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02-04-2009, 01:35 PM #1
How many of you use Nolv only for PCT
Hey bro's,
I wanted to ask - how many of you out there use only Nolva for PCT ie 40/40/20/20 or any other variation. I'm not interested in hearing anyone's advice on oh you should use clomid/nolva or hcg ....I just want to hear from you who have done only Nolv PCT and successfully recover post cycle.
Thanks
WCBB
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02-06-2009, 12:49 PM #2
Bump - 42 views but no responce.......does nobody use the Nolv Only PCT method at all anymore?
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02-06-2009, 01:28 PM #3
It is pretty common belief that more than just clomid is needed for pct. I have always ran clomid/nolva + an ai
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02-06-2009, 01:39 PM #4
I generally don't even answer questions where I'm told what not to say, but I doubt you find much support for a nolva-only pct by anyone who knows what they are doing.
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02-06-2009, 01:44 PM #5Banned
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K but I've got a question:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/catnolv.htm
The profiles of these two compounds are virtually identical. If you're doing a test only cycle, don't you think that nolva would be sufficient...??
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02-06-2009, 01:50 PM #6
I'll just copy and past my answer from last night, the last time I was asked that lol:
selective estrogen receptor modulators(SERMs) such as Clomiphine and Tamoxifen are selective to which tissues they bind too. Clomid being selective to the suprapituitary, while Tamox is selective to breast, bone, and liver ERs. I've come to this conclusion based on the comparison of studies on both SERMs. In every study showing benefit to HPTA from tamoxifin, the duration of the administration is 3-12months(This includes studies cited by William Llewellyn in his Nolva vs Clomid article). In studies showing levels of LH, FSH, and Testosterone checked after short durations of tamox, they were either insignificant, or their was an actual drop. I believe this is because tamox selectively works at the mammery(as well as bone and liver), thus taking longer for LH stimulation to occur.
With clomid, benefit to gonadotrophin concentrations, LH, FSH, and serum testosterone can be seen in short periods of 2-6wks. Because of the apparent selective nature of the two, and given our usual PCT duration, clomid is by far superior at LH stimulation than Nolva. Now both is the wise choice for a couple of reasons:
1. Nolva acts as the preventive measure to the estrogen flux
occured PC while clomid is the primary LH stimulator(Even more so in the case an AI is not used).
2. If your running a longer PCT, clomid needs to be discontinued after a while as it has been shown to desensitize GnRH, this due, IMO, to it's selective nature to the suprapituitary. In the longer forms of PCT, the clomid will be phased out, leaving Nolva and L-dex
credit: Pheedno
NOTE: Clomid and Nolvadex are both anti-estrogens belonging to the same group of triphenylethylene compounds. They are structurally related and specifically classified as selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs) with mixed agonistic and antagonistic properties. This means that in certain tissues they can block the effects of estrogen, by altering the binding capacity of the receptor, while in others they can act as actual estrogens, activating the receptor. In men, both of these drugs act as anti-estrogens in their capacity to oppose the negative feedback of estrogens on the hypothalamus and stimulate the heightened release of GnRH (Gonadotropin Releasing Hormone). LH output by the pituitary will be increased as a result, which in turn can increase the level of testosterone by the testes.
Although these two are related anti-estrogens, they appear to act very differently at different sites of action. Nolvadex seems to be strongly anti-estrogenic at both the hypothalamus and pituitary, which is in contrast to Clomid, which although a strong anti-estrogen at the hypothalamus, seems to exhibit weak estrogenic activity at the pituitary.
credit: Llewellyn
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02-06-2009, 01:52 PM #7
by the way, no offense, but going to bodybuilding.com for steroid advice is like calling McDonalds for fine dining recommendations. I'm sure that will ruffle some feathers, just my 2 cents.
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02-06-2009, 02:15 PM #8Banned
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02-06-2009, 02:48 PM #9New Member
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02-06-2009, 03:07 PM #10Banned
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See this is what I'm talking about. I know so many people who have cycled and only recovered with novladex. And after reading your post BIG, I'm still not really convinced that clomid would be a necessity for a light test cycle.
With Ryan's cycle I'd probably throw another SERM into the PCT... but I'm talking about just straight Test-E, or C...
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02-06-2009, 03:10 PM #11
many peeps recover fine with nolva only, esp for a light cycle, but that's not to say that everyone would. personally even if I wasn't adding clomid, I'd at least throw aromasin into the mix.
the reason I had posted the comparison last night was in reference to someone who claimed nolva and clomid were exactly the same, so there wouldn't be any reason to ever use both.
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02-06-2009, 03:20 PM #12New Member
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Hey dude. Bigs right. It just depends on the person. If you recover awsome the way it is it's pry not big deal just hitting the nolva. Its the same with me i'm going on a light cycle and it really just depends on the person. If its not working... Add the clomid
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