What's the pulse of the American people, concerning aid to Ukraine?

[Euroholic]

Do you lads even believe that seal was a deserter?
American special operation forces and CIA have been in Ukraine for years. This is well documented.

I would say that the seal was not a deserter but in the interest of plausible deniability because the USA cannot admit to being actively fighting he was very much still serving in his official capacity as active military.

[XnavyHMCS]

So perhaps, with these slated deliveries of tanks and APCs, we will observe a broadening of the conflict, with UA mounting a much anticipated offensive in the coming months. Although I seriously doubt that the necessary tanks will arrive in time to initiate a spring offensive; most likely we will see these arms on the battle field in the summer months.

And I don't believe that a couple of hundred (if the west furnishes any number over 100) tanks is going to turn the tide in this conflict. One must remember, when Rus. was attacking with armor and mobile forces, they fell prey to anti tank weapons (Javelin / NLAW), now we will see at what level Rus. anti tank systems are developed...

Here again we are perhaps observing the west drip feeding the UA arms; permitting them to stay in the fight, but denying them the ability to knock out the Bear...

Some stats on our Abrams:
The engines in the Abrams are multi-fuel engines. "Honeywell AGT1500 multi-fuel turbine engine"

The engine can use a variety of fuels, including jet fuel, gasoline, diesel and marine diesel.

Fuel capacity 504.4 US gallons (1,909 L)

Operational range M1A2, road: 265 mi (426 km) Cross country: 93–124 mi (150–200 km)

Maximum speed: M1A1, road: 45 mph (72 km/h) (governed); Off-road: 30 mph (48 km/h)

The U.S. has close to 5,000 Abrams tanks in its possession.

[Euroholic]

Giving the tanks to Ukraine is basically a declaration of war. Remember when the USA gave Britain 50 destroyers and then on December 11 1941 Germany declared war on the USA.

Backing one side over another will eventually lead to open conflict. Nobody wants that.

[< <Samson> >]

Giving the tanks to Ukraine is basically a declaration of war. Remember when the USA gave Britain 50 destroyers and then on December 11 1941 Germany declared war on the USA.

Backing one side over another will eventually lead to open conflict. Nobody wants that.

It’s over, we’re fucked - when I agree with this guy

I was just about to post something similar - I really don’t know how Vlad will respond to this at all. “We(the US)” only need to hold off another year until this senile fossil is out of the White House. Will RU wait? I dunno - but, he’s more of a man than many. I’d b getting an itchy finger for some serious underhanded shit to be handed out real quick.

[XnavyHMCS]

Giving the tanks to Ukraine is basically a declaration of war. Remember when the USA gave Britain 50 destroyers and then on December 11 1941 Germany declared war on the USA.

Backing one side over another will eventually lead to open conflict. Nobody wants that.

I would be more inclined to believe that the Nazi regime and AH had other reasons for their mistaken declaration, than the gifting or leasing in September, 1940 of 50 warships; like they were flush with "victory disease" and they erroneously believed that we were an inherently weak nation, infested with the likes of "niggers and Jews". Furthermore, by the time of the declaration, American naval assets in the Atlantic had already been engaged in a shooting war with the Kriegsmarine Wolf Packs.

I do agree with you and Samson that we are headed for perhaps an open confrontation with Russia, if the status quo continues.

[< <Samson> >]

I don’t see Vlad to really want to try to set foot on US soil. But, man - Ukraine already looks like desolate waste land. The Ruskies really kicked up the air strikes & I mean, what’s really left?

US $ over there, what a sham

[XnavyHMCS]

I don’t see Vlad to really want to try to set foot on US soil. But, man - Ukraine already looks like desolate waste land. The Ruskies really kicked up the air strikes & I mean, what’s really left?

US $ over there, what a sham

100% in agreement with you, brother.

Sitting here right now, I can't remember which dignitary that I saw recently on a clip (I guess that a joint or two a week @ my age is negatively effecting my short-term memory after all...), but this guy said that Rus. will never surrender the territory which they have seized from UA; the Donetsk and Luhansk Oblasts, along with Crimea. Makes a lot of sense, if you look at it from the Rus. perspective of maintaining control of their own back yard, and for the security of distance between themselves and NATO. I stand by what I have said repeatedly; if some nation was meddling in Mexico, attempting to entice them into their camp and out of ours; we would come up with a plausible reason to cross the border, and right the wrong. Sorry for the Ukrainian people, but their country occupies an unfortunate geographic position.

Rus and President Putin could NEVER invade the USA; maybe Alaska, until we booted them back across The Bering Strait, which obviously wouldn't take us that long. Rus. is (or we were erroneously lead to believe) a Continental colossus, lacking the necessary lift to effectively project her forces outside of the Continent. Her surface vessels comprise a collective fleet of "rust buckets", which have all seen better days. She does have (again, we have been lead to believe) a significant submarine force. which we would need to contend with, but again I believe they are no match for our fleet and its technological capabilities. One need not even mention, if an enemy is unfortunate enough to gain a foothold on our shores, she would rapidly run afoul of our 5th column of "armé jusqu'aux dents" American good ol'boy patriots, behind every bush...

I am still looking for the comeback in the second round, for Rus. to raise itself up off the canvas, and deliver a punishing attack on UA. This is where my money is at.

[< <Samson> >]

Kamchatka is where the Ruskies have stockpiles of who knows what. From diamond mines to who knows wtf - and at subsonic speeds that shit can hit AK on down in a matter of hours - But, I don't see Vlad being that kind of war monger type of guy


Who knows what he'll do tho - this 98% dead "president" of ours clearly represents no one - but, watching US paid for junk just pile onto your own continent can't make him too happy

[lovbyts]

No words needed.

[XnavyHMCS]

No words needed.

Beautiful...

Anybody recall whether or not these are both factual quotes?

It sounds plausible, and just par for the course, when it comes to our govt....

[XnavyHMCS]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64455123

Interesting read, and it should come as no surprise.

I believe that the best the Ukrainians can hope for is that the US govt. has invested so much money in the conflict, that they cannot afford to let the UA lose the conflict. A UA loss and a Rus. victory would translate to a zero return on our investment...

[Honkey_Kong]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64455123

Interesting read, and it should come as no surprise.

I believe that the best the Ukrainians can hope for is that the US govt. has invested so much money in the conflict, that they cannot afford to let the UA lose the conflict. A UA loss and a Rus. victory would translate to a zero return on our investment...

There is no "return on our investment." We're never going to get back the money we've given Ukraine in aid, we're never going to get back the interest on the money we gave them. The only thing that happened was billionaire defense contractors got more of our money, because their plants in Congress and The White House voted to give them our money to fight a war that benefits us in absolutely no way.

In fact, it's brought us closer to WW3/nuclear war. And for what? I don't care about Russians. I don't care about Ukrainians and I certainly don't care about their occupied governments. Their problems are their problems not ours. We will spend billions in tanks, ammo and possibly in the future aircraft to them, but we can't even have discussion about the "wokeness" problem in America. We can't even guard our own border from the invasion that is happening every single day.

The whole thing is fvuking stupid. And from the average Ukrainian's perspective, how exactly will their life change living under Vlad's regime's control verses that degenerate, Zelensky's? I'm willing to bet it won't be enough of a difference to make a difference in their lives. If anything, it'd probably give them cheaper access to energy since they wouldn't be paying import taxes to pipe it through their country.

[< <Samson> >]

There is no "return on our investment." We're never going to get back the money we've given Ukraine in aid, we're never going to get back the interest on the money we gave them. The only thing that happened was billionaire defense contractors got more of our money, because their plants in Congress and The White House voted to give them our money to fight a war that benefits us in absolutely no way.

In fact, it's brought us closer to WW3/nuclear war. And for what? I don't care about Russians. I don't care about Ukrainians and I certainly don't care about their occupied governments. Their problems are their problems not ours. We will spend billions in tanks, ammo and possibly in the future aircraft to them, but we can't even have discussion about the "wokeness" problem in America. We can't even guard our own border from the invasion that is happening every single day.

The whole thing is fvuking stupid. And from the average Ukrainian's perspective, how exactly will their life change living under Vlad's regime's control verses that degenerate, Zelensky's? I'm willing to bet it won't be enough of a difference to make a difference in their lives. If anything, it'd probably give them cheaper access to energy since they wouldn't be paying import taxes to pipe it through their country.

My thoughts exactly

Where this will go - who knows

Can “we” do anything about it? - nope, just live with it. 5 dollar a gallon fuel & 50 cent eggs

[almostgone]

My thoughts exactly

Where this will go - who knows

Can “we” do anything about it? - nope, just live with it. 5 dollar a gallon fuel & 50 cent eggs

It's almost cheaper to raise your own cackleberries right now.

Gas and diesel are outrageous!!

[lovbyts]

There is no "return on our investment." We're never going to get back the money we've given Ukraine in aid, we're never going to get back the interest on the money we gave them. The only thing that happened was billionaire defense contractors got more of our money, because their plants in Congress and The White House voted to give them our money to fight a war that benefits us in absolutely no way.

In fact, it's brought us closer to WW3/nuclear war. And for what? I don't care about Russians. I don't care about Ukrainians and I certainly don't care about their occupied governments. Their problems are their problems not ours. We will spend billions in tanks, ammo and possibly in the future aircraft to them, but we can't even have discussion about the "wokeness" problem in America. We can't even guard our own border from the invasion that is happening every single day.

The whole thing is fvuking stupid. And from the average Ukrainian's perspective, how exactly will their life change living under Vlad's regime's control verses that degenerate, Zelensky's? I'm willing to bet it won't be enough of a difference to make a difference in their lives. If anything, it'd probably give them cheaper access to energy since they wouldn't be paying import taxes to pipe it through their country.

Speaking of WWIII Maybe thats the plan, again...

[Honkey_Kong]

Speaking of WWIII Maybe thats the plan, again...

I'm sure they just want us thinking we're on the brink of the end of the world. It's always some sort of manipulation of the population going on and fear porn is always the means of doing it.

[< <Samson> >]

Sucks ass, all of our trucks are parked and rarely started - which really sucks for diesels & anything with hydraulics

We just drive tiny 4 bangers & pack that shit like a truck when possible

[Euroholic]

A Leopard tank at a museum in Australia has been graffitied with Russian Z symbols. Hahaha. So much hate for the pedophiles at the World Economic Forum and their puppet Zelensky back home.

The German leopard tanks are going to get destroyed on the battlefield.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3P0A...ature=youtu.be

[XnavyHMCS]

The German leopard tanks are going to get destroyed on the battlefield.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3P0A...ature=youtu.be

Your analysis is incomplete; Leopard 2 and Abrams tanks, are going to get destroyed on the battlefield. I fixed it for you...

Of course, this is logical. Any arms on the field are at risk of destruction by enemy forces. But more than that, these machines are now going to fall prey to Rus. anti armor defenses, Rus. hand held anti tank weapons, etc...

I am working right now, and do not have adequate time to respond, but I have some interesting information, received it just this morning, concerning Warren Buffet junior's latest trip to Kiev, and his face to face with Pres. Zelensky. I will write more later.

*Euroholic, I am 100% on board with you on, "A world without Islam." = Make the world a better place.

[almostgone]

China balloon?

[< <Samson> >]

China balloon?

They really need a balloon when a satellite can get a clear image of a license plate

[XnavyHMCS]

They really need a balloon when a satellite can get a clear image of a license plate

Yeah... I'm calling bullshit, like you guys, on that one.

My first thought was, "Now what is our government doing, that they want to distract us from".

[almostgone]

This is very close to what I found. Hardly the size of 2 school buses.

[lovbyts]

Yeah... I'm calling bullshit, like you guys, on that one.

My first thought was, "Now what is our government doing, that they want to distract".

I sort of hate to keep using meme's but sometimes its easier.

[almostgone]

Exactly. It's "meteorological" equipment is the size of 2 buses?

Years ago, on the back side of our land, I found one of the NWS's radiosondes that they send up on their balloons. It was about the size of 3 encyclopedias stacked one stop the others and consisted of some electronic gizmos encased in a Styrofoam box. Damn thing weighed under 2 pounds. Had a plastic mailer inside the box for you to return it.

Edit: I can't imagine what the size of Chinese equipment is that is the size of 2 school buses? Well, I can, but none of the thoughts that cross my mind are benign.

[XnavyHMCS]

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...to-arm-ukraine

A typically "long read" by the New Yorker, but I wasn't complaining.

I searched for an article which I read yesterday morning, where the UA govt. said that they have created some form of assault brigade, composed of "veterans and volunteers" to spearhead an offensive... This struck me as a Nazi Germany Volksturm, last ditch effort... I can't find the article... Perhaps someone else can.

*** Ok, here is the article; I found it.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/ukraines-...204500596.html

I had to go back into my history and search, which is not easy, when you consume the quantity of PORN that I am watching... But, for the pleasure of the perusing audience on the forum, I present a news tid bit which strikes me as more of an act of desperation, than of defense. You be the judge.

[Cylon357]

I had to go back into my history and search, which is not easy, when you consume the quantity of PORN that I am watching... But, for the pleasure of the perusing audience on the forum, I present a news tid bit which strikes me as more of an act of desperation, than of defense. You be the judge.

You just watch your porn in a private browsing window. That keeps it out of your history. Or at least that is what a friend of mine does...

[Fresh2death]

You just watch your porn in a private browsing window. That keeps it out of your history. Or at least that is what a friend of mine does...

DDG and burn that history after watching. Same friend told me that

[XnavyHMCS]

DDG and burn that history after watching. Same friend told me that

I will keep it in mind; thank you.

I tend to carouse with the type of cunts (see what I did there) that are willing to accept my peculiar (it is rather not; I would say common) affliction for pornography. I tell'em straight up that if they want to be with me they have to accept that; it comes with the territory, so to speak. They need to understand that they are the beneficiaries of my fantasies, which I fuel with my consumption of said genre of films.

I am far and away from any form of IT specialist... I delete my history after watching, so unless she enlists the assistance of a specialist, she isn't likely to find much. I oftentimes think that some monitor, buried deep within the NSA (or some equivalent EU organism), is scratching his head while observing me and thinking, "something has to be wrong with our surveillance system; nobody can watch that much porn". Hey, I can do...!!!

[Euroholic]

[XnavyHMCS]

Euroholic...!!!

Right on...!!!

LMFAO

[wango]

An embarrassment.

[almostgone]

Just a reminder. Please don't drag any politics into threads. It never ends well.


Carry on.

[Fresh2death]

Just a reminder. Please don't drag any politics into threads. It never ends well.


Carry on.

My parents generation had that figured out. You never talked about politics or religion with your friends/ at parties! Now it's all anyone wants to talk about!!! When I'm at parties, even the people that are similar to me ideologically, if they start in on a political rant, I'll immediately steer the conversation away from it. It's pointless. No one ever wins.

[Euroholic]

Just found this youtube channel. It is foreign fighters fighting in Ukraine. They are conducting combat patrols and close quarter street fighting.

Look at the kit they are using. A nice gift from Biden most likely.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQeyk1BQ7LE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mzfg...ature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOiG...ature=youtu.be

[XnavyHMCS]

Just found this youtube channel. It is foreign fighters fighting in Ukraine. They are conducting combat patrols and close quarter street fighting.

Look at the kit they are using. A nice gift from Biden most likely.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQeyk1BQ7LE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mzfg...ature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOiG...ature=youtu.be

Thanks for the links, brother. I will pass some time watching these, as I have seen several already, which friends sent me from Tik Tok and YT.

I have some interesting info from my Christmas visit to the Ukrainian Consulate in Lublin, Poland (roughly 2 hrs north of where I am currently installed) specifically regarding an in shape and in possession of a DD214, middle-aged man's possible summer vacation enlistment with the Ukrainian International Legion.

You are spot on that the foreign fighters are supplied by primarily the US govt (I puff out my chest in the belief that WE are NATO.), with the weapons of war, because logically, one couldn't travel intercontinentally with a bag packed with instruments to deal death and destruction. An enlistee is strongly advised to cross the border in Korczowa-Krakowiec bearing his own body armor and ballistic helmet, because if he is issued these items by the Int. Legion, and he later decides of his own accord to change to another group, he must return these things to them.

Thanks for the links.

[XnavyHMCS]

I agree with the esteemed members, in participation here, regarding the fear mongering (fear porn; I'm gonna incorporate that one into my lexicon); a common tactic that bridges the political divide, as both sides are equally as culpable.

This fits right in with about 2 wks ago when some govt official / analyst published a report stating that, it is believed that we (USA) will be at war with China by/in/just after 2025; or something like that... Well, heaven forbid if we don't keep the golden goose (military industrial complex) laying her golden eggs; eggs which benefit a small percentage of the nation.

Gotta keep the fear alive after the American people have seen what a pitiful shape our primary adversary was really in.

Chinese balloons? Does anyone know the regulations, distances, governing international airspace? I would like to believe that Am. airspace extends much greater than the reported 40,000 ft, that the Ch. balloon was flying. I mean, when the Russians downed F.G. Powers spy plane; I sure hope that his mission required him to traverse enemy territory at a greater height... So, if that was really a violation of our airspace, the govt would have brought it down in a heartbeat. I am calling bullshit on a bunch of stuff.

[wango]

I agree with the esteemed members, in participation here, regarding the fear mongering (fear porn; I'm gonna incorporate that one into my lexicon); a common tactic that bridges the political divide, as both sides are equally as culpable.

This fits right in with about 2 wks ago when some govt official / analyst published a report stating that, it is believed that we (USA) will be at war with China by/in/just after 2025; or something like that... Well, heaven forbid if we don't keep the golden goose (military industrial complex) laying her golden eggs; eggs which benefit a small percentage of the nation.

Gotta keep the fear alive after the American people have seen what a pitiful shape our primary adversary was really in.

Chinese balloons? Does anyone know the regulations, distances, governing international airspace? I would like to believe that Am. airspace extends much greater than the reported 40,000 ft, that the Ch. balloon was flying. I mean, when the Russians downed F.G. Powers spy plane; I sure hope that his mission required him to traverse enemy territory at a greater height... So, if that was really a violation of our airspace, the govt would have brought it down in a heartbeat. I am calling bullshit on a bunch of stuff.

Agreed, but when dealing with communism in this country it’s business as usual. We’ve been in “fear” (not saying that as a positive or negative) since the 40’s. It’s gotten us entangled with Vietnam, Korea, Afghanistan (aiding them against Russia), now Ukraine and the ever looming Taiwan & N. Korea.

We need to bring back the drop & cover drills in school. And to be ahead of the curve, push & invest in companies that make bomb shelters. We can then form a niche market for luxury bomb “residences” equipped with wine rooms, high end kitchens & underground pools.

Hopefully with this global economy, China is more hesitant. Putin seems to be a bit of a loose canon here, but I won’t put anything past N. Korea, as they have little to nothing to lose.

Hey gotta dig those underground air-fields for Iran, that’s some cool design work.

[Euroholic]

I agree that by 2025 The cold war with China will end and she will become hot.

We are basically living the same as they were in the mid to late 1930s when everybody new a war was brewing.

Now is a good time to rack up heaps of debt in buying supplies because you most likely won't have to pay it back when society collapses.

[XnavyHMCS]

I agree that by 2025 The cold war with China will end and she will become hot.

We are basically living the same as they were in the mid to late 1930s when everybody new a war was brewing.[/B]

Now is a good time to rack up heaps of debt in buying supplies because you most likely won't have to pay it back when society collapses.

Euroholic, I hope that you are wrong in your congruity with the 2025 forecast.

We must keep our fingers crossed that the past peace keeper, the concept of mutually shared destruction, which worked quite well at keeping the big players at bay in the last 50 odd years, will continue to do so. Of course, we faced off obliquely with the Soviets in Vietnam, perhaps Korea, if in fact the USSR was supplying Red China, Afghanistan; along with many other locales. I have faith that China and America, being members of the nuclear club, will let cooler heads prevail in this matter.

Furthermore, I have heard/read that we are the number one consumer of Chinese goods. If that is in fact true, then a "shooting war" between the parties would certainly be unwelcomed by both sides. (Please note that I specified "shooting war".)

I would agree that Ch. is flexing her muscle in the Pacific region, but I would guess that's to be expected, it being her backyard. Hopefully as long as we maintain our support and our presence in the countries which are allied with us, we can dissuade them from any greater provocative moves in the region. I personally do not consider an Am. administration abolishing support and assistance, in the coming years, to the breakaway republic of Taiwan, as any reason to resort to an armed conflict with the Red Dragon. My wish is to see their repossession come off without firing a shot.

Where I highlighted your second sentence; I would venture to guess that you made a rapid typo here... As China preceded Europe in the global conflagration which we now know as the Second World War, being invaded by their bellicose Asian brothers on July 7, 1937, by approx. 2 years. You call yourself "Euroholic", so I would surmise that you hail from the European Continent, so it is only logical, along with myself and my fellow Americans, that we are of the mind that WW II began with the 1 September, 1939 breach of Polish sovereignty, when in fact the war had been raging in Asia prior to this date. Excuse me for pointing that out here; I am not meaning to come off as smart.