T3 or clen

[tboney]

Hi, I'm no medical expert and a chic to boot... however, I wanted to point out that T3 has been used in the medical community (not just for thyroid issues, but for depression/bipolar as well). It has long standing usage and is considered safe. That being said - you can abuse anything, and understanding what it does is helpful.

It does increase your metabolic rate. Great. Awesome.
It does increase your systolic blood pressure. Ok, maybe not so awesome. That's the figure we don't want creeping up too far past 120
It does increase protein synthesis. Back to pretty awesome.
It does increase your heart rate. Again, maybe not so awesome... Might get palpitations, etc. If you have a history of heart problems, well... be careful.



Important details no one seems to mention:
Kinda important: It can effect your sleep as well.. you take too much, can cause nervousness and sleeplessness (basically you'll mimic hyperthyroidism).
Important: Some folks have an allergic reaction to it. It can cause hives.. or you can have a serious reaction to it. Just be aware of this possibility if you've never taken it.
Very important: In clinical/medical settings - you ramp up on T3. Patients start on a fairly low dose... like 25mcg, and up it after about a week. You can bump it about 25mcg each week... maintenance for someone with a thyroid condition is about 100-150mcg... no idea what recommended dosing is for weight loss for an average sized dude... but I can't shrug off the medical communities advice on ramping up the dosage over 2-3 weeks.... You might consider tapering it down gradually as well... else you might feel peculiar...

All that being said... I'm not advocating one over the other. I think it depends on personal pref and how your body responds. Clen isn't without it's issues - not the least of it being - it's toxic.

I hope some of this was helpful. Best of luck -- m

I agree. I am aware of the fact that it is safely used by the medical profession for certain conditions as you mentioned above. However docs are not using the same doses and protocol as many use it weight loss. If you have hypothyroidism then yes docs are now starting to use t3 to treat it. I was on t3 for two years to treat my hypothyroidism.....That is different then using it soley for weightloss. I have never heard of them prescribing it [B]to people who have normal, healthy thyroid functioning, at the doses we talk about here. I am not saying that people dont recover just fine.... but some do not. I just feel like fat loss can be acheived through diet and cardio. [/

[mi-chan]

I agree. I am aware of the fact that it is safely used by the medical profession for certain conditions as you mentioned above. However docs are not using the same doses and protocol as many use it weight loss. If you have hypothyroidism then yes docs are now starting to use t3 to treat it. I was on t3 for two years to treat my hypothyroidism.....That is different then using it soley for weightloss. I have never heard of them prescribing it [B]to people who have normal, healthy thyroid functioning, at the doses we talk about here. I am not saying that people dont recover just fine.... but some do not. I just feel like fat loss can be acheived through diet and cardio. [/

T3 is sometimes prescribed (often with other anti-depressants) in people with normal thyroids, for treatment of depression and bipolar.

But I do agree with you - anything is easy to abuse (more is not always better)... I tend to proceed with great caution when mucking with my own personal chemistry. Again, not advocating usage - rather just want to provide some info on using, including risks (ie don't give yourself a heart attack or cause your blood pressure to spike). As for long term damage - that is an area I am uneducated/have a lack of info on. I know of a few long term studies for t3 in depression patients (up to 2 years), with no reported thyroid damage... but, again.. those are controlled studies, with an emphasis on something else.

At lower levels, I'd say it's likely relatively safe - our own t3/t4 levels fluctuate quite a lot... And if someone's coming off a cycle, and they have some degradation in liver function - it might be they aren't converting their own levels of t4 to t3 efficiently.. In this case - it might be a good idea to bump the levels. I don't know - I'm not a doctor... I'd say in the spectrum of drugs discussed in this forum, it probably falls on the safer side in terms of risk (as long as you don't take mega-doses).

And you are absolutely correct - the safest/healthiest path is diet and exercise... no argument there!

[tboney]

T3 is sometimes prescribed (often with other anti-depressants) in people with normal thyroids, for treatment of depression and bipolar. Right but not 75 to 125 mcgs....
But I do agree with you - anything is easy to abuse (more is not always better)... I tend to proceed with great caution when mucking with my own personal chemistry. Again, not advocating usage - rather just want to provide some info on using, including risks (ie don't give yourself a heart attack or cause your blood pressure to spike). As for long term damage - that is an area I am uneducated/have a lack of info on. I know of a few long term studies for t3 in depression patients (up to 2 years), with no reported thyroid damage... but, again.. those are controlled studies, with an emphasis on something else. Right again but not at dosages of 75 to 125 mcgs...
At lower levels, I'd say it's likely relatively safe - our own t3/t4 levels fluctuate quite a lot... And if someone's coming off a cycle, and they have some degradation in liver function - it might be they aren't converting their own levels of t4 to t3 efficiently.. In this case - it might be a good idea to bump the levels. I don't know - I'm not a doctor... I'd say in the spectrum of drugs discussed in this forum, it probably falls on the safer side in terms of risk (as long as you don't take mega-doses).

And you are absolutely correct - the safest/healthiest path is diet and exercise... no argument there!

Bold

[mi-chan]

Bold

Tboney- I'm not gonna get in a pissing match with you b/c you have the equipment advantage on that one, and I think we actually agree... I would never dream of dosing that high, but then again, I barely weigh 100lbs soaking wet (and truthfully, I'm good with the eca stack for a little boost if I'm trying to cut.Yeah, I'm old school that way). And, I think I did point out, at lower levels, it prob ain't a bit deal... can't speak for the dosing you've cited. So, thanks for clarifying.

Really my whole point was if you don't know your blood pressure or have problems with your heart, be cautious. If you're ramping up your cardio and taking something that makes your heart contract harder (like t3), it might be risky. Get big and strong, boys. But be safe.

[tboney]

Tboney- I'm not gonna get in a pissing match with you b/c you have the equipment advantage on that one, and I think we actually agree... I would never dream of dosing that high, but then again, I barely weigh 100lbs soaking wet (and truthfully, I'm good with the eca stack for a little boost if I'm trying to cut.Yeah, I'm old school that way). And, I think I did point out, at lower levels, it prob ain't a bit deal... can't speak for the dosing you've cited. So, thanks for clarifying.

Really my whole point was if you don't know your blood pressure or have problems with your heart, be cautious. If you're ramping up your cardio and taking something that makes your heart contract harder (like t3), it might be risky. Get big and strong, boys. But be safe.

Wow I wasnt aware you were feeling that way.... I thought all along that we were saying the same thing. I was just pointing out that the off label uses were given in doses much lower trhan we talk about here......

[mi-chan]

Wow I wasnt aware you were feeling that way.... I thought all along that we were saying the same thing. I was just pointing out that the off label uses were given in doses much lower trhan we talk about here......

Oh hon, I'm not the slight bit offended or taken aback - sorry if I came off that way. I have a bit of a sense of humor and sometimes it doesn't translate right when I type things out... I think you were smart to point out the dosing, glad you did! And glad we are both on the same page. My bad for for communicating otherwise!

[tboney]

Oh hon, I'm not the slight bit offended or taken aback - sorry if I came off that way. I have a bit of a sense of humor and sometimes it doesn't translate right when I type things out... I think you were smart to point out the dosing, glad you did! And glad we are both on the same page. My bad for for communicating otherwise!

No sweat! I appreciate the humor... its refreshing around here.. We are good to go! You made some great points!