IGF-1 and "PERMA-GUT"

**needbigguns** · 08-24-2006, 04:08 AM

Just been reading a post that says IGF-1 will grow your intestines especially at high doses - i planed to run it at 100mcg's for a month - will this definitly grown my intestines ? and what is ment by perma gut or coleman gut ? Please explain... I have a small waist 30" and decent abs - could IGF-1 jepordise this long term

**AleX-69** · 08-24-2006, 04:19 AM

Well in THEORY:

If you train your muscles IGF-1 recpetors will be more sensitive to IGF-1. Therefore it is recommend to shoot IGF-1 directly after your WO in the desired muscle. Most of the IGF-1 is then taken up by the IGF-1 receptors within the trained muscle. EXECSS IGF-1 floats around your body until it finds a IGF-1 receptor it attaches to.. As most IGF-1 receptors are found in the intestines it is possible that execess IGF-1 execerts a growth effect on these.

ss01 claimes to have heard of people who have aquired a perma-gut from exessive IgF-1 dosage.. So it might be possible. Therefore i would start as low as possible with IGF-1 to avoid any exesss IGf-1 floating around..

Nevertheless there are other theories (for example from Powerhouse85 - muscletalk) which claim that it dosen't matter if you shoot IGF-1LR3 in AM or PWO and haven't expierenced adverese side effects shooting soley in the AM so far..

I for myself will not take any chances. So pining a reasonable amount directly after training into the trained muscle seems the safest route for me.

**needbigguns** · 08-24-2006, 05:41 AM

Iv heard IGF-1 Lr3 isnt site specific and does not cause localised growth... is this true or not ? Everything on IGF-1 seams sketchy at the min and everyones ideas seam confilicting... i want to run IGF at 100mcg for 4 weeks - if i do it i wanna do it properly as some people see no results untill 80mcg

**needbigguns** · 08-24-2006, 06:01 AM

so once again what actually is Perma Gut ?

**AleX-69** · 08-24-2006, 06:19 AM

A perma gut is a really wide midsection due to inner organ growth which pushes the abdominal wall outwards as seen in this "beautiful" picture

**needbigguns** · 09-06-2006, 04:42 AM

So is permagut a gud or a bad thing ? cant decide - will it make abs look bigger ? or just like uv got a fat belly with abs... (if u have abs)(which i do)(they are nice)(i like women to kiss them)(but only nice women)(no fat women)(only when im drunk)(and i wake up and pretend the house is on fire)(to get them out ASAP)(then throw there fat apple catcher pants out of the window)
... But anyways - yeh perma gut, gud thing or bad ?

**Nelstar** · 09-06-2006, 05:07 AM

why do you have brackets on everything??

permagut = bad...

youll look fat with a shirt on... and fat with abs without a shirt

***perfectbeast2001*** · 09-06-2006, 05:42 AM

Originally Posted by needbigguns

So is permagut a gud or a bad thing ? cant decide - will it make abs look bigger ? or just like uv got a fat belly with abs... (if u have abs)(which i do)(they are nice)(i like women to kiss them)(but only nice women)(no fat women)(only when im drunk)(and i wake up and pretend the house is on fire)(to get them out ASAP)(then throw there fat apple catcher pants out of the window)
... But anyways - yeh perma gut, gud thing or bad ?

LMAO. I can't believe you lied to me about your house being on fire. And give me my big pants back

**ss01** · 09-06-2006, 08:16 AM

^^^
LMAO

AleX-69 put it as simply as you might ever see it explained, good job bro. Why do the bigger guys all have guts? When did guts first come to the scene? With GH? Nope. With insulin ! Because insulin is only really worth it when used with GH, *BECAUSE* it makes more IGF-1. And that grows the guts and all organs. As well as muscle, obviously.

As for site-specificity: Long R3 IGF-1 is designed to be a systemic drug. But by injecting in a muscle that has its receptors greatly upregulated by exercise, we diminish that systemic effect because more local receptors will take it up, leaving less for organ growth.

So yes it's a systemic drug. But yes you can diminish its systemic-ness, and that is a GOOD thing. Now if you're gonna pin 100mcg ED, then it will be pretty systemic no matter what you do because that's simply a huge amount, which SEEMS to be needed when you pin at non-optimal times, but isn't needed if you pin when the muscle receptors are at their max.

**bigacct** · 09-06-2006, 08:51 AM

Originally Posted by ss01

^^^
LMAO

AleX-69 put it as simply as you might ever see it explained, good job bro. Why do the bigger guys all have guts? When did guts first come to the scene? With GH? Nope. With insulin ! Because insulin is only really worth it when used with GH, *BECAUSE* it makes more IGF-1. And that grows the guts and all organs. As well as muscle, obviously.

As for site-specificity: Long R3 IGF-1 is designed to be a systemic drug. But by injecting in a muscle that has its receptors greatly upregulated by exercise, we diminish that systemic effect because more local receptors will take it up, leaving less for organ growth.

So yes it's a systemic drug. But yes you can diminish its systemic-ness, and that is a GOOD thing. Now if you're gonna pin 100mcg ED, then it will be pretty systemic no matter what you do because that's simply a huge amount, which SEEMS to be needed when you pin at non-optimal times, but isn't needed if you pin when the muscle receptors are at their max.

SS01,

I've read your posts on this in the past, and they seem to be right on target. According to Dave Palumbo (yes the bodybuilder w/3 yrs of Med School), anything over 10 - 20mcgs grows ALL other parts of the body (hands, feet, etc.) The body produces only 1mcg per day....

The direct method of injecting with LR3 seems to be the best.

**needbigguns** · 09-07-2006, 03:27 AM

Originally Posted by bigacct

SS01,

I've read your posts on this in the past, and they seem to be right on target. According to Dave Palumbo (yes the bodybuilder w/3 yrs of Med School), anything over 10 - 20mcgs grows ALL other parts of the body (hands, feet, etc.) The body produces only 1mcg per day....

The direct method of injecting with LR3 seems to be the best.

So can IGF-1 increase bone size/density ? i belive i have naturally small bones - i think this due to skinny fingures and small clavicals - doubt theres anything i can do to change this tho - i read deca increases bone desnity but i havent really noticed anything to write home about

**ss01** · 09-07-2006, 09:02 AM

Small bones are good for aesthetics bro. You want STRONG bones, but not BIG bones, there's a world of difference. Deca is good for bones, tendons, ligaments and joints. So is Var. IGF-1 can make the ends of your bones grow, which gives a cool "caveman" look. Ugly. But yes in moderate doses it does make your bones stronger. Weight-bearing exercise in generla strenghtens bones over time.

**needbigguns** · 09-08-2006, 02:47 AM

Originally Posted by ss01

Small bones are good for aesthetics bro. You want STRONG bones, but not BIG bones, there's a world of difference. Deca is good for bones, tendons, ligaments and joints. So is Var. IGF-1 can make the ends of your bones grow, which gives a cool "caveman" look. Ugly. But yes in moderate doses it does make your bones stronger. Weight-bearing exercise in generla strenghtens bones over time.

Forgive my stupidness but in relation to this question what do you mean by aesthetics ?

I feel that because i have skinny fingers and small clavicals they would possibly break easy - dunno if this is true or not (touch wood i dont break anything now iv said that) - So which favours best for bone strength... Deca , Var, IGF-1 or Milk... ?

**Zelos** · 09-08-2006, 08:46 AM

Originally Posted by needbigguns

Forgive my stupidness but in relation to this question what do you mean by aesthetics ?

I feel that because i have skinny fingers and small clavicals they would possibly break easy - dunno if this is true or not (touch wood i dont break anything now iv said that) - So which favours best for bone strength... Deca, Var, IGF-1 or Milk... ?

i think he spoke about esthetic body

deca and var are both good for bones , igf1 also like hgh .
btw , even natural train make your bones stronger