Yeah i was looking at the thread yesterday on the phone and got me hooked, really good info. I'll look it up carefully now on the computer so i can really suck in that info. At the percentage i am now when i flex i can definitely see some abs but i rather start working them now so i can have more visible abs at 10% rather then waiting to get to 10% to start working out abdominal section. Thanks Mick for the thread and everyone else who chimed in!!!