High dose cycles - experience and questions

[marcus300]

By no means I recommend what I am going to talk about but ive had plenty of experience with high dose cycle more the short burst ones and ive also experimented with many different compounds and high dosages.

What would you guys like to know? results, dosages, why, length, sides, would I do them again? you tell me what you want to know and I would also like to hear other members experiences with higher dosages and all the highs and lows of doing such cycles?


What ive done is ONLY for the advance bodybuilder and I don't recommend any of the cycles in this thread what are going to be posted to be followed.

[NACH3]

Love this!

So, obviously the SBCs(short burst cycles) definitely have their place...
1. Less sides - meaning even with a short or long ester - you can reap the rewards as if your running a standard length cycle w/out the sides you'd get from one(as the longer we are on the more sides will pop up... So these cycles - your in and out b4 the side effects actually hit?

2. In order for these to work... Is it true that one must link a pre-cycle prime to it?(meaning over a 6wk period your trying to drop BF yet reduce the amount of glycogen in your body - which opens up a huge growth window?)? Btw dropping BF via carb cycling is more of a reward that comes with the glycogen stores going down, correct?!

3. What was your favorite stack on this protocol? Compounds etc - & which did you get the best results with??

4. I'd imagine your muscles are like a sponge at this point just retaining everything(all nutrients etc) along with real EATING 24/7 around the clock?!

5. What's the length? Or is it open ended until gains slow?

[marcus300]

Love this!

So, obviously the SBCs(short burst cycles) definitely have their place...
1. Less sides - meaning even with a short or long ester - you can reap the rewards as if your running a standard length cycle w/out the sides you'd get from one(as the longer we are on the more sides will pop up... So these cycles - your in and out b4 the side effects actually hit?

2. In order for these to work... Is it true that one must link a pre-cycle prime to it?(meaning over a 6wk period your trying to drop BF yet reduce the amount of glycogen in your body - which opens up a huge growth window?)? Btw dropping BF via carb cycling is more of a reward that comes with the glycogen stores going down, correct?!

3. What was your favorite stack on this protocol? Compounds etc - & which did you get the best results with??

4. I'd imagine your muscles are like a sponge at this point just retaining everything(all nutrients etc) along with real EATING 24/7 around the clock?!

5. What's the length? Or is it open ended until gains slow?

We've spoke before about these I can tell by your questions and your knowledge lol

I much prefer SBC because my body type would only grow for a set number of weeks then sides and gains would slow or stop, so I listened to my body and implemented what worked best. My best gains would come early on in the first part of a cycle no matter what I was taking. Some people are different and tend to start gaining at the latter stages of the cycle but for me it was all about the first few weeks that's why I much prefer SBC because it coincided with my gains and also I had less sides.

Priming is must no matter the cycle length IMHO, its a remarkable tool to use to reap more gains and to springboard in your cycle, it opens up a growth window and makes your receptors very excitable and if you couple this with AAS and all the rest of the growth factors you have a ideal environment for muscle tissue to grow. You line everything up the prime, the pullback on training and the cycle start.

Just for the record SBC don't all have to be high dose,

Cycle length would be between 30 days to 6 weeks usually but I would also leave them open ended and stop them when gains or serious sides started to appear.

[Cuz]

Have you ever reached over 2 grams of test per week?

[kelkel]

Have you ever reached over 2 grams of test per week?

My prostate would explode.

[Mr.BB]

My prostate would explode.

One less thing to worry about....

[marcus300]

Have you ever reached over 2 grams of test per week?

In a high dosed short burst cycle I have used around 5g's worth of AAS and 15ius of hgh. I did use growth for years but the longest time on growth was 3 years straight were I would cycle the dosage from 4 ius to 15 ius during the cycle.

Its a strange feeling being on so much AAS and to be honest with you 5g's was way to much for me, my sweet spot in my prime was 3g's that's were the magic happened for me many times. I was advised by one of Dorian's friends who would help up and coming pro's, he was a crazy guy and introduce me to priming and using higher dosages to bring me to the next level. I would hit a wall and could never get over a certain size and Paul would show me how to build myself bigger but it was at a cost.

Yes, they did make me huge but the 5g's cycles didn't do anymore for me in terms of serious gains than the 3g cycles, it was just way to much for me to handle and my sweet spot like ive said was around 3 g's and that wall I would always come to just collapsed but it was a combination of many things the priming, the drugs, the hgh and my mind set listening to guys like Paul and my motivation to build something what would turn heads.

I didn't care about anything when I was younger except being big so I would listen to what the pro's were doing and follow suit. I do think I used to much and I also think you don't need that kind of amount of drugs to get over the sticking point.

I remember one day when I was in the middle of a really high dosed cycle and I was in my mates kitchen eating and he asked me to do a double bicep and I felt huge, I felt like a super hero the euphoria was immense and my took a photo and my arms were bigger than my head at the time, it was a great feeling but I had a constant BP sensation in my head which would get worse as the cycle went on and on and also the longer the cycle the more water started to appear.

[ScotchGuard02]

I would like to know:

1. Does HDC work well for leaning out and cutting? i.e. final prepping for a show.
2. What should the compounds/dosage?
3. What should be the duration of the HDC?
4. How long before showtime should the HDC start?
5. What can I expect from the HDC?
6. Are there any significant sides I should prepare for?
7. Is the HDC safer/harmful than a normal 12 week cycle?

Thanks in advance for the knowledge.

[marcus300]

I would like to know:

1. Does HDC work well for leaning out and cutting? i.e. final prepping for a show.
2. What should the compounds/dosage?
3. What should be the duration of the HDC?
4. How long before showtime should the HDC start?
5. What can I expect from the HDC?
6. Are there any significant sides I should prepare for?
7. Is the HDC safer/harmful than a normal 12 week cycle?

Thanks in advance for the knowledge.

The were usually for mass gains, to help you get past that sticking point in your off season. If your prepping for a show your not in the right environment to build new tissue its all about sculpturing and decreasing the fat to show the muscle you have built and also to maintain what you have while trying to cut. So usually the higher dosed cycles were just for bulking.

I wouldn't be to heavy on the orals, I was advised not to use high dosed orals but ramp up the injectables. I would use around 3 compounds or even 4 and I would drop certain things at certain times and introduce other compounds but for me the base was Test because for me Test was the king of all muscle builders, I grow like fuck on T so that's was the main compound. Dosages of a cycle like ive already mentioned was around 5g's in total, I knew guys who used 9's infact he use to be on this board. A close friend of mine who was a monster of a bloke used 7g's but for me my highest was 5g's but it was way to much the tipping point for me was 3g's.

Cycle length would be 30days to 6 weeks or I would leave it open ended and go with how my body is growing and feeing, sometimes depending on the drugs used like tren for example I couldn't take that for long so my cycle length would be cut down, I've took massive amounts of tren which was scary and my sides were not good but it was my experimental phase to see what it did to my body lol.

I wouldn't do a high dosed cycle before a show, its the wrong environment to introduce one imho and I was always advised to use them in the bulking phase to get you past a sticking point. They are not all the same cycles were designed off your previous cycle history and how you respond, so you do need a cycle history to look into and then design the idea cycle for you.

I don't recommend using high dosed cycles I really don't think they are necessary I think the job can be done for a lot lower dosages, obviously this is an individual thing just like the pro's I know 2 pro's and one using super high dosed cycles and the other one just moderate ones, they respond differently and have different body types. The longer you stay on something what I would class as high dosed the sides come on quick and fast. Water retention, BP issues, sexual sides, your mind set changes its hard to describe but all the normal sides you would get are increased, BUT if don't correctly with the right cycle length ( which is key) you can minimize the sides a lot and when I got my sweet spot sorted and the cycle length sides never were a problem.

Are they safer? in a SBC they can be managed and great but its getting the dose right for you which is the problem because going to high could well be very dangerous and its something what I don't recommend and in all my experience I would say you don't need super high dosed cycles to get over that wall or sticking point, or unless your turning pro and you can be monitored weekly to make sure everything is good and manageable. If you put a 12 week high dosed cycle against a 12 week normal cycle then yes its far more harmful.

[marcus300]

I would like to know:

1. Does HDC work well for leaning out and cutting? i.e. final prepping for a show.
2. What should the compounds/dosage?
3. What should be the duration of the HDC?
4. How long before showtime should the HDC start?
5. What can I expect from the HDC?
6. Are there any significant sides I should prepare for?7. Is the HDC safer/harmful than a normal 12 week cycle?

Thanks in advance for the knowledge.

I just want to come back to this one. I do believe but ive no evidence of this but I do believe my gh use over the years caused me a lot of sides. I did use pharm grade by the way nothing but the best but I do have health issues now what in the back of my mind I think its all those years on hgh especially the higher dosed terms I did.

[InternalFire]

subd

[Marsoc]

By no means I recommend what I am going to talk about but ive had plenty of experience with high dose cycle more the short burst ones and ive also experimented with many different compounds and high dosages.

What would you guys like to know? results, dosages, why, length, sides, would I do them again? you tell me what you want to know and I would also like to hear other members experiences with higher dosages and all the highs and lows of doing such cycles?


What ive done is ONLY for the advance bodybuilder and I don't recommend any of the cycles in this thread what are going to be posted to be followed.

Never cycled but am interested in the benefits. I've gained a lot of knowledge etc from these threads and will retain that Intell prior and post cycle God willing all goes well..I like the fact that testosterone is natural and seems a good choice. But I sometimes wonder about all the other souped up strains of test and other options. Halotestin seems crazy intense but I am still curious. Have you or anyone ever used halotestin ?

[marcus300]

Never cycled but am interested in the benefits. I've gained a lot of knowledge etc from these threads and will retain that Intell prior and post cycle God willing all goes well..I like the fact that testosterone is natural and seems a good choice. But I sometimes wonder about all the other souped up strains of test and other options. Halotestin seems crazy intense but I am still curious. Have you or anyone ever used halotestin ?

If you never cycled using anything what I class as high dose is a 100% no no, don't even think about it and like ive said all the way through this thread I don't recommend them anyway, it was just a time and place I was in and a experimental phase I was going through.

Halo ive used a few times usually if I was in mid cycle and wanted to explode in power or when I was power lifting, its extremely hard to get hold of these days and sends your aggression sky high but the strength was can come from it is remarkable but its not something I used often because I didn't feel it was a muscle gainer. Building muscle was my no1 goal and halo didn't really to that for me it was great for a burst of strength or power but its not something you want to use for any length of time.

[Sfla80]

By no means I recommend what I am going to talk about but ive had plenty of experience with high dose cycle more the short burst ones and ive also experimented with many different compounds and high dosages.

What would you guys like to know? results, dosages, why, length, sides, would I do them again? you tell me what you want to know and I would also like to hear other members experiences with higher dosages and all the highs and lows of doing such cycles?

What ive done is ONLY for the advance bodybuilder and I don't recommend any of the cycles in this thread what are going to be posted to be followed.

My main question would be.

Do you regret the HDC?

I mean even if I thought about it I would probably never come close to the dosages I'm sure u have done. But it's all realitive to the individual too.

I know SBC are a great tool to use. But worth it in the long run?

[Marsoc]

My main question would be.

Do you regret the HDC?

I mean even if I thought about it I would probably never come close to the dosages I'm sure u have done. But it's all realitive to the individual too.


I know SBC are a great tool to use. But worth it in the long run?

What is HDC and SBC for us less knowledgeable fellas...other then names of news channels lol

[marcus300]

My main question would be.

Do you regret the HDC?

I mean even if I thought about it I would probably never come close to the dosages I'm sure u have done. But it's all realitive to the individual too.

I know SBC are a great tool to use. But worth it in the long run?

Yes I do regret doing the crazy dosages.

A short burst cycle is far safer than a longer standard 12 week cycle imho, it doesn't have to be high dosed it just needs designing correctly to your body, I am one of those guys who like shorter cycles even when I would go on long cycles like 12-14 weeks my gains would slow or stop half way through no matter what I did to solve and carry on gaining and trust me ive been on cycle for over 6 months once swapping and changing dosages and compounds so ive done both ends of the scale very long cycles vs shorter cycles and for me a shorter cycle is far better for gains and sides.

You also need to remember if someone does fancy taking on a higher dosed cycle in a short burst cycle frame work its all individual. If someone is use to taking 500mgs to 700mgs per week then to them a 1000mgs/1400mgs cycle is going to be a very high dosed cycle, its all relevant to the person, but going from a 500mgs cycle to crazy arsed high dosed cycles is stupid and total dangerous.

[Sfla80]

What is HDC and SBC for us less knowledgeable fellas...other then names of news channels lol

Lol HDC.... high dosed cycles

SBC..... short burst cycles

[Marsoc]

Agh. I see. Thank you sir

[AR's King Silabolin]

What are the top 3 most dangerous BT values for a short high-risk blast as you see it, and how do you deal with them?

[tarmyg]

5g Test? My head just exploded reading that. That will never enter my body :-) Granted I am such a small guy anyways! Great thread Marcus!

[marcus300]

5g Test? My head just exploded reading that. That will never enter my body :-) Granted I am such a small guy anyways! Great thread Marcus!

When I first started I grew like a weed and then started aas, I grew and grew I am a good responder. Even when I met Paul he said I had huge potential so I started to experiment but 5g's was way to much for me, it just created more sides and not bigger gains but around the 3g mark was the sweet spot for gains and sides for me but only for short periods of time. Was I stupid?? yes because with the mentality I had regarding training and eating I still would of got big anyway because it was my mind set and sheer determination.

[NACH3]

When I first started I grew like a weed and then started aas, I grew and grew I am a good responder. Even when I met Paul he said I had huge potential so I started to experiment but 5g's was way to much for me, it just created more sides and not bigger gains but around the 3g mark was the sweet spot for gains and sides for me but only for short periods of time. Was I stupid?? yes because with the mentality I had regarding training and eating I still would of got big anyway because it was my mind set and sheer determination.

There it is!!! The mind is the most powerful thing we have - by far

[krugerr]

[/B]

There it is!!! The mind is the most powerful thing we have - by far

You obviously havent seen my pecker...

[marcus300]

Another thing members need to take note even if they are considering doing anything like this and I don't recommend it is. I used hgh pharm grade for around 15 yrs ish on and off and also used crazy amounts of gear advised by a guy who trained and was working with the best and I was doing this for years. I was doing 24/7 eating and nothing came in my way of training and food, this was my life, at the time money wasn't an object so what I am trying to say is I did everything I could and I was nowhere near a pro at the end of it. This just goes to show you all you can be is the best you can be which would be governed by your genetics ect and after everything ive done I was nowhere near a pro. Don't get me wrong I'm a big fucker or I was at my peak not many could stand next to me and beat me but I wasn't pro standard in my eyes.

[krugerr]

Another thing members need to take note even if they are considering doing anything like this and I don't recommend it is. I used hgh pharm grade for around 15 yrs ish on and off and also used crazy amounts of gear advised by a guy who trained and was working with the best and I was doing this for years. I was doing 24/7 eating and nothing came in my way of training and food, this was my life, at the time money wasn't an object so what I am trying to say is I did everything I could and I was nowhere near a pro at the end of it. This just goes to show you all you can be is the best you can be which would be governed by your genetics ect and after everything ive done I was nowhere near a pro. Don't get me wrong I'm a big fucker or I was at my peak not many could stand next to me and beat me but I wasn't pro standard in my eyes.

I know you like to keep yourself faiurly anonymous brother, and understandably. However, do you have any pics from the era you're talking about?
Ive used what I consider to be big cycles, and at that point I knew genetically I was never going to be pro. At 2g a week total AAS I peaked at about 290lbs. I was big a fuck, stronger than a bull, but to look at I just knew proportions and insertions were not in my favor, at that point I dialled it back and aimed at being just big.

Of course, the best laid plans of mice and men... I ended up coming off and trying to sort my TRT.

[marcus300]

I know you like to keep yourself faiurly anonymous brother, and understandably. However, do you have any pics from the era you're talking about?
Ive used what I consider to be big cycles, and at that point I knew genetically I was never going to be pro. At 2g a week total AAS I peaked at about 290lbs. I was big a fuck, stronger than a bull, but to look at I just knew proportions and insertions were not in my favor, at that point I dialled it back and aimed at being just big.

Of course, the best laid plans of mice and men... I ended up coming off and trying to sort my TRT.

At my peak all the photos I had was on my computer at home when I was married and when I left and came back for my computer the cunt wiped everything from it, The closest picture I got is the old double bicep pose which I will send you in pm. If you look closely at my biceps you will see bruises that's because I was injecting around 3-4 ml each head nearly every day on that pic.

I was a monster I must admit but at the time I didn't think I was, everywhere I went people looked and asked about what I was doing. But I didn't need that amount of gear it was crazy.

[NACH3]

At my peak all the photos I had was on my computer at home when I was married and when I left and came back for my computer the cunt wiped everything from it, The closest picture I got is the old double bicep pose which I will send you in pm. If you look closely at my biceps you will see bruises that's because I was injecting around 3-4 ml each head nearly every day on that pic.

Crazy MFer!

I was a monster I must admit but at the time I didn't think I was, everywhere I went people looked and asked about what I was doing. But I didn't need that amount of gear it was crazy.

......

[krugerr]

At my peak all the photos I had was on my computer at home when I was married and when I left and came back for my computer the cunt wiped everything from it, The closest picture I got is the old double bicep pose which I will send you in pm. If you look closely at my biceps you will see bruises that's because I was injecting around 3-4 ml each head nearly every day on that pic.

I was a monster I must admit but at the time I didn't think I was, everywhere I went people looked and asked about what I was doing. But I didn't need that amount of gear it was crazy.

To give these some perspective, as its not fair to use my weight only. I am 6'4". In the 280lbs I had just finished a heavy, and long cycle of about 2g AAS a week.

[marcus300]

To give these some perspective, as its not fair to use my weight only. I am 6'4". In the 280lbs I had just finished a heavy, and long cycle of about 2g AAS a week.

That's some height , you'll scare people

[-Ender-]

At my peak all the photos I had was on my computer at home when I was married and when I left and came back for my computer the cunt wiped everything from it, The closest picture I got is the old double bicep pose which I will send you in pm. If you look closely at my biceps you will see bruises that's because I was injecting around 3-4 ml each head nearly every day on that pic.

I was a monster I must admit but at the time I didn't think I was, everywhere I went people looked and asked about what I was doing. But I didn't need that amount of gear it was crazy.

As soon as you mentioned 5g's my first thought was: where? site rotation would be harder than hell to navigate.

[marcus300]

As soon as you mentioned 5g's my first thought was: where? site rotation would be harder than hell to navigate.

Daily injection all around the body, wasn't for long when I did 5g's but it was painful

[krugerr]

As soon as you mentioned 5g's my first thought was: where? site rotation would be harder than hell to navigate.

Nahh, depends on the concentration of the stuff you're using. Shoulders, Chest, Bicep, Quads, Glutes, thats 10 sites a week minimum, more if like Marcus and others, you do multiple spots in the same muscle, like both heads of the bicep.

I did traps once... once being the operative word. That hurt!

[KINGKONG]

Great stuff Marcus!!iam gonna go on my first cycle in years in about 4 months never did over 1.5 grams total, Iam thinking 2 grams and a few compounds..gonna take the next 4 months to get my bodyfat sub 10:/: and Iam gonna reasearch priming ..AT 36 years old I'll prob do trt after the sbc and never come off..

[NACH3]

Great stuff Marcus!!iam gonna go on my first cycle in years in about 4 months never did over 1.5 grams total, Iam thinking 2 grams and a few compounds..gonna take the next 4 months to get my bodyfat sub 10:/: and Iam gonna reasearch priming ..AT 36 years old I'll prob do trt after the sbc and never come off..

Here ya go KINGKONG...

http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...e-cycling.html

[KINGKONG]

Here ya go KINGKONG...

http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...e-cycling.html

Thanks bro!

[bobbypump]

Great stuff Marcus!!iam gonna go on my first cycle in years in about 4 months never did over 1.5 grams total, Iam thinking 2 grams and a few compounds..gonna take the next 4 months to get my bodyfat sub 10:/: and Iam gonna reasearch priming ..AT 36 years old I'll prob do trt after the sbc and never come off..

I turn 36 this month.. I'm leaning the same way.. hmm

[Cuz]

Big lats and tris marcus. Super thick! How many calories did it take to grow to that size? Estimate?

[marcus300]

Big lats and tris marcus. Super thick! How many calories did it take to grow to that size? Estimate?

Thanks Cuz, its not my best but I have a very thick set body style with good muscle bellies. Bodybuilding is an illusion and I worked on weak points to make the most of the size in certain places. I never count calories anymore I just know what to eat to maintain my size, I am very in tune with my body and don't weight anything anymore but I would eat around 4k-5k daily depending on my goals.

One thing I never ever do and I am sure you know this from my posts were we have talked before is that when I cut I never do this fast, its a very slow process and I attack my body fat slowly because when cutting my main priority isn't cutting bf its maintaining my muscle tissue that's were many go wrong!

Cutting to fast or using some of these stupid diets what are out there and being governed by online calculators is digging into your muscle tissue and also cutting this back as awell as fat and what ive been through to get to my size and build what I have there is no way in hell will I ever sacrifice my muscle tissue so I attack cutting slowly with the tools ive told you before.

A huge problem what ive seen over the years and also when I had a lot of clients is bulking and cutting was just a circle of gaining and losing weight and also muscle tissue so at the end of cycling and eating good they would waste all the efforts and let the muscle tissue disappear to get cut, well that's something I would not do because for me to build tissue I go through serious pain, I am a very hard trainer and I only grow one way and one style and there is no way in hell will I ever give back any muscle tissue unless it was not under my control. This is what I use to tell my clients and help them with and I changed most of them who stuck with what I told them to do. Why would you go on cycle eat massive amounts of food and build some tissue to only waste it away in a cutting phase and be were you was before to only go back on cycle and do it all again! I see this all the time in around 90% of people that's what makes the difference once you listen to your body and also your very much in tune with it. But you know all this because we have been on a journey together before

[Cuz]

Thanks Cuz, its not my best but I have a very thick set body style with good muscle bellies. Bodybuilding is an illusion and I worked on weak points to make the most of the size in certain places. I never count calories anymore I just know what to eat to maintain my size, I am very in tune with my body and don't weight anything anymore but I would eat around 4k-5k daily depending on my goals.

One thing I never ever do and I am sure you know this from my posts were we have talked before is that when I cut I never do this fast, its a very slow process and I attack my body fat slowly because when cutting my main priority isn't cutting bf its maintaining my muscle tissue that's were many go wrong!

Cutting to fast or using some of these stupid diets what are out there and being governed by online calculators is digging into your muscle tissue and also cutting this back as awell as fat and what ive been through to get to my size and build what I have there is no way in hell will I ever sacrifice my muscle tissue so I attack cutting slowly with the tools ive told you before.

A huge problem what ive seen over the years and also when I had a lot of clients is bulking and cutting was just a circle of gaining and losing weight and also muscle tissue so at the end of cycling and eating good they would waste all the efforts and let the muscle tissue disappear to get cut, well that's something I would not do because for me to build tissue I go through serious pain, I am a very hard trainer and I only grow one way and one style and there is no way in hell will I ever give back any muscle tissue unless it was not under my control. This is what I use to tell my clients and help them with and I changed most of them who stuck with what I told them to do. Why would you go on cycle eat massive amounts of food and build some tissue to only waste it away in a cutting phase and be were you was before to only go back on cycle and do it all again! I see this all the time in around 90% of people that's what makes the difference once you listen to your body and also your very much in tune with it. But you know all this because we have been on a journey together before

Thank you for the informative post Marcus. Always good to jog the memory!

[marcus300]

Thank you for the informative post Marcus. Always good to jog the memory!

Your all over it Cuz,