You'll want to read this!

[VASCULAR VINCE]

bigron..number 1 ASS building exercise ...for females???

[VASCULAR VINCE]

bigron..agree..or..disagree..with article??


The Great Oral Debate: Anadrol vs. Dianabol
By Gavin Kane

For many years, a great debate has raged over which oral is superior for mass gains, and two of them have stood the test of time; dianabol and anadrol. The debate has continued, arguing which of the two is superior, yet no conclusive evidence has proven one better than the other. People respond to each one differently, some swearing by dbol and some swearing by anadrol. Before we declare one the winner, I am going to go over a bit of history and chemical structure on both products.

anadrol (oxymetholone) was first made available in the 1960’s by Syntex. It is very effective at increasing red blood cell production and was promising for treating severe cases of anemia. With the advent of newer and more advanced drugs such as Erythropoietin, which have less androgenic side effects, anadrol was discontinued. New studies in AIDS/HIV patients revealed anadrol was particularly effective at reducing wasting symptoms so it was re-released in the late 1990’s.

Oxymetholone is a derivative of dihydrotestosterone, which in theory means it should not convert to estrogen. Since it does not aromatize but still causes gynecomastia in some users, there are other pathways by which it converts. After looking at studies on AIDS patients, I found that it may convert by actively activating the estrogen receptor, so this is a product that would need an anti-estrogen such as Nolvadex.

dianabol (methandrostenolone) was first made in 1956 by John Zieglar of Ciba fame. dianabol has been one of the most por oral steroids of all time, exploding in pority in the 1970’s with bodybuilders and football players and expanding into all avenues of athletics during the 1980’s. It somewhat waned during the 1990’s with the steroid control act, but was hot again in the early 2000’s with reproduction in mass quantities by Mexican labs and underground labs.
Methandrostenolone is a derivative of testosterone and hence will convert to estrogen. gynecomastia will be a concern for sure, in almost all users, whereas only less than 25% have problems with anadrol. Again water retention will be a problem, usually due to the estrogenic properties.

Both products will have similar androgenic side effects, which include; acne, water retention, oily skin, male pattern baldness, and increased body hair growth. Both drugs are c17 alpha alkylated, therefore Liver protection will be necessary, especially when combining the two.

So we come to the premise of this article, anadrol vs. dianabol. Why, the great debate over which product to take? They work on different pathways, have similar side effects you will have to combat, and both are Liver toxic. So why is there a debate over which is better and which one should you take? Well, as I stated earlier, different people have different responses to each product. Many people, including myself, find high doses of anadrol to be too much to handle in trade of the results you get. With this product, I have an extreme loss of appetite, massive water retention, and overall aches and pains and headaches.

On the other hand, when I take dianabol, I get a general sense of well-being, good but not great size gains, and the ability to keep eating. It sounds like I should keep taking dianabol and drop the anadrol, right? Wrong. I get massive male pattern baldness from dianabol, which I do not experience from anadrol. I have an increase in blood pressure levels at doses that are high enough to match my gains from anadrol, and I have to shorten my cycles because of the massive dosages I take to get good gains. So in all, I get some side effects from each that I would like to avoid, while still retaining the great benefits that I can only get from each product.

anadrol is well known for its ability to cause massive size and strength increases, and as we all know, a stronger muscle has to become a bigger muscle with enough calories to feed it. dianabol gives me large, quality muscle gains without as much water retention as anadrol. So what is the compromise? Do I take one during one cycle and then the other product during my next cycle?

The answer is no to both. There is no need to short change yourself gains in either department when you can have your Cake and eat it too. I am not alone in my assessments of both products. Most guys have similar issues of massive water retention, headaches and loss of appetite with anadrol, and MPB and fewer gains with dianabol comparatively. So, the best thing we can do is decrease our dosages of both products to cut down on side-effects and take them at the same time to increase the benefits.

My recommendation is to take both products in lower dosages but for longer periods of time. dianabol has been found to work much better for quality gains when taken in lower dosages but for longer periods of time. High doses have severe side effects in some users, a loss of all gains with cessation of the product because of the short cycle (4-6 weeks) and most of the aforementioned side-effects.

Your dosages will be cycle history dependent but when I was at the peak of my career, I was taking cycles of 200mg dianabol for 6 weeks per cycle, or 250-300mg anadrol per 6 week cycle. In later cycles when I decided to combine the two products together, I was able to drop my dianabol use to 50mg per day, and my anadrol use to 100mg per day and because of the synergistic effect of the two products combined, the effect was similar to high doses of each but with none of the sides. There is something very synergistic when taking these two products together with just a simple cycle of testosterone and deca-durabolin.

I would run my anadrol cycles for 8 weeks at that dose and my dianabol cycles for 10 weeks at that low dose with no Liver toxic effects as proven by my quarterly blood tests. I did not have to take liver protectants, but I recommend them for most users. I no longer had to watch my blood pressure, my water retention was minimal compared to earlier cycles, and I was able to continue eating massive amounts of food because I did not experience appetite loss from a massive dose of anadrol.

I highly recommend on your next bulking cycle you try the following: A base cycle of test and deca, add in the anadrol and dianabol mix, and some Nolvadex. You will be able to control your water retention, Liver toxicity, and other side effects by controlling your dosages. Your doses will vary from mine, but just adjust accordingly and run them for longer periods of time. You will be amazed at the simplicity of this cycle and yet the synergy is un-describable. Your gains will be far better than you have ever had when taking each product alone, your side effects will be less than if you were to take either product in higher doses, thanks to the different biochemical pathways. Everyone already knows that test and anadrol, and deca and dbol are very synergistic. Now combine all four in a cycle and watch yourself just blow up.

[pfmahan]

Hi Ronnie, great thread, already on my 3rd time reading through it, you present info worth absorbing. And with all you've been through you are a real encouragement. I know you have answered this before, but mabye you can explain it to me so I understand it. I will be starting my 3rd reload in 2 weeks. I have used nothing but testosterone for the cycles. 1st one was 500mg, second 750mg, and for the 3rd it will be 1g. My question is can I continue to increase each time with test only, or is their a certain point where I should add another compound. I thought as long as you increase anabolics each reload you would continue to see results. Thanks in advance for any answer!!

[The Titan99]

Hey Ron, this last cycle I was running MENT (Acetate), Masteron P, NPP. A week before my deload I started adding 200 mg Test E Mon. and Thurs. It's the first time I've done a reload with all fast esters like this one. Usually I have either test Enth, Cyp or Sust, as a base, or run Prop for my deload at 350-525 mg. Anyway, WOW!!! Unbelievable how my strength dropped during this last week!! I was squatting 462 lbs for 6 reps on my first working set last week for instance. This week I knew I would have to drop the weight and go for high reps. I was doing my second warm up set at 375 lbs when I realized that like it or not, this was my first working set, not a warm up after all. Like I said, WOW!! I got 10 reps but just barely!!! Almost panicked was thinking about 1 ml of prop being afraid I'd waste away!! I haven't done that since I thought I'd wait to get your opinion on the subject. Like I said, I led the thing by a week and still felt like the rug was jerked out from under me. I'm wondering if this is cool or if you'd leave in say 400 mg of enth during future reloads, deload with prop or just do it like I have been?

[Ronnie Rowland]

[QUOTE=The Titan99;6008065]Hey Ron, this last cycle I was running MENT (Acetate), Masteron P, NPP. A week before my deload I started adding 200 mg Test E Mon. and Thurs. It's the first time I've done a reload with all fast esters like this one. Usually I have either test Enth, Cyp or Sust, as a base, or run Prop for my deload at 350-525 mg. Anyway, WOW!!! Unbelievable how my strength dropped during this last week!! I was squatting 462 lbs for 6 reps on my first working set last week for instance. This week I knew I would have to drop the weight and go for high reps. I was doing my second warm up set at 375 lbs when I realized that like it or not, this was my first working set, not a warm up after all. Like I said, WOW!! I got 10 reps but just barely!!! Almost panicked was thinking about 1 ml of prop being afraid I'd waste away!! I haven't done that since I thought I'd wait to get your opinion on the subject. Like I said, I led the thing by a week and still felt like the rug was jerked out from under me. I'm wondering if this is cool or if you'd leave in say 400 mg of enth during future reloads, deload with prop or just do it like I have been? YOU'LL LOSE MORE STRENGTH ON DELOADS WHEN ONLY FAST ACTING ESTERS ARE USED DURING RELOADS. THAT'S ONE OF SEVERAL REASONS TO RUN A LONG ACTING TESTOSTERONE AS YOUR BASE IN ALL YOUR RELOADS. STILL YET, LOSING STRENGTH FOR A COUPLE OF WEEKS IS GOING TO GIVE YOUR JOINTS ALITTLE MORE BREAK FROM THE HEAVY LIFTING AND AT YOUR AGE IT'S NOT NECESSARILY A BAD THING. ANOTHER OPTION WOULD BE TO DELOAD WITH PROP AS OPPOSED TO LONGER ACTING TEST ESTERS IF YOU WANT TO USE ONLY FAST ACTING ESTER DRUGS FOR RELOADS OR YOU CAN JUST ADD A BASE OF 4-500 MGS OF TEST-E WEEKLY DURING RELOADS AND KEEP THAT DOSAGE IN FOR THE DELOADS.QUOTE]ABOVE

[Ronnie Rowland]

Hey Ron, this last cycle I was running MENT (Acetate), Masteron P, NPP. A week before my deload I started adding 200 mg Test E Mon. and Thurs. It's the first time I've done a reload with all fast esters like this one. Usually I have either test Enth, Cyp or Sust, as a base, or run Prop for my deload at 350-525 mg. Anyway, WOW!!! Unbelievable how my strength dropped during this last week!! I was squatting 462 lbs for 6 reps on my first working set last week for instance. This week I knew I would have to drop the weight and go for high reps. I was doing my second warm up set at 375 lbs when I realized that like it or not, this was my first working set, not a warm up after all. Like I said, WOW!! I got 10 reps but just barely!!! Almost panicked was thinking about 1 ml of prop being afraid I'd waste away!! I haven't done that since I thought I'd wait to get your opinion on the subject. Like I said, I led the thing by a week and still felt like the rug was jerked out from under me. I'm wondering if this is cool or if you'd leave in say 400 mg of enth during future reloads, deload with prop or just do it like I have been?

I answered this question previously but forgot to add that creatine is a great addition for 2 week deloads to help maintain strength!

[Ronnie Rowland]

Hi Ronnie, great thread, already on my 3rd time reading through it, you present info worth absorbing. And with all you've been through you are a real encouragement. I know you have answered this before, but mabye you can explain it to me so I understand it. I will be starting my 3rd reload in 2 weeks. I have used nothing but testosterone for the cycles. 1st one was 500mg, second 750mg, and for the 3rd it will be 1g. My question is can I continue to increase each time with test only, or is their a certain point where I should add another compound. You'll reach a point where another anabolic will have to be used if you are looking at maximal gains but if you are a recreational lifter you can get by with just using test.. I thought as long as you increase anabolics each reload you would continue to see results. You will up to a point. Most find that anything over 1.5 -2 grams of test weekly is a waste and the side effects become too much to handle. Thanks in advance for any answer!!

above

[Ronnie Rowland]

bigron..agree..or..disagree..with article??


The great oral debate: Anadrol vs. Dianabol
by gavin kane

for many years, a great debate has raged over which oral is superior for mass gains, and two of them have stood the test of time; dianabol and anadrol. The debate has continued, arguing which of the two is superior, yet no conclusive evidence has proven one better than the other. People respond to each one differently, some swearing by dbol and some swearing by anadrol. Before we declare one the winner, i am going to go over a bit of history and chemical structure on both products. i agree so far.
anadrol (oxymetholone) was first made available in the 1960’s by syntex. It is very effective at increasing red blood cell production and was promising for treating severe cases of anemia. With the advent of newer and more advanced drugs such as erythropoietin, which have less androgenic side effects, anadrol was discontinued. New studies in aids/hiv patients revealed anadrol was particularly effective at reducing wasting symptoms so it was re-released in the late 1990’s.

Oxymetholone is a derivative of dihydrotestosterone, which in theory means it should not convert to estrogen. Since it does not aromatize but still causes gynecomastia in some users, there are other pathways by which it converts. After looking at studies on aids patients, i found that it may convert by actively activating the estrogen receptor, so this is a product that would need an anti-estrogen such as nolvadex. i would use masteron over nolvadex unless gyno was evident because nolvadex decreases igf-levels and does nothing for muscle mass gains unlike masterone which increase size while mildy reducing estrogen.
dianabol (methandrostenolone) was first made in 1956 by john zieglar of ciba fame. Dianabol has been one of the most por oral steroids of all time, exploding in pority in the 1970’s with bodybuilders and football players and expanding into all avenues of athletics during the 1980’s. It somewhat waned during the 1990’s with the steroid control act, but was hot again in the early 2000’s with reproduction in mass quantities by mexican labs and underground labs.
Methandrostenolone is a derivative of testosterone and hence will convert to estrogen. Gynecomastia will be a concern for sure, in almost all users, whereas only less than 25% have problems with anadrol. not true! If d-bol causes gyno for you then so will anadrol in the majority of cases and those not prone to gyno will have no issues with either drug. Who makes up these myths i often wonder!? again water retention will be a problem, usually due to the estrogenic properties.

Both products will have similar androgenic side effects, which include; acne, water retention, oily skin, male pattern baldness, and increased body hair growth. Both drugs are c17 alpha alkylated, therefore liver protection will be necessary, especially when combining the two.the best liver protection is not overdoing strong orals.
so we come to the premise of this article, anadrol vs. Dianabol. Why, the great debate over which product to take? They work on different pathways, have similar side effects you will have to combat, and both are liver toxic. not really as some feel sleepy all the time on d-bol and nauseated all the time on anadrol but some feel great on both d-bol and anadrol. There's no set rules! so why is there a debate over which is better and which one should you take? Well, as i stated earlier, different people have different responses to each product. true! many people, including myself, find high doses of anadrol to be too much to handle in trade of the results you get. With this product, i have an extreme loss of appetite, massive water retention, and overall aches and pains and headaches.

On the other hand, when i take dianabol, i get a general sense of well-being, good but not great size gains, and the ability to keep eating. It sounds like i should keep taking dianabol and drop the anadrol, right? Wrong. I get massive male pattern baldness from dianabol, which i do not experience from anadrol. I have an increase in blood pressure levels at doses that are high enough to match my gains from anadrol, and i have to shorten my cycles because of the massive dosages i take to get good gains. So in all, i get some side effects from each that i would like to avoid, while still retaining the great benefits that i can only get from each product.this is not true either as some who have mixed small amounts of d-bol and anadrol together felt sicker than ever. Then theres those who do fine with the injectable versions and then theres some who do not.
anadrol is well known for its ability to cause massive size and strength increases, and as we all know, a stronger muscle has to become a bigger muscle with enough calories to feed it. Dianabol gives me large, quality muscle gains without as much water retention as anadrol. some gain more water on d-bol than anadrol so this is simply not true! so what is the compromise? Do i take one during one cycle and then the other product during my next cycle?

The answer is no to both. There is no need to short change yourself gains in either department when you can have your cake and eat it too. I am not alone in my assessments of both products. Most guys have similar issues of massive water retention, headaches and loss of appetite with anadrol, and mpb and fewer gains with dianabol comparatively. So, the best thing we can do is decrease our dosages of both products to cut down on side-effects and take them at the same time to increase the benefits. [bnot so as ]this works for some and makes things worse for others.[/b]
my recommendation is to take both products in lower dosages but for longer periods of time. Dianabol has been found to work much better for quality gains when taken in lower dosages but for longer periods of time. High doses have severe side effects in some users, a loss of all gains with cessation of the product because of the short cycle (4-6 weeks) and most of the aforementioned side-effects. i agree that taking it for longer periods at lower dosages is best or switch over to a different compound after 4 weeks of usage.
your dosages will be cycle history dependent but when i was at the peak of my career, i was taking cycles of 200mg dianabol for 6 weeks per cycle, or 250-300mg anadrol per 6 week cycle. In later cycles when i decided to combine the two products together, i was able to drop my dianabol use to 50mg per day, and my anadrol use to 100mg per day and because of the synergistic effect of the two products combined, the effect was similar to high doses of each but with none of the sides. the majority still have some side effects taking d-bol and anadrol at the aforementioned dosages. There is something very synergistic when taking these two products together with just a simple cycle of testosterone and deca-durabolin.true only if you are one of those who do better mixing the two but not if you do better using one or the other!
i would run my anadrol cycles for 8 weeks at that dose and my dianabol cycles for 10 weeks at that low dose with no liver toxic effects as proven by my quarterly blood tests. I did not have to take liver protectants, but i recommend them for most users.i see a contradiction here! Hes promoting liver aids but does not use them himself!? Liver protectors make some people sick and do nothng positive for them. i no longer had to watch my blood pressure, my water retention was minimal compared to earlier cycles, and i was able to continue eating massive amounts of food because i did not experience appetite loss from a massive dose of anadrol.this has more to do with long term use and getting along better with the drugs due to building up a tolerance not because mixing d-bol and anadrol works magic. Some do well mixing them in injectable form but not oral but some feel like garbage even on the injectable d-bol and anadrol.

I highly recommend on your next bulking cycle you try the following: A base cycle of test and deca, add in the anadrol and dianabol mix, and some nolvadex. You will be able to control your water retention, liver toxicity, and other side effects by controlling your dosages. Your doses will vary from mine, but just adjust accordingly and run them for longer periods of time. You will be amazed at the simplicity of this cycle and yet the synergy is un-describable. Your gains will be far better than you have ever had when taking each product alone, your side effects will be less than if you were to take either product in higher doses, thanks to the different biochemical pathways. Everyone already knows that test and anadrol, and deca and dbol are very synergistic. Now combine all four in a cycle and watch yourself just blow up this can work for some and not work for others!

above

[Ronnie Rowland]

[QUOTE=VASCULAR VINCE;6006776]bigron..number 1 ASS building exercise ...for females??? Smith machine barbell lunges using a (reebok step up as used in aerobics/body pump classes in order to get down deeper and make those glutes work even harder than a standard lunge.). /QUOTE]above

[VASCULAR VINCE]

[QUOTE=Ronnie Rowland;6008631]

bigron..number 1 ASS building exercise ...for females??? Smith machine barbell lunges using a (reebok step up as used in aerobics/body pump classes in order to get down deeper and make those glutes work even harder than a standard lunge.). /QUOTE]above

ron..my girl's ass is sore as hell....lmao!!!