I received a call from my GP last night and he says...

[Times Roman]

....he is willing to try me on two months of TRT. I'm going in for my first shot this afternoon. He wouldn't talk about dose, or type of Test ester. He says I will get one shot a month for two months and then we will reevaluate, but he doesn't want this to be a long term "thing".

So my question, is there a type of ester that will cover me sufficiently for a month? I will find out in a few hours when I go in, but would like some info from you knowledgeable folks.

I would like a discussion with him about ester types and doses, but he is making this seem like some kind of huge exception ,and two other endos he wanted me to see in the Kaiser network said "no need".

My results from 8/4 blood work:

TESTOSTERONE FREE 63.6 35.0-155.0 pg/mL
TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 211 250-1100 ng/dL

LH 4.1 1.0-12.0 mIU/mL

PROLACTIN 7 2-18 ng/mL

Do any of you have any ideas what ester type would have sufficient half life to cover me for a month? What would a reason dose rate be for TRT?

[MuscleScience]

find another doc if he is jerking you around.

[Times Roman]

find another doc if he is jerking you around.

Just the person I was hoping would answer. Since 'tween jobs, options are limited.

I read all the stickies and was hoping you could point me in the right direction for typical TRT dose rates / schedule by ester type.

this GP called me last night and almost sounded angry, like he is majorly sticking his neck out here since going against kaiser guidelines.

Any idea where I can find this information?

[Vettester]

Just the person I was hoping would answer. Since 'tween jobs, options are limited.

I read all the stickies and was hoping you could point me in the right direction for typical TRT dose rates / schedule by ester type.

this GP called me last night and almost sounded angry, like he is majorly sticking his neck out here since going against kaiser guidelines.

Any idea where I can find this information?

There are several members here that can bang this out for you, including myself. That's what we do in this forum day in and day out. Let us know if you want to network your resource pool.

[Times Roman]

There are several members here that can bang this out for you, including myself. That's what we do in this forum day in and day out. Let us know if you want to network your resource pool.

Thanks mates. I really appreciate all the support. and yes, to the poster above about my first post going to kaiser.... i was expecting this to be a royal pain. But in all fairness to kaiser, I am actually pleased at the outcome. GP was uneducated as to TRT. Was talking about a patch, which we all know leaves a lot to be desired. Two endos wouldn't touch me since within Kaiser guidelines. GP calles me up and initially tells me 1 pin/mo X 2 months is max he will do. So now, for a first go around, I'm very pleased with NO PATCH, and 200mg cyp eow. Now he has me keeping a journal which I will email weekly, and the two month "MAX" isn't as firm as he once said... now it's "we'll see how it goes".

Eventually, I'd like to maybe be at 150mg/EW, and maybe bring up some B12 one time a month.

I think as he gets comfortable with me, he'll loosen up.

AND, this will sound very strange, but almost 25 years ago, I caught a 2x4 (14 footer) where you don't want to catch it, at full speed, resulting in saying good bye to my right nut. It was smashed to smithereens, and is now about the size of a pea. The reality is, this should have minimal impact on my test production, but I finally told him about it, and he seemed to think that was a very important thing to consider in this process.

The bottom line? I think I'm good for now.

The other funny thing. They will only administer at the clinic. No "to go" packages. The lady gave it to me below my hip, and I'm thinking it was more sub cutaneous than intramuscular. I'll ask her about it next time I go in, but it was painless. If it was intramuscular, it wasn't very deep. No soreness, nothing. But the volume was only 200mg, so not that much. And she took about 20 or 30 seconds to administer. Very pleasant experience.

[marcus300]

Why would he want it to be short term, if he is going to try and bring your natural test back up after being on trt to a reasonable level he would be better doing that now before he shuts it completely down.

Sounds like he doesn't really know what he is doing and I would seek advice from a Endo who understands hormone's.

[Times Roman]

Why would he want it to be short term, if he is going to try and bring your natural test back up after being on trt to a reasonable level he would be better doing that now before he shuts it completely down.

Sounds like he doesn't really know what he is doing and I would seek advice from a Endo who understands hormone's.

Good question. At least, after I went in, he admitted he didn't know too much. So I brought in some information about the various esters out there, and how long they stay on in the blood stream, so he changed his mind and we are now doing 200mg cyp EOW. Not a lot, but at least it's a start, and the guy was open about not knowing, which is good for Kaiser. We did yet a third blood panel for test, then the shot, and now I'm supposed to email him weekly with how I feel.

As far as the short term, I think it is because HE doesn't want to committ to anything long term, this really being the realm of the endo, both of which said my levels are within "kaiser guidelines" and no need. I think my GP feels like he is taking a chance. So, for now, I just have to take it one step at a time with this guy.

and the DRE wasn't fun either......

[Bio-Active]

Good question. At least, after I went in, he admitted he didn't know too much. So I brought in some information about the various esters out there, and how long they stay on in the blood stream, so he changed his mind and we are now doing 200mg cyp EOW. Not a lot, but at least it's a start, and the guy was open about not knowing, which is good for Kaiser. We did yet a third blood panel for test, then the shot, and now I'm supposed to email him weekly with how I feel.

As far as the short term, I think it is because HE doesn't want to committ to anything long term, this really being the realm of the endo, both of which said my levels are within "kaiser guidelines" and no need. I think my GP feels like he is taking a chance. So, for now, I just have to take it one step at a time with this guy.

and the DRE wasn't fun either......

I have some friends that do 200 eow and do fine with it. I have other friends that need 200 ew. Every one responds to compounds different. I am doing 100 ew and it keeps me in the high 800 ng/dc. I think 200 eow is a good starting point but make sure when you have your levels ran again that you have them run as close to and before your next inject. So i would have labs ran 13 days after last inject or the day before next inject. I hope this makes sense. Also diid you have your labs run in the am when you first woke?

[Times Roman]

I have some friends that do 200 eow and do fine with it. I have other friends that need 200 ew. Every one responds to compounds different. I am doing 100 ew and it keeps me in the high 800 ng/dc. I think 200 eow is a good starting point but make sure when you have your levels ran again that you have them run as close to and before your next inject. So i would have labs ran 13 days after last inject or the day before next inject. I hope this makes sense. Also diid you have your labs run in the am when you first woke?

No. Right before my pin, so around 1:30. But I will take your advice and not have anymore labs ran unless going in for a pin, and then right before. so if my next appointment is 8:30am in two weeks, you are thinking just wake up and have my labs done. Test levels lowest right after waking?

[tubs]

eow is no good imo you need to break down the amount and pin once a week or even twice a week

with pinning less often you will end up with more sides and not feel nearly as good as more frequent shots with lower doses

[zaggahamma]

well congrats for at least gettin started on some test...sounds like although not very knowledgeable he doesnt try to hide it and seem to be willing to work with you and also be hands on with the night calls and emails

best of luck

[Epic Ed]

How can a doc believe it's honestly in the patient's best interest to prescribe one dose EOW when he KNOWS the half life of the ester is 6-8 days? It just makes me screaming mad.

[zaggahamma]

How can a doc believe it's honestly in the patient's best interest to prescribe one dose EOW when he KNOWS the half life of the ester is 6-8 days? It just makes me screaming mad.

you'll love the way my script is actually written...200mg e3w

but i pin at home

[Vettester]

Times, I presumed you would be seeing these issues with kaiser when you made your first post about going to Kaiser. Also, no AI or HCG with them, and they will probably want you in their lab for your shots. Good luck.

[Times Roman]

Times, I presumed you would be seeing these issues with kaiser when you made your first post about going to Kaiser. Also, no AI or HCG with them, and they will probably want you in their lab for your shots. Good luck.

Well, you are on this board for a reason, and you were right!

If you read my above comment about the "2 by 4" testicular injury, you know from a practicle standpoint I've only one functioning testicle. So I am trying to get as much mileage as possible with that. I just emailed my GP recently, saying we (I) need to protect my "sole survivor" and asked if we could discuss HCG. So now I've got a referral to a urologist (no response from him yet). I know you said Kaiser is a "no-go" with HCG, but I'm hoping to get lucky again......

btw... do you really have to pin HCG 3x EW, or is there some esther version where I can pin eow? Just a thought....

[Times Roman]

Times, I presumed you would be seeing these issues with kaiser when you made your first post about going to Kaiser. Also, no AI or HCG with them, and they will probably want you in their lab for your shots. Good luck.

Went to the urologist yesterday. and the correct answer is.... (drumroll please!)

You are right. She has never issued an Rx for HCG... period!

She wanted to examine my junk, so I told her only if she keeps her hands behind her back, then she can "examine" it all she wants.

bada bing~!

Here was an eyeopener for me. We discussed dose rate for cyp, and she said eow is fine. I'm like how's that? It drops off after the 11th day. She said after 5 halflifes on an eow plan with cyp, the blood levels of test become very stable.

So I ran home and looked it up. I was in error. Cyp has a "half life" of 12 days. I was thinking it had an "active" life of 12 days, so, from my perspective, no need to go from eow to ew.

Sometimes, I just need to come up for air and pull my head out my asss.

Life goes on mates!

BTW... I go in for my second injection for my knee today. Stuff works!!

[Times Roman]

you'll love the way my script is actually written...200mg e3w

but i pin at home

So do you break it up into 66mg and pin weekly, or do you stick with how the scrpt is written and pin e3w?

[zaggahamma]

So do you break it up into 66mg and pin weekly, or do you stick with how the scrpt is written and pin e3w?

i was trying to say...i give myself what I WANT....

last 3 months i've been low dose around 125 ew because i stopped taking arimidex thinking i dont need it at that dose

[forrest_and_trees]

you'll love the way my script is actually written...200mg e3w

but i pin at home

LOL... My script says the same, 1ml/200mg every 2 to 3 weeks. I'm currently injecting 150mg ew broken up into .75 twice a week. At one point it was 200 mg w. My doc knows all this and is OK but I think they have to put that in writing to cover their ass.

Originally I too had to go into the office for the shots but since I pay out of pocket, it was much cheaper to do it myself. I just told my doc that the longer periods were giving me a roller coaster effect and I'd feel like crap by the time I was due for another shot. I just asked if I could break it up into weekly shots, in your case that would bee 100mg a week. Eventually I began pinning at home and took it upon my self to go twice weekly.

You just have to go through the process and show your doc you're not going to go ape-s#it. Also, if your doc wont do the E Test, then just do it yourself using one of the online testing sites. Better to know for sure than play guessing games. And if your e2 does raise, you can show your doc and he'll likely get on board. That's pretty much what I had to do. I asked for it at the beginning but he said it wasn't necessary. Now I'm getting it each time I run a lab.

[coop1212]

Im going to give my endo a big hug when I see him in Sept. All these drs i hear about in here makes him look great. I bet if he was walking around with a 215 t level , his ass wouldn't go once a month!!

[Spartans09]

Your dr. sounds like he is doing a 5th grade sceince project. I would not follow that awful protocol.

[ds53]

If you think your test levels are low now, they will be nothing after you get shut down from a shot and then left alone with no help to restart you testicles. This is going to be a up for about 8-10 days and get worse in a hurry after that. You need to split the dosage up into about 5-8 day dosages to keep your test levels even. Then you will know what kind of treatment you need. Get your blood work done on the last day before your next injection and then the dr. can make necessary adjustment in dosage to keep you going strong. From my experience after day 5 levels drop off pretty quick and thats when I take my injection, My dr thought it was a good idea to split up the dosage as long as i didnt mind the extra shot.

[digismash]

Times, lookin forward to how this works out for you man! keep us posted!!

[durak]

Half life is 3 +- .5 days so less than 2x week will not be as effective.

[JuiceBox12]

Two times a week. That is good to know. THANKS!

[JuiceBox12]

I have an Rx for hCG but have no clue as to where to get it filled.

In search of answers,

JuiceBox 12

[zaggahamma]

I have an Rx for hCG but have no clue as to where to get it filled.

In search of answers,

JuiceBox 12

have u tried a pharmacy?

[JuiceBox12]

The pharmacies where I live say they don't carry it cause it being allocated for diet clinics.

[zaggahamma]

The pharmacies where I live say they don't carry it cause it being allocated for diet clinics.

they should have to order it....whatever happened to the hypocratic(sp?) oath ...lol...is that just for doctors...lmfao...FVCK THEM ALL

[Times Roman]

just a quick update on my trt dose rate.... for those that don't recall, I was Rx 200mg test cyp eow. lately, i've been noticing i get angry a few days before my next shot.... argumentive with my kid... oh, i have my reasons... he has no job, not going to junior college, argues with me all the time.... he's almost 20 btw.... yeah, I have my reasons, but I've been especially irratible lately a couple days right before my next injection. even my woman had to have a talk with me last night asking me "what's up with all the anger?"
so I emailed my kaiser doc this morning (i had an injection this am) and said the amount seems to be right, but maybe we should split the amount and inject 100mg ew instead of 200mg eow.

until then, everyone in my house seems to be walking on eggshells around me......

[CFforged]

Quality head on the regular is as far from feminine as you can get, good for you bro

[Vettester]

Just get some rabbit fur or carpet and double side tape it for your appointment.

[Epic Ed]

Just get some rabbit fur or carpet and double side tape it for your appointment.

This is a solid idea. Please post pics and a report when done.

[Times Roman]

This is a solid idea. Please post pics and a report when done.

a report... ha ha ha!

that's my laugh for the day!

[Times Roman]

Just get some rabbit fur or carpet and double side tape it for your appointment.

or some used Elvis Sideburns?

you guys are a hoot!

[JuiceBox12]

Fly your freak flag! If the urologist hasn't ever seen shaved junk, run like crazy. I'm pretty sure he's seen one or two up close.

[chuckt12345]

WELL for one 2 shots spread out by 2 months will not get your levels to plateu. Some people natural test levels will stay higher than they were before after they get off a trial TRT. Thats prb why he wants to do it, but i have never heard such a short trial.

im back to 200mg e2w and i dont experience up and downs, all i do notice is usually a few days after shot my sex drive is at its highest point in the 2 wks then drops a little towards the end

[Times Roman]

WELL for one 2 shots spread out by 2 months will not get your levels to plateu. Some people natural test levels will stay higher than they were before after they get off a trial TRT. Thats prb why he wants to do it, but i have never heard such a short trial.

im back to 200mg e2w and i dont experience up and downs, all i do notice is usually a few days after shot my sex drive is at its highest point in the 2 wks then drops a little towards the end

yeah, i've been drilling the woman almost every day. she's on her period right now, so I've been working on her all day for some oral tonight..... test is great stuff!!!

[Times Roman]

get this. I asked my GP if we could switch from 200mg cyp eow to 100mg cyp ew, and he said....
"I am not comfortable doing anything outside of the standard protocol that people use for testosterone when free testosterone is low( yours was normal as you recall). "

btw.. my free test was 67 and my total test was 211.

I told him I understand his position.

Anyone know of any clinical reference material I can stick under his nose that may get him to change his mind?

[Vettester]

get this. I asked my GP if we could switch from 200mg cyp eow to 100mg cyp ew, and he said....
"I am not comfortable doing anything outside of the standard protocol that people use for testosterone when free testosterone is low( yours was normal as you recall). "

btw.. my free test was 67 and my total test was 211.

I told him I understand his position.

Anyone know of any clinical reference material I can stick under his nose that may get him to change his mind?

Roman, I might have told him that I DON'T understand his position. Again, this is Kaiser, so nothing surprises me with them.

Were you able to get anywhere with them on HCG?