on liquidex... forgetting to take your doses for a couple days would be a classic mess up... Nolva forgives you for doing this and quickly reverses damage... Liquidex, a day or 2 with full aromatase emzymes in your blood means lots and lots of estrogen production that day.

    I have done both on my cycle... I didnt take any ancillaries until about week #4 (anti-estrogens) so I got the sensative itcy nipples, red in appearance but no tissue growth that I know of. Then did so much L-dex that a few weeks later sex drive and muscle growth stopped until I did Nolvas to replace the estrogen starvation I was having. For the most part now I found a happy medium with 0.5 Mg l-dex ED and 1 mg Nolva EOD. I think right now I am running with estrogens very low so the nolva is more needed to replace a shortage of estrogen, but again earlier in my cycle I was having early gyno warning simptoms too. For me being on week #10, increased my testosterone to 600 mg a week and having low estrogen and having NO consequences if I skip 3-4 days with the nolva except crashing my estrogen levels, I think thats pretty good.. I hope to go into PCT in week #14 with estrogen levels as low as possible.
    Last edited by Ntpadude; 12-08-2003 at 12:47 PM.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMudMan
    Bro the best bet is to use .25 l-dex and 10mg Nolva ED through your cycle. All bases are covered....... and there will be no hindering of gains.
    Bingo.

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