Using Clen to combat cortisol during PCT?

[jfalco]

How effective is this?

Is it worth doing?

[Swifto]

How effective is this?

Is it worth doing?

Clen is anti-catabolic and will lower cortisol levels. I recently saw some studies on this.

How much I'm not sure. But if I was to use Clen for this perpose (and I will next PCT), I'd go with 20-40mcg/ED 2 weeks on, 2 weeks off.

You should also look into supplements that lower cortisol. I know 11-oxo will lower cortisol, but may hinder ones PCT. The other product is EndoAmp, by PP.

Eat clean, train to failure on some sets, but not beyond. Get sufficient sleep and take your multi-vits. I also supplement *****-3 at about 30-40g/ED.

[jfalco]

Clen is anti-catabolic and will lower cortisol levels. I recently saw some studies on this.

How much I'm not sure. But if I was to use Clen for this perpose (and I will next PCT), I'd go with 20-40mcg/ED 2 weeks on, 2 weeks off.

You should also look into supplements that lower cortisol. I know 11-oxo will lower cortisol, but may hinder ones PCT. The other product is EndoAmp, by PP.

Eat clean, train to failure on some sets, but not beyond. Get sufficient sleep and take your multi-vits. I also supplement *****-3 at about 30-40g/ED.

I was thinging of using it the way you suggest. Anyone out there actually done it?

I shy away from clen a little because I have insomnia naturally. I'm afraid I won't sleep at all on the shit. That's why I am trying to weigh the benifit.

[jfalco]

The last thing you suggest got crossed out. What is it?

[Swifto]

The last thing you suggest got crossed out. What is it?

It isnt anyting that will lower cortisol, but I take a lot of it.

O m e ga -3.

I'd look into EndoAmp too by PP. Do a search on google.

[Dukkit]

It isnt anyting that will lower cortisol, but I take a lot of it.

O m e ga -3.

I'd look into EndoAmp too by PP. Do a search on google.

yeah id say

30-40g is a boat load

[peachfuzz]

I ran clen post cycle and regretted it. and its "anticatabolic properties" are vastly overrated IMO. maybe not in animals who have a boatload more beta 3 receptors than we do and can tolerate higher doses, but lets face it, not everyone can be my size.

[jfalco]

I ran clen post cycle and regretted it. and its "anticatabolic properties" are vastly overrated IMO. maybe not in animals who have a boatload more beta 3 receptors than we do and can tolerate higher doses, but lets face it, not everyone can be my size.

Why did you regret it? Just waste of time and money, or sides outweighed benifits?

What else were you running with it?

[Swifto]

yeah id say

30-40g is a boat load

Look into the (many) benifits of high dose fish oil (Om eg a-3) and you'll be surprised and probably follow suit!

It can increse ones metabolism, increase protein synthesis and has many benifits for the heart and brain.

[jfalco]

I'm getting 13g of Om ega-3 a day from flax oil. Should I be taking more. I'm not on any sort of cycle, just a clean bulking diet.

[jimmyinkedup]

Swifto - how about sharing those studies. Ive seen one in rats where cortisol increased ,...and one on horses where cortisol decreased while taking clen . I have never found one study on humans that stated this. Id love to see them as ive heard it for years.

Also with regards to ***** 3 supplementation - in this case i see one prudent reason to supp with ***** fa's - and thats phospatadyl serine. Fish oil is actually a better choice in this case as it contains 2 efa's that the body uses to produce PS. As many have heard PS is supplemented to decrease cortisol - supposedly. Honestly in this case i dont think the fish oil will help unless the body has a deficiency of PS. The bodies natural disposal method of cortisol is not by PS production (thats why unless deficient i dont think fish oil or ***** 3 fa's will help in this case).
Cytadren lowers cortisol - definitively ...and it is also a mild ai as well that can be used as part of pct protocol - just not so easy to get a hold of.

[peachfuzz]

Why did you regret it? Just waste of time and money, or sides outweighed benifits?

What else were you running with it?

lost too much too quick. i lose weight easy enough as it is. dont need the help of clen . also headaches were not fun. i just wasnt the same on it. felt weird all day. my pct consisted of clomid/nolva/aromasin

i think your best bet for cortisol mitigation is meal timing. not alot else thats gonna help too much.

[Swifto]

Swifto - how about sharing those studies. Ive seen one in rats where cortisol increased ,...and one on horses where cortisol decreased while taking clen . I have never found one study on humans that stated this. Id love to see them as ive heard it for years.

Also with regards to ***** 3 supplementation - in this case i see one prudent reason to supp with ***** fa's - and thats phospatadyl serine. Fish oil is actually a better choice in this case as it contains 2 efa's that the body uses to produce PS. As many have heard PS is supplemented to decrease cortisol - supposedly. Honestly in this case i dont think the fish oil will help unless the body has a deficiency of PS. The bodies natural disposal method of cortisol is not by PS production (thats why unless deficient i dont think fish oil or ***** 3 fa's will help in this case).
Cytadren lowers cortisol - definitively ...and it is also a mild ai as well that can be used as part of pct protocol - just not so easy to get a hold of.

Ok.

I've found and read the studies and it seems beta-2-agonists have some anti-catabolic properties and anabolic properties. There is one study on Clen, Salbutamol and Metaproterenol. I must have misread that Clen actually lowered cortisol. It does, however, show some sort of anabolic effect in gaining strength in muscles.

Form your own opinoin.

1: Arch Phys Med Rehabil. 1995 Jan;76(1):55-8. Links
Increased muscle strength in paralyzed patients after spinal cord injury: effect of beta-2 adrenergic agonist.

Signorile JF, Banovac K, Gomez M, Flipse D, Caruso JF, Lowensteyn I.
Department of Exercise and Sport Sciences, School of Medicine, University of Miami, FL 33101.

The administration of beta-2 adrenergic agonists in experimental animals result in an increased strength of skeletal muscle. In this study, we evaluated whether a beta-2 adrenergic agonist, metaproterenol, had an effect on muscle size and strength in a group of patients with muscular atrophy following spinal cord injury. Ten male subjects were randomly divided into 2 groups and agreed to participate in a prospective, double-blind, placebo-controlled, and crossover study. Metaproterenol (80 mg/day), or placebo, was administered orally for a period of 4 weeks. Muscle strength was measured by a force transducer interfaced with a microcomputer. Muscle size was calculated and expressed as a cross-sectional area of upper arm and forearm using a formula. Metaproterenol induced a significant increase of muscle strength in both groups of subjects, compared with placebo (p < .001). Similarly, there was an increase in a muscle size in the forearm following the administration of metaproterenol. Our data indicate that beta-2 adrenergic agonists may improve both muscle strength and size in patients with muscular atrophy following spinal cord paralysis.



1: Clin Sci (Lond). 1993 Jun;84(6):651-4.Links

Clenbuterol , a beta-adrenoceptor agonist, increases relative muscle strength in orthopaedic patients.

Maltin CA, Delday MI, Watson JS, Heys SD, Nevison IM, Ritchie IK, Gibson PH.
Rowett Research Institute, Bucksburn, Aberdeen, U.K.

1. The sympathomimetic agent clenbuterol has a muscle-specific anabolic effect in normal and wasted muscles from animals. This trial was designed to examine the effect of the drug on the recovery of muscle strength and area after open medial meniscectomy. 2. A double-blind, completely randomized, placebo-controlled study was carried out on 20 healthy male patients. Muscle strength and cross-sectional area were determined before and after surgery. Patients were treated with drug or placebo for 4 weeks postoperatively and there was a 2 week washout period. 3. The results suggest that, in the operated leg, clenbuterol treatment is associated with a more rapid rehabilitation of strength in knee extensor muscles; in the unoperated leg, knee extensor strength increased above the initial values after 6 weeks (P = 0.01). However, in terms of absolute strength the differences were not significant between the two groups. 4. It is concluded that the data lend support to the proposition that clenbuterol has therapeutic potential in the treatment of muscle-wasting conditions.




1: Clin Sci (Lond). 1992 Nov;83(5):615-21.Links

Erratum in:
Clin Sci 1993 Jun;84(6):following XX.
Salbutamol, a beta 2-adrenoceptor agonist, increases skeletal muscle strength in young men.Martineau L, Horan MA, Rothwell NJ, Little RA.
Department of Physiological Sciences, University of Manchester, U.K.

1. beta 2-Adrenoceptor agonists have been shown to increase rapidly lean body mass and reverse muscle wasting in several animal models of human illness. However, no published information is available for humans. In the present study, we investigated the effects of a slow-release preparation of salbutamol or a placebo on skeletal muscle functional capacity in 12 healthy men. The strength of different muscle groups was measured on two occasions before and after 14 and 21 days of treatment. 2. No significant changes in muscle strength were observed with placebo during the trial. In contrast, the strength of both quadriceps muscles increased significantly (12 +/- 3%) after 14 days on salbutamol, and remained elevated at 21 days. Whereas the strength of the hamstring muscles of the dominant leg significantly increased after 21 days on salbutamol (22 +/- 6%), the strength of the non-dominant hamstring muscles returned to baseline values. 3. There was no significant change in the grip strength of either hand in these subjects during the trial. The maximal static inspiratory mouth pressure increased significantly (7 +/- 2%) after 14 days on salbutamol, and increased further after 21 days (15 +/- 4%); the expiratory mouth pressure remained constant. No significant changes in body weight, skinfold thickness, lean body mass or limb circumferences were measured in either group. 4. These data demonstrate that short-term administration of salbutamol increases voluntary muscle strength in man. However, the magnitude and duration of this effect vary between muscle groups. This study implies that the beta 2-adrenoceptor agonists may be of therapeutic potential in altering skeletal muscle function in humans.

[jimmyinkedup]

^^^ thanks for posting the info bro - regardless of the cortisol question id still say it can be a good addition to pct. Id still love to have the cortisol question definitively answered. Oh well ...thanks agin - Seamus

[molecule]

I have been using Clean and am a big fan of it. There are ways of doing it and only then will u get the benefits of it. Like one of the threads in here suggested i do the following cycle of Clen

Day1: 20mcg
Day2: 40mcg
Day3: 60mcg
Day4: 80mcg
Day5: 80mcg
Day6-Day14: 100mcg
Day 14 - day 21 100 Mcg ( Benedryl 50mg ED before sleeping)
Day 21 onwards the same as above for anotehr 21 days.

You can do this for 12 weeks.


Clen works better for me then ehpi. Ephi crashes on me.
I have seen ppl who are not on gear or never were on gear showing some good results just with CLEN.

peachfuzz it might be possible that it was not clean that crashed on you but a wrong PCT or something else. Or if you are really really unlucky it would have ben Clen bit i doubt it.

[Swifto]

I have been using Clean and am a big fan of it. There are ways of doing it and only then will u get the benefits of it. Like one of the threads in here suggested i do the following cycle of Clen

Day1: 20mcg
Day2: 40mcg
Day3: 60mcg
Day4: 80mcg
Day5: 80mcg
Day6-Day14: 100mcg
Day 14 - day 21 100 Mcg ( Benedryl 50mg ED before sleeping)
Day 21 onwards the same as above for anotehr 21 days.

You can do this for 12 weeks.


Clen works better for me then ehpi. Ephi crashes on me.
I have seen ppl who are not on gear or never were on gear showing some good results just with CLEN.

peachfuzz it might be possible that it was not clean that crashed on you but a wrong PCT or something else. Or if you are really really unlucky it would have ben Clen bit i doubt it.

Ephedrine is catabolic and will cause the adrenal glands to elevate cortisol. It will be causing the secrection of ACTH. It shouldnt be used therfore. Same with Caffeiene.

Clen is far superoir, 2 weeks on, 2 off.

[Swifto]

^^^ thanks for posting the info bro - regardless of the cortisol question id still say it can be a good addition to pct. Id still love to have the cortisol question definitively answered. Oh well ...thanks agin - Seamus

It shows that there is some merit with beta-2-agonists.

Use Clen during PCT at small doses IMHO.