need to get off my 6 year cycle!!

[BITTAPART2]

Been on for yes 6 years now. I ran everything in the world at one point and several points in between as well. I havent used anything but test for the past 3 years though and at no more thann 500 mgs. The past two years I have been running 375 (homebrewed enanthate ) per week as it seemed to be just what I needed to keep muscle and a good sexual appetite. I want to come off totaly now, my concern is loss of sexual function and/or libido. I have plenty of cialis but obviously that will do nothing for the desire, also on hand is HCG (very little) arimidex and some cabaser (left over from a tren cycle 3 years back) and arimidex. Is there nything any VET could suggest to help me I am 33 been cycling for 8 years in total, I am 5'11" 195 at 7% right now as well but I am confident my nutrition and training can keep me in good shape. Think I am screwed.....

[Vitruvian-Man]

I can help propose a very advanced PCT for you; however, I would like to state from the beginning that chances are that you will not recover. Unfortunately, you've abused AAS to the point where your body probably will never be able to produce significant amounts of testosterone naturally again. Your HPTA has been shut down for 72 months. (like no one recovers from this...)

IMO, you should really go talk to a specialist (endo)... you can get your blood-work done, etc.... He/She will just put you on TRT (testosterone replacement therapy) for the rest of your life though.

In any case, let's begin...

a.) How is your testicular atrophy to this point? (shrunken?)

b.) Have you got BW done recently? how are your lipids been from running test @ 400mg for 3/yr straight?

You need to get a large amount of HCG immediately. Beginning @ 500iu ED for 2 - 3 weeks. See if that regains size in your testicles...

Then you should begin a PCT (~8 weeks) of nolvadex + Clomid

Anyways, I want to state once again... the damage has been done... I'm not a pessimistic guy.. but I'm going to say it as it is....

You've probably shut yourself down for life.

Sorry..

[BITTAPART2]

In these cases I wonder about people like Arnold..is he shut down?? When I use HCG I use it very sparingly as I worry I will desensitize my lydeg cells to not recognize the LH that will be sent there way. But I respond very well to HCG, I am way atrophied now, yes, but when I use HCG they come back very well.

[Vitruvian-Man]

In these cases I wonder about people like Arnold..is he shut down?? When I use HCG I use it very sparingly as I worry I will desensitize my lydeg cells to not recognize the LH that will be sent there way. But I respond very well to HCG, I am way atrophied now, yes, but when I use HCG they come back very well.

Ok... Well if you're an quick responder to HCG therapy then maybe try 250iu EOD (every 2nd day) for 14 days. (so remain on the test-E for now, and do the HCG protocol I just outlined ^^... if your testicular atrophy improves after 14 days then stop the Test-E, and wait 14 days for your PCT to commence. During this 14 day waiting period you should be shooting HCG @ 500iu every 4 - 5 days. (stop the HCG 3 days before starting the PCT)

Then do something like this:

Nolvadex 40/40/40/20/20/20
Clomid 150/100/100/75/50/50

It might take a couple of PCT's; one is not always enough for such prolonged "cycles". It's good you've got cialis on hand; because boy you're going to need it.

Anymore questions?

Keep us updated plz. Feel free to PM me if issues arise (as i don't subscribe to threads...)

[BITTAPART2]

lets keep it rolling bro, Ill call this my log. I am running prop now as I always used to b4 ending a cycle, just to keep everythng more controlled and even. 75mg EOD (again homebrew 150mg/ml prop). Yeah the cialis will be on deck for sure. My primary doctor said he will test me and move from there, I just would need insurance to cover it if at all possible. I dont mind running it legitimatly forever if my doc says so just cannot fool with the consequences I had always messed with in my younger days as I have more to lose now if I where to get something seized or anything like that.

[Vitruvian-Man]

lets keep it rolling bro, Ill call this my log. I am running prop now as I always used to b4 ending a cycle, just to keep everythng more controlled and even. 75mg EOD (again homebrew 150mg/ml prop). Yeah the cialis will be on deck for sure. My primary doctor said he will test me and move from there, I just would need insurance to cover it if at all possible. I dont mind running it legitimatly forever if my doc says so just cannot fool with the consequences I had always messed with in my younger days as I have more to lose now if I where to get something seized or anything like that.

Ok... Well stay on the prop for the next 2 weeks then (as you run the HCG ) then if your testicles recover in size/volume you can discontinue the prop, and begin the PCT 3 days after that.

That's good your doc said he'll test you. You should get a test done before PCT (just to check your lipid-profile, etc) -- as your cholesterol, and a whole wack-load of other things can be highly elevated from this 6/yr cycle -- and then I would get another blood-test done 1.5 months after PCT.

If your numbers after still extremely low 1.5 months post PCT then you'll know that you're completely shut-down and that there is no hope of recovering your production (in this case your doctor will have to prescribe you TRT because levels will be lowww...)

BTW though, if you don't have insurance being on TRT can be very expensive. Arimidex isn't a cheap drug; nor is pharma-grade testosterone . So if you can't afford for medical, legit TRT then you may have to just do home-prescribed TRT.

BTW, a normal dosage of TRT is about 1/2 of what you were cruising on. 150 - 200mg each week is a 'replacement' dosage of testosterone.

[BITTAPART2]

I have insurance but I am hoping they would cover it????? Cholesterol is actualy fine bp was 100/66 at last test. I eat very very clean and lots of fibrous green vegis daily, salmon daily, and most importantly no family history of high cholestorol. Think insurance would cover it??

[Vitruvian-Man]

I have insurance but I am hoping they would cover it????? Cholesterol is actualy fine bp was 100/66 at last test. I eat very very clean and lots of fibrous green vegis daily, salmon daily, and most importantly no family history of high cholestorol. Think insurance would cover it??

Mmm it depends. You would have to talk to your insurance company directly. Sometimes they will only pay for things like androgel .. and won't fork out cash for the actually testosterone injections.

If you've got good coverage you should be fine.

[Spartans09]

Good luck bro. I'm interested to see how this goes.

[shadey33]

Yeh also very interested as i have a mate been doing 12 on 12 off for the last 5 years and also thinking of giving it all away even though his case is very different to yours.

[stevey_6t9]

Been on for yes 6 years now. I ran everything in the world at one point and several points in between as well. I havent used anything but test for the past 3 years though and at no more thann 500 mgs. The past two years I have been running 375 (homebrewed enanthate) per week as it seemed to be just what I needed to keep muscle and a good sexual appetite. I want to come off totaly now, my concern is loss of sexual function and/or libido. I have plenty of cialis but obviously that will do nothing for the desire, also on hand is HCG (very little) arimidex and some cabaser (left over from a tren cycle 3 years back) and arimidex. Is there nything any VET could suggest to help me I am 33 been cycling for 8 years in total, I am 5'11" 195 at 7% right now as well but I am confident my nutrition and training can keep me in good shape. Think I am screwed.....

sorry mate, IMO doing even the most aggresive PCT is worthless, i dont think your HTPA will ever recover. Best advice i can give is go see an endo and discuss TRT.

[BITTAPART2]

again, what about people like Hulk Hogan, Arnold etc?? I know Hulk still uses obviously but Arnold doesnt, he must still have sex right? How effective would androgel be at giving me normal test levels though? Again, if I lived somewhere where it was legal and I didnt have to worry al the time about ordering etc. I would be fine with dosing myself 150mg per week or so but I worry about the legal consequences now more than I did in my younger days

[j4ever41]

i doubt androgel will do anything for you bro,i would follow the above protocol and give it some time,if nothing then trt for life,alot of bodybuilders have sexual sides but its not going to be talked about. goodluck to ya!

[wharton]

Stay on

[JinNtonic]

What caused you to stay on for so long?

[BJJ]

What caused you to stay on for so long?

...x2

[Bonaparte]

In these cases I wonder about people like Arnold..is he shut down??

Arnold never stayed on for years at a time, and he sure didn't run all the stuff you did. Who knows, maybe he is on TRT now? Hulk Hogan is probably on TRT as well.

[BITTAPART2]

What caused me to stay on so long was meerly stubborness and physicological dependency. All that say gear isn't addictive are not stating the truth in their words, be clear it is very addictive. I could go on for hours about why I enjoyed the physical benefits of steroids but we all know about the positive feelings and confidence we get fromm using these substances. I am thinking, yes it is TRT for life but will definatly first give it a go at trying to devise a PCT and see where I "land" for lack of better words. ANy OTC libido boosters one would recomend for this process???

[JinNtonic]

^^^ I agree I wish I never had to come off cycle. But I would worry about my health staying that long. 6 years? wow...

I could see myself staying on for 6 months tho!

Good luck with PCT, hope you can recover.

[TITANIUM]

All you can do is try to do a PCT plan.

If it does not work, it doesn't work.

Maybe it will, who knows.

TRT is not that bad, as you can buy HCG and CYP yourself.

I hate insurance companies.

Best

T

[normaljoe]

I think that after 6 years you should consult with a MD with experience in setting you up with a totally supervised PCT. anabolicdoc.com/index.html

[Warmachn]

I agree with Normaljoe ^^^

[BITTAPART2]

Just started some HCG and the boys are up to size within two days. Not putting much hope into a full on recovery so I think I am leaning towards doing ym own TRT with abround 150mg CYP and trying to cycle it a little bit, if I do in fact recover enough to live a regular life I will discontinue for a year or two before runnning a small cycle and trying to do it right but I think I should just accept the fact that I will be running CYP forever. I have had gear stockpiled for freakin years and am low finaly which is probably the only reason I started worrying in the first place (not proud of that but ehh) I am going to finish u the prop and HCG then start Clomid/Nolva just like the old days (I favored Arimidex over Nolva however but seems Clomid is making a but of a comeback). We shall see

[BJJ]

Any blood work?

[BITTAPART2]

will be getting hormone levels checked after completion of my PCT. I had my other work done yesterday, cholestorol, tri-glycerides, liver function RBC etc. will post findings when I recieve them. Bp was great, resting heart rate was 48bpm, this is all I have now. He told me how much the TRT would run me though!!! yikes!! it is usually 100mg/ml Cyp he says and a 10mml bottle is ridunKulous! Androgel would be covered under my pllann but he thinks I would be using boxes of it ultimatly

[KAEW44]

You never know man you might recover slightly or completly , if you do recover it would be wise to quit the stuff alltogether man and live your life normally after this close-to-death encounter for your libido that is!
However in the case of you being shut down for good (god forbid) and your insurance does cover TRT with test then i dont see why you should go on TRT doses for life, just keep making your home-brewed and stay on a cycle dosage so you can keep your muscle and keep making gains...the libido thing though i dont know how you can work that on TRT.

[Kiki]

6 years, jesus christ?

I'm currently on a cycle and am contemplating running it for 18 weeks, and that for me is a long asssss time.

[BITTAPART2]

You never know man you might recover slightly or completly , if you do recover it would be wise to quit the stuff alltogether man and live your life normally after this close-to-death encounter for your libido that is!
However in the case of you being shut down for good (god forbid) and your insurance does cover TRT with test then i dont see why you should go on TRT doses for life, just keep making your home-brewed and stay on a cycle dosage so you can keep your muscle and keep making gains...the libido thing though i dont know how you can work that on TRT.

honestly i would but since what 2007 no powders to brew, so I am in scramble mode now. Ordering premade gear at those premiums I have seen nowadays is retardulous!! I cant even go into what a cycle cost in the glory days! Libido is fine with TRT doses anyhow

[Swifto]

You need to do a fairly aggressive PCT and get some Toremifene IMHO.

Come off tapering the testosterone dose over X amount of weeks (determined by the ester) and start HCG therapy with the use of an AI.

HCG 500ius for 21 days with Aromasin 10mg/ED.

Then begin Tore and Tamox therapy. Tamox 20mg/ED for 6 weeks, with Tore tapered (120/120/100/100/60/60). VitC pre and post WO.

I'd also add in something for labido. Perhaps LJ100, Tongkat Ali or Tribulas.

[BITTAPART2]

aromasin wont shut my cok n balls down like letro will it??? I havent used it b4, I prefer anastrozole.(arimidex ) aromasins good to go?

[Kiki]

Aromasin isn't anywhere near as harsh as letro when it comes to your sex life.