couple hgh questions

[ward065]

1) Running HGH with AAS, what is the idea HGH dosage to promote muscle hypertrophy/hyperplasia? I am 23 and just started using HGH. Right now i am doing 4 iu's eod, 2 iu in the late morning and 2 iu in the early evening....since i just started, i am keeping the starting dosage low for now as i want to see how my body reacts.

2) What's the closest to bed that you can inject gh and won't shut off gh production during sleep... for my evening shot i am injecting at 9:30 pm, and going to bed at about 1 am (3 and a half hours before bed) Is this too close to bed, or is the timing alright?

[SPIKE]

Ward, at 23 you wont see much from GH especially at that dose. I've ran GH a couple of times at that age and can tell you from experience that it definitely wasn't worth it. Especially if looking for actual LBM.

I"m on 5iu 6/1 now and after these 800ius are done I wont touch GH for at least a few more years. IMO anyone under 30 wont reap much from GH, especially if looking for LBM.

[JohnnyB]

I have to agree, at 23 HGH is a waste of money, IMO. HGH isn't a great muscle builder anyway. The reason BBers started getting bigger when they added HGHG to their protocol is because they added slin with it and the slin is what was adding the size more then the HGH.

At 23 you have no need for HGH, you lots of growth to do with AAS still.

JohnnyB

[ward065]

jayhova, i am using GH for several reasons...First is, i have read that taking GH after a cycle of AAS, even if the dose is moderate to low, will help you retain what you gained from that cycle. I cannot see any negative aspects of giving it a try. This has always been a problem where i tend to lose about 30% of what i gained during a cycle afterwards, no matter how hard i train. And the PCT is a sound protocol, with HGH before the PCT, it does not seem to matter as i always will lose strength/size.

Secondly i am using it to help LBM...i know you seem skeptical but there are some younger members here who have used it. If used with AAS, i see this as only a positive as more LBM could be attained, but the question is at my age and point in time what does i'll need to take. If i can also reduce fat with it, that would be another nice bonus.

It seems in general some people here get really good results from hgh+aas, while there are some who do not.....i guess the only way to know for sure is to run it yourself. I am going to be running this course for 7-8 months. I also do not want to touch insulin after what i have read- risk is not worth the reward imho.

[JohnnyB]

You are right HGH can help keep the gains from a cycle. It works by increasing your IGF-1, in order to get the benefit of the increased IGF-1 after an AAS cycle, you need to of started the HGH with the AAS cycle. Since it takes about 3-4 months to see the benefits of an HGH cycle, that includes keeping the gains from an AAS cycle. When did you start the HGH?

This seem like an expensive way to keep your gains from an AAS cycle. Have you ever used HCG during a cycle? The sooner you restore your natural testosterone the better your odds are of keeping the gains from your cycle.

JohnnyB

[ward065]

Yeah, i've done HCG each time. I have run my protocol like this

Week 5-11 of cycle (During the cycle) 1,000 IU of HCG every week (7,000 iu total)

Weeks 12-13: 1,500 IU HCG Every week

Weeks 14-17: Clomid & Nolva:

day 1 150mg clomid, 50mg nolva
day 2-14 100mg clomid, 30mg nolva
day 15-28 50mg clomid, 20mg nolva (every day)

Anyway though this course is 7-8 months of HGH. As i stated yes, it does cost money, but i need to see how it will work for me. If i conclude the HGH did nothing for me, and did not help me with my bodybuilding goals, of course i will not use it again any time in the near future.

[Teabagger]

Conventional thinking is that early a.m. and early p.m. injections are best for a split dose. Some take first inject around 5 am...go back to bed for an hour or two. Then the second dose around 2-3 pm. You may be inhibiting your natty production of HGH, but no one is quite sure so I err on the side of caution.

[Ufa]

Good post! Teabagger.

[SPIKE]

Ward I'll try to answer your comments in order as you stated them.

I like the idea of wanting to use GH for the ability to retain more gains post cycle. Johnny beat me to it in stating that it takes several months to get IGF levels up significantly in order to start reaping its benefits. That's why GH for most needs to be taken for an extensive period of time. If I were you I'd rather take LR3 and get an immediate response rather then waiting several months. I can tell you form experience that I will never run another PCT without it, LR3 made a world of a difference in LBM retention.

Secondly I dont see anything wrong with you wanting to use it in order to attain some new LBM. Buuuuuuuuuuuuuut the problem is your age combined with your dose. AS you stated everyone has reacted differentely and the only true way for you to find out is to try it. At 23 I ran up to 6iu a day with meager resutls. Heck, 500mgs of test a week would have given me better results at that age. Nothing wrong with trying it buddy jsut dont expect too much. I cant argue with you on the fat loss. With your intended dose thats about all you'll see.

Insulin is much more scary on paper then in real life IF you know what you're doing. I"m not recommending it just dont rule it out.

BTW, PCT looks good. If its worked for you in the past stick with it.

[ward065]

thanks Jay,

I decided on this low dose based, on one reason, what i read in the Profiles form on the HGH profile. He stated in the profile the best way to run GH is 2 shots a day, done every other day, each shot .028 X KG of bodyweight. For my weight, that comes to 198/2.2 (KG to lbs conversion) = 90 KGS. 90 * .028 is 2.7 iu's per shot, or 5.4 IU's every other day total. Anthony_roberts stated that this is a good protocol to get the GH benefits. I am thinking about working the dose up to 6-8 iu's every other day

Also, i do not wish to run LR3 primarily because of the fact that there have not been any studies done on its safety- this gets me concerned. I even have read in MD magazine, several people who have written there have recommended to be careful of LR3 IGF.

Finally, you probably have it posted, but what dose of hgh did you have to run to achieve results? I know this varies from person to person. One member here, hosam4ever, i think is just about my age and does not use more than a couple IU per day- and has gotten results i read it in a post somewhere he made.

Here is his post-

http://forums.anabolicreview.com/sho...d.php?t=190025

he's only ran .5 iu and has gotten results from it. Again, this is why i say it varies from person to person. If i realize i can gain off a lower dose than a higher one, it needs to be tried out first

[JohnnyB]

How are you doing that 1500iu?

JohnnyB

[ward065]

How are you doing that 1500iu?

JohnnyB

is that in reference to the HCG ? For the 2 weeks before my PCT begins, i just do 1500 iu of hcg each week. This is an increase from the 1000iu/ew during the cycle. the dose is higher before pct begins because i have read it is good to help kick the testes back to natural test production.

[SPIKE]

I remember AR stating that in the GH profile he wrote for us. The only problem I see is that his suggestions came after the studies done on Children and height. If it were done on grown men for muscle mass then I'd be singing a different tune. I"m not saying it's wrong but there are so many different views on this in which I've read so many studies on. The final conclusion will be your own.

I dont blame you on your reasoning behind LR3, cant argue that.

Also, Hosams dose is very low but that also has to do with it being before comp. After skimming over the thread he stated that 6iu was a good dose for him. Can't run a higher dose like that before a comp. He wanted a lower dose to at least work synergistically with his AAS and not too high to retain much water.

Keep in mind Ward I"m not trying to deter you. You asked for opinions and all I"m doing is giving you mine. Good luck either way you choose to go.

[GearIdentity]

Insulin alone is not worth it, Insulin with AAS is ok but Insulin with HGH is definately worth it. Insulin + HGH do some great things together, they might not do much when used alone.