You'll want to read this!

[AnimalJ]

I would like your opinion on this if you would. iv been playing with the idea of doing a cycle for a while and i have dabled with pro hormones some orals and what not but am now ready to this. ill post my stats goals and available gear and perhaps you could bestow some wisdom upon me.

Stats: 5'9 Weight: 206 pounds %BF:14
My goals are to shred up and maintain as much lean mass as possible and with the use of anabolics perhaps gain lean mass in the process. I am a very easy gainer if i eat protein and look at weight i tend to get mass, but cutting fat is a bit of an issue. Anyways id like to be around 202 at 6-8% somewhere in there so i know its all diet and cardio. I am currently on the anabolic diet which is a cyclical ketogenic diet as im sure you know. so in essence im not worried so much about getting bigger but am ready to take my physique to the next level in terms of quality. i do cardio 5-6 days a week sometimes twice a day and do intense weight training on a 4 day split. abs 3 times a week.

Anabolics available. Anavar, QV bold 200 (equipoise) these are the 2 i would like to use seeing as they are the most mild in terms of side effects, what might you recommend for an 8 week cycle as far as dosage and inj times. or if you don't recommend it and you would recommend otter AAS what would you suggest? if its possible to run a cycle with these two i would like to as there so mild, if not i believe i can get test or deca, as i said side effects are a concern but i have accese to hcg, clomid and noval. one more thing if theres any supplements yo u reccomend to take with this cycle? looking forward to a responce (if i get one) and thank you for your time in advance.

-Animal

[Coca Cola]

I've been reading your thread again, and in page 2:

http://forums.steroid.com/showpost.p...1&postcount=77

You mentioned that it is not necessary to wait for the long ester to clear before starting pct? Am I reading this correctly?

I had an experience of doing this, I was finishing a Test/Deca cycle and I went straight to pct a week after last shot. The last 2 weeks of the ON cycle i used hcg and i managed to swell up my balls back before entering pct. I continued my hcg treatment up until the first week of pct to maintain the full size while waiting for the clomid and nolva to fully saturate in my system, then week 2 onwards i stop completely.. My pct consist of 4 weeks of clomid 50mg/day and 4 weeks of nolva 20mg/day. But what happen afterwards was that my balls actually shrink again during second week pct.

So from this incident, I made an assumption what went wrong was the long ester hasn't clear up from the last injection, and it continually suppress my HPTA even though I'm already on PCT.

This experience kinda draws attention to your statement where it is not necessary to wait until the ester clear up, if your statement is true, then what do u think went wrong, how did I end up shrinking again during pct even though i enter with full size (up to week 1 pct)?

Is it cause by the long ester (sustanon & deca) that has not clear up?

or could it be because of the use of hcg during pct?

or some other reason which i'm unsure of?

[Ronnie Rowland]

I've been reading your thread again, and in page 2:

http://forums.steroid.com/showpost.p...1&postcount=77

You mentioned that it is not necessary to wait for the long ester to clear before starting pct? Am I reading this correctly?

I had an experience of doing this, I was finishing a Test/Deca cycle and I went straight to pct a week after last shot. The last 2 weeks of the ON cycle i used hcg and i managed to swell up my balls back before entering pct. I continued my hcg treatment up until the first week of pct to maintain the full size while waiting for the clomid and nolva to fully saturate in my system, then week 2 onwards i stop completely.. My pct consist of 4 weeks of clomid 50mg/day and 4 weeks of nolva 20mg/day. But what happen afterwards was that my balls actually shrink again during second week pct.

So from this incident, I made an assumption what went wrong was the long ester hasn't clear up from the last injection, and it continually suppress my HPTA even though I'm already on PCT.

This experience kinda draws attention to your statement where it is not necessary to wait until the ester clear up, if your statement is true, then what do u think went wrong, how did I end up shrinking again during pct even though i enter with full size (up to week 1 pct)?

Is it cause by the long ester (sustanon & deca) that has not clear up?

or could it be because of the use of hcg during pct?

or some other reason which i'm unsure of?

If your shut down, your shut down, so the compounds used will not matter! Everyone's body reacts a little differently when coming off steroids and pro-hormones. For example, I once read in a muscle magazine were Lee Priest claimed PCT was a complete waste of money for his body. He's not alone! Arnold never did PCT and some simply can't afford it as it can cost more than their cycles.

I'm all for PCT as a whole, don't get me wrong but throughout the years I have seen
people who did not seem to benefit one iota from PCT. They never had any negative side effects coming off steroids (including no or a low sex drive) or the PCT did nothing noticeable to help them recover faster or keep more gains. However, some of these people did taper their dosages all the way down to 100 mgs of test enanthate per week before going off. Some believe post cycle therapy puts too much strain on the recovery of their own axis so they just taper. I've seen some use hcg during cycles but not use it after coming off steroids and they claimed they did fine. Some use proviron to deal with a lower sex drive for a few days as well. That said, we all respond a bit differently. You might be one of these people who would benefit using 500 ius of HCG per week during the 2 week deloads. If that does not work you could always use 500 ius per week throughout your entire cycle. My experince has shown that many will experience desensitized testes to some degree over a 20 week Slingshot Anabolic Cycle. Postponing HCG usage until the end of a 20 weeker can increases some peoples need for a larger amount of HCG at the finish line. If you are one of the unlucky ones who do not bounce back well you will more than likely do better with lower/more frequent injections of HCG. By doing so you will help mimic your body’s natural LH release.


NOTE: At the end of the 20 week Slingshot Cycle, you'll want to stop the HCG as the slow acting steroids such as test enanthate clear the system. When doing a FULL PCT it's a good plan to start HCG 1 week after your last testosterone injection. Test leaves the system in two weeks making week 21 a good time to start HCG injections. This is 1 week after final deload after having done a 20 week Slingshot cycle. This allows for an even clearance in hormonal levels, while initiating FSH and LH production to begin stimulating your testes to produce testosterone. Recovery doesn’t begin while you are on HCG but after you quit using HCG since your body will not release its own LH until the HCG gets out of your system. Utilizing HCG during a steroid cycle will help prevent testicular degeneration if that's an issue for you!

[Coca Cola]

If your shut down, your shut down, so the compounds used will not matter! Everyone's body reacts a little differently when coming off steroids and pro-hormones. For example, I once read in a muscle magazine were Lee Priest claimed PCT was a complete waste of money for his body. He's not alone! Arnold never did PCT and some simply can't afford it as it can cost more than their cycles.

I'm all for PCT as a whole, don't get me wrong but throughout the years I have seen
people who did not seem to benefit one iota from PCT. They never had any negative side effects coming off steroids (including no or a low sex drive) or the PCT did nothing noticeable to help them recover faster or keep more gains. However, some of these people did taper their dosages all the way down to 100 mgs of test enanthate per week before going off. Some believe post cycle therapy puts too much strain on the recovery of their own axis so they just taper. I've seen some use hcg during cycles but not use it after coming off steroids and they claimed they did fine. Some use proviron to deal with a lower sex drive for a few days as well. That said, we all respond a bit differently. You might be one of these people who would benefit using 500 ius of HCG per week during the 2 week deloads. If that does not work you could always use 500 ius per week throughout your entire cycle. My experince has shown that many will experience desensitized testes to some degree over a 20 week Slingshot Anabolic Cycle. Postponing HCG usage until the end of a 20 weeker can increases some peoples need for a larger amount of HCG at the finish line. If you are one of the unlucky ones who do not bounce back well you will more than likely do better with lower/more frequent injections of HCG. By doing so you will help mimic your body’s natural LH release.


NOTE: At the end of the 20 week Slingshot Cycle, you'll want to stop the HCG as the slow acting steroids such as test enanthate clear the system. When doing a FULL PCT it's a good plan to start HCG 1 week after your last testosterone injection. Test leaves the system in two weeks making week 21 a good time to start HCG injections. This is 1 week after final deload after having done a 20 week Slingshot cycle. This allows for an even clearance in hormonal levels, while initiating FSH and LH production to begin stimulating your testes to produce testosterone. Recovery doesn’t begin while you are on HCG but after you quit using HCG since your body will not release its own LH until the HCG gets out of your system. Utilizing HCG during a steroid cycle will help prevent testicular degeneration if that's an issue for you!

Damn Ron! Thank you so much for such a detailed explanation! You're awesome!

For my next cycle I will follow your advice, I will use HCG throughout the 20 week cycle.

Just one last thing I need to make sure from you, if I do such protocol where I use the HCG all the way through, and succesfully prevent testicular shrinkage, is it still required to do your aggressive pct where you recommend to take HCG 2500iu EOD for the first 2 weeks of pct + 4 weeks of Clomid 50mg/day + 4 weeks of Nolva 20mg/day? Would that be an overkill?

Can I just use Clomid 50mg ED for 4 weeks instead, and leave out the HCG and the Nolva?

[Ronnie Rowland]

damn ron! Thank you so much for such a detailed explanation! You're awesome!

For my next cycle i will follow your advice, i will use hcg throughout the 20 week cycle.

Just one last thing i need to make sure from you, if i do such protocol where i use the hcg all the way through, and succesfully prevent testicular shrinkage, is it still required to do your aggressive pct where you recommend to take hcg 2500iu eod for the first 2 weeks of pct + 4 weeks of clomid 50mg/day + 4 weeks of nolva 20mg/day? Would that be an overkill? yes, that would be overkill. When using 500 ius of hcg per week (though two weekly injection of 250 ius) throughout entire cycle (starting hcg 1 week after first injection) you'll want to stop the hcg before you start pct with clomid/nolva so your leydig cells will begin to become sensitized to your lh production. At the end of the 20 week slingshot cycle, stop using hcg 1 week before the test enanthate clears your system. Once again this is week 21! This produces a more even clearance in hormonal levels, while initiating fsh and lh production so testes will start producing test once again.

can i just use clomid 50mg ed for 4 weeks instead, and leave out the hcg and the nolva? you could get by with clomid only if desired but it's best to use nolva for optimal results.

Answers above in bold.

[Coca Cola]

Answers above in bold.

Thank you once again for the clarification!

I'm now ready to try out your Slingshot Cycling combine with Slingshot Training! I'll start out the slingshot training naturally first though, then a few months from now, I'll start the cycle.

[blitzkrieg1985]

great post !!

I am planning to do the following cycle:-

Weeks 1-10: Test E 250mg x2 per week (500mg total) [Reload]
Weeks 5-11: hCG 250iu x 2 per week [Deload]
Weeks 12+: Nolva 40/20/20/20/10+Aromasin 10/5/5/5/5/5 [PCT]

I just want to do a single cycle of test...do you think the above is well laid out?

I will be using the slingshot training program..

Also, I just did a H-drol solo cycle ( which was my firs cycle) and my PCT ends today..My libido didn't suffer any setback during the entire cycle, i made some average gains which i wasn't satisfied with much...is there anything wrong if i begin my test cycle next month (i.e. a break of 1month)

any changes to be made to my cycle ronnie?


thanks!

[Ronnie Rowland]

i would like your opinion on this if you would. Iv been playing with the idea of doing a cycle for a while and i have dabled with pro hormones some orals and what not but am now ready to this. Ill post my stats goals and available gear and perhaps you could bestow some wisdom upon me.

Stats: 5'9 weight: 206 pounds %bf:14
my goals are to shred up and maintain as much lean mass as possible and with the use of anabolics perhaps gain lean mass in the process. I am a very easy gainer if i eat protein and look at weight i tend to get mass, but cutting fat is a bit of an issue. Anyways id like to be around 202 at 6-8% somewhere in there so i know its all diet and cardio. I am currently on the anabolic diet which is a cyclical ketogenic diet as im sure you know. IMO GOING IN AND OUT OF KETOSIS ON THIS ANABOLIC DIET IS NOT GOOD! So in essence im not worried so much about getting bigger but am ready to take my physique to the next level in terms of quality. I do cardio 5-6 days a week sometimes twice a day and do intense weight training on a 4 day split. Abs 3 times a week.

Anabolics available. Anavar, qv bold 200 (equipoise) these are the 2 i would like to use seeing as they are the most mild in terms of side effects, what might you recommend for an 8 week cycle as far as dosage and inj times. Your going to need testosterone in any cycle as a base. You will also need to run a 20 week slingshot cycle not an 8 week cycle for maximum results. It's not uncommon to have more side effects on eq (anxiety/high hemocrit levels) and var (lethargicnes/low sex drive) than when using straight testosterone. many options are available. You might try the cycle below with the compounds you mentioned:
Phase 1:
8 week reload- anavar 40 mgs per day/test enatnthate 500 mgs per week divided into two weekly injections.
2 week deload- 250 mgs per week with 1 weekly injection.


Phase 2:
8 week reload-test enanthate 750 mgs of test enanthate divided into 2 weekly injections/400 mgs of eq divided into 2 weekly injections per week.
2 week deload-300 mgs per week with 1 weekly injection.

Or if you don't recommend it and you would recommend otter aas what would you suggest? If its possible to run a cycle with these two i would like to as there so mild, if not i believe i can get test or deca, as i said side effects are a concern but i have accese to hcg, clomid and noval. One more thing if theres any supplements yo u reccomend to take with this cycle? supplements would be protein powder, fish oil caps, glucosamine/chondroitin and have anties on hand in case needed. Taking creatine ehtyl ester during 2 week deloads works well. looking forward to a responce (if i get one) and thank you for your time in advance.

-animal

answers above in bold