Once a week or Twice per week?

[JuliusPleaser]

Here's a pic of me following the Simply Shredded program (each muscle 2x per week) Push pull legs, and was also flexible dieting. (LEFT)
VS
Dorian 4x a week each muscle once to death, 1 working set (after 1-2 warm ups) finished with a drop. Was still doing flexible dieting but not really, was really doing rice and steak Stan Effodring type, but then did cheats. No counting either. (RIGHT)

I didn't cover my entire face so you can see how much leaner I was in the left.

So my logic is I should go do the 2x per week but I was on gear in both pics. Now I'm on nothing but MK and creatine

Also I didn't do any cardio in the right pic, whatsoever.

[GearHeaded]

Here's a pic of me following the Simply Shredded program (each muscle 2x per week) Push pull legs, and was also flexible dieting. (LEFT)
VS
Dorian 4x a week each muscle once to death, 1 working set (after 1-2 warm ups) finished with a drop. Was still doing flexible dieting but not really, was really doing rice and steak Stan Effodring type, but then did cheats. No counting either. (RIGHT)

I didn't cover my entire face so you can see how much leaner I was in the left.

So my logic is I should go do the 2x per week but I was on gear in both pics. Now I'm on nothing but MK and creatine

Also I didn't do any cardio in the right pic, whatsoever.

if things are set up properly I think you can get leaner and still maintain your fullness. now without AAS your not going to have near the protein effeciency or the glucose super compensation effects. so going high protein is essential and so is 'timing' of any carb consumption. so your diet needs to be spot on.
also with training. your recovery is going to be the limiting factor without AAS. make sure you hit those crucial working sets that provide the stimulus you need, and thats it. don't go beyond that. don't think that extra volume junk sets are going to do anything for you.
your calorie burning will happen just fine via diet and NEAT. your training with weights is just for the stimulus needed to grow and maintain muscle.


drugs -
your not able to take any AAS . but with the MK677 and adding in something like Clen (at low dose) and T3/T4 is pretty syneregistic and will not only add to fat loss benefits it will also be 'anabolic' (with sufficient natty estrogen levels .. guys that go flat and lose muscle with thyroid hormone are generally low in estrogen levels from taking AI's or they are taking way too much T3).
40mcg Clen, 25mcg T3 and/or 75mcg T4 with the 25mg MK at night, that combo will help

[JuliusPleaser]

if things are set up properly I think you can get leaner and still maintain your fullness. now without AAS your not going to have near the protein effeciency or the glucose super compensation effects. so going high protein is essential and so is 'timing' of any carb consumption. so your diet needs to be spot on.
also with training. your recovery is going to be the limiting factor without AAS. make sure you hit those crucial working sets that provide the stimulus you need, and thats it. don't go beyond that. don't think that extra volume junk sets are going to do anything for you.
your calorie burning will happen just fine via diet and NEAT. your training with weights is just for the stimulus needed to grow and maintain muscle.


drugs -
your not able to take any AAS . but with the MK677 and adding in something like Clen (at low dose) and T3/T4 is pretty syneregistic and will not only add to fat loss benefits it will also be 'anabolic' (with sufficient natty estrogen levels .. guys that go flat and lose muscle with thyroid hormone are generally low in estrogen levels from taking AI's or they are taking way too much T3).
40mcg Clen, 25mcg T3 and/or 75mcg T4 with the 25mg MK at night, that combo will help

I do have some pharm clen left I can do 40mg a day keep to add to the mix. Do you think I should be doing HIT or 2x a week? Obvious I think I did HIT correctly lol. If I can do HIT 4x a week and do LISS 2-3x a week on off days

[Windex]

I do have some pharm clen left I can do 40mg a day keep to add to the mix. Do you think I should be doing HIT or 2x a week? Obvious I think I did HIT correctly lol. If I can do HIT 4x a week and do LISS 2-3x a week on off days

If it worked for you before then you can certainly continue until progress slows or plateaus.

[JuliusPleaser]

If it worked for you before then you can certainly continue until progress slows or plateaus.

Indeed. I just hate reading all this information that existst on both sides making good points.

[GearHeaded]

guys that do 25 sets of chest two times per week either don't know how to calculate volume and count only working sets, or they don't know how to train with intensity..
its physically impossible to do 50 sets of chest per week if your training high intensity.

these guys do 5 sets of bench press, with pussy ass weight. then run over to cable flies and do 5 sets of that and swinging the weight and don't contract their chest. then do incline dumbbell presses with only 40 pounds for 5 sets.. then do 5 sets of machine presses while playing on their phone. then 5 sets of pec dec at the end of their workout and they still don't even have a chest pump at this time.
then they calculate that and say they did 25 sets of chest. bullshit. they didn't even do one

these guys are not really training with "high volume" like they pretend to be. they aren't training at all. they are spinning their wheels in the gym doing nothing.
a lot of high volume advocates simply don't know how to train in the first place and they are grossly over exaggerating their volume.


sure I've done "high volume" and done 12 sets of bench press in one workout.. but the only sets I counted were the 2 sets at 315 to failure. the other 10 are not counted at all

[JuliusPleaser]

Well i didn't see your response until just now after the gym. I decide to go with HIT and did back. I did 5 exercises. Each got 2 warm up sets of 8-12 reps; then I added enough weight after feeling it out to get 8 reps to good failure. SO each much got ONE working set.. A few of the exercises I did a drop set removing a plate to knock out another 4 reps (since I don't have a partner). I focused on going slow and all that so they weren't sloppy at all.

I feel Fking good right now. AND I have pump.

My breakfast was 3 eggs with 2 pieces of cheddar scrambled with med rare steak.

I guess we'll see if my back heals by thursday. if it does, I should prob go back to 2x a week.

Some people have suggest to cycle routines to get best of both worlds. Do HIT for a few weeks, then switch to HVT.

[GearHeaded]

I do have some pharm clen left I can do 40mg a day keep to add to the mix. Do you think I should be doing HIT or 2x a week? Obvious I think I did HIT correctly lol. If I can do HIT 4x a week and do LISS 2-3x a week on off days

keep in mind that HIT cardio is glycolytic (where as steady state cardio is more lipolytic). and on a no/low carb diet glycogen is going to be a limited resource . so I wouldn't waste time doing a glycolytic form of cardio and burning up that limited resource.. you'll likely be in ketosis and your body will become very efficient at burning fat for fuel. doing a 50 minute treadmill session at 3.5 pace and 4 incline is going to be easy breezy for you (cause in ketosis you have unlimited energy) and you'll burn up plenty of fat in the process while preserving muscle glycogen.

also HIT cardio is more 'catabolic' , especially if your trying to cut and in a calorie deficit, and you don't have any anabolics helping you preserve muscle.

I would just do moderate intensity steady state cardio 5-6x per week. its lipolytic and glycogen sparing

[JuliusPleaser]

keep in mind that HIT cardio is glycolytic (where as steady state cardio is more lipolytic). and on a no/low carb diet glycogen is going to be a limited resource . so I wouldn't waste time doing a glycolytic form of cardio and burning up that limited resource.. you'll likely be in ketosis and your body will become very efficient at burning fat for fuel. doing a 50 minute treadmill session at 3.5 pace and 4 incline is going to be easy breezy for you (cause in ketosis you have unlimited energy) and you'll burn up plenty of fat in the process while preserving muscle glycogen.

also HIT cardio is more 'catabolic' , especially if your trying to cut and in a calorie deficit, and you don't have any anabolics helping you preserve muscle.

I would just do moderate intensity steady state cardio 5-6x per week. its lipolytic and glycogen sparing

When I say "HIT" I mean HIT as in Dorian. I don't plan on doing any HIIT cardio at all for the reason you mentioned. The question I have is whether go HIT training or HVT while being zero carbs essentially.

[GearHeaded]

When I say "HIT" I mean HIT as in Dorian. I don't plan on doing any HIIT cardio at all for the reason you mentioned. The question I have is whether go HIT training or HVT while being zero carbs essentially.

lol . my bad


I pretty much assume anyone that runs gear and trains for bodybuilding purposes is already doing "HIT" training to some degree already.
unless your a total newb lifter, you cannot grow without high intensity max effort sets

I personally don't think Dorian style HIT training is anything unique or some form of specialized training system. its simply training with max effort sets which is what any good bodybuilder has done to get big in the first place.

so I would say yes on doing HIT . thats pretty much a given. whats not a given and what needs to be customized for yourself is your volume equations (MEV = minimum effective volume .. and MRV = Maximum recoverable volume).

so plan on doing "HIT" but just be careful with how you select your volume of those intense sets. I would start with a low number then ramp up the number of working sets per week as your progress and if your recovering just fine.


90% of people who train at the gym don't even consider "recovery". they think they are recovering just fine all the time no matter what.. they will do set after set after set week after week and be recovering just fine. they don't think ''recovery'' even plays a factor.
well this is because these pussies don't train "HIT" or train with intensity.

I guarantee you that if you train with max effort sets with true high intensity, recovery and limiting your sets is gong to be 100% applicable and a huge factor in your training